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-   -   Manchester Victoria station knife attacks. (https://www.cableforum.uk/board/showthread.php?t=33707240)

nomadking 02-01-2019 20:36
Re: Manchester Victoria station knife attacks.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 35977650)
Totally meaningless figures.
EG Within "Fraud offences" there will be a difference in sentencing between a £10,000 fraud or a £10m fraud or even a £113m fraud.
Quote:
Britain's biggest cyber-fraudster grew so rich from a £113million scam that he flew his personal valets 8,000 miles across the world to polish his Porsches.
Feezan Hameed Choudhary, 25, described himself as ‘King’ and lived like one – jetting off around the globe to party with pop stars.

jfman 02-01-2019 20:39
Re: Manchester Victoria station knife attacks.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmistoffelees (Post 35977653)
That's fantastic!

So a predominantly white criminal justice system is less likely to arrest white people and less likely to convict. Where a conviction does take place a white person is less likely to face a custodial sentence. If they do face a custodial sentence it's likely to be for a shorter period of time, and white people are more likely to be released early.

An astonishing set of statistics.

---------- Post added at 20:39 ---------- Previous post was at 20:38 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by nomadking (Post 35977654)
Totally meaningless figures.
EG Within "Fraud offences" there will be a difference in sentencing between a £10,000 fraud or a £10m fraud or even a £113m fraud.
Ah, back to extrapolating a sample size of one.

Of course a better representation of reality than official statistics.

mrmistoffelees 02-01-2019 20:40
Re: Manchester Victoria station knife attacks.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfman (Post 35977655)
That's fantastic!

So a predominantly white criminal justice system is less likely to arrest white people and less likely to convict. Where a conviction does take place a white person is less likely to face a custodial sentence. If they do face a custodial sentence it's likely to be for a shorter period of time, and white people are more likely to be released early.

An astonishing set of statistics.
Yet have the 2nd highest reoffending rate.....

denphone 02-01-2019 20:42
Re: Manchester Victoria station knife attacks.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfman (Post 35977655)
That's fantastic!

So a predominantly white criminal justice system is less likely to arrest white people and less likely to convict. Where a conviction does take place a white person is less likely to face a custodial sentence. If they do face a custodial sentence it's likely to be for a shorter period of time, and white people are more likely to be released early.

An astonishing set of statistics.
Institutionalized discrimination l would call it.

pip08456 02-01-2019 20:44
Re: Manchester Victoria station knife attacks.
 
I know you love to google for stats Hugh, so here's one for you.

Is the inbalanced White, Muslim, Black imprisonment rate based on like for like crime or is it because different racial groups may commit different crimes?

nomadking 02-01-2019 20:46
Re: Manchester Victoria station knife attacks.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfman (Post 35977655)
That's fantastic!

So a predominantly white criminal justice system is less likely to arrest white people and less likely to convict. Where a conviction does take place a white person is less likely to face a custodial sentence. If they do face a custodial sentence it's likely to be for a shorter period of time, and white people are more likely to be released early.

An astonishing set of statistics.

---------- Post added at 20:39 ---------- Previous post was at 20:38 ----------



Ah, back to extrapolating a sample size of one.

Of course a better representation of reality than official statistics.
You CANNOT use overall figures without looking at the make-up of those figures. If certain groups are committing more serious crimes in a category, then they are justifiably going to get longer sentences.


The highest conviction rate in those figures is for White people at 86%.

mrmistoffelees 02-01-2019 20:49
Re: Manchester Victoria station knife attacks.
 
https://www.ethnicity-facts-figures....f-crime/latest here's some more interesting reading

Hugh 02-01-2019 20:52
Re: Manchester Victoria station knife attacks.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by pip08456 (Post 35977660)
I know you love to google for stats Hugh, so here's one for you.

Is the inbalanced White, Muslim, Black imprisonment rate based on like for like crime or is it because different racial groups may commit different crimes?
I’ll let you do the looking, since you’re putting forward the question - why should I do your research for you? ;)

But here’s a starter for you...

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...s-report-finds

Quote:
People from black, Asian and minority ethnic backgrounds are more likely to be jailed for some crimes than those who are white, according to a government-commissioned report.
Quote:
The investigation was given a political boost by Theresa May, who pledged to fight injustice and acknowledged, as she entered Downing Street in July: “If you’re black, you’re treated more harshly by the criminal justice system than if you’re white.”
Quote:
Disproportional outcomes were particularly noticeable in certain categories of offences. For every 100 white women handed custodial sentences at crown courts for drug offences, the report found, 227 black women were sentenced to custody. For black men, the figure is 141 for every 100 white men.

pip08456 02-01-2019 20:52
Re: Manchester Victoria station knife attacks.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by nomadking (Post 35977661)
You CANNOT use overall figures without looking at the make-up of those figures. If certain groups are committing more serious crimes in a category, then they are justifiably going to get longer sentences.


The highest conviction rate in those figures is for White people at 86%.
Hence my question to Hugh in my previous post.

jfman 02-01-2019 20:54
Re: Manchester Victoria station knife attacks.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by nomadking (Post 35977661)
You CANNOT use overall figures without looking at the make-up of those figures. If certain groups are committing more serious crimes in a category, then they are justifiably going to get longer sentences.

The highest conviction rate in those figures is for White people at 86%.
Are certain groups committing different crimes though to the extent it’d skew the figures to any meaningful extent? Or is that conjecture?

Is a white person more likely to benefit from privilege?

https://www.theguardian.com/law/2017...bing-boyfriend

pip08456 02-01-2019 20:56
Re: Manchester Victoria station knife attacks.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 35977663)
I’ll let you do the looking, since you’re putting forward the question - why should I do your research for you? ;)
Why should I do any research to fit your agenda?
Nice try but if you want to prove a point then do so otherwise keep quiet.

mrmistoffelees 02-01-2019 20:58
Re: Manchester Victoria station knife attacks.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by nomadking (Post 35977661)
You CANNOT use overall figures without looking at the make-up of those figures. If certain groups are committing more serious crimes in a category, then they are justifiably going to get longer sentences.


The highest conviction rate in those figures is for White people at 86%.
Since neither the ONS nor the MoJ publish these datasets we're left with speculation and conjecture.

pip08456 02-01-2019 21:19
Re: Manchester Victoria station knife attacks.
 
So don't speculate or conjecture.

jfman 02-01-2019 21:24
Re: Manchester Victoria station knife attacks.
 
Done.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jfman (Post 35977655)
So a predominantly white criminal justice system is less likely to arrest white people and less likely to convict. Where a conviction does take place a white person is less likely to face a custodial sentence. If they do face a custodial sentence it's likely to be for a shorter period of time, and white people are more likely to be released early.

nomadking 02-01-2019 21:37
Re: Manchester Victoria station knife attacks.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfman (Post 35977651)
Well, if you target one group you would hope that convictions go up!
They targeted drug gangs, not any particular "racial" group. If drug gangs are disproportionately non-white, then those convicted of the more serious drug offences will inevitably be non-white.


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