Re: Energy companies collapse
 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-58879101

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

BP pull the plug on Pure Planet. No one wants the customers now. I think Octopus said they were taking no more after Avros lot. Nightmare times

https://www.itv.com/news/2021-10-11/...nergy-news-yet

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Pure Planet and Colorado Energy have both ceased trading.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

One thing is for sure, energy will be getting much more expensive this winter.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

We're going to run out if it's a bad winter, so your bills will be low.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Love that positive spin, keep it up :tu:

Us hardy older folk will be fine, we grew up without central heating, double glazing (I remember frost on the inside of those steel framed windows), a fire in one room and draught excluders (snake things) everywhere, no cavity wall or loft insulation.

Plenty of thick jumpers though :D

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

It's already much more expensive for companies buying it. For consumers like us, we're lucky as it's price-capped until April next year. That's when we'll notice a hike in bills. Those transferring onto variable rates before then will notice a hike too but not as much as is likely in April.

Apart from pardoning the Salisbury bombers, there's not much we can do about it in the short term.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

I remember the fern patterns on the inside of the windows. One small coal fire in the front room, a parrafin heater in the kitchen diner and plenty of blankets on the bed.

You tell the young of today and they don't believe a word of it. :D

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Tin bath in front of the fire;)


my house has no cavity wall to insulate, no central heating, mostly single glazed windows ,iron stove in living room, the loft is insulated but who lives in the loft:shrug: kitchen is a walk in fridge from nov-april.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Didn't Edwina Currie say that, perhaps the elderly could wear wooly hats if they're cold. Actually when I think about some of the things she said, like good Christian's don't get aids, you only get cervical cancer if you screw around, she really was the Pritti Patel of her day

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Does that mean, <gulp> Pritti's doinking Boris ?

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Quite probably, he's not fussy

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

He doesn't have to be fussy when they're queuing up for him.

'sigh' I remember those days :D

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Topic!

---------- Post added at 12:19 ---------- Previous post was at 12:18 ----------

Topic!

---------- Post added at 12:19 ---------- Previous post was at 12:19 ----------

Topic!


Please stop trying to score points

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Not quite in the dark as the lecky will still be there.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Looks like being an interesting winter. :erm:

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

I imagine a hefty subsidy will be needed for an energy supplier to take on Bulb's customers as the difference between the capped prices and the prices the new company would have to pay in the market for energy for a large number of customers would be loss-making otherwise.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

as someone on a low fixed income the next year is causing me great anxiety tbh. I am already actively avoiding using the heating in favour of blankets but at some point I will need it to stop pipes freezing and damn and then next year when it all goes up again is quite scary

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Not good i'm with them, what happens when it goes bust, the lights don't suddenly switch off and how do we reclaim the balanced owed?

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

"Martin Lewis

Pls share.

Sky reports energy firm Bulb UK may go under imminently. Many consumers panic asking me "should I switch now?" My answer is no.
- You're on a price capped tariff. Nowt cheaper is available.
- If any firm goes bust you'll be auto-moved to a price capped tariff.
- Your credit is protected by Ofgem.
- Switch now & if it does go under you may be caught in middle.
DO NOTHING!

PS business energy tariffs are a different matter and not my expertise, so this doesn't apply to them."

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Bulb going under will be a nightmare for so many. They have given away millions gaining their customer base with their £50 each referrals, I can see how they are in the crap now

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Octopus are still offering sign up bonuses also…..

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

They are who I am with now since Avro collapsed but missed out on getting on as it was the receiver who switched me hahaha will see if I can get a couple to sign up before Octopus collapses too

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Wash your mouth out!!!! Don't you dare temp fate Mr Moss. Octopus is NOT going to crash out. Consider yourself as having been slapped with a wet kipper. :D

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

they have said they have backers that are in it for the long haul but we will see :)

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Good article recently in the Times about Octopus

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/o...bets-sgk7zj3st

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

In the short term, nothing happens.
Then you get moved to someone else, on their basic tarriff.
Atm, the basic price capped tarriffs are the best deal anyway.

I'm with bulb, but no panic here, I'll just watch it play out.
Whatever happens, I'll owe them money, not the other way around.
They quoted me half what my actual costs will be as they screwed up the quote [badly].

Atm, Im paying 50% of what will cover my eventual [actual] bills.
I know eventually they will realise, and I'll have to pay up, but I'm hanging on to it until then.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Octopus have now got my switch in progress should be complete by 5th Nov so will have taken them 6 weeks. Avro have billed me to the 11th Sept final bill runs to the 26th and should be with me in a couple of weeks they say then what is left is going to Octopus so should run ok for me

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Yet more energy suppliers cease trading

https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/ne...fAdZqIu8iHMnaQ

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Octopus claim they are well hedged (paid up front) but the longer that goes on I am just wondering how long it lasts. They also seem to be struggling setting up accounts. On their facebook page there are a lot of Avro customers who have not even got their details yet. They were meant to take my DD yesterday but did not. Obviously I will save the money but you just know a lot of people wont and will end up in debt

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Never heard of any of these, but by the look of it, they were very small.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Me neither.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Around 6 years ago I switched to a small company called GB Energy Supply. I had to involve Ofgem almost immediately because they and Scottish Power between them made a mess of the final billing/meter reading process. The customer service person I spoke to at Ofgem had at that point never heard of the company I was switching to. I guess there have been a whole load of companies popping up and going under since the system was porivatised. It doesn’t help when some of them decide they’re only dealing with certain of the distribution network operators so they are only ever regional companies.

GBES collapsed after a couple of years and I had my account transferred by the regulator to the Co-Op. These days I’m with Bulb, so at this stage I don’t know whether I’m about to go through that process again. For what it’s worth I just booked a smart meter installation with them.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

I have looked at where these 4 latest companies are based and they seem only cover private homes and to be in different areas.

As I quoted, they only have 27,000 customers between them so I'm not surprised they aren't company's most of us would have heard of and, as they are relatively new, they wouldn't have managed to get sufficient ratings to come up very high on comparison sites.

Hopefully those people who were with them will be allocated a new company soon. Not getting billed as winter sets in could result in eye watering bills at a time when many all ready expect to struggle.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

I have done the maths on my known electricity consumption and am being very careful with my gas so I know within a small degree of error how much my costs will save that amount every month until Octopus start taking my DD. I will not be caught out

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

:tu: You are being very sensible but I fear others don't all follow your example. It seems like no-win situation for those who would have struggled financially without this double whammy of a higher cap on winter bill plus no chance to find a lower tariff.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Why ?

---------- Post added at 18:17 ---------- Previous post was at 18:15 ----------

Its a no win for pretty much anyone, unless they were lucky enough to be on a long term fixed deal. My bills are basically going up by about 60%

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

We’re likely to be selling the house in the next year or so and I’m guessing it will look better on the survey for the installation to have been done already. I can’t be bothered with it myself - I know what we’re using and I’ve already gone round the house ensuring our electricity usage is as efficient as it can be.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Business users are not protected by a price cap as was highlighted on R4 "You and Yours" today and some are seeing eye-watering increases in energy costs. Sufficient to put some small enterprises out of business.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Ofgem must be very busy atm, finding new homes for everyone.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Agreed and it's work they created for themselves.

As the boss of Octopus said, energy companies should have to buy energy in advance to match the tariffs they are offering their customers. If they just gamble on energy prices falling all the time, then they will get caught out when prices rise. The extra costs from companies not doing this and failing result in extra admin for Ofgem and these costs are passed onto us consumers.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

As it always is and ever shall be

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

2 more energy firms cease trading.https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/ne...JLmFF22mCAtNik

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Despite all the doomy predictions, Bulb are still going.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

I think they are getting help on the QT. Too many customers to lose. With their pricing structure though at least they have not lost as much as those who were honoring massive loss inducing deals

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Yes, they don’t do fixed rates or introductory bribes - just one basic rate (although they do now also offer an economy electricity tariff for EV owners). I guess this may have made business planning slightly simpler for them. It has certainly given them the necessary flexibility to move all their customers onto the Ofgem maximum tariff.

They installed our smart meter last week and against all expectations it has done something useful. All three teenagers in our house used the electric shower last night so we got a timely reminder of what it looks like when a 10kW appliance runs for about an hour, more or less continuously. It was eye-watering. I’ll be having a word.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

they used to do introductory bribes as I almost got all my gas paid for one year by referring people

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

You've got teenagers that take a shower:shocked:

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

that is £2 quid gone poof just like that

Mind you a 10KW shower must be awesome

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Yeah sorry I was meaning bribes as in reduced rate tariffs for the first six months and that sort of thing - stuff that would hamper their flexibility if they needed to suddenly increase their tariffs. Some other energy companies have found themselves selling at a significant loss in recent months because they have customers on those sorts of deals.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

And now Bulb teeters on the brink …

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-59373198

---------- Post added at 12:59 ---------- Previous post was at 12:51 ----------

We appear to have reached the point where the customer reassignment process is broken.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

From Bulb website.

https://bulb.co.uk/blog/bulb-special-administration/

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

We had just switched to Green Energy from GOTO Energy, had only been with them for one month and had received back all our credit balance from GOTO. Then Green went under. So luckily I'm not in the hole moneywise.

I took meter readings the day Green went under and cancelled my Direct Debit.

I had an email saying I was being switched to Shell, but that was several weeks ago and heard nothing since. So I'll just bank what I was paying monthly to one side and wait.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

I moved from Bulb to Shell in April this year, and have found them to be OK.

They, in fact, reduced my DD from £122 to £103 in August...

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

I got most of my credit balance back from Bulb a few weeks ago because they had set a direct debit that was excessive and the amount in my account was just going up and up. I’m happy with the level of my credit at the moment because it is now definitely going to go into debit during the winter which IMO is what it’s supposed to do, although in recent years energy companies seem to have been trying to shift the goalposts so we all think it should mostly be in credit with at most a tiny dip into debit by mid spring. I’m also happy with the amount they’re taking each month. TBH as they are now going to be kept busy for a few months being back-door nationalised, I’m just going to sit tight, ride out the winter and then look to see if there are cheaper deals when things settle down next year.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Just arrived by email

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

I am dreading next April. Struggling as it is

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

The Orbit email asked me to send today's meter readings. To do that, I have to request an OTP by email. And it looks like they have shut down their system.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

just keep a note for your new supplier. I took readings after Avro shut and held onto them

---------- Post added at 14:35 ---------- Previous post was at 14:34 ----------

It has now been 2 months since Avro closed and still no final bill or balance transfer

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

What happens in April ?

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Windows 13 probably ;)

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

next price cap increase

---------- Post added at 16:27 ---------- Previous post was at 16:26 ----------

hahahaha

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Ah. Ok.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Im struggling as I'm currently paying about £114 dual fuel and my renewal is double that per month!
Is it worth going variable rate?

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

No energy company is allowed to charge you more than the price cap. If someone is offering you a new fixed rate, IIRC it can’t be more than the cap, so you won’t be any worse off on it than you would be on a variable rate. Plus, as the cap will for certain rise substantially next spring, if you are lucky enough to find a fixed rate that lasts more than 6 months you might actually save a little by next April.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

That is not correct. Fixed rate can be more than the cap

"The price cap only applies only to domestic energy customers paying standard variable rate energy tariffs (SVTs) – also known as ‘default’ tariffs. So those with a fixed-rate energy tariff are not affected by it."

https://www.forbes.com/uk/advisor/en...gy-price-caps/

There are loads of fixed rate tariffs out there way in excess of the cap. Hoping you bite and are worried abotu the rise coming and hoping the prices drop in time to not lose on it

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Freaking heck, that’s worth knowing …. There’s been so much talk about the price cap lately that that point seems to be getting overlooked. :Yikes:

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

I know crazy innit

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

You may find the Octopus page on Avro helpful.

HERE :)

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

cheers bud. Some updates there I have not seen. Appreciate it

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

I got collared by a Scottish Power rep in town earlier this week. Not only was he saying my tariff was more than I'm paying (currently on the price cap), he was also trying to get me to sign up to a 2 Yr fix at £100/month more than I'm currently paying.

The question is though... At what point will such a tariff start to look enticing? The price cap will increase again in April, so it's likely fixed rates will increase by then too. When should we jump ship from the capped rate onto a fixed deal? How far in advance is the new price cap announced?

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Will the price definitely, without question, go up in April though.

Lots of water under the bridge (and gas through pipelines) before then ;)

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Privatise the profits .. Socialise the losses:

UK government sets aside £1.7bn to support Bulb customers

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Agree on that one, my heckles rose when I first read the story :shocked:

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

do not really know what else they can do though

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Same as they did with the others that went bust?

bugger all

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

they all went to other suppliers. This time there are just too many and the risk of other suppliers going under if forced to take 1.7 million customers at a loss just impossible to do

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

The"others" were a lot smaller, and all their customers were transferred to bigger complanies, Bulb are magnitude larger, so its clearly not feasible to do so.

If you have a serious practical solution rather than the usual "lets attack the government" we'd all like to hear it.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Just didn't see why all the bulb customers couldn't go back to 'British Gas' or whatever they call themselves now.

no matter tho

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

they do not want them. 1.7 million new customers all making BG a loss ? you cannot force them to take that hit

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Here's one: we follow a more balanced model where the state and private sector work together like a number of countries in Europe:

https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...y-owned-crisis

https://blogs.worldbank.org/developm...rent-end-users

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

The way things are heading, only Centrica might be the only provider left.

So back to British Gas......

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

:confused: Garbage.
The problems have been caused by "socialising" the industry with people not paying what it actually costs. The businesses are being forced to provide energy at a LOSS.
The £1.7bn represents the extra that Bulb customers should have paid. It is the CUSTOMERS who are being subsided by the taxpayer.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Pretty sure that the customers didn’t set up the business model, or decide the prices…

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

The Government did, via the regulator.:rolleyes:
Link

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Not at the time the business model was set up…

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Precisely. The business model etc was ok and sustainable, until the government got involved.
What business can possibly survive when regulations are heaped upon it, and it is ruled that they have to supply at below the actual cost.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

I think what is "garbage" is that we, the tax payer, has to pay £1,000 a customer to keep Bulb afloat.

£1,000 a customer? Why the UK is counting the cost of keeping Bulb’s lights on

If they want to be a private company, they should be wound up when they get it wrong.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Will they have any profit(s) between now and April?
Who's keeping score?

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

If they were a private company, they could've charged the customers the proper rate.
Are you suggesting that Bulb customers should be cut off? It is the customers being propped up and subsidised.

They could only pay in advance, if they had been allowed to make actual profits to pay for it.
Even with paying in advance, the price increases still catch up with them.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

We're at the point now where, even if suppliers did hedge their supplies for the duration of a fixed tariff, in the coming months more and more customers will be coming to the end of their fixed deals and suppliers will be forced to provide energy at a significant loss because there's no competition. Even the best run companies could struggle on the months ahead.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Which only shows what happens when you apply free market dogma to national infrastructure services. When companies that are motivated by profit and shareholder returns are created in an artificial "free" market, it can never end well. The same story is seen in the water sector where it is probably worse.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

:confused:
How on earth would a publicly owned company have performed better?:rolleyes:
Same costs involved. The taxpayer would've had to subsidise consumers long before now.

The bigger companies are surviving because they are bigger and have the "cash", which a publicly owned company wouldn't have.

How much money do you think the taxpayer would have to splash out with a publicly owned company with 20 times the customers, rather than one with 1.7m customers.
Link

Profits?

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

So they were running at a loss before the price of energy surged?

Not a sustainable business model.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

So there wasn't a government imposed price cap before then?:rolleyes:
£63m against £1,700m is quite a difference.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Exactly. As the boss of Octopus Energy commented, power companies should be obliged to purchase power in advance to match the fixed tariffs they charge customers. Otherwise, they will be caught out by upswings in prices.

The price cap might be an issue for all power companies in the future if it is not increased but the likes of Bulb acquired customers with multi-year fixed tariffs. They do not have many legacy customers on variable rates like the incumbent power companies British Gas or Scottish Power do.

---------- Post added at 02:54 ---------- Previous post was at 02:40 ----------

The issue is that some of the newer companies did not buy their fuel in advance. This was ok when wholesale prices were falling but was a one-way bet when they rose. Compare Bulb to Octopus and you'll understand why one exists without subsidy and why the other has been effectively nationalised.

Re: Energy companies collapse