Re: blacks and asians more prone to being stopped
 

And once again, you fail to address the issue of Muslims born over here. Where do you suggest they stay?

It's always very amusing to see people like you attempt to justify their viewpoint, nothing more fun than seeing people dig that hole even deeper.

I see, so if you move to a foreign country you should adopt the local customs at the expense of your own culture? Try telling that to the beer-swilling ex-pats who live in other countries.

Traditional British way of life? That's an illusion put out by the tabloids for the benefit of middle England and those who can't think for themselves. So many aspects of our "traditional" way of life are not native to this country. There are enough of them that the Discovery channel didn`t just manage to make one program about the topic, they managed to make a whole series.

There are many aspects of the "traditional" way of English life that I do not agree with, but I`m certainly not going to leave the country.

Re: blacks and asians more prone to being stopped
 

What issue about being born over here, just because they are born here doesn't mean they are exempt from terrorist actions in the name of their religion or religious beliefs. I was working with an Asian contractor last year and he told me about how he was going "back home" for a month!

He was born in this country and is in his mid 30's, he considers the country in Asia to be his true home though.

I have a friend who went to an African country recently, he got locked up by the local police/army for not playing along with the local rules. It was his fault entirely he knew the rules and got put in prison for almost 24 hours for breaking a silly little rule that we would all laugh at.

He was in Rome and had to do as the romans do.

Re: blacks and asians more prone to being stopped
 

Simple.......they like the money they can earn here.

Re: blacks and asians more prone to being stopped
 

Exactly, they often use it to purchase property back home.

These people are often referred to as "economic Migrants" some say they come to help the economy, in my experience they come to line their own pockets.

I am not knocking them, its only what Brits do in Saudi and places like that.

I would just like people to aknowledge its the case and not spout of rubbish trying to convince us otherwise.

Re: blacks and asians more prone to being stopped
 

You specifically raised the example of if you didn`t like something in a different country you would stay in Wales? I asked you where those born here would stay if they don`t like something about their country of birth. Do I really need to connect all the dots for you?

There is a world of difference between breaking a local law and opposing the policies of the authorities when they legitimise institutional racism.

Re: blacks and asians more prone to being stopped
 

If they dont like it emigrate, the problem is we have to many liberal minded people about in the UK. You have to remember that, if people complain in other countries its jail.
If you are in a muslim country you follow their laws, or you end up in jail same goes here.

Re: blacks and asians more prone to being stopped
 

See we differ here, I dont class throwing a bag of flour at someone as assault. Assault to me is what happened when I was 13, and I received a smashed cheek bone, a broken nose and lost sight in my right eye. Its a shame the CPS didnt feel like following the case up really, perhaps they were too busy prosecuting phantom flour throwers.

Quite rightly these people were detained because they did something pretty damned stupid, but i didnt think it was illegal to bring a bag of flour into the house of commons. I've never heard of anyone being charged with assault for throwing flour around. I'd imagine they would have been takent o the small claims court to pay for the cleaning bill personally.

Re: blacks and asians more prone to being stopped
 

I'm white, 28 years old, male and big built, if I was stopped and searched in the street because I was matching the description of being white and male of someone the police were looking for, I'd gladly help them out.
How are they supposed to do their job if idiots will not co operate with them?
We are quick to condemn the police for not doing anything and we also chastise them for doing something, how can they possibly win?

If In spoke with an Irish accent in the 70's and 80's yes it would be annoying to be stopped all the time, but I would be understanding enough to known that the police are doing their job. They see someone that they want to question they go and ask questions. Its the Idiots that say they are being victimised that create the problem, not the police stopping and routinely questioning the public, which they are allowed to do. It would be nice if the police didnt have to do this, unfortunately because of the terrorist threat coming form people disguised as a muslims, and a lot of muslims being of Asain origin, the police stop people of Asian Origin.
Woiuldnt it be a relief if the Police could say, due to the current climate in world terrorism I would like ot stop you and ask a few questions, as I am required to do so to help keep the general public safe.

Imagine the outcry? but its so bloody true

As I am a heavy metal fan and in my student days I used to dress as most Heavy metal fans did during the early 1990's Not one day went by without me being stopped and searched by the police. Did I cry persecution? Did I threaten to kick up such a fuss? Did I complain when I was told to get out of a village that I actually live in the parish of? no I co-operated with the police, I answered their questions and I left the village, they had no legal right to ask me to move on (I was sat on a bench correctly and drinking milk shake) but I still complied, because their job is to aid with crime prevention also, and as innocent and unlikely to commit a crim I knew I was they didnt know me.


On another note Dr Wadd please stop berating and insulting people because they dont agree with you, not only are you doing it in this thread you have made some very strong accusations in another thread because I dont agree with you. It makes you oppinionated and exactly what you are calling others.

Re: blacks and asians more prone to being stopped
 

Well I've been busy for a few days, so I've only just had a chance to catch up with this thread and, unsurprisingly, the same old misguided arguments are being trotted out seemingly in attempts to justify prejudice :(

Good for you. But as has already been said in this thread, it's not blacks and Muslims being stopped *because* the Police are *looking* for someone, it's them being stopped because "everyone knows" that blacks and Muslims are more likely to be criminals and terrorists!

So anyone who doesn't immediately co-operate with the Police and, instead, insists on their legally backed Civil Rights is "an idiot"? Hmm, that's a constructive argument.

What a wonderful piece of logic. You conflate too entirely separate arguments from the extremes and try to make a point out of them.

Surprisingly enough, however, there *is* middle ground between "let them do whatever they want" and "don't let them do anything".

I suggest you read this article

http://www.yourrights.org.uk/your-ri...st/index.shtml

and see *exactly* what they are actually allowed to do and not to do.

As for calling someone an "idiot" because they think they're being victimised: try reading the following:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/1866502.stm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/3731489.stm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/3859991.stm

Look at the different levels of Stop and Searches done on the various groups and the wide disparity between them and then consider whether the black and Muslim community commit *so many more* crimes than the white community to justify such a disparity.

"True"? "A relief"? But for *whom*?

The black/ Asian/ Muslim community? Or just the white community?

"Not one day"? Do I detect just a *touch* of hyperbole here?

So you consider it to be *acceptable* to abuse someone's human rights to "prevent crime"? You think it's ok to judge someone purely on how they look? You will allow someone to presume a person a threat without any reasonable grounds?

I'm sure there have been some regimes in other parts of the world who would *LOVE* to have you as a citzen with that attitude!!

You mean like people who make comments such as: "I would just like people to aknowledge its the case and not spout of rubbish trying to convince us otherwise."?

Which reads as "I'm right, you're wrong and anything you say to counter my *opinion* is 'rubbish' ". Hmm, pots? Kettles??

Re: blacks and asians more prone to being stopped
 

Culture clash
......with some of the attitudes/resentments seemingly prevalent amongst young Muslims atm it would possibly be rather dangerous to stop them at random......

Re: blacks and asians more prone to being stopped
 

Yes, but you don`t define the laws. So it is ok for you to pick and choose at a whim? :rolleyes:

Re: blacks and asians more prone to being stopped
 

Let's throw in a little hypothetical example. A predominantly white, "law abiding" right-wing Christian group decides to make a point by conducting a terrorist campaign against abortion clinics (I know, all WASPs are beyond reproach, but let's just ride with this one for a while). By thelogic here rate of stop and search indicidents on middle Englanders should go through the roof, simple because they are middle class, white Christians. Somehow I can`t really see that happening, there would be uproar in such august publications as the Daily Mail.

Why would there be such an uproar under these circumstances? I don`t think it takes a rocket scientist to work out that there are double standards at play.

Re: blacks and asians more prone to being stopped
 

If you are happy to have your rights trampled upon and for you to be persecuted simple because of your appearance I`m certainly not going to complain about that. There is a difference between aiding authority and bowing and scraping at their every demand. If you're willing to roll over so easily then you don`t really have a case to argue.

Re: blacks and asians more prone to being stopped
 

Here's what I've just written to the "feedback" page regarding that article:

* * * * *

For those who are puzzled by the seeming shift of young Muslims to "extremism", may I invite them to consider the rise of "Black Power" organisations in America in the 1960's

Here were a group of people in what they thought they could consider to be "their country" being effectively told that they were second class citizens. They were a "problem" to be dealt with, a "threat" to the status quo, people to be suspicious of, not to be trusted.

Is it any wonder that some turned around and said "well, if that's how you think we should be treated, we'll damn well behave that way!"?

Now consider the young Muslims again and ask yourself if there's really that much difference.

* * * * *

Re: blacks and asians more prone to being stopped
 

So, come on then, Grahm, Dr Wadd - what do you suggest the police do instead? :shrug: