Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
 

Yup, it's their stock in trade. Keep quiet about their own track record of the economy, housing, inequality etc. etc. etc. Just blame everything on the Tories and condone the sort of thuggishness and intimidation we've seen so often at their rallies, demonstrations and so called conferences not to mention so widely on affiliated social media. Why is it that Labour feel they can preach fairness and morality when their tactics are so often more closely related to the likes of the BNP in its heyday? Epic hypocrites!

For the many not the few? Do me a favour. :rofl:

Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
 

You ain't seen nothing yet. The recession resulted from the last Labour Government, and even with the measures introduced, we're still paying off the deficit so we can stop our trillians of pounds worth of debt from continuing to increase.

What do you think the £312 billion new commitments Corbyn has just announced at his conference do to the economy even before the current debt created by Labour has started to be paid??

What is more, what additional commitments will Labour commit themselves to between now and the next election?

No wonder they are worrying about a run on the pound!!

Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
 

And you appear to have left out or forgotten the fact that they were the people responsible for all of it, many of the poor little dears now having to get by on just 2.5 million a year are lucky they didn't go to prison so yes let's have a go at them and anyone else who hasn't held those responsible to account

They're not worrying about it, imo it was an incredibly smart piece of politicking, as good as Mrs Mayday bringing gove in from the cold and lets not forget who was in charge last time there was an actual run on the pound either

Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
 

Ah yes the Bankers, best friends of Tory bretheren, still living it large and unaffected by the disaster they caused. Still forgive and forget eh ? Can always blame it on the socialists !

Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
 

You don't have to convince me about Corbyn, I was banging that drum back when people thought his candidacy was a joke. Now he is a lot closer to No 10 than most of us expected.

But his ascendency is at least in part down the Tories own ineptitude. They played games that came back to haunt them. Drastically cutting benefits for some, freezing public sector pay and doing little to address the cost of living crisis. A lot of the economic growth we did get, which remained sluggish for the last 7 years, has been fuelled by consumer debt as opposed to any great gains to productivity.

And yet despite all that they kept missing their own targets for eliminating the deficit because they weren't able to get the gains in the economy they wanted and weren't actually beyond spending on benefits so long as it was for 'their' voters.

Tuition frees tripled, young people were priced out of the housing market and/or went into less secure work than their parents, people in the public sector effectively saw their pay cut accounting for inflation whereas others struggled.

Corbyn may not have the solution for these, the housing charity Shelter disapprove of rent controls for example, but the Tories didn't offer any for years. Theresa May actually did spot this weakness, even co-opting some of Ed Miliband's ideas about predatory capitalism, but it was too late. That last point also highlights why I think the obsession over party can be unhealthy since she offered ideas deemed insane just twos years before...

Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
 

Politics is Politics.
you agree and he disagrees.
you been in long enough. time for him to have a go now.
that's how it happened last time.


they had a good innings though. they can't complain.

Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
 

Can you not see the contradiction here? On one hand, your decision to back Brexit is inflicting a poorer future on a generation that did not want it and then in the same breath, you say that you cannot believe that someone would want to inflict a poorer future on you & yours? Words fail me ...

I see you have Hope and Faith but they did not work for King Canute and they will not work for you ..

Lastly, drop the personal comments, eh?

Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
 

I think you've nailed it in a single sentence!

Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
 

The problem the Tories have is that Brexit is totally swamping the process of Government. The civil service can only handle 1 'massive" project at once: they are not sized to run the country and have spare capacity to handle the 40+ year complexity that is unravelling the EU exit process.

As a result, "good" Government is effectively on hold for the next 2 years. All they can do is react and band-aid. Strategy policy making requires skill, time and a realistic Parliamentary majority. Mrs May has none of these.

The country will see inflation going up, a looming credit crisis, a resurgent risk-taking City fuelled by near 2008-level bonuses and they will reflect on the brutal cuts of local and national Government services. They will ask why not give Labour a go? Some of the policies make sense to many e.g. re-nationalisation of key infrastructure, curtailing the ever increasing wealth disparity, etc.

All Corbyn has to do is try and walk the Brexit tightrope long enough to not alienate one side or the other. If he can get to the next Election having done this then I feel he would be favourite to win.

What will be interesting is that when/if Corbyn gets into power, will the people who endlessly complain that criticising Brexit is "undemocratic", immediately shut up when Corbyn is voted into No 10. by the "will of the people"? No way .. talk about hypocrisy .. Jeez ...

Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
 

Spot on Damien.:tu:

Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
 

Warning:

Another post deleted, that was berating and provocative in tone.

It is a thinly veiled personal attack and I'm not having it.

The next person to berate and provoke or refer to another member, in the 3rd person, such as referring to them as, 'usual suspect', may face having their posting privileges revoked until further notice.

Nobody, is a 'usual suspect' on this forum. In a civil debate. What other people say, you refer to them by name.

In all honesty. The current tone in Current Affairs is toxic. Too much of a them vs. us situation. This has to end.

Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
 

So if Corbyn hasn't got the solution for these problems why are people thinking about voting for his party and their totally unrealistic objectives and, frankly, lies? People may not like the status quo, do you imagine I do? Do you imagine I like my son being one of those with a huge student debt and being unable to buy a home? Do you imagine the squeeze on social care and benefits which adversely affects my other son's entire life is a pleasure to me? The thing is that it wouldn't have been any different under Labour because they won't end the fees system they won't build all the cheap housing and they'll destroy the economy making things far far worse in the longer term. I don't know how many more times they have to be given the chance to prove it before people realise they're a busted flush and Corbyn's vision as dictated by the likes of Momentum will lead to a very nasty outcome indeed.

It's all very well getting angry but people have to give proper thought to the ramifications of putting Corbyn's cronies in office. Given the chance they'll destroy our economy and those who've been whining about austerity will get to find out they haven't got a clue how bad real austerity is just like the Greeks have. It's rather revealing that none of those who support the sort of stuff Corbyn is promising ever seem to have anything to say about the likes of Greece. I can't think why can you? It's populist but highly dangerous pie in the sky and when they subsequently come to realise it and demand better they'll find out just how nasty the people they elected are.

Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
 

Because they're offering some ideas and the Tories offered fewer. Also not everything believes they're not realistic solutions. It's also not as if the Tories have great credibility on the economy either, lambasting the 'magic money tree' but finding money whenever they need a electoral bribe or to do a deal with the DUP.

I think more than anything though it could end up simply that they're the only realistic alternative in our system.

You've said before that if you ignore people long enough they'll react when talking about immigration and the rise of parties like UKIP. I think the same applies for Corbyn. If people are generally doing alright then they may not want to take the risk but if they've got little else, insecure work, cut benefits, no prospect of home ownership and ever-rising costs then they might well think it's worth a shot.

Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
 

Ideas are easy mate and if people believe they're the only credible way forward we're already doomed. Tell me what is realistic about Corbyn's nationalisation garbage, his PFI reviews, his housing promise, rent controls, Brexit policy, student debt pledges, etc etc etc. It's all so much tosh and I'm staggered that anyone would consider any of it 'realistic'. It's populist nonsense and we saw just how easily he finds dropping pre-election pledges after the event. Clearing student debts??? Yeah Labour were really going to do that weren't they... :rolleyes:

They found £1bn which is being spent on services in NI as part of an electoral deal, not given to politicians. It may stick in the throat for some people but it pales into insignificance when compared to the cost of Labour's spending promises. Remind us how much that 'fully costed' promise to do away with student loans/debt was going to cost? How big do you think they're money tree will have to be to get us out of the PFI* contracts 80% of which were negotiated on Labour's watch? How much bigger will it need to be to renationalise the utilities they've told us they'll do away with. These people are talking nonsense. They have no plan, they're promising what they know they can't deliver and they'll do what they always do which is spend money like confetti to keep themselves in power for as long as they can. They'll then blame it all on the Tories.

*
https://order-order.com/2017/09/25/8...-under-labour/

http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/1...y_to_Scotland/

That's just Scotland!

Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
 

The Tories main selling point at the last election was vote for us because the alternative is worse; very much like some of the repeated boring posts here about nasty/cronies/hypocrites etc.... The negative narrative didn't work very well. They'd do well to reflect on that.

'Corbyn is nasty' isn't good enough any longer. They need to say something positive about how they are going to rescue the health service and make housing and higher education affordable and increase peoples standard of living, which is being eroded by inflation and stagnant wages. I suspect they can't because they don't intend to do any of these things, just pander to their narrow privileged base and try and scare everyone else. It isn't going to work forever, people are wising up, even if they don't care for Corbyn.