Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

A valiant attempt but I fear your words are falling on particularly deaf ears.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

you quote from it chapter and verse [like other news outlets] but claim not to be a reader ,you can't make this stuff up .:rofl: bless .

---------- Post added at 08:52 ---------- Previous post was at 08:45 ----------

it looked like illiterate drivel so i ignored it .


"it's what we bloody well elect them":shrug: pass .

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

The thread started off in the day with interesting discussions about the UK's relationship with the EU post-Brexit. Come the end of the evening and without provocation people are throwing names around that would not be out of place on the school playground.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

The quote was from the Guardian article :dunce:

---------- Post added at 08:59 ---------- Previous post was at 08:56 ----------

You're are right here. The constant use of the childish names is aimed at winding people up. It has no other purpose from what I can see. It certainly does not further debate, just the opposite.

---------- Post added at 09:09 ---------- Previous post was at 08:59 ----------

I would like to thank you for this post. Your analysis is accurate and unbiased.

The referendum had a (small) majority to leave the EU. There was not a vote on the terms of leaving. The Leave campaign (in its many forms) had a variety of suggestions some of which have already been ruled out (by the Leave leaders themselves).

The bottom line is that we are leaving the EU. However, it is the responsbility of the Government to get the best deal for the long term prosperity of the country.

It is not the duty of the Government to seek some ideological hard-core Brexit solution just so it can appease the zealous right wingers.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

Yep. Guilty as charged. After all the names that brexiteers like myself were called after the vote (stupid, racist etc) , I figured that as I can't beat the remoaners I'll join them.
Funny how the snowflakes get unhappy when it's done to them :D

---------- Post added at 11:55 ---------- Previous post was at 11:50 ----------

I agree completely. The problem is that the govt won't really be able to get the best deals if it's thoughts and plans are open to scrutiny by all and sundry before negotiations start.

I agree again but if remoaners keep pushing and obstructing the process they may well force the govt to hard brexit asap rather than risk the process being adversely softened or scuppered completely.

---------- Post added at 11:59 ---------- Previous post was at 11:55 ----------

I'll leave this here again: New Lib Dem MP Skewered on Brexit :D

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

thats never going away is it :rofl::rofl::rofl:

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

It's no accident that the Lib-Dems are so pro-EU. They only hear what they want to hear, think the same way and employ the very same tactics as the Eurocrats. They commend the process when it suits but immediately call it into question when it doesn't then set about undermining anything or anyone who has the temerity to disagree. The truth is that they're only interested in the democratic process when it yields what they want - to hell with it when it doesn't.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

If people on this forum called you (specifically) stupid and/or racist, I would expect that to be reported. If one or two people on this forum tarred all Brexit supporters as racist and/or stupid, you would be justified in commenting back to them using your terms.

However, if you are taking it out on anyone here who disagrees with you because a few behaved badly, it would seem that the 'special snowflake' hat appears to be firmly perched on your head...;)

I thought most people grew out of the 'but they did it first' behaviour around adolescence...

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

I'm doing my best not to grow up :pp: :D
I'll try to behave myself henceforth :D

---------- Post added at 14:46 ---------- Previous post was at 14:30 ----------

Yep, a masterclass in pinning down a remoaner. It does illustrate nicely how disingenuous some of them are being. :D

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some of them ? don't you mean most of them ;)

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I do enjoy it when a politician hits the nail squarely on the thumb.:D

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And the name calling isn't a recent phenomena purely linked purely to Brexit either. Anyone who's dared to challenge uncontrolled migration, for example, has long been fair game for all sorts of abuse from many of those on the left. Not much attempt at adult debate, despite regular promises that one could be had. No, plenty of shouting down, taunts and jibes directed at anyone who dared to voice their concerns by those who claim to abhor abuse and intimidation based on any form of stereotyping but don't mind resorting to it when it suits.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

Indeed. Hence my shorter than usual fuse when talking to our liberal bretheren of late.
Goose/gander.......doesn't seem to work both ways :shrug:

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

In the interest of fairness, can we have some examples where you (and others), as individuals, have been subject to the name calling you are complaining and (over) reacting to?

We can see the large number of posts that you and others are doing this but I am willing to be convinced so where are these many posts that are doing the same thing to you?

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its too distressing to bring it all up again .

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No. You don't get access to my Facebook account :D

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https://mobile.twitter.com/DuncanCas...564613/photo/1

;)

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Yes, it does sum up this thread and the delusions of the 'having their cake and eating it' Brexiteers. Some day the reality will hit them, too late of course.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

Does it hell represent us stupid piece of made up rubbish just one more to add to the already large pile.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

Why bring that crap from Facebook over here then, no one here has called you names so there's no need to try and drag this place down to the level you're used to

---------- Post added at 21:33 ---------- Previous post was at 21:30 ----------

It does a bit imo, you can actually quote posts from this thread that say bits of it word for word

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

It was a joke - are you leaving your sense of humour as well as the EU? ;)

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No I am afraid it does

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Yawn. Old and disingenuous. Next? :)

---------- Post added at 22:38 ---------- Previous post was at 22:35 ----------

The governments "leaked memo" (if it was anything of the sort) mentioned the thing about the cake. Us realistic brexiteers are more realistic and understand that there will be pain. But it will be worth it in the end.

---------- Post added at 22:42 ---------- Previous post was at 22:38 ----------

Because that's what you remoaners think of us........and how the liberal left have 'talked' to us for years. Hell, Jonathan Pie puts it better than I can. :)

---------- Post added at 22:54 ---------- Previous post was at 22:42 ----------

My sense of humour is wearing a little thin in light of remoaners attempts to delay or sabotage brexit.

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I know in this post brexit utopia facts count for very little but you'd help your cause by getting some right, 10 years ago there were very few people on this forum calling for us to leave the EU and you as far as I can recall weren't one of them, it was sparkle and I that put up with all the flak, I also voted ukip for years, long before it became fashionable and they only lost my support after Dave's assessment that they were clueless fruitcakes started to look more and more accurate. I was very much a swing voter in the referendum and wanted leave to put forward a convincing case to gain my vote as all the reasons I had for wanting us to leave no longer existed. They couldn't and resorted, much like yourself to name calling, their blind optimism, lies and failure to counter any arguments didn't enamour them to me either. So let's hope johnny pie can put it better than you because you didn't make a good job of it at all. Remoaner pffftt

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Don't confuse leave voters with leave campaigners as the two are very different I've acknowledged many times here that there will be an economic cost in the short to mid term but it will get better and i personally do believe in the end the UK will prosper more out of the EU then in it. That's if the EU even makes it another ten years which i don't think it will as resentment and opposition to it is growing in most member states it is not just the UK that has anti EU feeling. Also anti EU should not be associated or confused for anti european as they are not the same, I'm all for trading with those nations in europe that we can trade with but not by paying into EU coffers.

I also don't want the UK to close the door on immigration just get a far better regime in place so that those we need and who want to come here to contribute can do so even more easily then now but those coming to take out and give nothing back get stopped at whatever point of entry. As for british industry i believe once we can make the trade deals we want and with who we want that issue will resolve itself and India hasn't completely told us to get lost they are quite keen to trade in at least one area.

Return of the empire seriously is there any sensible person that's even muttered that after brexit because I've heard no one even mention the empire outside of historical debates in the last two decades. Bunting yeah right and tea and vicars also a new one for me, looks like somebody has been talking to the fringe lunatic end of leave rather then trying to engage one of the majority sensible leave voters and lets not pretend the remain side don't have their lunatic fringe who even now given the chance would take us into the single currency.

There has been name calling on both sides and whatever side it is doing it is not helping even though I'm sure I've used the term remoaner, but the patronising and arrogant view has been far more evident on remain then leave. Lets not kid ourselves the EU referendum and the continuing stupidity afterwards has made both sides look pretty bad and no one side has any moral high ground to take in that regard.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

I find it very sad that some are people may be so impacted by their friends' comments on Facebook that they feel the need to let off steam by name-calling in a totally separate discussion forum.
If you believe in yourself and your arguments then ignore such comments on Facebook. And if peoples' Facebook friends don't respect their views or simply wind them up, then they should consider defriending them.

---------- Post added at 09:02 ---------- Previous post was at 08:37 ----------

In response to a question regarding the benefits of leaving the EU to their company, Eurostar submitted this answer in writing:

[quote] Eurostar No.
There are no benefits of growth opportunity that we could identify from leaving the EU.
As a cross-border operator, our fixed costs are already very high, and in many instances the business case is marginal. Any additional cost, small as it might seem, would only add to these costs and risks either raising prices for passengers or, if the market cannot bear such increases, making the operation unsustainable in its present form. [/no]
Eurostar is a Canadian- and French-owned company.
https://www.indy100.com/article/euro..._campaign=i100

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

It was first tweeted 2 weeks ago, but thank you for your Breitbartian 'post-truth' rebuttal...;)

Not for the majority of posters on this forum, it isn't, and for you to conflate your experiences on FB with this forum, and reacting the way you are, is, to use your own words, disingenuous...

It's like if you go to one pub for a beer, and there's a bunch of anti-social twits who give you a hard time, so when you are at another pub where no one is behaving that way, you treat them as if they are the original group - that soon becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy, if you're not careful...:(

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

Everyone is responsible for how they treat each other. You can't blame others for your own actions.

Anyway back on topic. Johnson is playing down the idea of continuing to make EU payments: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-38200112

It's not clear because by definition overpaying to the EU would be paying too much but if we pay the correct amount that seems fine :D

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

The correct amount being zero. I have no problem with that. :D

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If Theresa May gets her way, the correct amount will be whatever amount furthers her political career. No more, no less.

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So it looks like a swing toward soft brexit. Just to remind everyone, that means everything stays exactly the same as it is now but we leave in name only and lose both our representation in the European Parliament and our national veto.
In layman's terms, this is a bit like giving everyone in the pub the finger and announcing you're leaving, then sulking on your own in the beer garden drinking whatever the regulars deign to send out to you.
So certainly less insane than hard brexit as it may not cause economic self-immolation (probably just some severe burns), but a very high level of stupidity nonetheless.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

Did you watch his video?

---------- Post added at 13:12 ---------- Previous post was at 13:02 ----------

That's what I'm scared of happening.
It needn't have to but if the remoaners keep carping on and obstructing the process then it just might. :(

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

Far-right candidate in Austria defeated: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-euro...e=news_central

Might Italy also be spared the populist revolt? Probably not but the polls overestimated Hoffer

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

they will get whatever the democratic process delivers .

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Well yes but what will that be? Looks like a No vote which would be the bigger of the two votes in Europe today.

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its another close one ,Europe's established political party's will have to up their game if they want to sell their brand and bring home the big win's .

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It will be whatever, and I'm sure the good decent people of those countries will respect the result. Its so sad within the UK people are unwilling to respect democracy.

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Renzi has already called a press conference for an hour after the polls close....can't be a good sign for him...

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Looks like No will win easily, the press conference is presumably for Renzi to concede and maybe even resign.

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Yep renzi is gone don't think he'll be the last things are changing for better or worse we will have to see.

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when is the re run - the no side obviously didn't understand what they voted for :rolleyes:

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Labour's Brexit bill amendments likely to delay Article 50

"The Labour leader was at pains to say it was not about stopping Brexit, as had been suggested by his predecessor Tony Blair.
"You can't say to people 'you vote, you take the decision. Sorry, you've made the wrong decision. You've got to take it again'."
"It is still Labour's position that it will not block Article 50, but it will try to insist on plans being published for new trading arrangements and protection of social rights."
http://news.sky.com/story/labours-am...le-50-10681748

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

"Protection of social rights" is SOLELY a matter for the UK government, whoever is in power, and should be nothing to do with the EU.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

I think Corbyn is looking to guarantee that these rights are not taken away from people when we leave the EU. In the short term, I'm sure that will happen.

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Perhaps that is because the "Empire" no longer exists. The Commonwealth does though

On what basis do you draw that conclusion?

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But that is a totally separate issue, and is a matter for Parliament. Let's assume his ideas get implemented, then Parliament could just as easy reverse them after Article 50 is approved. If they couldn't reverse it then that would be anti-democratic, which is why Corbyn and Labour are in favour of imposing by the back door.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

From what Theresa May has said, though I get that it's foolish to believe any politician.

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Yes a separate issue but, EU legislation will, as a matter of course, have to remain in effect until such time as Parliament produces new legislation to replace it otherwise there will be none in effect.

Some may be passed into British law some may not. That is for Parliament to decide.

It's all part of the huge leaving process.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

EU directives have to be passed separately in each nation state.
Eg.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

Yes and must stay in effect until Parliament decides to change them or leave them in force.

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Leaving the EU doesn't magically make them disappear. They would still be in place. It would be more appropriate to automatically remove the Working Time Regulations, as they were forced upon us via the backdoor. We had an exemption from the Social Chapter in the Maastricht Treaty but the EU found a way, under the guise of Health and Safety.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

some on the leave side have some difficulty understanding as well judging by some of the posts here .



Nobody is saying it is anything to do with the EU but the rules that have been introduced since we joined the EU and have benefited everyone need to stay in place ,i think Corbyn is simply making sure that stuff like the WTD stays in place which quite frankly is his job

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Still nothing whatsoever to do with Article 50 or anything to do with the EU. For it to be overturned there would have to be a Parliamentary vote. That would be the time, if it happened, for Corbyn to say anything.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

I think the point that Sky News is making is that Corbyn's actions will delay Article 50.

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Well it does presuming the government lose their appeal .Assuming the government lose they will have to make some guarantees as to what legislation will be abandoned or kept ,Corbyn is simply making sure that workers rights through the WTD and suchlike are protected

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Good to see common sense prevailing from the Government:

Brexit: Theresa May U-turns and says Government will reveal plans before Article 50 is triggered
"Theresa May has agreed to a Labour demand to lift the lid on her Brexit strategy to avoid an embarrassing Commons defeat.
With just moments to go before a Parliamentary deadline, the Prime Minister accepted a motion - due to go to a vote on Wednesday - that she must set out “the Government’s plan for leaving the EU before Article 50 is invoked”.
However, her carefully-crafted amendment also sought to box Labour in by adding key words that mean the party will also be backing her Article 50 timetable if it votes for the motion.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...-a7459236.html

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

Good good. It isn't that outlandish a demand. Let people know what we're trying to do.

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Does that mean we can carry on with it now?

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If the govt loses the court case then there is even less likelihood of any trouble in Parliament now. Most of the debate would be if Parliament would be informed of what is happening.

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What's the point of the court case now ? May should just kick it over to parliament where it belongs

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Well the case has started now and technically it's nothing to do with if Parliament should be informed but that it should be the one that votes to issue Article 50. Really the main appeal of kicking it to Parliament is that Parliament could leverage that to have some input into the process so it's less of an issue now I guess.

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If anything, its speeds things up.

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Why does it belong in Parliament? The public voted on it, the public voted to leave. Therefore we should be triggering Article 50 ASAP.

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Because we are a representative Parliamentary democracy.

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Except that ...

Assuming the Supreme Court is going to rule that parliament must be involved before A50 is invoked, expect the government's lawyers to make reference to this motion during their submissions to the court this week. It is just about possible that this will be ruled to have been enough. It's certainly worth a punt for the government, and at surprisingly little cost. There's nothing in this motion that is going to compel them to reveal a detailed negotiating position.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

Yeah might have jumped the gun there..,

I don't see how it impacts he court case though. That's about an actual vote not merely informing parliament.

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Because this isn't some 2 bit trade deal being negotiated it is a fundamental change to our legislation

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

The motion coming up on Wednesday won't just acknowledge that Parliament has been informed of what el gov is doing. If accepted in its current state, it will cause Parliament to resolve that the gov's proposed A50 timetable should be implemented.

The Supreme Court has a wide range of possible conclusions open to it. If its ruling is anything less than full repeal of the EC 1972 act then it is conceivable that it will accept Parliament's resolution of this Wednesday as adequate.

I'm not saying this is the most likely outcome but the government has certainly thrown something very interesting into the pot.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

I thought these were interesting reader's comments on the forthcoming negotiations worth sharing on this forum as it gives an interesting perspective.

Originally posted by The Pouca in FT.com on 6/12/2016

"The core of any Brexit deal is getting to 27 yeses - and any sensible discussion has to start from that standpoint - what can the UK seek that the other 27 EU member states will agree to? However, even in the pro-EU pages of the FT and The Guardian this is almost never discussed, it's all about the UK's wants and needs.

One thing that pretty well no one grasps is how big a deal psychologically and politically Freedom of Movement is for Poland, Romania, Bulgaria, Hungary, Slovakia, the Czech Republic, Estonia, Lithuania, Latvia and even Germany. Memories in the UK may be short, but before the Berlin Wall fell citizens of those countries did not enjoy FoM, they were effectively trapped inside the Eastern Bloc. For them a huge aspect of freedom and of joining the EU is FoM - and the UK's objection is not helped by the xenophobia and outright racism that was displayed in the referendum campaign and afterwards, the attacks on Eastern Europeans in the street. So up front you have ten member states that regard FoM as a very big deal - and inter alia it's fair to say that the same view is taken by the Spanish, Italians, Portuguese, Greeks, Irish, etc. That is a big problem because refusing FoM means that there are already 10-15 No votes that can be counted.

Next, you have passporting. Again I think there is a failure to grasp why passporting into the Eurozone is a serious issue. Understand the UK is in an unusual position for any country - it has the untrammelled right now to sell financial products into what is in effect another economy, impacting that economy and its central banks (the ECB's) exposure, etc. The US does not allow foreign banks to do that into the US dollar zone. The UK's exceptional circumstances are as a result of being in the EU - and the 4 freedoms, including two key ones freedom to provide services and freedom of capital - but it is a historical accident - because those 4 primary freedoms were part of the original EEC and predated the Euro and the ECB. The UK has stayed out of the Euro, to a large degree carping hostilely from the sidelines. For any currency union to allow the sort of access that the UK now has would be pretty astonishing - so it is hardly surprising that many countries in the Eurozone cannot see this continuing. The especially cannot see it continuing if the European Central Bank, the European Commission and the European Court of Justice lack the authority to enforce rules on the City.

Next you have goods and to that must be added paying into the EU budget. A little history here might be useful. When Ireland entered the EU in 1973 it led to the almost immediate demise of car manufacturing in Ireland and a host of other industries as they faced competition from UK and EU manufacturers that operated on a much large scale, as well as the loss of tariffs on goods which entered the Irish market via importation into the EEC at Felixstowe or Rotterdam - while UK and EU industry gained. Those were tough years for Ireland initially - but the EEC (later EC and then EU) in effect compensated the Irish through the regional and structural funds. Ireland is now a net contributor to the EU budget, and has been for several years. Pretty well all western European countries are now new contributors, and most of that money goes east - and compensates the former eastern European countries for allowing the rest of the EU access to their markets for goods and services. Now the UK wants that access (which hurts Eastern European industry, employment and tax base) for free - or to put it another way, they want the rest of western Europe to pay the UK's club dues - while keeping the market access.

Then you have a raft of EU programs, Erasmus, Horizon 2020, Galileo, where a disproportionate share of expenditures were made in the UK and where UK scientists and institutions were allowed leading roles - again, why should this continue?

I could go on, but the point remains - few UK commentators are looking at this from the perspective of the EU 27, and when they do they are rather poisonous in their analysis, projecting venality (it's all about the money), pusillanimity and vindictiveness onto the motives of the EU 27. They also forget - all of the things I'm describing the UK voted to throw in the rubbish bin, declared valueless - all are in the gift of the EU 27, should they choose to return them. These are not things the UK gets to keep after the divorce unless the EU 27 agree, each and every one."
Source:
Subscribers https://www.ft.com/content/64ec9a92-...5d080#comments
Non-subscribers Google "This is what ‘red, white and blue’ Brexit will look like"

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

We are not expecting anything for free we fully understand there will be a cost it's the amount and who gets it that is the primary concern. Clearly the commentator is pro EU and that bias shines just as it does in some of the leave rhetoric and the best thing in the upcoming negotiations is to try and get objective people on both sides though that might be a little hard. To be honest and maybe to sound xenophobic but if the EU can't get 27 approvals on the eventual deal it will be hard brexit and it will be because of the EU not the UK.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

You want to live in a dictatorship? I find it amusing that there's people banging on about how important it is for us to make our own laws in one breath and then trying to ignore them in the next :spin:

Does anyone want a detailed negotiating position revealed? The gist of it will suffice

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

I think It's useful to understand what the EU27 might want and this article helps here. I hadn't appreciated the freedom of movement issue which is not about money but about the Iron Curtain. In fact, a lot of the post emphasises how the UK commentators talk about money all the time when it's not about it.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

Linky

Looks like the EU is in for a rough ride over the next few months.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

The financial meltdown predicted for a no vote result in Italy has yet to appear and Austria hasn't elected a far-right government so some of the doomsday scenarios pencilled in for this month have not arisen. What is next to come?

---------- Post added at 09:39 ---------- Previous post was at 09:32 ----------

Some Conservative backbench MPs want more detail.
Tory backbenchers demand detailed Brexit plans from Theresa May

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

German and French elections. Greece hasn't gone away either.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

Can't link to the story at the moment but the Eurozone have agreed some debt relief to Greece.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

Here's the article on the debt relief to Greece http://www.reuters.com/article/us-eu...-idUSKBN13V22R

I think elections in France and Germany will not be issues for the Eurozone. It's in Greece, Italy and Spain that problems may exist.

---------- Post added at 11:42 ---------- Previous post was at 11:41 ----------

Theresa May is a politician's politician and a clever move on her part.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

Yep, when I'm playing a high stakes game of poker I always show my cards to the audience so that they can discuss my hand within earshot of the other players :banghead:

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

Leave voter British hairdresser Deir Dos Santos explains why he brought the legal challenge against Parliament not needing to vote on Article 50. Yup, it's not just Gina Miller who feels strongly on this issue.
Will the Brexit red top press term him a Monaleaver? ;)
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...-a7395096.html

---------- Post added at 12:59 ---------- Previous post was at 12:56 ----------

A group of Labour MPs will refuse to vote to force Theresa May to reveal her Brexit plans – because it would also mean backing her timetable for triggering Article 50.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...-a7460531.html

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

Presumably they don't represent heavily leave-voting constituencies. Having that on your voting record could be considered electoral suicide come 2020.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

I believe they're all London MPs so shouldn't harm their re-election chances but won't enamour them to Jeremy Corbyn.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

Motion passed easily. http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2016/12...-50-end-march/

There is never any threat of Brexit being overturned by Parliament. Look how comfortable that majority is. May should just allow a vote on Article 50 and recognise the importance of Parliament.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

That's interesting but not particularly relevant here. The EU knows the cards that we hold; all the information about imports, exports, payments to the EU, EU nationals working in the UK, British soldiers deployed in Eastern Europe etc; it's all there in the public domain.
We know the EU needs time to get decisions from its 27 members so I cannot see the big deal in revealing what the UK Government wants, especially when the clock is ticking against us. I fear it's just been stalling by the UK Government whilst it seeks to get its own internal consensus and get a plan together. Why else wait so long?

---------- Post added at 00:04 ---------- Previous post was at 00:01 ----------

Agreed. May's a politician's politician but has strong tendencies to over-control things. I think that's why this lamentable situation has arisen when she could simply have put it to a vote in Parliament and won it hands-down.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

I think once we start the process of article 50 come the end of the 2 years I think it would be extended if nothing is final. lets face it it's in the best interests for everyone to get it right as it could bring the EU crashing down if its all done wrong

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

The only potential problem is that either desirable outcome of the two year period (deal or extension) requires unanimous agreement. If the assembly of the walloons or whatever they are decide to dig their heels in, then no deal is possible and equally no agreement to extend negotiations is possible either. In those circumstances the U.K. automatically leaves the EU after the two years with no treaty governing its future relationship with the bloc. Trade in and out of the bloc is organised by default on WTO rules and tariffs.

Having said that, many don't see that as a major problem...

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

When we buy items or services from America how is that treated? Obviously if I buy a subscription to dropbox I guess that's considered a transaction that took place in the US so how do they govern the rest of it?

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

I think it's now considered a purchase in the country of the purchase, at least for VAT purposes. And some of the US companies like Airbnb and LinkedIn now operate through European subsidiaries.

---------- Post added at 09:54 ---------- Previous post was at 09:53 ----------

Many Conservative politicians may not but most businesses do.

---------- Post added at 09:55 ---------- Previous post was at 09:54 ----------

I agree. Although I doubt it would bring the EU crashing down, it wouldn't do it any favours either.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

We'll have to agree to disagree on that point :shocked:

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

Just look at what is happening and what could potentially happen once we leave.

Greece is set to need yet another Bailout, to what end does the EU, having to keep doing this? Of course it's other EU Countries which are not protected from the arrangement the UK had agreed on last year for Eurozone bailouts, thank god we did not join the Euro.

So such countries in the Eurozone, will be expected to foot the bill, rich nations expected to cough up all the time and help out AGAIN, this what I mean about ALL having to pay their fair share for membership and they, Greece, are not doing, and some just expect handout after handout and ride the gravy train, it cannot continue any more and in two years, we will be out of this unbalanced financial system, that is on track to implode on itself and people want to remain in this corrupted, weaved web of financial mess. No thanks.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

Because timing and preparation are crucial?

I'd give up Mick. There are none so blind as those who will not see.

Leave it to "insurgents" Blair and Clegg to deliver the kiss of death to Remain ;).

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

Makes sense. I guess it's harder if you're literally shipping goods to the country. I wonder if the European subsidiaries are the 'seller' of those products? I know most tech companies set up a European office to deal with it and one of the benefit of the single market is one-stop access to the entire European market.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

Good news, if that doesn't boost investor confidence I'd be surprised but then you have to wonder what their motives are behind the move

https://www.theguardian.com/business...-tax-structure

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

I'd say their motives are pretty clear.

The EU has been going after American multinationals like some kind of Spanish Inquisition for several years now. Brexit may make the UK an attractive place in which to place their tax affairs beyond its reach.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

The European subsidiaries are the sellers. Apple in Ireland is a famous example. Another benefit for a European subsidiary has been that profits do not need to be repatriated to the USA which has higher rates of corporation tax. This may well change under the Trump administration though.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

Our corporation tax is corporation friendly ,it's no real surprise that companies wish to move away from countries that want to take more and more from them in ant attempt to make up budget deficits

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

Will be interesting to see how the UK and EU approach this. It will be in the interests of both to go along with something like this on economic grounds. But May might put party unity ahead of tax revenues and jobs and the EU may play hardball if it doesn't see the downside.

British banks in call for five-year Brexit buffer
"The UK’s financial institutions, who trade on the Continent under EU passporting rules, are calling for the current set-up to stay in place in a transitional deal lasting between three and five years in a confidential document submitted to the Treasury."
Without an interim arrangement, it claims some banks may not be able to move parts of their operations out of Britain or set up new British subsidiaries in time, threatening an abrupt halt to EU business.*
“Transitional arrangements are likely essential,” the document says. “This is important in order to avoid potential damage to the ‘real economy’ that is reliant upon uninterrupted access to financial services.”
http://www.standard.co.uk/business/b...-a3416461.html

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

Typical obfuscation from remainers.

Banks already have a 2 1/2 yr transition period. Invoking A50 will not happen before May 2017. There will then be 2yrs negotiation so that gives them 4 1/2 yrs. After the negotionations have concluded we don't as yet know how long it will be before we are finally rid of the corrupt set-up.

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

You talking about the EU or the banking racket or possibly both

Re: Post-Brexit Thread
 

I regret I have to disagree with your numbers. Firstly, Theresa May has indicated she's still on target to invoke Article 50 by the end of March 2017. The two-year countdown starts then. There is no extra 2.5 years on top of this.

At some stage between March 2017 and the end of negotiations, the banks will have a clearer understanding of the UK's future relationship with the EU. If this was one year into the negotiations, then the banks would only have one year to adjust. They're obviously being as proactive as they can now by speaking to other cities like Frankfurt and Paris but it makes sense for them to have more time to adjust to the new environment so as not to disrupt the industries they support and to make it easier on the many support staff who stand to lose their jobs as they are unlikely to move to the Continent.