Re: Muslims outpace Anglicans in the UK
 

if i feel better later on, im going to show my religious freinds those quotes, i bet he wont believe it :D

but if i was to come out in to the public domain and say i dont believe this etc etc

two things would happen

A) i would get sat down by people and get 'taught' islam by them.

B) the idiots would come around to my house :mad:

BTW the option B was threatened once and you should have seen the aggression i dished out i got up pointed at the guy in an angry face and said to him "DONT YOU DARE DO THAT I CONTROL WHO COMES IN TO MY HOUSE"

scared him off :rofl:

Re: Muslims outpace Anglicans in the UK
 

Of course, what often happens next is that some religious smoothy comes in and starts saying things like, "oh it doesn't really mean that literaly and transposed into a modern context it really means...blah blah b/s blah". You know, like what some bible bashers here do.

Re: Muslims outpace Anglicans in the UK
 

Are you referring to me?

Re: Muslims outpace Anglicans in the UK
 

Pardon me, but *rubbish*!

There is *no* logical connection between the two unless you start with some *extremely* flawed premises.

Have you ever listened to a fundamentalist right wing evangelist *Christian* preacher? Promising hellfire and brimstone for all those who aren't saved? Saying that anyone who hasn't accepted Jesus as their saviour is damned for all eternity?

As with all holy books (except for *very* short ones!) they can be made to "prove" anything the reader wants.

Sorry, where in the Koran does it say that "A woman who is raped cannot accuse her rapist unless she can produce a male witness" or are you conflating the Koran with Sharia law?

And, of course, similar atrocities have *NEVER* been committed by *ANY* other armies of *ANY* other countries... :rolleyes:

It's very easy to "prove" how "barbaric" a certain group is if you pick and choose your "evidence"...

Re: Muslims outpace Anglicans in the UK
 

So what's wrong with that?

Re: Muslims outpace Anglicans in the UK
 

You are of course correct that many if not most religions, even christian ones promote a 'struggle' against the non believers or infidels, (erm but aren't all religions just a different form of worship of a deity called god or allah or whatever nonsense). :confused:

The big difference is, it is evident Islam is on the increase and is far more vigorously promoted today than christianity and further that 'struggle' is, by all the evidence, far more insidious and often violent.

Islam IMO does appear to promote itself, via the many vociferous fundamentalists, much more aggressively amongst not only its 'followers' (to ensure continued compliance) but even more so against the 'non believers' i.e. the west.

Of course it is easy to choose the 'evidence' to prove the barbarity, but it appears to me it is the many fundamentalists that choose these paths of 'struggle against the infidels', I merely point out the documented reasons they use. :(

Re: Muslims outpace Anglicans in the UK
 

I didn't say there was anything *wrong* with that (although I have my own opinions on what they're saying).

My point is that if someone's going to criticise *one* religion for behaving in a certain way, if they wish to be seen as having an unbiased viewpoint they should point out that it's not just that *one* religion that behaves that way.

Re: Muslims outpace Anglicans in the UK
 

"By all the evidence"? Or only by all the "evidence" that you've heard, or perhaps only by all the evidence you're willing to *listen* to?

And "insidious"? Why does that sound like "the insidious international communist conspiracy"?

And finally, yes, there are violent Muslims. There are also violent Christians.

And there are also many Muslims who, because they preach moderation, don't get *heard* in the Western press because their views don't provide rabble-rousing headlines about the "threat" of Islam...

Re: Muslims outpace Anglicans in the UK
 

The evidence I refer to is there written in the quran, that together with what I see in the media regarding the activities of al'queda (and the taliban before them), various bombings worldwide and...oh yes, 9/11.

Who mentioned communism ? By insidious I meant that some of the less savoury aspects of Islam (such as suppression of women) are less well known and rarely mentioned although they are an intrinsic part of the way Islam is used to subjugate its followers.

Can't disagree, and I don't condone violence carried out in the name of chritianity either.

Maybe they should shout as loud as the fundamentalists. Maybe they are scared they will be 'downsized' !

I wonder why those who promote voilent struggle in the name of religion are referred to as 'fundamentalists' ?? i.e. maintaining traditional beliefs ? :confused:

Re: Muslims outpace Anglicans in the UK
 

That doesn't have any relevance here because the christian promises hellfire in the next life whilst the muslim (if the quotes on this thread are to be accepted) promises to do nasty things to non-believers in this life.

Re: Muslims outpace Anglicans in the UK
 

Fair point.

I disagree. There are no violent Christians. If a man (or woman) uses violence and professes to be a Christian, IMO that is not possible. What you do have is people who use violence in the name of Christianity, which is entirely different.

True Christians don't go around smacking people about, attacking people, or flying planes in to buildings.

Re: Muslims outpace Anglicans in the UK
 

no russ in every race religion around the world, there are violent people in it to say christianity has none is absolutely ignorant.

how do you know that ? you cant account for every christian ?

Re: Muslims outpace Anglicans in the UK
 

No, true Christian teaching does not advocate the use of violence. Violence in the name of Christianity is not that is taught in the Bible. I did not say Christianity has none of these people buy they are not true Christians IMO.

As above. Being a Christian isn't just name, it's a way of life, a whole belief system, a lifestyle.

Re: Muslims outpace Anglicans in the UK
 

And there are quotes from the bible which can be used to justify almost anything. And the media are generally *not* what I would call "unbiased". And there are people committing acts of terrorism that aren't Muslims. Oh, and most Muslims disown the September 11th terrorists as not being Muslims as far as *they* are concerned.

If you pick and choose the "evidence" you accept you can prove anything you want. (Or someone else will do it for you cf Hutton, oops, sorry :notopic: )

Communism, Islam, Catholicism, unions, Jews, it matters not what the name is, there is always *something* that someone will claim to be an "insidious threat" to our way of life or world peace or democracy...

There's always a "bogeyman" out there that can be exploited by those who seek or hold power to scare the "ordinary people".

And once again we see the "big brush" technique used to tar *all* of Islam with the "less savoury" actions of a *minority*.

Maybe the Archbishop of Canterbury or the Pope should also "shout as loud" as them... :rolleyes:

Re: Muslims outpace Anglicans in the UK
 

An interesting caveat there "IF the quotes on this thread are to be accepted" (my emphasis).

I don't accept them as being representative of *all* Islam.