Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

At the moment electric cars aren't viable for most people but the Government is talking about 23 years away not 23 hours!

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Again, they're not making everyone buy electric cars now. 23 years ago the 'global super information highway' was the next big thing. The Nokia 3310 was 6 years away.

The world doesn't stay still, it moves on. Electric cars are coming. Manufactures and governments are moving in that direction and it would be foolish not to plan for it. If Tesla can build electric sports cars with a range of 300 miles now, after 10 years since their first car, imagine what we'll be able to do in another 10 years. Especially since now it's no longer a niche market with BMW producing an electric mini, Ford looking at electric engines and Volvo going electric only.

A society with less technological sophistication than ours managed to move to the combustion engine, set up those networks, we can do the same.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

I've not read any on this thread and I've been back a few pages. It's the high upfront cost that's prohibitive at the moment. To charge a Nissan Leaf for 80 miles costs about £1.50. Maintenance costs are a lot lower which is a threat to garages.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

lets not forget battery lease charges £70 per month

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

It's included in the price of the car which makes the car pricey but you can lease both instead.

"The lithium battery pack is included in the price of your Leaf. It is guaranteed for eight years, although Nissan reckons it should have a useful life of ten years. Replacing it out of warranty will cost £5,000, but you’ll get £1,000 back if you trade in the old one."
http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/nissan/leaf

Costs will inevitably come down as electric cars go mainstream but the way people buy transport will change in 23 years' time with self-driving vehicles. Like music and films, people may well start paying monthly subscriptions for access and not upfront for ownership. Diesel and electric cars will become the Virgin Megastores and Blockbuster Video of the highways.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

... and what happens if/when their 2040 deadline is there and the required national infrastructure isn't? Providing enough charging points is going to be a massive task and it wouldn't surprise me if half way through the hugely costly and protracted process they drop the whole thing in favour of something else. Remember it was only a couple of years ago that they were cajoling people into buying diesel cars. I bought one and now I'm a pariah...

You keep drawing analogies with phones and the internet - if they don't start digging up roads and putting in charging points soon it'll be too late. If they can come up with a way to charge up cars wirelessly via the internet maybe they have a chance...

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

The key thing is that there is a strong financial incentive for companies to devise an easier charging solution so money will be invested into it. Mobile phones can be charged remotely so why not larger devices in the future?
http://www.techradar.com/news/phone-...-phone-1325667

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

I see we've one or two Luddites on the forum.:)

What the future may hold:-

Solid state lithium-ion

Solid state batteries traditionally offer stability but at the cost of electrolyte transmissions. A paper published by Toyota scientists writes about their tests of a solid state battery which uses sulfide superionic conductors. All this means a superior battery.

The result is a battery that can operate at super capacitor levels to completely charge or discharge in just seven minutes - making it ideal for cars. Since it's solid state that also means it's far more stable and safer than current batteries. The solid-state unit should also be able to work in as low as minus 30 degrees Celsius and up to one hundred.

The electrolyte materials still pose challenges so don't expect to see these in cars soon, but it's a step in the right direction towards safer, faster charging batteries.

Graphene car batteries

Graphene batteries are the future. One company has developed a new battery, called Grabat, that could offer electric cars a driving range of up to 500 miles on a charge.

Graphenano, the company behind the development, says the batteries can be charged to full in just a few minutes. It can charge and discharge 33 times faster than lithium ion. Discharge is also crucial for things like cars that want vast amounts of power in order to pull away quickly.

The capacity of the 2.3V Grabat is huge with around 1000 Wh/kg which compares to lithium ion's current 180 Wh/kg. The best part of all this is that these batteries should be ready to go by mid way through 2016.

Graphene batteries have already been demo'ed to the press.

Link

That's just 2 examples of batteries being developed. The Government are going to have to get their finger out to provide the infrastructure and more importantly power generation solar and wind won't be able to keep up wwith the increase in power consumption.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

I dont think so.
The battery that will give you about 80 miles is the 24KWH.
Even assuming the charger was 100% efficient and only used 24KWH, thats about £3.00 minimum in the UK (assuming 13p per KWH which is quite cheap).
Chargers are not 100% efficient (they are about 90%, though this drops the flatter the battery was when you start charging it).

Based on what evidence ?

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

the way electricity prices are rising no one will be able to afford to charge up a car in 23 years

British Gas to put up electricity bills by 12.5%, owner Centrica says

http://news.sky.com/story/british-ga...-says-10969486

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Our previous history on a good many huge infrastructure projects does not make for good reading.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

don't panic



it's sorted https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ptlhgFaB89Y

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Sound business sense. Lose 377,000 customers in the first half of the year, put your prices up to win them back!

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

they can smell the oncoming dependency on electricity

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Sadly the other suppliers will follow suit pretty quickly.:td::(

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

well with the government switching to total dependency on electricity we can expect price rises in the high % bracket every few months for the next 23 years .

charging your car up will be 10x the cost of petrol /diesel well done greentards

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Correct, they'll let us believe how cheap it's going to be and then when it's done we're all totally dependent on electric vehicles the prices will rise and people will wake up to the reality that they have no choice. It's not like the electricity companies are everybody's favourites either is it but I dare say we'll get a whole load of assurances about how well they'll be regulated and how well the 'market' will work blah blah blah...

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

like privatising energy was gonna be cheaper and nuclear would be practically free of charge .

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Never believe what you hear most of the time as usually its total ********.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

You're being too hard on other posters again Den ;)

Too many cars is the problem - many households having one for each resident. Double the road tax for each additional car. Quadruple it for Audi and BMW owners as they drive like ******s and indeed are ******s should you be unfortunate enough to meet one.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Well we've been 'totally dependent' on fuel based cars up until now. It's not as if fuel can't further rocket in price as oil supplies become harder to extract and instability in the middle east restricts supply.

You can generate equivalent levels of energy cheaper than the fuel you get at the pump. Electricity is the just the medium that allows it's transport. The key is getting the energy generated in the first place and we have more than enough notice to work on it - something we should be doing anyway given how crucial energy supply is just as a national security issue.

I didn't think there would be much support for nationalising the energy companies on here given how much even regulating their prices was view with absolute horror on here when Red Ed suggested it but maybe that is a way to make it cheaper?

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

I can't quite understand why the rotation of the wheels on the car cannot be used to generate the energy needed to replenish the battery. But then again, I always knew I'd never be a rocket scientist! :scratch:

---------- Post added at 13:35 ---------- Previous post was at 13:33 ----------

Well, they might get a shock if we decide to run our cars on cow poo. If it works on buses...

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

They do in electric cars when you brake. When that happens you're taking energy out of the rotating wheels which the car turns into electricity that goes back into the battery.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regenerative_brake

Most electric and hybrid cars have display of some form that tells you where the energy is coming from and going to.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Electric/Hybrid cars already sort of do this but on breaking: https://www.tesla.com/en_GB/blog/mag...rative-braking

I think this is also roughly how alternators work but in that case some of the energy from the fuel is being put into the battery, here it wouldn't make sense because you would just the looping it from the battery and back into the battery. Instead electric cars look at conserving energy in other ways such as the breaking.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

What about 10? The iPhone I used to run GTA: San Andreas 10th Anniversary edition in 2013 was considerably more powerful than the PC I used to run GTA: San Andreas in 2003.

I've seen a lot of people complain about this on here and on facebook appear to think nothing will change.

I have a few points.

1. 2040 is a long way away. A lot can happen in the next 22 years, including building a network of charging stations if necessary.
2. Technology changes. Batterys made in 2017 are considerably more efficient than those made in 1995. They charge faster, and often have higher capacities for the same size. There is no reason to assume that in the next 22 years, we won't discover at least one new formula that improves battery life. That's assuming that batteries are the only viable source for the electricity, and that electricity is the only viable way to power the car. There will also be improvements in the technology of cars that may improve efficiency.
3. I said on Facebook that I remember being told at school that BP had estimated that at (then current) rates of use, the planet would run out of oil in about 2030. Usage will have changed, and other deposits have been found since then, so that estimate is not accurate. However, the world does have a finite supply of oil, and it seems likely it will run out sooner rather than later.

We also had one poster say until an electric car can do 600 miles on one charge, it won't be worth it. Really? How often do you drive 600 miles in one day? When you go home at the end of the day, what do you do with the car? Do you leave it outside your home (perhaps on the drive). Where your diesel car would be sitting there for 8-10 hours (or more) while you sit at home doing whatever, then sleeping, it could be charging for the next day. Yes, you pay to charge the car, but you are already paying for fuel (and seeing as you need to drive to the petrol station, you are effectively buying extra fuel so you can buy fuel) so charging may actually be cheaper.

One of my neighbours had a BMW he made heavy use of, both for work and family life. He sold it a year or so back and bought a Tesla Model S. It's a lovely car. He uses it just as much as he did the BMW, he just has to remember to plug it in when he gets home.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

We have until 2070 apparently.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

It will probably last longer than that but the issue is escalating cost as oil reserves become harder to extract. In fact towards the end it's likely it will become so expensive that we move off oil before all the reserves are depleted.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

A toxic legacy. I will be switching to clean electric before 2020. No doubt there will be times of inconvenience but it's time to take personal responsibility.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

i'm upgrading to a 6.6 ltr petrol thanks for covering my carbon footprint ;)

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

As has been said previously it's all very well buiding charging stations etc but the electricity for them has to be generated by one means or another.Solar power is limited to daylight hrs and will be severely limited in the winter months.

Wind power has it's limitations as well. Turbines are turned off if the wind speed gets too high. Neither can be relied upon because of this.

ATM the only alternative is Neuclear. That will cost billions and take decades.

Does that include Venezuela's vast rich oil reserves?

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Happy to oblige. I will of course continue to cycle slowly and erratically to spoil your big motoring pleasure. No road tax, no MOT, no insurance and not a care in the world :).

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Slowly and erratically is likely to eventually get you involved in an accident.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Thankfully we have decades but we should start right now either way because we need energy. The UK being fully energy dependent is a goal we should chase anyway.

Also I can see us using a mix. Solar is becoming more and more efficient per panel so a future where new houses are decked in the Tesla-style roofing helping to reduce the energy required per-house from the grid and other measures to reduce the energy used.

A combination of designing things to use less energy, to recapture the energy that we do use (such as breaking in electric cars) and to capture more in smaller amounts from elsewhere (solar) can all help reduce the work of the grid.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Considering the Powerwall battery alone is £5,900 what's the roof going to cost?

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Tesla is a premium brand for now. It's just an example of what we could do in future.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Memory cards are a good example of increased capacity and reduced price - my first camera memory card was 128Mb at nearly £50 in 2003, and now you can buy a 128Gb for around £45.

An improvement of 1000x capacity for less cost.

People were paying nearly £2k for a 42" LCD TV in 2008, now you can get a good name brand 50" for £400-500 less than 10 years later.

If there's a perceived need, the market will provide.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

you used to get 6 eggs in a box now you get 15 :shrug:

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Make cars pack up if you drive them for less than 2 miles. Might cure us of diabetes and being a fat lazy generation too.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

you can get 15 cheaper than you used pay for 6?

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Are cars running on eggs now :confused:

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

I know someone who did a bit of consulting for this lot. Seems promising, refill in minutes at a filling station just like you do now. It's quiet and clean so what's not to like? It might come to nothing but it shows where there's a will there's a way and that there are alternatives.

Cheers

Dave

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

No more so than riding two abreast, jumping red lights, weaving, ignoring cycle lanes and hogging the centre of the road; all skills acquired by the experienced cyclist to manage traffic :D.

Yep, there are alternatives but it's going to take some doing weaning people off the petrol/diesel tit.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Interesting idea if it works, and is powerful enough.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Probably what the marketing slogan "go to work on an egg" was invented for

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Yep and a danger to many other safe motorists at the same time...

---------- Post added at 06:43 ---------- Previous post was at 06:41 ----------

More generalising l see Mr K.:rolleyes:

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

no they're not and they're not running on memory cards i phones or computers /tv's they still need fuel [electricity] :)

if they could run on sarcasm i would buy 2 i have a lifetime supply of fuel

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

And the point that technology advances in ways we can't forecast, using those examples, obviously whooshed over your head like the morning flight to London (hope this helps refill your sarcasm reservoir, which is probably co-located with your bile repository...).

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

now now don't you upset yourself calm down dear

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Projecting again, I see. ;)

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

it's only a forum :naughty:

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

But is it?


That's what "they" want you to think...:shocked:

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

It's an inventive way of keeping you awake at the wheel old timer although it probably makes you dribble a bit more.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

With age comes wisdom Kursk but obviously with you it got missed along the way.;)

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

I reckon we're going to see a VHS v Betamax style competition in the market and someone's going to wind up losing a lot of money which customers will ultimately pay for.

Whatever options there are, installing the required infrastructure is going to be a massive task and those involved will want to be sure they have some realistic prospect of a return on their money. With all the usual governmental dithering and regulatory burdens (e.g. health & safety, planning etc.) to be considered I can see this turning into a costly debacle. It takes a whole lot longer to implement ideas than to come up with them and there's a real risk that by the time it's done the technology installed is obsolete.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

but vhs and betamax were overtaken and replaced by stealing movies off the internet ;)

will there be the theft of fuel/power option from these charging points

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

'Theft' from customers probably. Charging electric vehicles not stay cheaper than alternative fuels for long.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

I see you occasionally think outside the box, Mr K.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

We have to upgrade the infrastructure anyway. Oil is running out and will become more expensive the closer to get to that point. We're running these things on a resource which is finite, polluting and comes from volatile sources which makes the supply of it insecure. We can replace this with energy that is flexible, can be renewable, can be clean, more efficient and produced nationally. It's entirely logical.

It does take a while, we have a while.

As for it being obsolete well it's more likely to be done so by driverless cars than something replacing electricity as a medium. The production of electricity or it's final delivery method is easier to swap around.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

They were overtaken by many things initially DVDs for sale or rented via LoveFiilm then Sky Movies, Netflix, Google Play etc.
Stealing movies came relatively recently in the timeline and only has a fraction of the market compared to services like Netflix and Sky Movies. Stealing digital content is easier than physical content.
Subscription models like Netflix are probably the likely route for electric cars, possibly combined with buses and even access to electric bikes. Interesting times ahead but with the potential for lots of job losses in the transport and automobile sectors.

---------- Post added at 20:14 ---------- Previous post was at 20:10 ----------

What will the petrol stations do? I guess many have closed down in cities as the price of land made them unviable. You would think that the BPs of this world might want to enter the recharging market but with driverless cars, maybe country pubs? will enter the market. ;)

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

It's the infrastructure which is the problem unlike a petrol station which from a very small site can refuel hundreds of vehicles fully and within a few minutes. We're going to need to install sufficient on road charge points at every address which doesn't have space for their own, not to mention workplaces, public buildings etc. That's going to be massively costly and take years. It's that investment in time and money which risks being undermined or rendered needless by possible advances in alternative technology in the meantime. As I said, getting stuff installed in the ground is what takes the time and costs all the money to build and maintain. Who's going to pay for that unless there's a decent return on the investment? Either we pay through taxes or the prices we pay for our electricity or probably both. Either way, the carrot of cheap car charging is a convenient illusion for those who're forcing change. They also have to replace all the tax derived from fuel sales from somewhere else - guess where...

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

i think investors will be nervous to put new infrastructure in place in case it is superseded by another technology rendering their investment void ,chances are nothing will happen and when the day comes we will just drop off a cliff edge and transport will grind to a halt

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

I think some investors will be nervous, which is why they need a nudge here and there. I know this isn't a retrospective approach, but in Leeds as part of the planning process all new residential properties that have dedicated parking spaces with the property will require 1 charging point per property, while communal car parking will need 1 charging point for every 10 spaces. In addition the communal parking will need 'cable enabled bays' so extra charge points can be added later as and when required.

I know there's been some resistance but at the end of the day if installing a charging point during construction makes a development unprofitable then the developer really needs to ask if they're in the right business!!

Just because it's not headline news doesn't mean things aren't happening behind the scenes (I'm sure Leeds are not working in isolation). I know some people are trying very hard to find any reason to have a moan, but these would be the people shouting the loudest if the oil stopped flowing and there was nothing there to take it's place - especially if we'd known for decades that the end of oil was coming!!


Cheers


Dave

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Is that all new builds in Leeds Grim ? I'm in Leeds too and work is sited in the middle of a new build. I haven't seen any charging points at the houses nearest to me although I haven't particularly looked out for them (until now). Sounds a good idea tho'.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

In the guidance link lower down this page:

http://www.leeds.gov.uk/residents/Pa...rking-SPD.aspx

Cheers

Dave

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Transport for commercial purposes won't; transport for the individual might, which is why it is better to embrace the change to electric. That the change is cleaner is a bonus; for most people, retaining a personal means of transport ought to be their priority.

Go electric or get a bike; the choice is yours. Stinky old combustion isn't on the table.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Ta for that. Good to see :Yes:

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

I'm doing neither of those things. Go inefficient electric if you like, and dice with death on your bike if that gives you a thrill.

I'm going for tried and tested petrol cars for as long as possible, and if I have the option of a hydrogen fuelled car when I'm forced to do the other thing, then that's what I will get.

We have until 2040 to figure that one out, and I dare say used petrol cars will be around for a lot longer. No need for me to worry, then.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Pollution was never going to be an issue for anyone with an "I'm alright Jack" mentality.

Given that oil reserves are finite, pollution is killing us and we don't know if a hydrogen option will ever become available, what is your advice to someone who is in their teens/early twenties?

There is indeed no need for you to worry; but don't you worry for them?

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

suck it up i had to ;)

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Yeah, sod 'em. Sadly :D.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

after i got the planet killing baby boomer speech from my kids i thought sod it you ungrateful gits ill give em used all the resources ruined the planet sucked all the money out of everything own all the housing etc etc ...
sadly ;)

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

I agree we need to do something about pollution, but if every car became electric overnight or if everyone used their bikes in future, it would not make any difference.

It's the big polluters like China and India we need to tackle, not the humble car.

The politicians need to get together instead of fighting each other and find some suitable alternatives to electric vehicles. I say again, what has happened to the hydrogen car?

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban (2040).
 

oh heck

Pollution tunnels to tackle car emissions

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/n...ions-cjgpx3zmg

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban (2040).
 

If they are taking the p, they are not very good at it...

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban (2040).
 

Good grief ....

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban (2040).
 

Some people live in cloud cuckoo land. Is it a TFL plan?... :rolleyes:

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Oh, I know Solar and Wind power are not the whole answer. That said, some of the problems with unreliability can be reduced by the use of batteries.

Personally, I'd like to see us looking at Nuclear again. I know we have existing Nuclear stations, but I think we need to look at either upgrading our existing ones or building new ones.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

yes we should build one in london

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban (2040).
 

Why would you build one in London ?

We dont build power stations in the middle of cites.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban (2040).
 

well he wants more of them he lives in Sarf east Luhndun. where else would it go ? closer to someone else who doesn't want one :shrug:

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

One? What about resilience?

Cheers

Dave

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban (2040).
 

To quote an article I saw about this and the Ford Mustang 5.0l

"No Replacement for Displacement"

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban (2040).
 

Anywhere in the country, we do have the technology to distribute ;)

People who "dont want" appear to have a choice, no transport, or more power stations, electricity isnt generated by magic.

Btw, whats wrong with your shift key :erm: sentences start with capital letters.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

We are http://namrc.co.uk/intelligence/uk-n...ns/developers/

---------- Post added at 21:53 ---------- Previous post was at 21:30 ----------

Interesting development on the electricity storage front, with Ikea launching a solar panel battery storage solution
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/bu...-a7874331.html

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban (2040).
 

But that is the problem is we say lets build it but when the nimby's realise its going to be built on their holy ground they get out their placards and start waving them about angrily.:nono::nono::nono:

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban (2040).
 

Tesla model S wih ludicrous mode engaged......

Can't believe as a diehard petrol head I've written that

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

There are currently 3 new nuclear power stations in the pipeline. Joint ventures between EDF and the Chinese.

Link

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban (2040).
 

Yep, that Tesla is quick. Guy Martin rode an electric bike around the Isle during TT week and he was impressed; he said after 'it was the future'.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban (2040).
 

The streets would need extension leads running across pavements.

it's all a fantasy. it will never happen.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Agreed. http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/sh...&postcount=284

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban (2040).
 

It's already happening.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban (2040).
 

Where does that post mention "extension leads running across pavements." :confused:

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban (2040).
 

Without a major investment in infrastructure that no one so far seems interested in commiting to, electric vehicles will not be in the majority anytime soon. I'm not opposed to the idea hell as someone who lives on a main road I'd welcome it with open arms it just isn't going to happen anytime soon no matter how much i and others may like it too.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban (2040).
 

I think people are putting too much faith in battery technology improving.

There is however some simple physics that shows why this is not really viable: Say you had a 100 KWhr battery, this is enough to give a decent range, to charge it in 1 hour requires 230v at 440 Amps excluding inefficiencies. Just think of the cable thickness and "plug".

Now you want a fast rechage at a garage say, 6 minutes? that's 4,400 Amps!!! A cable to carry that would be so heavy you'd need a crane. The magnetic field generated by such a current is likely to erase things in the vicinity.

Quick refilling and long range can only be got from a fuel cell / hydride tank using Hydrogen. A simple swappable tank cartridge could have you filled up in under a minute and the tanks are recharged with Hydrogen at the garage, generated using surplus electricity, where you stopped. The fuel cell can also be run "backwards" for a slow recharge of the tank at your home.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban (2040).
 

It mentions it in the quoted post:

A potential solution is inductive charging.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban (2040).
 

An idea.

otherwise it'll have to back to the extension cables running across the pavements.

it'll never happen :)

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban (2040).
 

Apparently, inductive charging has been in use in S Korea for a number of years. When we say "it'll never happen" they just get on and do it.

Admittedly, it isn't going to be easy but if you are offered the choice of an electric vehicle or nothing, what will you choose? The government will keep commercial transport running but there is less need to provide an independent means of transport for private individuals....

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban (2040).
 

If there is no other choice then people will definitely force to choose electric vehicle.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban (2040).
 

... and therein lies the reality. We're not going to have a choice and will be reliant upon our local and national authorities to get it right and ensure sufficient infrastructure of the right type is there when it's required. I'm sorry but given the debacles surrounding London's new airport/runway, power generating capacity etc. I don't have a great deal of faith that the reality will bear any relation to what's being envisaged. It may be possible in societies such as Korea but in the UK I can see this being chaotic with a huge impact on personal freedom. Of course the great and the good will be effectively exempt from any of that and no doubt delighted that the rest of us aren't clogging up the roads for them as they go about their business of accumulating more wealth whilst living the high life. I reckon a great many people really believe that switching to all electric vehicles will provide them with just the same freedom and flexibility they enjoy now with petrol/diesel vehicles but much cheaper and IMHO the reality will be very different, certainly within the timescale set out. The lost fuel related and other revenues will have to be recouped from somewhere as will the massive cost of the national infrastructure required to support such a dramatic change. I have no faith that our glorious leaders can deliver on this objective and of course if/when they don't it'll be us mere mortals who'll suffer most of all...

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban (2040).
 

Oh come on have more faith in Mother Theresa, she's got her finger on the pulse and knows what's going down.

We were supposed to be in hover cars by now according to my 1975 Beano Annual, so they haven't a clue what transport will be like in 2040. I suspect like now, but even more congested. Number of cars is the problem, not the fuel source.

---------- Post added at 10:05 ---------- Previous post was at 10:02 ----------

No wonder N Korea are threatening war, that's energy theft !