Re: Workers To Win Bank Holiday Rights
 

i still reckon it is blatant electioneering from blair :(

Re: Workers To Win Bank Holiday Rights
 

Whats it matter if its gets the job done? Many a good law came from electioneering!
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If they are on that much of a knife edge then this proposal is the least of their worries!

Re: Workers To Win Bank Holiday Rights
 

OK, so why do I have to be sympathetic to the workers? They are hardly getting screwed over here.

And you may not have any sympathy for the companies who are having to foot the huge bill... but no companies = no jobs. The mega-corporations can probably the extra cost, but all the small and mid companies? You just want to let them fall to the majors? It is hard enough for small businesses to compete as it is. Profit margins are so tight and costs have to be kept to a minimum.

Re: Workers To Win Bank Holiday Rights
 

Hands up those who have their bank holidays tacked onto paid leave?

AND I NEVER signed any such contract when I was a full time teacher....It was just the tradition that school holidays encompassed practically all Bank Holidays.

I certainly think that it should be illegal to force people to sign away their holiday rights..It was always understood that KEY workers would work on Bank holidays but get time off later.How many people who are forced to work on bank holidays are actually key workers?Retail?I don't think so...

I hardly think industry will grind to a halt for the sake of 9 days a year. :rolleyes:

Re: Workers To Win Bank Holiday Rights
 

Well, it adds up. Lets say 10 employees @ £80/day. Thats £800 per bank holiday. There are 8 bank holidays, so thats £6400, that will vanish straight out of the profits to help pay the wages, benefits and bonuses in the first place. And that's if they decide not to operate on BHs and take the government's medicine.

If they decide to operate, that means time-and-half, minimum, and a day in lieu, which means £1,200 per BH, (£9,600 in total), plus the £800 for the extra day.

The employees wouldn't care, they are getting paid either way under the new or old system, but crucially the old system gives the company the freedom to offer it, if they can afford it, rather than just forcing it to operate the new system.

Help the workers by all means... But by doing so why simulatenously hurting the companies seems a silly.

Re: Workers To Win Bank Holiday Rights
 

How do you work that out then? They're low paid and they don't get BHs. Think that maybe you should step back and think how happy you would be in that situation.


As all businesses will rightly bear the cost then the playing field will be level so not a competition issue. And any company which cannot act decently towards its workers in giving them the same BH allowance as most workers, shouldn't be in business.
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Totally agreed. At least this measure is going to help people, and disadvantaged people at that (unlike most of the initiatives that have arisen during this pre-election campaign)


Indeed!

Re: Workers To Win Bank Holiday Rights
 

But its not going to be level. The small and mid level businesses aren't as able to swallow endless costs like the big companies are. It won't make a difference for them, they probably afford top give away BHs anyway, but it will make a big difference for the smaller one.

Re: Workers To Win Bank Holiday Rights
 

Small businesses are always whingeing, well, actually, the Federation of Small Businesses is always whingeing. I've worked in several small businesses and if they'd ever tried to refuse my BH entitlement, I'd have been off. Which would have cost them more. As I say, if they don't treat workers decently then they will incur more cost and shouldn't in any case be an employer if their attitude is so Victorian.

Re: Workers To Win Bank Holiday Rights
 

I`ve worked for 2 of these pennypinching, tightfisted companies and they are not small companies. INITIAL and ISS are 2 of the biggest cleaning and security companies in the UK and they incude Bh`s as part of the annual hols.

Re: Workers To Win Bank Holiday Rights
 

And Tesco is hardly a small business, its income being equivalent to being the world's 74th largest economy.

And besides, small businesses often make larger margins than big businesses (which have volume on their side)

Re: Workers To Win Bank Holiday Rights
 

I suppose you are only concerned about the poorly paid, and not interested in justice across the board though!

Companies who poorly pay workers are generally not able to pay more because they are in a cut throat business/industry, when I was working "On-call" for ntl and the on-call fell on a bank holiday, I didn't have to go to work.
However ntl did expect me to stay at home to be on-call for any problems, we got no extra for this and only got paid as if it was a normal day.

This sort of thing happens with many bad employers, many employees working on-call are in a similar situatioon on bank holidays. They are unable to take their family to the beach etc, but the company will argue that they are not working and are having the day off.

I dont suppose these people are worthy of any sympathy or effort, because they are not generally the low paid that gets the do-gooders feeling sympathetic.

What about contractors and self employed, they dont get paid for not working?

People who have a contract with an annual salary generally get paid bank holidays, poeple who get paid by the hour dont.... simple as that really.

Re: Workers To Win Bank Holiday Rights
 

I make no apology for sympathising with the poorly paid - and would hope you wouldn't expect me too! I also have sympathy for others higher up the pay scale who are forced to work BHs for no or little reward, but the combination of low pay and no BH entitlement is a particularly nasty one.

I'm self employed so I don't get BH, sick pay etc. Doesn't mean I think others (and particularly the low paid) shouldn't be paid for them though.

Everyone should be paid for the hours worked and receive BH entitlement.

Am I a do-gooder? I do hope so. So much better than a do-badder ;)

Re: Workers To Win Bank Holiday Rights
 

Of course the big losers in this will be the corner shop owners, if someone owns a couple of corner shops and employs assistants they will now be forced to pay. These employers are already under threat from big companies offering cheaper produce due to their bullying tactics and bulk buying power.

The small business will suffer.

"Do-gooders"

Well just cos someone is not a Do-gooder, doesnt mean they are a Do-badder. I treat people as I expect them to treat me, however people who treat me badly are given the same in return. I am not a Do-gooder, but the majority of people who know me would say I go out of my way to help anyone if I can. On the other hand they would probably say I am a nasty piece of work if taken advantage of.

There is a big difference between someone who "Does good" and a "Do-gooder" the do-gooder will keep helping those who sh*t on him, the person who does good will draw a line at some point. ;)

Re: Workers To Win Bank Holiday Rights
 

I thought being on-call was a fairly standard requirement in engineering positions? Certainly most of the engineers I know have an on-call clause in their contract. But, they are usually compensated (higher pay, day off etc). For example, where I work now, I am theoretically on call. In practice it's never likely to happen as I live 15 miles away and can't drive, but I could be called in to work at short notice. We get paid travel, paid overtime for out of hours work or a day off in leiu. Obviously, having never worked for NTL, I don't know what they offer, but most companies seem to offer a similar deal to the one I work for.

What andyl is talking about is those who get no compensation, just minimum wage and are still expected to work Bank Holidays. When I was a student, I worked first for Sainsburys and then for Blockbuster. In both cases, I was on what is now below the minimum wage and I was expected to work ALL bank holidays.

Having said all that, I was actually quite happy to work, as all the extra money added up and I was saving up to cover my expenses at Uni. It would have been nice to have the choice though.

In theory at least, the rewards for contracting or being self employed outweigh the risks. The reward being higher pay rates, and the risks being a greater chance of not having a job and possibly having to work unsocial hours.

For instance, my Uncle does accountancy on a contract basis. He works 6 months a year, and spends the other 6 months doing what ever he wants. Admittedly, he has no wife and kids, and doesn't need an awful lot of money himself, but he lives comfortably. My point is, he couldn't have that with a salaried position.

Re: Workers To Win Bank Holiday Rights
 

You know every time Labour comes out with an idea that will help the more disadvantaged of society the whole of industry whinges about it. :rolleyes:

Does anyone remember the predictions of doom and gloom over the minimum wage?How it would bring business to it's knees and the larger organisations so loved to quote how it would damage smaller businesses.

Well I never noticed any particular drop of and insolvancies of said businesses.

Of course they moan at anything that obliges them to treat their workers as workers not slaves... :rolleyes:

And all for 9 fecking days in the year....9 days that heaven forbid a shop like Tesco's won't be open at full strength.As for the corner shop...well the shopowner no doubt will pay themselves double time for working on a Bank holiday.

I think since Sunday trading became a fact that peoples' rights in this matter SHOULD be treated with respect.