Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

ye it was boring, wouldn't have mind Chelsea sneaking in a winner but hey, as Denny rightly said no one deserved 3 points.

Arsenal 2 up, Gibbs on the scoresheet :tu: Theo too or two ;) a few more goals would be nice :Yes:

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Its simply not good enough at the moment against Wigan.:td::td::mad::mad:

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Is it a case of,..the king is dead, long live the king?

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

:bigcry::bigcry:

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

:D I shouldn't laugh..and i am trying, but..

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Arteta scores a beauty to seal the win 3nil

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Its ok Colin as l have broad shoulders.:)

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

I think its very sporting of Liverpool to donate three points to a fellow Lancashire club.:D

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Nice tribute at The Reebok... :tu:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england...ester-17498947

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Yes it was lovely to see that.:tu:

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Yes, very charitable :rofl:

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

brilliant, top class :tu:

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

You are taking it well. :D

But on serious note, it does raise questions about king kenny, though I doubt whether he will lose his job..unless liverpool totally collapse..and even then, question marks may be more about the players

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

The pitch isn't in bad condition at Stoke for once

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Nasri has improved in last few games...he was very much a passenger earlier in the season

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

after a few pumped up performances. he must of settled in with his new pay pack, got bored.. wants another payrise now

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

l always take things well as my family say l am so laidback that l will fall off the chair but seriously l think most of the blame lies with the players as some of them are clearly underperforming and if they don't start to get their finger out then Kenny has to decide whether certain players have a future at the club.:)

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

:D

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Goal of the season by Peter Crouch for Stoke against Man City.:clap::clap:

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

seriously?! i tuned out at HT :banghead:

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Just remember the name Van Basten.:D

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Not the best quality, but here you go MvB's goal was much bettter though.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

yeah Van Bastens was better but still... 'take a bow' :shocked:

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

l won't disagree with that but nevertheless still a great goal from someone who has always been under-rated by many.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

I always was impressed with his skills with the feet, for a tall lanky guy he has a nice touch (and i will never ever say that about a guy again :D )

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Oh yes. It's a great goal, but what made van Basten's goal truly exceptional was the impossible angle. There's none of that in this goal. Still a cracking goal though :tu:

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

I donated over 100 quid to the overpaid wasters' wage fund go and watch that

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Well Celtic might win the Scottish title by a distance but they are certainly being given a mauling by Rangers.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Officials were probably told to not let celtic win today...to ensure the animals don't riot

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Steady on old chap.:)

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Just my view on the people who cause trouble

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Great start by Newcastle as they are running the show at West Brom.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

It must be a contender

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2012/03/10.gif

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

A very good article about Liverpool - http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/foo...-failings.html

I think that sums up their current state very well.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Its seems critics are only to quick to come to conclusions about football clubs and l remember the knives were out for other clubs earlier in the season yet those voices of doom seem to have suddenly gone quiet and l think people should also remember that it would take at least 3 to 5 years for Liverpool to regain more prominence and those words came from the owners and in my mind people just have to be more patient as things cannot be turned around overnight and l do rightly remember when SAF came to Man Utd the same type of surgery was needed and at one stage he was very close to the sack but the club stood strong and kept patience with him and we all know what followed so l also thing patience is required at Liverpool as it takes time to turn the ship around.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

The thing that argument would work if there were more evident sign of upward progress and if he hadn't been given a lot of money which he has poorly invested in the team. He also dealt poorly with the racism story this season but has meant spending a lot of goodwill he had amongst the press.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Chris Bascombe has never written a very good article in his life and I very much doubt he's going to start doing so anytime soon.

It is shameful that a that a credible publication should give a two-bit hack with a massive chip on his shoulder licence to waste ink and electrons.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Yes true Liverpool handed the racism story poorly but lets remember we have won a trophy and lets also remember players sometimes can take over a season before they show their true potential and if l righty remember Several others clubs have had to be patient with big name signings as they can take a fair while to adapt to a different style of play and tactics so l think perhaps the time to judge Liverpool and Kenny is at the end of next season as short-termism never did any club any good as we are now seeing at another London club.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

I think the reaction to Liverpool shows how little significance is given to winning cups if you don't perform in the league.

Liverpool's issue is quite simply that they are not in contention for a Champions League spot which it's fans and owners believe is where Liverpool should be. In reality this is difficult given there are five clubs better than Liverpool in the league; United, City, Chelsea, Tottenham and Arsenal. However Liverpool are a way behind Newcastle and risk finishing behind Sunderland and Everton amongst others. Additionally they have spent considerably more than some of those teams to build the current squad of players. The team that goes out cost more than Arsenal and United. Some of those players, especially the more expensive ones, were the responsibly of Kenny Daglish and Damien Comolli.

I agree he shouldn't be fired but he is under performing for the money he was given.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

An interesting stat....

Liverpool have taken 24 points from the last 20 league games under Dalglish.

Hodgson was only manager for 20 league games. He was sacked for his poor record of picking up just 25 points.

So it must be the Carling Cup that will keep Dalglish in the job ?

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Exactly, yes man yesman :D

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Daglish is the Brian Clough of Liverpool. He could get them relegated and the fans would still love him.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Certainly a fair statement.

This season was always going to a dip into untested waters for the club. Such a massive upheaval in the playing staff was a risky gamble as was the moneyball style transfer strategy thus placing boundaries on players who may be selected as transfer targets.

Unfortunately, in a results driven business Kenny comes under scrutiny as the sensationalism hungry media circle like vultures for the next defeat or draw against a relegation zone club as do all of the other attention seeking non-entities who crawl out of the woodwork thinking that they have a valid opinion. The more even handed will see the bigger picture.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

What is the big picture? Is Kenny right, and no matter what happens, it will come right eventually?

Or is it that he should have done better, and the club needs a more tactical manager?

Or is it a mixture, no one can guarantee success, and Liverpool must learn that they are not guaranteed success, as Newcastle have learned...leeds...etc

I favour the last one :D

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Well Colin everybody is entitled to their opinion but l disagree with you as l believe in time the manager and the owners patience will eventually reap Dividends.:)

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

I know :D.

But I sometimes think that fans (and club owners) forget, there is only one winner, 19 will always be disappointed.

If you stretch it to a champion's league place...4 happy (though 4th place does have qualifying), 16 sad...of the 16, 3 really sad..they get relegated

:D

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

The big picture is that it's a long way back from the brink of administration and after a lengthy period of turmoil some decorum, stability and continuity is required. Nobody said that turning the fortunes of the club around while implementing a model of financial sustainability was going to be easy. Mistakes were made but none that can't be corrected with the correct attitude and mentality on and off the pitch.

Roy Hodgson was seen by some (including his buddies in the media) as the person to have steadied the ship but he was unfortunately for him, in teh wrong place at the wrong time. The fact that he was more adept at putting his foot in his mouth than managing matters on the pitch won him no support. This was ultimately the straw that broke the camel's back and he had to go. Yet more instability and with his (and Purslow's) indescretions in the transfer market this was more unneccessary damage for the current hierarchy to sort out: Offloading the likes of Joe Cole, Poulsen and Konchesky.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

There is no apparent application of Moneyball principles in Liverpool's transfer strategy. This appears to be a myth born of the fact that their owners applied Moneyball to the Boston Red Sox. However, they do not appear to have applied it at Liverpool.

Moneyball isn't so easily applied to Football anyway. The concept of Moneyball is to get value by carefully analysing statistics on players, 'Sabermetrics', and buying players that offer the best value per measurable quality. This was an easier revolution in Baseball as their statistics are easier to measure because the play is much less fluid. You throw the ball, you hit it, you get on base, you score a run if you can. The play goes again. Each part extremely measurable, with little team dynamics effecting the runner or the person on bat. It was also a bigger revolution in a sport which neglected such statistics for a long time.

Football has long used statistics such as ProZone and did take on board Moneyball principles when they spotted them emerging from Oakland 10 years ago. However football is a lot harder to measure. You can measure assists but that can vary greatly depending upon the pattern of play, the way the team is set up, and the striker they served. You can measure goals but, again, goals can vary widely depending on the set up of the team. A team may be all out attack or funnel their play via a single striker. Last season Arsenal were the former, depending on many players providing goals and assists with players cutting in from the flanks. Doesn't mean Van Persie was rubbish last season. Equally how do effectively measure the impact of full backs or a defensive midfielder? How do you measure a creative playmaker like Xavi?

No, Football finds the application of Moneyball style principles far more difficult. There are a lot of clever people trying and, were possible, ProZone is applied to measure fatigue levels, running speeds, when to time impact subs and when to take them off.

Liverpool are not applying Moneyball principles. It's just a myth. They have done the opposite. Paying over the odds for ineffective players based on their hype and/or form, buying them because they look good. £35 million for Carroll after 6 to 8 months of good form for example. That is actually the antithesis of Moneyball which was designed to find hidden value in unlikely places . Newcastle have a far better claim when it comes to getting value out of the transfer market.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

There are some statistical metrics kicking about with regards to Downing and Adam inparticular for last season (I'll try to find them when I get home). Henderson is a player with considerable technical ability who is struggling to translate this in a game of competitive football. I disagree that a measure of statistical analysis and focus on potential has not been a major factor in our transfers.

I agree that Carroll was probably a panic buy and the funny money involved in the transfer deal has put him under great scrutiny based on the fact that he does not appear to fit into the fluid system of football the club are trying to implement.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

A 'focus on potential' is at the root of a lot of football transfers. Liverpool played roughly £20 million for Henderson and while I agree he has a lot of ability this was evident without the use of statistical metrics. He was capped for England. The price tag reflected that, at £20 million this was money that commands a big name.

I think Downing and Adam are probably prime evidence that the approach isn't working. Henderson will likely become good, Adam not so, Downing will be a decent players but never spectacular and at £20 for a player of 27 you'll never get value out of that transfer.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Old Trafford atmosphere gets to the Ref again... :rolleyes:

---------- Post added at 22:52 ---------- Previous post was at 22:07 ----------

This is great news :tu:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/17512080

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

I agree :tu:

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

yea great stuff :D

what happened, who ref'd

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Clear Penalties are denied every week.

Penalty shouts are denied every week in every game.

There is no conspiracy between Man utd and Ref's.

:sleeping:

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Didn't say it was a conspiracy between Man Utd & refs, it's the atmosphere in the ground...

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Sure...

Every time there is a chance of a penalty at SJP we go mental, But don't recieve one..

I'm guessing it's because we aren't Man utd fans :erm:

You don't happen to support City do you?

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Shouldn't that be SDA? ;)

And, with respect, there's not the same weight of expectation for success from fans at SDA.

The home crowd at OT can be very intimidating for a ref.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Must have intimidated ref's into doing all of this.

v Newcastle 26th November 2011 - Incorrect penalty given for Newcastle, goal for Manchester United wrongly disallowed for offside

v Crystal Palace 30th November 2011 - Glenn Murray's winner offside and allowed to stand

v Blackburn 1st January 2012 - De Gea fouled as Grant Hanley scores the winner

v Ajax 23rd February 2012 - Alderweireld's winner offside and allowed to stand

v Bilbao 8th March 2012 - De Marcos offside goal allowed to stand. Ref gives a free kick against Evra for not having his boot on which leads to a Bilbao goal to make it 1-3 on the night.

Or the united fans were absent for these =[

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

The £20M transfer fee has been flatly denied by the club (in an interview with Damien Comolli himself).

There was an excellent article in the FT a while ago on the moneyball factor with focus on both Comolli and Arsene Wenger in his use of statistical analysis to support transfer activity. And here it is:

linky

My concern over this approach at Liverpool is that the strategy is very much at the mercy of a previously untested relationship between Comolli and the manager. This is something that soon soured between himself and Jol at Spurs when things started going badly. Does Kenny really have the last word on transfers? Apparently he does but I am pretty certain that he is working within boundaries beyond his control.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

No, I support Southampton because that's where I was born...

---------- Post added at 01:42 ---------- Previous post was at 00:58 ----------

Was it or wasn't it a penalty? Vast weight of opinion from the pundits was that it was...

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Typical. Still there should be a twist or two left in this race for the title.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Thats brilliant to hear that.:tu:

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

It was a penalty...and giggs tackle should be red card

If either had happened when city were playing, it would have definitely been both.

Poor showing by ref.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Yet again another ref at OT has bottled it.:td::(

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Good post :tu:

When I read his post, I took it that he was replying to your assertion about the crowd, not the validity of the claim.

I don't know if you watched it or not, but the crowd appeared to be even more subdued than normal, even at that point.

Oh, I support my local club as well ;)

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Thought there was no atmosphere at Old Trafford.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

A fact from Opta

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

But we can't let these facts get in the way of the 'you never get anything at old trafford' bandwagon...

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-17515992

:tu:

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Great news and its about time some decent punishment was meted out to these sick idiots.:tu:

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

yeah I hope this guy IF found guilty is punished too! Infact I'd love a restraining order on him from Arsenal to not support the club, feck off..

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2...t-arsenal-game

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Gotze has signed a contract until 2016 with Dortmund.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

I have it on very good authority that Swansea will be a very hostile city towards him upon his return.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Well l am sure Arsene Wenger with his good contacts will have many more potential targets to go for so if one player wants to stay put then there are many others who will jump at the chance of joining one of Europes top clubs.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Gotze wasn't ever going to sign, he'll move to Barca when departing Dortmund.

Arsenal have so far supposedly completed the signing of Lewis Holtby. Matty Suarez awaits a work permit. Podolski has a relegation clause in his contract which seems to be stopping that deal being wrapped up too, no point paying extra when you can pay 5 odd mill Koln get relegated.

Theres strong rumours that Arsenal are trying to wrap up Vertonghen and M'Vila. A new keeper could be on the cards if Fabianski leaves.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Yeah the rumours on M'Vila have been around for a while but then so were the ones about Hazard and Gotze. I like the idea of M'Vila as Song seems to want to bomb forward a lot. Not sure we need a Hazard or Gotze with Wilshere, Walcott and Chamberlain alongside Song, M'Vila, and Miyaichi to come back.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

not sure but theres voices inside Arsenal saying a big name from France is likely to come in. That said Arsenal officials were said to have been sent to Germany for Gotze last week.

heres an old article on Lewis Holtby > http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/foo...das-touch.html

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Yeah it's all just rumours at the moment. M'Vila would be good in the continuing quest to sure up the defence.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

What about another forward to share the load with RVP.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Podoski is likely to arrive.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

French Second Division Club Angers sign Lionel Messi... :shocked:

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

:D

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Good try danielf.:D

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Well, it's true, isn't it? :shrug:

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

True by name but not by talent or wagepacket.:)

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

I fancy torres making a statement tonight...and scoring a goal :D

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Well lets hope so Colin.:)

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

He won't score if he keeps staying on the wing. He is a good crosser, but that ain't getting me a goal.

---------- Post added at 20:22 ---------- Previous post was at 20:19 ----------

Torres is like the gf in bed...I know what I want her to do..she knows what i want her to do..but I'm not going to tell her in case she stops everything in a huff :D

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

:LOL:

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

I avoided saying, you can be a good crosser of the ball..but sometimes just go for goal..and remember..as far as I'm concerned, there is no offside rule :D

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Well he did not score a goal but he made the goal as Chelsea take a precious win back to Stamford Bridge.:)

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Great all those people that rob and attack people wandering the streets and we jail someone who calls a spade a spade (his words not mine :D). Still guess your every day Joe getting beaten up doesn't create many headlines and we've seen from the riots just how tough the law can be when headlines have been made.

---------- Post added at 13:23 ---------- Previous post was at 13:22 ----------

Holtby would be a good signing imo

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Totally agree. Sent to prison for basically being a ****** on twitter while people commiting far worse crimes get a slap on the wrist.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

I think there are a number of issues here, the first of which is to be clear on what he actually did.

He did not just post a single racist message about Muamba. He then posted a series of racist and sexist messages directed specifically at other members of the site who found his initial post offensive. I won't repeat what he said but they were very offensive and meant to be read by the people he was abusing, he sent them those messages. There seems to be a desire to lessen the extent of his abuse to that single message about Muamba as make the sentence seem more egregious than it actually is.

That doesn't mean a jail sentence is warranted of course. However I think it's good to see action taken against these sick messages that are becoming increasingly common on the Internet and Twitter. It's worth taking a look at the messages Stan Collymore receives, it's often a unrelenting stream of explicit, sometimes violent, racial abuse whenever he comments on any topic. This is not a minor problem. It is not 'people being stupid on Twitter'. It's very nasty people hiding behind their perceived anonymity to constantly abuse people because of the colour of their skin or their gender. They have also taken to trolling the Facebook pages of the recently deceased to cause further grief to their families, again this will be tinged with racial and/or sexist abuse if they were not a white male.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Have you seen him play, could you write up a little review of what to expect?

I've not read much on the guy tbh, a few short comments and this http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/foo...das-touch.html all pretty much saying hes a quality player

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Newcastle's European chances.

The picture became a little clearer after the results of last night's FA Cup quarter finals.

With Spurs and Chelsea now certain to provide one of the FA Cup finalists and both likely to qualify for Europe by finishing in at least the top five, the FA Cup Europa place is now only realistically available to Everton.

If the Toffees fail to make the final then we are almost certain to qualify for Europe, unless one of the teams below Liverpool (at least ten points behind us) can finish above us.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

I don't think anyone is upset he has got punished. He deserved what he got. But was he anything other than a stupid little boy acting the big man on Twitter and FB? I believe the only reason he got a jail sentence is because it went viral and that is no way to have a justice system.
He wasn't the only person to make disgusting comments, but he was the only person who went viral.

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

Newcastle might be able to nick 5th of Chelsea! Don't you still have to play them?

Re: Football Season 2011/12
 

And Chelsea fixture list in April looks very tough indeed so Newcastle have a fair chance of overhauling them as Chelsea could have potentially 3 very tough semi finals to play in April.