Re: smoking and the pub
 

The Lounge closed earlier this year (still looking for the link).

edit: here.

As I've said, I have no choice with regards to where I go in the Swansea/Port Talbot areas for pubs which have a no-smoking policy. The closest I can get is Llanelli which, apart from being 20 miles away, is South Wales' very own Royston Vasey.

Re: smoking and the pub
 

It's nothing at all like saying that - anyway the point I'm making is that there are lots of carcenogens you quite happily indulge in every day.

If we are to ban smokings how about a ban on this lot as well??????????

Re: smoking and the pub
 

Well, for a start, the proposed law will not ban smoking. It will, however, control more tightly the way in which tobacco can be used. In much the same way as legislation already controls the use of (I would surmise) most, if not all, of the chemicals on your list.

Re: smoking and the pub
 

True,

It's just that the buzz word everybody seems to be banging on about is "Choice". None of use have a "choice" but to breathe in the crap the some foundries and chemical plants kick out, some people don't have a choice but to leave beneath high voltage power line, some people don't have choice but to leave on estates where there are high volumes of Radon gas.

At the moment you do have the choice to go into a smoking or non-smoking area.

and now because of this legislation your choices will be even clearer as we will now have smoking or non-smoking pubs.

So now I can't see what the problem is?

Re: smoking and the pub
 

I'm not so sure, http://www.greenpeace.org/internatio...mpaigns/toxics
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I hardly think a reasoned look at the effect on depression and social isolation of the smoking ban is 'insiduous'. If that of course is what you are referring to.

Re: smoking and the pub
 

What makes you think I am happily indulging in them?
I disagree. One of the main points being made on this thread by those opposing a ban is that there are many other dangerous substances out there such as alcohol, drugs, and car exhaust fumes. But that is completely beside the point, and how on earth is it an argument against protecting us from smoking? This is why I said about the Aids cure thing - it's like saying 'well what is the point of focusing on reducing the dangers caused by one thing and not on others?'
I really do think this concern is another 'straw clutcher'. Is this honestly an argument being put forwards - let's not stop people smoking because it might make them feel depressed?? I think finding out you have lung cancer would be pretty depressing...

Re: smoking and the pub
 

Please (re)read my previous posts on this subject. This a a rather glib response to the serious issue of mental health problems. The fact that you may or may not get lung cancer is not going to have much bearing on somebody suffering a mental illness.

Re: smoking and the pub
 

figure of speech.

But why single out smoking when it is proven that all these other things affect people that have no choice.

whereas non-smokers have a choice.

and to use your anology it's like saying we can cure Aids, Cancer, Hepatitis, Ebola, glandular fever and Bird flu.

But that would be too expensive at this time so we'll pick an easy target and cure the common cold. Only they can't cure the cold all they can do is hand out lemsips.

Re: smoking and the pub
 

I have re-read your posts and I still disagree that this is a relevant point that goes against a ban. As said before, no one is being forced to quit, and furthermore from what I have read, smoking and depression perpetuate each other, and smoking can cause depression, or make it more likely that you will develop depression.

Even if smoking were a good remedy for depression this still has no effect or benefit for non-smokers, and smoking and passive smoking are still bad for the health!
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You cannot compare smoking to the common cold in your analogy as smoking is one of the most dangerous and risky causes of cancer of all of the things affecting our healths on a daily basis. And even if your analogy were true, so what? How is that a bad thing? Maybe it is too expensive and too difficult to cure those illnesses yet, doesn't mean we should sit on our asses and do nothing!

Re: smoking and the pub
 

If the Government spent money on all of those things then they would save lives.

They could ban cars in town centres to stop the passive intake of car fumes, quite easily just make it so that anyone driving into a citry centre has to have an electric car.

But they target the perceived threat of passive smoking

I don't see where there is a difference, if they were to announce a series of initiatives where they were to address all of the carcinogens in the atmosphere then I would support a total smoking ban. But they're not.

There is even little hard evidence on the effects of "passive smoke" but there is hard evidence on the effects of lead and other heavy elements that are kicked out into the atmospshere every day and little is done.

Re: smoking and the pub
 

How is that easy? It's nowhere near as easy as saying right, stop smoking indoors.
I can't understand your logic. Yes I agree it would be much better if we were to address all carcinogens in the atmosphere, but as we are not, surely it is better to attack the one we are??

If you want rid of cancer provoking poisons, why refuse to support a ban on smoking on the principle that not all carcinogens are being considered? All the time you are resting on your principles, people are continuing to puff out smoke into the air...

Re: smoking and the pub
 

Raising other issues is just a diversionary tactic. Yes more should be done to reduce air pollution, especially given the major rise in respiratory diseases, but that doesn't mean smokers should be allowed to pollute enclosed public spaces.

Re: smoking and the pub
 

OK, so I'm grandstanding (just a little ;) ). But the difficulty I have with the mental health angle is that those who put it on the agenda are pushing supposition and estimates of illness as reasons for not introducing a public ban. This merely begs comparison with the general health argument in favour of a ban - statistics that have been quoted in this thread ad nauseam - yet they are quiet on that point. Either health is an issue or it isn't; if it is, then the death-from-smoking argument wins hands down.

Re: smoking and the pub
 

Because it's a soft target, the links between passive smoking and any of the smoking related illnesses have not been categorically proven.

Anyway I'm not bothered for me the argument is over, I am an infrequent smoker usually having a smoke only whenever I am having a drinking session.

And I'm happy to say that my local does not serve food and therefore my enjoyment of a night out will not be affected.

Re: smoking and the pub
 

And until they are there in black and white in front of your eyes, you don't see why you should allow your 'enjoyment' on a night out be slightly marred by a little walk outside to light up...:rolleyes: