Originally Posted by Ignitionnet (Post 35748751)

Given the article is about how City Link plan on handling Christmas it seems reasonable to think that the staff surrounding these temporary delivery drivers will, likewise, be temporary else the mismanagement runs even deeper than any of us could've imagined. Hiring 1168 agency / subcontractors to handle the Christmas rush and supporting them with a few hundred new permanent warehouse based staff would be very odd.

Originally Posted by Mr Angry (Post 35748749)

What we do know as having happened since then is that according to their news feeds / press articles in January of this year that during the Christmas period of 2013 they as a company performed exceptionally well and were showing signs of turning the company around through better IT systems and and the much lauded Better Capital investment.

Originally Posted by Mr Angry (Post 35748749)

I appreciate your opinion on the matter but I note that you've introduced a very big "if" into the equation.

The RMT were forced to withdraw the threat of industrial action in Sepember 2013 due to a court ruling. I'm not aware of their having threatened any further industrial action or work to rule since then. I am happy to be corrected if they have.

The RMT actually positively encouraged its membership to sign the new City Link contracts.

What we do know as having happened since then is that according to their news feeds / press articles in January of this year that during the Christmas period of 2013 they as a company performed exceptionally well and were showing signs of turning the company around through better IT systems and and the much lauded Better Capital investment.

Indeed one would have to wonder who knew what given the fact that they were up until the appintment of administrators still advertizing "permanent" job posts with a closing date of December 31st 2014 for applications.

Several financial sites have for the past year cited potential risks and frailties facing the Better Capital investment programme for not only City Link but other acquisitions (hence Better Capital II being launched).

That aside, there is a human tragedy in all of this and petty point scoring serves little purpose other than to expose certain bigotries.

Let's think of those who've lost their livelihoods - particularly at a time of year where there is historically enough financial hardship to be faced.

Originally Posted by Sephiroth (Post 35748755)

I can't see where "petty point scoring" has taken place. I've detected and argued against a stance from your statement: “Not only was it the most brutal and callous way to treat nearly 3,000 staff but RMT believes there may have been more cynical motives behind it, which we want the government to investigate."

It's pretty pointless commiserating with "human tragedy" without considering practical ways of avoiding it. To make a profit, enough customers must pay enough money for a well delivered service. An analysis of this aspect would be more beneficial than the RMT's line of "cynical motives".

My analysis is entirely clinical and nothing to do with point scoring. BTW I have worked in the logistics industry and know both Yodel & DHL reasonably well.

Originally Posted by Mr Angry (Post 35748756)

I take your points entirely, sir. And, as I said, I appreciate your opinion.

Best we wait and see what comes out in the wash.

Happy new year to you & yours.

Originally Posted by Mr Angry (Post 35748753)

It may seem "reasonable to think" yes, but it is not exclusively factual.

Originally Posted by Mr Angry (Post 35748756)

I take your points entirely, sir. And, as I said, I appreciate your opinion.

Best we wait and see what comes out in the wash.

Happy new year to you & yours.

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet (Post 35748758)

No, but the balance of probabilities would strongly suggest it's the case as anything else would be suicidal. We're splitting hairs a tad here. They don't appear to have been advertising for permanent staff, your advertisement is for self-employed hence employed purely at the company's convenience with about as much job security as the average employee in the USA. The delivery drivers discussed in the PR blurb, at least, were precisely 0% permanent, all agency / subcontracted.

Regardless I don't agree with many that unions were entirely to blame, however it doesn't change that CityLink were loss-making and all indications are that their costs were too high given their market place. Whether unions could have done more to accommodate the demands of management or not is by-the-by.

I'm purely interested in the timing of the announcement. It seems abundantly clear that they were a casualty of an industry engaged in a race to the bottom where self-employed drivers using their own vehicles are increasingly common.

Blame their customers, the retailers, and in turn us for demanding free delivery if we pay over £x and being happy just to whinge when a delivery from a disinterested, self-employed driver goes pearshaped rather than paying more for higher quality service.

---------- Post added at 17:15 ---------- Previous post was at 17:14 ----------



This indeed - it could quite easily be a part of an accounting scheme to acquire losses for tax purposes. :)

Originally Posted by Mr Angry (Post 35748761)

Happy humanist new year to you & yours.

Originally Posted by Mr Angry (Post 35748761)

I agree, we are splitting hairs - but they are important hairs.

The supposed permanancy of the advertized posts was particularly why I put the word "permanent" in quotation marks in my reference / link to same.

Originally Posted by Arthurgray50@blu (Post 35749226)

Many years ago, l applied for a job,when they had vacancies. There basic wage was 15.000 a year. So l feel sorry for the drivers.

The union are there for a reason to PROTECT the worker. To me some employers treat there staff like carp. Look what's happened here. The must have known weeks ago, this was going to happen. What a day to decide - disgraceful

Originally Posted by Top banana (Post 35749228)

Big high five then Arthur, they did a great job for City Links staff.

Originally Posted by Maggy J (Post 35749247)

Bit of a cheap dig..how can any union do anything if the management call in administration during a holiday season?

Originally Posted by Mr Angry (Post 35748660)

From the link provided by Top banana;

"Scott Maynard, the City Link human resources director, said his company had been consulting with front line staff since June to make pay and conditions “fairer and more equitable”

“At the moment we are in the position where colleagues doing the same job in the same depot are getting paid different wages. This is a legacy that the current management team has inherited and is one we believe is fundamentally unfair,” said Maynard.