Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Go to http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programme...ht/default.stm and check out the panel "Latest programme available for 24 hours after broadcast".

---------- Post added at 16:12 ---------- Previous post was at 16:08 ----------

ANd you think they're not going to see that as a form of attack on them? (Which it would be, of course. Think of the economic ramifications.)

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

For those of us who like a reasoned discussion then BNP leader Nick Griffin is to appear on Newsnight tonight commenting on those cartoons.

Unless the public funded pro [insert party name here] BBC decides that it may cause offense to a minority that is :(

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

try the newsnight website and click on the latest programme video link.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

I'm not pulling anybodys beliefs down - it's your opinion and you're entitled to it. I just happen to believe that the phrase 'Muslims speak with forked tongue' is unacceptable - that's my opinion.

I'm also interested in what you think 'people like me' are. At no point have I come out in support of some peoples actions over the weekend - what I have supported is action being taken against people who deliberately attempted to 'fan the flames' by distributing copies of the pictures.

For the record, I'm not bothered about Britain being Christian, Muslim, or Zoro-Astrian - I like Britain as the big, multi-cultural melting pot that it's been since I was born and, quite frankly, there's a minority within each religion (and amongst atheists as well) who need to sit down and shut up, and appreciate the fact that Britain is multi-cultural.

Oh, and I swear that if I hear one more person say they're going to vote for the BNP because 'they'll sort it all out', I'm going to go mental. I support anyone's right to support whoever they want, but seeing as that bunch of bigots are the worst of the lot, I personally feel that we'd be better of without them.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

He is really. Allah is the Arabic word for God, so the word Allah is actually a noun, rather than a common name.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Excuse me but how many Muslims were on the streets of Britain protesting last week?This week?How many were not?Which was the larger percentage of the Muslim population?You are in danger of over reacting just like the extremists in the Muslim world.Anyway what's wrong with us no longer just being a christian country anymore? As long as the head of the country is still a practicing Christian than you can have no worry about that.;)

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

OK

For ONE, I havent tarred and feathered anybody
For TWO if the muslim leaders are as powerfull as they seem to think they are, could they not stop this before it happened, or perhaps tipped off people before it happened, I dont know anything, instead of distancing themselves in words and NOT actions form the idiots that did protest.

Equally, why is it, that I cant walk down the street saying white power, yet these "protestors" can call for the murder of a race and not be arrested?
Double standards? certainly looks like it doesnt it?
The MET claim they are working on arrests, funny that, Had it been a BNP rally all arrests would have taken place at the time.
I find it hilarious that the riot police can beat pregnant women and children at stone henge but mustn't anger the protesters that happen to be muslim in faith. What did the police do to the poll tax demostrations? to the miners strikes? but oh no we must not be seen as racist.
**** racism **** anti racism **** left wing politics **** right wing politics, its time we acted in our own self interest instead of pandering to everyone and their dog.
You commit a crime you get arrested, colour sex or religion does NOT come into it.
I'm pig sick of people whinging about rights of these people rights of those people, what about our rights? our right to be safe, to be protected. It was mighty pleasing to see it all get swept away and hidden under the carpet because of a pathetic few.
If a crime is committed it is the responsibility of the police to apprehend those committing it without delay. Funny how they can arrest white people for inciting racial hatred, but wont areest colured people for the same crime. That in itself is RACIST.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Is there a way of saving that show to my hard drive?

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

He's awesome. We need him standing up along side representatives from the MCB and imams from the UK's biggest mosques to prove that the prevailing perception of Islam isn't the only one.

My guess is though, this guy, if he gets found out, would face terrible retribution for his apparent siding with the cartoons and his comments against Islam. Rushdie had a death warrant put on his head for much less.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

You are still over reacting IMHO.It's not like every muslim is out on the streets is it?If they were then you might have a point.And I'm sure that there will be repercussions for those who were behaving illegally eventually.In fact I believe the person dressed as a bomber is back in jail. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4687996.stm.How much quicker could you want them to be.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

For now.

While you may well wish to ignore the nutter minority in whatever faith faction, it is the stated aim of this specific faith faction to convert the entire World to it's credo.

And since that doesn't leave any room for a multi-cultured anywhere, I suggest rather than assume the laid back "it'll be allright" approach, you might like to consider the implications of doing so, and of appeasing one faith faction in the vain hope that they'll lay off their domination ideas.

It didn't work for Chamberlain either - we still ended up with WWII!
They're no more going to solve this country's problems than any of the political parties can. No one party has all the answers - but it's not until all the parties realise that each may have some of the answers and that they work together to make the best of them, that we'll have any significant progress on any of the major issues.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

I never get offensive about any religion, I am not religious and I have no beliefs. I do however feel people who get annoyed over such silly issues such as these cartoons prove they are religiously brainwashed, or using it as an excuse/lever to flex their muscles.

I accept that religious people have their own beliefs and they should accept that non believers have their own beliefs. The key issue is these people will not accept that other religions or non-believers could have a valid point.

All this fuss just makes a mockery of more important issues going on in the world.:mad:

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

thats it nugget sit on the fence.but believe me the day will come when you will have to choose one way or the other,because if the extremist muslims get there way you will have to turn muslim or get the chop.because in there world there won't be any multi cultural society that you like to live in.
and before you say that won't happen.how many extremist muslims were there 20 years ago a few,and how many now a few thousand say.its only a question of mathamatics and time.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

I think you'll find it means a bit more to Muslims than simply 'a noun'...

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Sitting on the fence? How exactly am I sitting on the fence?

What is it you know that the rest of us don't? The day will come when I have to make a choice? I can categorically state that I will never 'turn Muslim' (and I'd like to take this opportunity to congratulate you for yet another wonderful turn of phrase :rolleyes: ) - that's got nothing to do with me disagreeing with Islam or siding with Christianity though; it's to do with the fact that I don't belief in God or Allah. As I've said before, I'm an atheist, so I'm hardly going to make a choice between a God I don't believe in and another God I don't believe in.

One of the reasons people come out and say 'there won't be a multi-cultural society' is because they don't like the one that they live in. I, on the other hand, appreciate what everybody brings to this country - I accept that some Muslims have acted in an irresponsible manner over the last few days, but Christians are just as capable of acting like @rses when it suits.

Oh, and if you want a reason for the increase in the number of extremists or radicals in the world nowadays, may I respectfully suggest that you start by studying American foreign policy over the last 10 years - it might give you a few pointers as to why the western world (and particularly the US and UK) are so bloody unpopular...

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Well to those who think that the muslim's who live here are just panting to turn us all into muslims I can only think what utter tosh...I as an athiest will fight to the death not to be forced to belong to any religion and I would fight just as hard to make sure that everyone can worship as they choose.This is an increasing secular country which makes it much harder for any religious extremist to take over.Our political system will protect us all from being forced in any particular religion.This is the 21 st century not the 16th.

And before I get to the point where I scream at some people's ridiculous idea that a few Muslims demonstrating about a few what were offensive to them cartoons is an indication that the screaming hordes are about to arise and take over,I'm really splitting from this thread because I will be getting myself banned otherwise. :rolleyes:

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

you still don't see do you in the world of the extremist muslim you would be made to worship allah or you would be put to death.
and i might have known you would blame it on the americans seeing as you have a go at the americans every chance you get.
and the increase in extremism couldn't be to do with the fact that muslim extremists marry have children and then there offspring become extremists could it.like i said its just a question of mathematics.
and another thing i was born when this country was mainly a christian country.why should i have to sit back and accept the country of my birth becoming multicultural.just because a load of left wing liberals say its nice to be multicultural.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Probably they are not. But many others in the world are.

And we've seen often enough, that when it comes to it, Islam is more important to many Muslims than any notion of community, family or nationality.
Though I too would defend my beliefs, I'd rather not have to fight to the death to remain who I am.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Yes, and what you don't understand is that I don't live 'in the world of the extremist muslim' and, as Coggy pointed out, the secular nature of this country makes it extremely unlikely that any religion could control it.

As for the Americans, where exactly have I had a go at them? I'm actually quite fond of the Americans as a group of people, and would quite like to visit their fine country. The only American I really have an issue with is their president and, as I have said on a number of occasions, that's mostly due to the fact that he hasn't got the intelligence to put his socks on in the dark.

Anyway, that's O/T - I'm also interested in your mathematics. Do all extremist Muslims have extremist children? If so, well done for finally putting that old 'nature / nurture' argument to bed. What rubbish - my parents are both members of the church, whereas I'm an atheist. You choose your own path these days...

Oh, and I'm not saying that you have to accept multi-culturalism - that's your choice. It won't make a blind bit of difference, because you do live in a multi-cultural society. I'd be interested to know how old you are actually, because the UK was 'mostly Christian' when I was born - I've just been lucky enough to be around in a period when the world has become that little bit smaller.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Please, don't leave this thread for good. As someone else said, your reasoned posts are a breath of fresh air.

The thing is Coggy, there are Muslims living in this country (albeit a small amount) who would like to turn this country into an Islamic state, complete with Sharia law. We aren't alone, most, if not all countries with a sizeable Muslim population have some people demanding this. Most likely, they will never achieve their aim, but the worry is on a few people's minds, would they ever put try? Its far fetched, but its happened before in other places. We never know how many people think like this. We only know the ones who are vocal about it.

Islam is the only religion that includes in its holy scriptures the declaration that Islam is the only religion that's allowed to exist. And some, who knows how many, of its followers take that word for word.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Actually, serious question, but doesn't the Bible say something about 'worshipping no other God but me'?

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Thats the Old Testament, not really relevant to Christians.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

I do believe that in time the majority of this country will be muslims, I believe the country will be controlled by muslims and the level of tolerance we currently have in this country will dissapear and become in their favour.

I would not like to guess timescales, and perhaps I will not see it in my lifetime but I do however believe it will happen. That opinion does not however make me a BNP supporting racist, just someone looking at the country, politics, religion and making an educated guess at the future in store for the UK. I honestly believe in years to come the grandchildren of many of the current "liberally minded" will curse them for their liberal attitudes, their bowing down to all and sundry and generally handing everything on a plate.

As I said, it doesn't make me racist just because I think this will eventually happen.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

It's one of the 10 commandments.

The difference being that (certainly since the Crusades) no (mainstream) christian church has suggested forcing that on anyone, or making it obligatory for non-christians.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Yes, it does... but "not worshipping other gods" is very different to killing those who do.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Eh? Since when? What branch of christianity are you speaking on behalf of?

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

On the contrary, the Old Testament is as relevant as the New.
Without reading and understanding the Old Testament law for example, how would any Christian appreciate how Jesus fulfilled it ?

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Well, that's the Crusades buggered than ;)

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Lot's of horrendous acts have been done under the pretence of following God, the Crusades being one.
There is nothing whatsoever in the Bible that encourages or condones the killing of others.

Before I get dragged further into this... please can we get back on topic.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Should have read my post instead, then :)

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Those that believe in the teachings of Christ, as he does not really appear in the Old Testament much does he;)

You are all to quick for me, I agree that it has meaning, just not to me

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

I think it's a bit late to suggest dragging this back to the original post.

Much as the situation has changed since then, so has the focus of discussion - the original topic is the context of the current discussion, and as such (and as OP) I believe we are still (mostly) on-topic.

---------- Post added at 17:08 ---------- Previous post was at 17:08 ----------

I refer you to the answer previously supplied by Jon M.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

It does, which makes sense if you are going to follow a religion, but nowhere in the bible does it say that Christianity is the only permissible religion on this planet. The Koran does actually say this. In fact the Old Testament part of the Bible is actually shared between Christianity/Catholism and Torah in Judaism, so...

The best way to highlight the difference in what I am saying is imagining religions as football teams, and all religions on this planet are in a league. Christanity is saying "If you want to support us, you can't support anyone else". That's fine. 1 team/religion for 1 person. Islam however, is saying that their the only team allowed to exist in the league.

It would be a bit funny if someone supported two religions & Gods simulataneously. In fact, I want to do that. Edge my bets for when the time comes :)

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Interesting point there Punky,

I'm not sure moderate Muslims would ascribe to that point of view to the letter though... we used to have an Iranian Muslim family that were perfectly happy to join in with our church services. Granted they may not have understood a lot of the implications of what was said to them there, but they certainly had an inclusive attitude to other faiths.
Likewise with a turkish girl who is a muslim and comes to our church, she regularly discusses and debates with us over whether we all worship one God or not.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

:tu: to punky, Jon M and SWW for answering my question - it was an honest one, you know :)

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

I think you'll find it's also shared by Islam...

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Indeed. I wasn't really saying how many, and which Muslims really ascribe to the view, only that the view exists in the Koran, and that some (the most famous being that Mahajaroon group, know allegedly dunfunct, thankfully) want to enforce that view.

I too know Muslims that embrace other religions, which goes further than merely allowing them to co-exist.

The fact that it exists in the Koran isn't a problem so much, but that some people will embrace it. In books so old they will reflect the time they were written in which a some things are incompatible with attitudes today.

Edit: The best example, is here

It should also be noted that this has been on the Internet for years, no Christians have ever called for anyone to be beheaded because of it, etc...

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

As someone has mentioned football hooligans, I am wondering how many say villa fans would get into the grounds at the next match if they all wore balaclavas, let alone waving placards saying "death to whoever" ?

Its not a case of tarring them all with the same brush, most are well aware theres more moderates and non radical activists than activists, however some who claim to be moderate, may well suddenly not be moderate if the need arises, and some will just quietly enjoy the show, while others will be as they say moderate in reality, but if these want a peaceful life here then they are going to have show themselves to stand out from the radicals one way or another else the inevitable will happen if the radicals continue with the current course.

Yes Allah maywell mean the word "God" but in most radicals eyes Allah is not the same God as any other faiths God, which is where the one religion only theme comes from, there is no other God but Allah and anything else is well fake to be nice about it.

Aparently the Seihks are up in arms over it all aswell, they are getting attacked by muslims and getting some backlash aswell and so are well and truly in the crossfire it seems.

When 7/7 happened it was Saudi I think said, we have got to stop permitting all these extremists in, many of them are highly dangerous criminals who are just as radical in their own country, hence why if they get caught and get away they are often on the way for asylum somewhere. The real problem is as we dont run these other coutries, we cannot tell wether an asylumn seeker is a radical extremist or an oppressed person running in fear for their lives, the two are indeed very close.

And for those who think none of them want to have anything else but a christian running britain, think again as several big UK Arab business websites have been took down and some likely still going for wanting precisly the opposite, which is the flag of Islam over #10 And do not misread this as my saying all islam wants it because I did not even infer that.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

I just heard about this site:

http://www.sorrynorwaydenmark.com/

A good initiative imo :tu:

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

The wee guy on my left shoulder says:
Dont publish and move on and discuss more important things like Chantelle and Preston.

The wee guy on my right shoulder says:
The cartoons should be published and then shoved down the throat of every immigrant who is living off the generosity of the peoples of this land.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Ok, if we ignore that the very earliest hebrews worshipped several gods, and concentrate on the one that Abraham picked, we get yaweh, who the jews don't name, the christians call god, and the muslims call allah.
They are all one and the same deity, or at least they're all from the same original diety.
Hebrews had the Torah, their book of g-d's laws etc describing how to live, stay healthy etc.
If your mother was a Jew, then you are a Jew, one of the "chosen" by g-d.
Someone couldn't convert.

Then Rabbi Joshua came along (aka Jesus to the Greeks and Isa to the muslims) and updated the Jewish faith with new teachings which were less day to day rules and more happy lifestyle rules which anyone could follow.
It also introduced the idea of conversion, where rather than one specific group being chosen, anyone could be chosen if they chose to live a certain way.
The teachings of Joshua were written down many years after he gave them, and so it is a matter of faith to believe they are accurate. This is made harder for those without faith because several hundred years after Joshua died, the bible pretty much as we know it today, was written, where men decided what should be included, and what should be destroyed.
They also ended the bible stating that no more should be added, thus ensuring that what they believed would be locked in place forever.

About 5 hundred years after Joshua, Mohammed came along, claiming to have been visited by the angel Gabriel with a new updated set of rules, the Koran (actually an old set of rules supposedly the true religion set up in Mecca by Abraham and Ishmael, however Psalm 83 states that the Ishmaelites are against the true god).
At the time, the bedouin had a mainly shamonic belief system, worshiping elements and dust devils etc, however they were aware of Joshua's teachings, although not in the same way as followers of the early church knew them via the bible.
The Koran comes after the teachings of Joshua, and recognises the previous prophets of the god of Abraham, just as the Bible does.
It also recognises that Jews and Christians are followers of Allah, in their own way and as such should be protected as brothers.

Unlike christianity, which started out as a very jewish sect, and didn't seperate until many years after Joshua died, when the jews revolted against the Romans after decreing someone else (I can't remember his name) as the messiah, Islam comes through Ishmael, the son who Abraham expelled into the desert with his mother to die.
Allah lead Ishmael to an oaisis, thus sparing his life, and creating the Ishmaelites.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Interesting...

http://www.guardian.co.uk/internatio...703501,00.html

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Your infidel summary is offensive to my faith, I reserve the right to visit Leighton Buzzard and tear you limb from limb ... :erm: ;)

Darned clever, the way you worked it out though. Goodness knows why all the millions who lived and died as Jews/Christians/Muslims didn't see it. If only we all had your clarity of thought and quasi-divine viewpoint. Have you ever heard of John Hick by any chance?

In all seriousness this is quite off topic. Can we get back to the topic of cartoons, satire and protest please.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

I was just showing how the three religions are linked as many people don't know.
For instance, a lot of people don't know that Islam acknowledges Isa as the messiah, or that Islam acknowledges jews and christians as "the chosen ones" long with muslims.

Perhaps it is easier for someone to see the links if they are able to take a step back and look at it from the outside.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

I know ... whilst generously lacing your illustration with a lot of sub-Dan Brown hokum. ;)

Anyway, you know I'll climb into the ring with you on this subject any time. Just not in this thread. :)

Back to the Muslim moral outrage please.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

and my little 2 bit

yes this is cool, people would be kicking off like this if it was jesus, but o no once again the muslin cause trouble !!! Do i need to say July 6th !!!

Did the cristians kick off NO

i am so sick of PC gone mad it is unreal

And yes i know a lot of ya will disagree with me but he yo that my views.

PS sorry about the spelling i am dyslesic*

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Did I say anything untrue?


Of the three religions, Islam is one which problably falls apart quickest under scrutiny, and is the one which is least tolerant of scrutiny.

Jews are able to question why should they not eat pork when these days its safe, or why they can't enjoy a nice cup of tea with milk while they eat roast beef.
Christians are able to ask whether the catholic way of worshiping is the correct way, or if they should set up their own church and worship how they see fit.

With these abilities, christianity and judaism are able to survive such questioning, and therefore tollerate it from people outside their religions.

Islam on the other hand doesn't tollerate much in the way of questioning it's beliefs.
As such many muslims who have not been exposed to the satyrical/questioning ways of the west see such action as insulting, especially if they have been told that the west is anti-islam (remember, many in the middle east have no idea that muslims exists in america for instance).

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Well, I personally am glad the "man" who dressed up as a suicide bomber has apologised and been put in jail (although, oddly, in last night's Evening Standard, he said he was just dressed normally.

Anyway, I know someone directly affected by the bomibings (she was in the building next to door to the bus that exploded). I haven't spoken to her recently, but it can not have been easy to see some **** dressed as a bomber on TV.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

which provider you go with? germany is very good value for ded servers, I have a few there.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Interesting stuff there from the Xaccers.

I once worked with a devout Muslim and completely innocently asked her one day, did the mountain move to Mohammed or did Mohammed move to the mountain. She looked at me like I was Frankenstein and ignored the question.

Suffice to say, I'm still waiting on an answer.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Once again, I have to say I believe it was entirely on-topic.

The whole issue of the cartoons/protest is that it would seem as if Muslim was pitted against Christian/Jew etc., yet all the while, it would seem that we ought to have more in common. Christians and Jews recognise this among themselves, but for some reasons a (large) section of the world's Muslims have been blinded to this.

And not by Mohammed or the Koran/Hadith.

It is up to Muslims to recognise that some (many?) of their imams are not what they seem...

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Therein lies the problem.
Those same such "corrupt" imams have managed to obtain power in many countries, and as the main source of religious teaching (in most cases the only source) they purpetuate their continued elevated positions.
If anyone questions them, they are branded a heretic.
This makes it nigh impossible to obtain enough of a gathering against them in order to over throw them.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Totally agree 100% with you there. :tu: Its not only the Imam's that we have to get rid of, but all the other corrupt people that rally with them, need to be removed too. Until this does not happen then it will be hard for all Muslims that want to live a peaceful life and abide by the laws in the respective countries they live in.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

The latest on this is that here in the UK they're trying to get legislation changed.

In this BBC story:
And specifically:
I wasn't aware that the RRA had anything in it regarding publication of cartoons...

And they also want to clamp down on the PCC's voluntary code of practice. Not that I quite understand how you can tighten up a voluntary code of practice...

Of course, when he says this:
The assumption on their part is that the insult was the intentional reason for publication.

But I have seen no proof that this is the case. Even the re-publications were not intended as an insult, but as a statement of support for freedom of speech.

It just goes to show that they have absolutely no understanding of Western culture, where satirical cartoons have sat alongside intelligent observation of the world, for a long time.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Has there been any more news on the suggestion that cartoons shown around the middle east by extremist muslims from Denmark are not those which were published, but much worse ones done by someone else and being used to stir up anti danish feelings?

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Not that I've seen.......in fact, afaik the original sh*t stirring cleric refused to say where he had obtained them from....but was happy to pass them off as having been published in the Danish paper.:rolleyes:

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Have you got a link to this Xaccers/Ramrod? Cheers :)

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

There's a bit (but not much) here:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/mid...st/4693292.stm

Edit: and there's wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jylland...ns_controversy

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

They really have no right to be this upset over some cartoons, not in the aftermath of 9/11, 7/7, Bali, Madrid and now this :afire:

---------- Post added at 19:08 ---------- Previous post was at 19:06 ----------

Here you go m8....interesting reading if it's true.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

That is a bit of a sweeping generalisation Rammy - as a religious group, Muslims have every right to be upset if these cartoons break a specific 'guideline' within their tradition (ie not producing a representation of Muhammed).

TBH, I feel that using examples such as 9/11 or the London bombings is somewhat disingenuous - these weren't particularly done in the name of Islam, but as a reaction to the western worlds involvement in the middle east. Using these examples does seem to tar all Muslims with the same brush which, in my opinion, is simply wrong.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

The guideline is up for debate.......many images of Muhamed exist already. The original cartoons were embellished with other, far more insulting ones as well.

Of course they were....and the demonstrators last week were supporting those acts in the name of Islam. That's the purpose of this thread......I feel that it is wrong of 'mainstream' Muslims to get so violently uptight over cartoons (which are after all merely poking fun at the fanatical element in their midst) whilst getting not nearly as worked up over many atrocities perpetrated by their own on us. I am trying to work out if I am wrong here or not.......




lol......I'm in the wrong thread as well :D

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

There is a certain amount of convergence between the two :)

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

I am surprised noone has reacted to the messages on some of their banners in london.

"massacre all that publish the pictures"
"say no to freedom of speach"

if they dont like it they free to move back to the middle east.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

What annoys me about all this, is that I have never seen in the news of any muslims condeming the the suicide bombers in Iraq who deliberateley target innocent men, women and children, even bombing funeral processions and in some cases hospitals. What I do here from muslim organisations is that the people in Iraq have the right to defend against foreign military occupations. Only the demands that we pull our troops out.

My answer to that firstly that the majority of leaders of these bombers are not from Iraq, and secondly, we are not targetting the innocent. The times we here that muslims look after their brothers, well, they are not looking after the innocent in Iraq, maybe they could have a march in support of them, which I very much doubt.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

To say that 9/11 was done in the name of Islam is one thing but to imply that it was done in the name of Islam and the majority of mainstream muslims agree with that (because you later say its mainstream muslims that are getting violently uptight over the pictures) is totally wrong.
All mainstraim muslim groups after 9/11 took adverts in the national press to condemn 9/11 as they did on the news and other programmes. 200 people waving hate filled placards on the streets of london is not representative of mainstream Islam in the UK

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Holy s**t

But look how many Arabic/Muslim names are at the bottom...

Also, interesting to see Rushdie getting in on the act. But thinking about it, there was a similar outcry over The Satanic Verses wern't there? Quite violent protests, but it soon died down... Speaking of which, haven't heard a lot about cartoon protests lately... Have Muslims just given up and accepted it then?

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Looks like the 'Church in Wales is in trouble (BBC):
Will this lead to further mad protests?

After all, this was the cartoon that France Soir used for it's front page when they re-published the Danish cartoons:

As I see it, this cartoon is satirising the reaction to the original cartoons.

Although in other reports the comment is being addressed to 'Muhammad' - it's not as if that's an uncommon name among Muslims. (Similarly the use of Jesus in South America - I have always thought it rather presumptuous to use the name of a 'deity' like that.) The point being, that it only becomes the 'Prophet Muhammad' if someone chooses to see it as such. i.e. whether the cartoon is a 'depiction' of the Prophet is arguable.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

mmm mm mmm.... I predict a riot... mmm mm mm

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

I'll keep you guys posted on any news of churches around here getting torched....

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

You mean about this of course ;) :rolleyes: :D

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Oh really?



And I don't see the show's producers cowering or withdrawing performances for fear of inflaming Christian opinion either ....

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

It was more a poke at the stupidity over what is only a sodding cartoon really...

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

And so many years later some fanatic finally tries to make good on the threats

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/8437433.stm

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Such a shame the attacker didn't get his 72 raisins....

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Interesting, If I remember correctly?

The author of the book Londonistan, claimed that muslims re-circulated the newspaper cartoons to stir up trouble. To spice things up a bit they also included extra cartoons that were more offensive than the original ones printed by the newspapers.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Whilst I believe the above is accurate, you have to take into account that the author of "Londonistan" is none other than Daily Mail bigot Melanie Phillips.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Yes she is, but a few of her claims including this one have been confirmed as fact. On the other hand where would you read of such facts, you don't exactly see the Guardian shouting about it.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

The thing that annoys/puzzles me is that the issue of images of the prophet Mohammed should be an 'internal' matter for Islam, not applied to other faiths/beliefs etc. Some of the Ten Commandments don't apply to everybody, eg 'You shall have no other gods before me'.

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

I'm guessing that the fuss is caused by extreme Musilms who use it to help their agenda. I guess for this reason they included extra images to stir up hatred.

I also believe the Islamic rule of view of 'Kill of Convert the infidels' adds to the problem, that is that Islam is blinkered and does not tolerate other religions. For this reason they see any negative comments about their religion as a serious attack.

It's in the T&Cs

Re: Should they be published in the UK?
 

Or there is the truth.....

Or as the CBBC website puts it