Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

Some medications can cause mental side-effects (Strattera for ADHD is one as my daughter has found out). But the side-effects are less of a problem than the original problem.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atomoxetine

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

Martyh also fails to see there been quite few accidents which increased health issues for many not talking the fake car accidentsthe proper accident which done damage. Then there new illnesses even new people collapse or feel ill diagnosed with number illnesses or combinations.

Now they maybe shorterm or long term they still have the right to claim if they pass the new goalpost.

I am not shocked disabilty going up because all these factors.

What are you proposition to solve it LIFO system we only allowed X number those who aint died yet or cured get drop for new member in the queue. It dont work like that you will get sadly increases while medication keeps disabled to live longer or should we be inhumane pull this needed medication. I not suprised with the atitudes and verbal attacks many disabled feel like giving up let the swines win.

Maggy you forgot to mention squeeze on pay high costs one of the biggest factors for mental breakdowns not actually suprised this going up as we see society crumble. Its another short sightedness that it will cause stress anxiety.

The purge on disabled, poor, unemployed will also create big increase.

Once people see no end see money shrink they become inward and depression sets in. I believe the pattern was before during the great depression too. Anxiety, stress, depression link to recessions

http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/20...ealth-problems


Suicides go up too sadly although this american so we will get told not in uk it wont.

http://www.boston.com/lifestyle/heal...des_surge.html

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

Quite a few accidents ? care to give any details of this sudden increase in car accidents because I'm buggered if i can find anything about it ,and i feel sure that if the accident rate had risen so much as to noticeably affect the amount of disability claimants i think we would all be aware of it ......not to mention very worried

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

Having taken some time off and got over my little bout of depression i am getting my sense of perspective back. What i think the problem is different perspectives and understanding on the two sides. On the one side you have taxpayers being bombarded with negative media exaggerating the scale of the problem within the benefits system being drip fed stories of ridiculous abuse of the system. They also have the government being alittle creative on the information side to keep the taxpayer supportive of this welfare reform process.

On the other side you have those within the system who have a better understanding of how things are changing and negatively the changes are being implemented and how unfairly the changes are being applied. Both sides are upset and neither side is listening to to the other side putting the arguments both sides hsve down to whinging and others with an agenda making sure the divide cannot be bridged.

I voted tory at the last election i fell hook line and sinker for the slick talk and the "we're all in it together" rhetoric and whilst i expected some of it to disappear once they got into power but i never imagined for one minute how badly they would divide this country. I have always agreed that welfare needs reform but i cannot in all honesty support this
current state of reform it has nothing to do with helping those who need it. This whole process is about saving money by whatever means necessary and is so stupidly short sighted it beggers belief.

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

No not just talking car accidents alone just when you see whole scope things understand why it could increase. Alsorts acidents even those who pursue life on edge hobbies not saying they should'nt but risks they take can often result in severe injuries. Then there the conflicts we had in last ten years where unfortunate very brave soldiers who sadly have been badly disabled for there country.

All you have to factor in lots cases we will see accident great they recover. Many will be just mere minor but there many who endup with bad disibilities or complications. Plus martyh people just become sick its human nature whether they sick enough the system there to decide. I think we hope it balances but as world changes risks get taken inocents get hurt. I wont even factor for self inflicited which why governments urged the healthy living mantra over the years they saw it coming. Many will cite the smokers many got lied to years back it was safe in thing to do. We as nation cant turn our backs on them surely.

Now you could argue we could change the law insurance pick the tab up for healthcare/living of that person now they cant work. If they did would hate to see what sort numbers insurance premiums goto for those without to cover those claims. fear this may happen at somepoint to ofset costs. Not problem if those dont claim get shafted.

Should business support someone who gets badly injured unable to work due to malpractise. Its certainly food for thought but I not advocating it its defenate one for discusion.

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

Incapacity tests reject 37% of claimants

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-17379564

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

And those that are told they are fit to work, (but are really in no fit state to do any work), have to go through the appeals process, and are normally having to wait around 8 to 9 months for their appeal to be heard. (probably a lot longer now due to a backlog).

Also, what about the genuinely disabled who are too scared to appeal the DWP's (with the help of the ATOS examiners) decision? I wonder what the figures would drop to then?

No wonder some of these "victims" find suicide to be the only viable option. What effects do they have on the overall figures?

Link

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

All this is a waste of time and money, that could be spend creating new decent jobs

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

When are you going to add something proper and constructive to a topic? I can't see any sense on most of your posts, and it's getting annoying when you see a new post then hoping that there's something to add to a topic only to see that you keep posting the same rubbish throughout each threads.

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

My point is that these benefit cuts are wrong and all they do is take the rich off the hook for their tax evasion and economic mistakes

Why should we pay the price of the mistakes of the rich and powerful?

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

"Why should we pay the price of the mistakes of the rich and powerful?" We always have Alan and we always will it's how things are and the way things have been under any system yet tried by humans even communism had it's version of the upper and lower classes they just got creative in the terminology. What needs to happen to our benefits system is a proper test created not by people with economics first and foremost in their minds but by impartial health professionsals truly only interested in finding those fit for work.

This is going to come back to bite everyone forcing sick people to take jobs is going to result in a lot of employers getting very fed up with unreliable workers which a lot of the people taken off sickness will be through no fault of their own. In the future it will make it that much harder for those of us who might get a cure or better treatment to get a job it is extremely short sighted. I voted for the torys at the last election i knew we couldn't afford to let labour back and although not wholly trusting of all that was being said to get our votes i never thought 99% of it would vanish when they got into power.

We need sensible people to sit down and work out the best practical way forward in many areas the welfare system being one of the biggies and we do not have that right now. I think the speed of all these reforms is because this is a government that knows it will only get the one term to do it and they want to do as much as they can regardless of the damage it will do. This whole process of reform in this country is not just affecting individuals or even singular groups it is changing attitudes in everyone. You only have to look on here to see the rising anger of some to the benefit system and some of the extreme suggestions being proposed for those on beefit to see we as a country are becoming more hateful and resentful.

Thats also a deliberate policy pushed by those who for years have had an agenda to get us at each others throats and now they have.

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:

Reform is essential - wholesale decimation is not.

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

Yes, but there have been times were we have had a more equal society and under a free market you pay the price for your mistakes, except that the rich and “forgotten� that rule. What governments are doing not just here but in most of the world (bar the emerging markets) will make people (especially young people) think “what is the point of democracy and capitalism when our lives are not improving but getting worse?� and when people think that, I fear that the answer will come from these types of people

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2012/03/29.jpg

By the way, who will you vote next time there is an election

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

The answer will come from a dead person who was killed whilst trying to foment a failed revolution?

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

I won't be voting simple as that because although it has taken time i have learnt the lesson that my vote doesn't count no matter who gets in we get shafted so screw the lot of them.

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

What if everyone who felt as you do voted Raving Looney Party or whatever?

It could be a landslide victory against the "major 3!!

;)

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

I am just incredibly fedup of the whole thing and at this point in time cannot see any point at all in voting for any party. I have never said there shouldn't be reform or reorganisation of most of what is being reformed right now but the way it is being done is disgusting and i genuinely thought we in this country were better then that seems i was wrong :(.

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

We know, near enough, that we will have a few years of "spend, spend, spend" with Labour then a few years of "put the finances back in order" from the Conservatives.

The carrot, then the stick.

And repeat.

This system of politics, Party Politics, means that whatever you elect your local MP for will be overshadowed, if not over-ruled, by those that lead the Party.

And by that I do not mean the Prime Minister, but those who really wield the real power.

In this part of the political cycle, many of us will see a drop in living standards and may well strike out at those not responsible, but an easy target for our wrath.

The disabled have been marked as scapegoats by the media (with a fair bit of help and encouragement by politicians) by lumping them in with a group known to contain some benefit fraudsters. Hence the growing abuse.

And let us not forget that Iain Duncan Smith, failed Prime Minister candidate, has been wallowing in the dark and dingy recesses of a Party out of power for many years, designing this "strategy" to save money and kick us ALL when we are down.

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

me,i dont blame the disabled,the forenger or any one but the govenment!!
if there wasnt and entitlements or benefits-it wouldnt get scammed!!
there fault!! govenment fault!!
and dont say,if they got rid of benefits,alot more people will be stealing!!
makes no differnce!! they still stealing!!

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

RizzyKing have you seen this website fighting for disabled got support from alistair campbell, stephen fry.

http://www.disabilitynow.org.uk/latest-news2

This one was cracker its not our fault media has demonised called cheats and scroungers Marie Miller says.

Well I think she should be told this. Tell the media that then Marie GET cameron on the telly. Make a press conference anounce to the world that. Its no good just putting in article it needs to be given wide audience.

http://www.disabilitynow.org.uk/late...r-blames-media

they have some very very interesting articles which taken the lid off quite few things.

This quite telling WCA is actually not working not fit for purpose, one critism is the questionairres are "lengthly" not easy to understand rely too heavily on stock questions.

Sorry for the reading but its worth a read in one seems tinkling admission there is problem. Seems PIP will be very expensive to implement for what 0.5% fraud.

http://www.disabilitynow.org.uk/late...it-for-purpose

http://www.disabilitynow.org.uk/late...-all-spartacus

this is another about watchdog concerned about disabled in work programme

http://www.disabilitynow.org.uk/late...work-programme

Marie Miller talks to Disabled Now

http://www.disabilitynow.org.uk/late...-on-dla-reform

This about joining the factions as one

http://www.disabilitynow.org.uk/late...shared-agendas

---------- Post added at 21:38 ---------- Previous post was at 19:49 ----------

just hit another survey shows way media increased the way disabled news is now potrayed.

http://www.leeds.ac.uk/disability-st...people_pdf.pdf


There quite few studies


http://www.leeds.ac.uk/disability-studies/

talk about how this crazy witchunt causing this was in januarys derby paper. Would not be suprised more things happening out there sadly.

http://www.thisisderbyshire.co.uk/Te...ail/story.html

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

Indeed, they're all one in the same at the end of the day

Ironically, they spend all their time in the house of commons, arguing with each other and acting like a bunch of misbehaving children, yet these people are supposed to be running the country.

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

Actually, you are confusing MPs (who are elected to represent their constituency) with Her Majesty's Government (who are elected to run the country).;)

Not all MPs (even in the majority party/parties) are in the Government, and not all members of the Government are MPs. :D

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

If someone lost their benefit they would turn to crime. (such as stealing)
so a lot more people will be stealing.
the ones who are already stealing will be stealing more.

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

I think you mis-judge people, Gary.

Not everyone has base instincts.

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

I didn't mean everyone.
just a lot of people.

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

Sorry.

I don't think a lot of people have base instincts, and turn to crime when they have less than before.

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

I think a lot of people who have nothing will. and a few who have less than before will too.

you have to look at it as they have nothing to lose, and all to gain.
benefit money was their sole means of survival.

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

I don't see that at all, those people of the correct disposition to commit crimes wouldn't be satisfied with only getting welfare money so will and do commit crimes already

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

Yes, I haven't seen anybody say otherwise.

what I was saying was a few of those with that disposition will increase their own crime rate figures to make up the shortfall.

and those who never had the disposition, some will now have the disposition and start stealing.

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

In normal circumstances agreed but you would'nt believe what people capable off until they pushed into very small corner.

There stats show the country in great depression it increases crimerates.

anyway this hugely off topic

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

Dont like bring old topics back but new developments on Remploy. Express will back the campaign after it emerged government will support prisoners £20 a week in new project. Now great for prisoners but did the government say they could not support losses remploy at £16 per head.

If remploy not financially viable how is prison workfare system subsidies viable.

http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/...t-the-disabled

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

If ATOS abuse continues, perhaps we shall see many disdabled people commiting crimes so that they can get involved in the prisons' project ?

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

I think that they are far more likely to become homeless and/or commit suicide.:(

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

sadly thats already happen the part suicides:(

Just showed the double standards

Hope the charity who got hoodwinked makes public apology to those disabled at remploy helps fight those closures.

I am even not shocked remploy make small losses under circumstances its sole disabled employer.

As long it does good job helping disabled it should never been decided not to be supported. The fact its helped many into mainstream employment it does not just provide its onw factories.

They are looking ways to see if its viable remodeling themselves apparantly. Sadly though not in time to save 208 staff and 1,752 jobs. Thats not forgetting the knock on to companies who supported them or had contracts.

Wonder where government going for some stuff they provide

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

Remploy is a company ,prisons are not .Remploy is there to make money ,prisons are not .
The subsidies given to Remploy to keep unproductive factories open will go a lot further if re directed to other areas of the disability budget ,even the charities accept that .

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

on profits this needs very much investigating.

http://righttowork.org.uk/2012/03/re...the-scrapheap/

I would not believe everything your told there hell alot disabled got miss trust at RADAR report. Liz Sayce organisation one of many not all disabled organisation believe she was right. There even growing concern ordinary disabled getting shafted by thes big charities who starting to lose sight to who they supposed to be supporting.

http://www.dpac.uk.net/2012/


You say it factory it more than that check tthe link remploy does alot thinks to help disabled not just in own factories. I would suspect remploy been used as they make alot goods for government. Which likely hit there impact to make those profits.

Prisons will still be form factories as businesses are involved. They being subsided those subsidies you could argue are remploy's saving. I will say this doubt penny will go into getting disablded work.

Those workers would have found employment in mainstream they have not reasons simple they are not getting help in work.

http://www.dpac.uk.net/2012/03/right...mploy-workers/

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

Remploy is a not for profit organisation

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

my mistake Martyh

found more stuff which puts doubt alot doubt to the report.

I would say on losses these bonuses are going harm any chance of not making a loss. Whether acusations founded about contract is another matter. If true again another issue which would harmed breaking even.

Been accusation that report visited only 3 Remploy sites and took less than 15 minutes to form her opinion on what a Remploy factory life looks like. If this true how can she evaluate in that short spell therefore would invalidate the report if true. It was accusation in letters on this news report

http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/283385/So-Mr-Cameron-why-are-you-sacking-disabled-workers--

There is small matter of how much her organisation was paid reports over 2m was poorly done.

If want to read some insight on this long read 16 pages can download it here. Was considering drop the whole doc on here but mods would have fit:D

www.gmb.org.uk/docs/SAYCE%20REPORT%20ANALYSIS.doc

some opening points

Problem with her organisation got under fire as more and more disabled are fighting this. Radar become quite noticable very quiet.

I am no doubt she had good intentions there many things in the report which good. However factors was never considered in findings. it is amirable assumption many would be helped into mainstream needs also changes to do so. Radar very much aware these issues such as equality and disability right in workplace. She knows the challenges yet supports instigated the removal avenue into work. There small matter the economic climate report should considered. Location those remploy factories in very very high unemployment sectors. Which sadly mean disabled going to find it hard even with support to bridge the move to mainstream employment.

Surely better for them in subsidised factories at present then repraisal of it when economic climate can take better convergance of these disabled to mainstream employment rather than on scrapheap.

There no doubt issues with remploy the highlighted bosses bonuses which need serious investigation. The issue of why contracts was turned down.

The in process restructure whether that means problems solved they bring back some factories time will tell.

Re: Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities
 

There been development in france ATOS staff speaking out about practises. Bear in mind only going by translation of french news article which has alot references to uk issues.

http://department-for-making-hope-po...taff-speak-out

Another was investigation by mirror on that found a number deaths a day its sad those been wrongly assessed. Its so heartfelt those families to seen there loved ones die.

Now accept it does not say cause death. Does question some cases hope the government eliminate this wrong assessments.

http://blogs.mirror.co.uk/investigat...ailing-in.html

Someone underneath in letters talked about those who they knew as one these statistics.

I think atos staff must surely be more educated on terminal illnesses. They should really understand more about the illnesses they assessing.