Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

:rofl:

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Keep getting constant jitter spikes, any ideas anyone?

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2015/02/14.png

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

OMG thats bad ;)

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Remember, it's not lag - it's bullet time!

I think you're suffering from high utilisation, there. Best just cancel the whole thing.

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

What does India say, Craigie? You need a new computer?

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

They told me i need a bigger gun to make my gaming faster and then suggested i went to America to get one :D

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Have you tried rebooting? :scratch:

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Or a pinhole reset?

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

or run off Dublins bent server

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

I think heavy downloaders in your local area network are to blame although its not at a level where it can be passed on to the network team yet.

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Ironically, I think thats the most replies a post has ever gotten :D

---------- Post added at 20:48 ---------- Previous post was at 20:31 ----------

thanks :)

Couldnt think of the word so made one up

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

How come the base latency is so good ?

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

[img]Download Failed (1)[/img]

woohhhhoooo back to normal.... that uploading isn't on my network so that's one other guy destroying the entire neighborhood.

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

It's never ONE guy. One person does not have the ability to congest the entire network.

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Virgin have won when they get customers blaming others for their poor connection. Virgin not supplying enough up or downstream for the amount of customers connected is where I would lay the blame.

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

one user with 10 or 12 meg upload could easily kill 1 upstream channel

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

How do you work that one out? Each upstream has about 30mbit of bandwidth. Sure, one person on 10meg upload could saturate over 1/3 of it, but hardly kill it.

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

20

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

30

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DOCSIS#...onal_standards

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Data rate = #_Bits_per_symbol * Symbol_Rate

Bits per symbol = 4
Symbol Rate = 5120000

= 20,480,000

or 20.48Mb/s

---------- Post added at 13:30 ---------- Previous post was at 13:30 ----------

http://volpefirm.com/blog/docsis-101...1_upstream-rf/

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

So it's because Virgin uses QAM16, then? Today I learned.

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

I guess it's the poor state of the field plant and the number of modems per channel that doesn't let them get to QAM64.

I see a lot of cut cables outside old VM customer houses in my area. I bet they haven't been disconnected at the cab.

My upstream power is all over the place from 41 to 44dBmV

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Exactly!!

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Whoops, missed this earlier (haven't been on much lately)

TCP overhead is typically 1.5-3% of the downstream usage. Then add on top DOCSIS overheads, and the fact an upstream channel has really about 1/3rd the capacity of a downstream channel, that means 4.5-9% of the upstream channel I just rounded that to 5-10%.

---------- Post added at 17:22 ---------- Previous post was at 17:16 ----------

Heh, well... On 50Meg they had 2 upstreams for every area (theoretically), but at half the bandwidth, so one upstream per 4 channels. What they have now, I don't know, but if it is 1-between-8, then that is not a good thing given general utilization in both directions will be higher now than it was when 50 came out.

50 didn't run particularly smoothly in areas with high utilization - engineers in my area quoted 90% capacity in use 90% of the time (!) - and getting more than 300Kbps upload was a chore some days.

The problem isn't him using his connection, both upstream and downstream channels are shared between hundreds of users. Other people using it to capacity will cause problems for him whether he uses it himself or not.

Bandwidth over the whole channel (8x55Mbit on the downstream, 1x20Mbit on the upstream).

Remember upstream is inherently inefficient on cable, because of the requirement for CSMA and guard intervals, etc. and you will rarely be able to use entirety of a channel's upstream capacity. The practical maximum is closer to 16-18Mbit available for actual use.

55Mbps dowstream with 2% used for ACKs is around 1.1Mbps if everything behaves efficiently, depending on RWIN, MTU, OS, etc. this can vary both up and down. Don't forget also a single 100/10 user could eat up over half the upstream capacity on such a channel.

(An ACK takes around 54 bytes 'on the wire', which with a pessimistic minimum MTU of 576 bytes, and no ack suppresion, etc., means 8 downstream channels could actually require ~40Mbps of upstream capacity in an almost-worst-case-scenario, without anybody doing any actual data uploads)

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

So on a channels with (in best case) 18Mbit useable bandwidth, on 8 downstreams, 8.8Mbit could be used just on acknowledgements, then there are users expecting to get 10 or 12Mbit upload speeds :erm:

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

The obsessive speedtester need not necessarily be you - remember, all capacity is shared. Some other person obsessively speedtesting (and using up over 50% of the network capacity at such a time) could well be the cause.

---------- Post added at 17:35 ---------- Previous post was at 17:34 ----------

Derp:
https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/local/2014/10/8.png

---------- Post added at 17:37 ---------- Previous post was at 17:35 ----------

Best-case involves ACK suppression (VM don't bother with this) SACK's, zero packet loss and large RWINs that reduce ACK overhead to well under 1%.

The 1.5% - 3.0% overhead I quote is for typical real-world scenarios.

[Edit]
Never mind, you meant at best 18Mbps useable upload bandwidth, yes, right.

That said I'm only speculating on the number of upstream channels. Some people supposedly report their area only has one, but in the past common practice was to have at least two (at that time they were half the capacity per channel though)


---------- Post added at 17:40 ---------- Previous post was at 17:37 ----------

Yes they do.

A "one guy" with 10Mbps upload speed on a 20Mbps channel can easily cause congestion - congestion can become visible at as low as 60-70% utilization on the upstream. All other users need only be using 30% of available capacity between them before one 100/10 user can "congest the entire network"

---------- Post added at 17:41 ---------- Previous post was at 17:40 ----------

Way to advertise... "Press here to cripple our network".

---------- Post added at 17:42 ---------- Previous post was at 17:41 ----------

Up until a few months ago some areas still used BPSK. The BPSK => 16QAM upgrade only started in 2011.

That said till recently the Superhub also clearly displayed 20Mbps next to the upstream channels on its normal status pages.

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

AFAIK, VM used TAS (Ack Suppression) in the form of Turbodox. I don't know the poosition now, but I imagine it could still be in use. Here is a supporting quote from Mark Wilkin in September 2010:

We've just released the new 12.01 firmware update for VM300 Cable Modems across our network.

The new firmware was tested over the past 8 weeks with 2000 customers including volunteers from this forum and we've seen no significant issues in testing.

The new firmware enables 100Mbps throughput for our forthcoming 100Mbps service and is also designed to improve upstream stability and throughput. It also turns back on the TDOX feature that was switched off in July with the 10.12 firmware, due to a bug affecting performance.

BTW, note VM saying that the VMNG300 was fit for 100 meg.

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

it could be if eg. the normal utilisation is say 60% and then a top tier user with 10 or 12 upload goes full throttle. On a 18mbit US channel one user can use more than half of the bandwidth, a 12mbit customer can use 2/3 of a US channel by them self. Your comment is right if the normal utilisation is 0% which isnt the case. I have been surprised to hear reports VM have been activating 120/12 in areas with no US bonding, seems nuts.

---------- Post added at 18:12 ---------- Previous post was at 18:09 ----------

Ultimately thats the problem, in particular too many modems per service group, but also that isnt fat enough pipes at the docsis level as well. Any setup that has a customer able to use more than half of a shared pipe is going to be fragile even at 2:1 contention.

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

As far as I know 12Mbit upload is never implemented before 2-channel bonded upstream is implemented. In other words, 40Mbps upload channels are a prerequisite before anybody gets 12Mb

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Qas are you sure large rwins reduce ack overhead? The only thing I have found that affects ack overhead is delayed acks, nagle algorithm and adjusting mtu(mss) size. Whilst boosting rwin allows higher throughput the ack throughput goes up with it. Also supressing acks isnt without consequence, its good for certian bulk downloads but bad for small packets. sacks also sends the same amount of acks, the difference sacks offers is just how recovery works if packets are dropped.

---------- Post added at 18:19 ---------- Previous post was at 18:19 ----------

Thats what I thought until my neighbour was put on 12mbit without bonding and I seen reports on tbb with the same.

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

I have seen quite a large number of 12Mbit users on 1 upstream on the VM forum

---------- Post added at 18:34 ---------- Previous post was at 18:33 ----------

LMAO, wish someone would have quoted that when Mark posted about the 92Mbit limit :D

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

You can ACK a whole RWIN with a single ACK (instead of, say, ~50 or so which is more usual). As you mention though, it doesn't work effectively in all scenarios (i.e. I did say zero packet loss)
Oh. Fail. :erm:

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Had an interesting episode tonight, anyone wanna explain why my min latency went so extreme? For about 30mins ping to bbc.co.uk was 900 LOL, Neighbour had same prob too. Guess they were doing some work to the exchange?

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/s...31-01-2013.png

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

New Broadband Graph

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/local/2013/08/4.png

The old one went to a sea of red.

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Nice

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

What sorcery is that? That graph is perfect!

Mine is fairly okay during weekdays but it goes off the rails over the weekend, especially Sundays. Not as good as yours by far though!

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/s...31-01-2013.png

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/s...31-01-2013.png


http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/s...31-01-2013.png

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Do virgin have some decent areas or are those mislabled openreach graphs? :p:

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Are you doubting my integrity again?

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

If you're asking Seph where he keeps his Horse?….
…..I'm still in the same semi-detached "loose-box" in Brighton! :dunce:

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

No - he's calling me "stable".

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Clearly there is some well intended confusion here :dmonk:

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Was problem with an amplifier last time
Seems again same problem this time of the day
[img]Download Failed (1)[/img]

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

I'm not far from Brighton ;)

you wish

:no: theres always an underlying message somewhere https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2013/02/10.gif

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

thenry, has your BB improved? This is ours at the moment:
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/s...03-02-2013.png

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

decent looking, no rise and fall on yours i see. look in the Crawley thread mate.

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

[img]Download Failed (1)[/img]

I'm not sure what is going on here. The normal, overnight, section is with all systems off as is the slightly spiky bit at the start of the graph. The rest is with my main PC on.

I have checked my system for malware using SpyHunter. Some minor stuff removed, but still my latency is elevated. Also checked for unknown applications, the sort that piggy back on other software installations and install themselves when you omit to uncheck those damn boxes that are checked by default! I can find nothing unusual that wasn't there before.

Something has changed. Any ideas?

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Have you got secure wi-fi?

If so are you using WEP for the security, if so change it to WPA and change your wireless password too, and use a good one, not password or something stupid like that. http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/technolo...ords-revealed/

Setup a new monitor and get it to keep an eye on your connections default gateway. You can then see if the problem is just your connection or not ;)

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Make sure there is not any program running at background at pc

If there is not any other 3rd part router & is just the sh alone at modem mode ... turn it on with router mode, turn firewall on and see if is the same

Also check if they are logged any other strange devices apart the one you using at home
(where reports their ip)
Check the log page because if is any attack i think the SH it reports it

Don't remember what page cos still on modem mode mine

I have modem mode, at the moment, but my draytek reports and blocks other devises if will ever manage go into my network by automatic or manually settings

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Anyone want to hazard a guess what the was up last night.
In my sig.

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Someone plugged in a signal jammer

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

:LOL:

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

VF

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

And again and again

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Something happen last night for anyone else, from about midnight to 3am?

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/s...11-02-2013.png

I was fast asleep so not bothered, like!

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Not here.

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Nope, fine here:

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/s...11-02-2013.png

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Just me then! I'll keep an eye on it, it's rock stable now so probably just a simple glitch.

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/s...11-02-2013.png

nope fine here... oh wait...

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Looks fine to me.

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2013/02/42.jpg

Anyone for a swim? :D

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Also looks fine.

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

looks fine

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

I went from 4 downstream to 6 and 1 upstream to two earlier today.
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/s...11-02-2013.png

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Anyone Up for a laugh (I have just created mine).

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/s...d358b7ac1.html

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2013/03/21.png

The high utilization is causing me so much grief. :(

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Seems you were right -

Reply on the 27/1/13 :
Reply on 5/2/13 after request for further info :
Reply on 8/2/13 after someone else asked about the SNR fix :
The dates just keep getting pushed further and further back :mad:

Still makes for interesting feedback on their trial Im taking part in

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

That was our situation about six months ago. It's not terminal, although you may feel like it could be. Chin up dude :)

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Dunno about you but that looks horrendous to me. Among the worst cases of congestion I've seen this year.

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Started geting small packet loss, all the time this last week 1 to 4 % and today seems to be geting worse going up to 10%, the high utilisation fix date keeps geting push back it now 06/03/2013, this is in the Bradford area bd17

Could this packet loss im seeing be any thing to do with the work been carryed out or is this a new error?

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/s...12-02-2013.png

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

It could be due to upstream noise introduced while work is being carried out.

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

That is the reason I left virgin. Well the broken broadband was the actual reason, the moving dates which meant the fix date was 12 months away from when the problem started, was the nail in the coffin :p:

---------- Post added at 12:55 ---------- Previous post was at 12:53 ----------

If the fix date is a month away, its not likely they are doing work now. So very unlikely.

They have already admitted a problem, maybe its related to the unfixed problem? ;)

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Well, upstream noise anyway.

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Last time i asked them about the work been carried out was told the "Current plans are to implement an additional upstream, once that is complete, load balancing across all the upstreams"

So ur prolly right with noise on upstream

@ Qtx it is starting to get a pain been going on last 5 months now, tho prio to this problem it all ways been good dated back from the blueyonder days, this is what was keeping me from leaving virgin

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Never had any issues back in the blueyonder days myself. Noticed steady degradation in service over the last 3 or so years with VM though, to the point where you realise the good old yonder days are gone :(

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/s...12-02-2013.png

Mine hasn't been too bad since network maintenance on the 4th though I wish the minimum latency was a smooth as it was before they added bonded upstreams in December.

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

The fact your minimum latency changes so often indicatea a fault of some kind imo

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

it'll probably start to rise. keep an eye on it. something similar to mine...

http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/12...s-page-21.html

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Just about all TBB's on a dual VM upstream now show the same minimum latency variation and have done since day one of the 2nd upstream channel being added.

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

I don't agree, Kymmy. The perturbations shouldn't be happening. Many, if not most of the TBBs on 2 upstreams that I've noticed have stable minimum latency. Here's mine:

[url=http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/b5c2787efc3df8534e0ef6b85be294ab-12-02-2013.html]http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/s...12-02-2013.png[/url

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Not something I had noticed. Good to know though.

So there can be a few ms difference between ping results depending on which of the 2 upstreams the ping reply returns on?

If this is the case, is it wrong to assume both upstreams should give the same results?

They look so different to my own connection that any variation looks 'off':

[img]Download Failed (1)[/img]

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

I get the uneven minimum latency while on 2 upstream channels but only when i use the connection, when i am not online it is flat.

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/s...12-02-2013.png

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

didnt you have the rise/instability issue when you was away Snoopy

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

That was a different issue over Christmas, and after a modem reboot that eventually went away. :)

1st Jan 2013
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/s...01-01-2013.png

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

its all linked to the same issue Snoopz

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Interesting point. Without double checking my DOCSIS 3 theory, my instinct tells me that the ping packet will be fragmented in both directions and thus be split across channels.

But if these 32 byte packets go down on channel and randomly move to the other, then my instinct suggests that different latencies wouuld account for those perturbations.

A brainio that knows more on this subject would be helpful here.

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

You know more than me in this area but my train of thought is first surprise that packets of that size would get fragmented across two channels, and secondly that even if they returned on different upstreams/different frequencies, the difference in times should be less than a millisecond unless one of the channels is close to capacity. With the fluctuations being consistent i doubt that is the case. So yeah, need someone who actually knows rather than our guesses.

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Any comments would be appreciated on what my graph is saying

[img]Download Failed (1)[/img]

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

It's saying you have a connection problem.

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Interesting that your minimum and average latency don't increase, even when you have the packet loss. That suggests that you instantly lose your connection every time this happens.

Might be indicative of an iffy amplifier in the area?

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

No s@@t ! :)

Not according to VM.......apparently I have no broadband issues :mad:

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

have you posted on the VM forum?

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Most times I had a fault with virgin it would take months of providing evidence before they admitted it, so take what they say with a pinch of salt.

If you called virgin and got through to their asian call centre and was told this, you may have better luck asking on virgins community forum

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

:rolleyes: disable firewall :mad:

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

How do you reach that conclusion, TH?

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

offshore love disabling the firewall

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

Perhaps because he's discounted a pinhole reset or calling retentions so it must be option 3?

;)

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

option 3 http://www.stangfix.com/testforum2/S...s/censored.gif

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

no better here its geting worse, all so starting to get t3 time out 8 so far today

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/s...13-02-2013.png

Re: Think Broadband Ping Monitor Results (POST YOURS)
 

The red on your TBB suggests upstream noise. Could be upstream congestion but I would have expected more blue in that case.

This needs to be put up on the VM forum so that the VM techs there can look at your circuit. Don't forget to post your DS/US power levels as well as the TBB.