Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

I dread to think what would happen if the yes vote goes through. It would be a disaster for us here in Scotland. I know there are a lot of his followers of Salmon don,t believe in independance but still like some things that he has passed for us. I believe we all need each other to stay in the UK is a must.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

The only impact I can see it having on the rest of the UK is it is unlikely that Labour could get a majority in what would remain of Parliament.

I foresee savings at the treasury overall, and change to B S T ( Now that would be good!) ;)

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

IMHO the SNP rely on stirring up nationalism amongst the few and the apathy/disenchantment of the many. The Scots have a big decision to make and I hope they get it right and don't base their decision on Salmond's soundbites. As an Englishman fed up with leftie lunacy, I'd quite like to see a lot fewer Labour MP's deciding our affairs, especially those doing so from the relative safety of Scotland.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Why should they be any different to most voters & not react to sound bites. Sorry sad but true . This is the age of the " edited " quote,if you get my meaning :dozey:

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Scottish voters have never paid too much attention to the SNP's drivel about independence. They are in power in Holyrood purely and simply because in Scottish Parliament elections they are the only viable alternative to Labour.

The SNP's popular electoral success does not, and has never, had nationalist undertones and Salmond knows this, which is why he has done everything he possibly can to delay the referendum and to set it in a context where he thinks he has at least an outside chance of success (Commonwealth games in Glasgow plus the 700th anniversary of the Battle of Bannockburn, an event sacred to Nats but which in my experience most Scots don't give a stuff about ... it is of similar significance to 1066 in the English consciousness and has about the same level of relevance in modern politics).

Of far more significance will be events marking the centenary of the Great War and the 75th anniversary of WWII, which of course will be draped in the Union Jack and will resonate strongly where most of Scotland's votes are - in and around Glasgow where in places the bomb scars are still evident.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

I might joke with mates about Scotland becoming separate from the UK but it's not something i really want. My national pride extends to the rest of the UK not just the section of it i happen to live, the days of the Scottish hating the English, vice versa etc etc are long gone. We're one nation now and it's times like these when the rest of Europe are in so much trouble that we need to stand shoulder to shoulder, not split over a sense of nationalism that belongs in the past.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Seconded! :tu:

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

I cannot see there being a yes vote on this in 2014 but what does worry me is what that idiot salmond is going to do in the next couple of years to try and bribe voters. Also i admit i havn't read much on this detail wise but if they do vote no how long will it be before they are asked to vote again is there a minimum time or could they have a vote every year.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

It might depend on the size of the defeat. If separatism eventually attracts as little support as it currently enjoys (around 30%) then it would be difficult for them to push for another vote in under 20 years at least, I would have thought.

However, an interesting issue now arises - the SNP accepts the precedent that the Scottish Parliament does not have the power to hold a referendum on the separation of Scotland from the UK. What happens if there's a resounding 'no' vote, then 10 years from now the SNP is in a position to call another? Does Westminster refuse to make the power available?

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

He will continue to ask until such time as he gets what he says is the right answer.

---------- Post added at 17:22 ---------- Previous post was at 17:20 ----------

Well said. :tu:

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Whatever way the scottish people vote i hope that whatever side loses will respect their choice and shut up about it. Personally if they vote to stay in the union the snp will have to give it a rest because constantly raising this issue will only damage scotland commercially. I think the big divide in scotland is those who have gone beyond the snp rhetoric and have researched enough to realise that voting to leave will not lead to the utopia the snp says they will enjoy and those who just follow the snp and what they say hook, line and sinker without actually doing the research on the issue. Also seems to me that some of the loudest voices for independence are the ones that have the option not to be adversely affected by it a certain mr connery comes to miind.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

We'll know by end of September 2014, come on Scotland do the right thing and err do one

http://m.guardian.co.uk/politics/scottish-independence

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

We're going nowhere, Pal. ;) support for Fat Aleck's little scheme is stuck around the 30% mark. Students at Glasgow held a mock referendum last month and produced a result broadly in line with the polls, which is a blow for the separatists because they expected support to be higher among the young. And on that point, support amongst 16 and 17 year olds, who are being given the vote precisely because the Nats believe the kidz will be well down wiv independence, yeah, well, wee Ned and wee Senga, as it happens, are also polling at around one third support for the proposition.

So there aren't going to be any border controls at Gretna on 15 September 2014.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Dam and here was me thinking of bidding on the contract to rebuild the Wall :LOL:

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Fat alecks convinced me, why should planks in westminster be making decisions on things Scots hold dear like welfare when there are planks a plenty in holyrood that can do it with just as much competence plus as if you didn't know Scotland sits on a sea of oil, it'll be like living in Saudi Arabia without the sunshine come independence.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

What, an absolute monarchy with a tenuous commitment to human rights? :p:

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

However, on the small matter of oil:

http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/at...1&d=1363893099

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

No more need for extraordinary rendition at least or headlines about imprisonment without trial. Who will you select as monarch, I'd go for either Shaun Connery or rab Nesbitt if I were a native.

---------- Post added at 19:13 ---------- Previous post was at 19:12 ----------

Ssssshhh we know that, don't want it getting out though, besides I do hope your not insinuating wee Alec's fibbing

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

I think he may be burnishing the truth a little.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

IMHO Scotland will not leave, its only pratts like Salmon that do

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

I'll go further and say he's a little fat liar, I seem to remember reading (might even have been,on here) that only once has oil revenue exceeded what Scotland gets under the Barnett formula and that without taking into account a lot of the gas fields would been in what would become English territorial waters.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

The Scots don't own the oil though IIRC, Westminster does? The fact it runs through Scotland is just a logistic matter. If the Scots did leg it I'm sure they'd request a 'handling fee' to process the oil. Which of course should not be too high otherwise Dave will just build a pipe around Scotland and get it direct.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

I am pretty sure they would get the Oil around there as it would be in what would become Scottish International Waters. I believe there might even be a UN regulation covering separating states that enforce that scenario. However I do wonder about this because some of it in technical in Shetland's territory and there was talk of them choosing home rule too.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

The oil belongs to the country whose territory is above it. Which in the case of North Sea oil, would be Scotland, for the most part. With an international maritime boundary drawn between Scotland and England, about 80% of the oil fields would be in Scottish territory.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Most people when asked about their opinion on the Yes No vote. The answer is definately NO. We are too wise to listen to the nonsense of Alex Salmon. We are BETTER TOGETHER and face problems as they come. To many lies from Mr Salmon. I am with you Chris. This referendom is going to cost a fortune with money that could be spent elsewhere.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Looks like Emperor Salmonds plans have run into another small problem.

As well as there being no guarantees that Scotland would automatically get into the EU (A plus point IMO but thats another story) there is now no guarantees that Scotland could get to keep the pound.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2...ency-ultimatum

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Yeah I've not understood why they think they can keep the pound. A country can use whatever currency they wish, as far as I know, but the pound would still need to be controlled by the Bank of England and the UK Government wouldn't it?

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

They always were a lot of amateurs pushing a hare-brained scheme, but now it's coming to the vote and they're under scrutiny, it's amusing how quickly it's all falling around their ears.

Funnier still are the cybernats, still furiously commenting all over the Scotsman website and anywhere else a critical report is found. Some of them have gone into outright denial. Apparently the recent student referendum vote in Glasgow, and last week's opinion survey at Napier in Edinburgh (support for the union at 65% and 70% respectively, which by massive coincidence are in the same ball park as every national opinion poll of the last decade) are all down to foreigners who won't be here to vote in the real thing next year. And the worse the news gets, the louder they insist that it'll all still come good in 2014.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

They still have time to arrange for round the clock screenings of Braveheart in the run up to it. :erm:

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

In the event of a no vote, do you think it needs to be overwhelming to avoid a referendum for a generation or will the SNP just start another one in 10 years time?

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

I think even they know this is a once-in-a-generation chance, especially with 16s and 17s getting to vote too.

All the indications are that it will be 'no' with between 60 and 70% of the vote, which is pretty overwhelming by any standard.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

A 5-10% majority no vote would probably give them enough wiggle room to demand another one in a few years but the way things are going the no vote will be a hell of a lot clearer than that.

Betting the countries future on oil revenues isn't a game I'm happy playing. Removing Trident would leave a huge black hole jobs wise and they seem hell bent on taking Scotland from one union with the rest of the UK and locking it into another one in the EU which baffles me.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

For me the point here is if it is a no vote as seems to be the case will the snp call a scottish election given their main agenda is independence or do people think they will cling to power hoping to turn opinion around. For me the only thing more damaging to scotlands future then independence would be constant unease about whether they will enter an endless round of referendums till the snp get what they want. How many no's make an absolute is what i guess i am wondering.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

They can't call a Scottish election no matter what happens. We have fixed term parliaments.

Also, it's not only a matter of how many people vote yes or no, the amount the opinion polls shift during the campaign will be relevant in the long term too.

They were insane to call a referendum with public support for separation so totally stuck at 30%, but the election results pretty much called the SNP's bluff. They got an outright majority at Holyrood under an electoral system that was supposed to prevent it and there was then nothing to stop them from legislating for a vote.

If a 2-year campaign fails to push support past the core vote, in 20 or 30 years time, if there is no evidence of general support for the idea of separation, it will be much harder for them to justify the cost and upheaval of another campaign aimed at convincing people that their settled view of Scotland's place in the UK is wrong.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Westminster governments have the power to call an election early isn't that something a scots government can do ?. Granted scottish politics is not something i am overly familiar with but the snp have always struck me as a bit loony fringe so expecting them to play by normal rules and common sense doesn't seem the likeliest outcome of all this.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Westminster governments no longer have that power. The House of Commons now has a fixed five-year term, excluding the possible consequences of a no confidence vote.

The Scottish Executive has never had the power to call an election early. The Parliament's term is fixed, just as your local councillor's term of office is fixed.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

So after initially claiming legal advice said Scotland would remain part of the EU, being made to look stupid when it was revealed there was no legal advice and being forced to seek expert opinion the SNP are now refusing to reveal what the experts think.

A cynic might suggest the experts don't agree with Emperor Salmond and his schemes.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotlan...itics-22550425

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

This referendum campaign has been great so far. For years we've had to put up with Salmond and his Cybernats touring the news studios and trolling the Scotsman and anywhere else they find a blog, making assertions about how wonderful it will be in Dalriada. Now they're having their proclamations challenged every day of the week and they don't like it up 'em.

All the SNP Yes Scotland seems to exist for is to moan about "scaremongering".

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Oh dear... :D

Salmond's always been better at the rhetoric than the delivery.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Yep. If I was Colin Weir I'd be asking for a refund.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

If I was Scottish I'd be asking for a new First Minister as well.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Oh, don't worry, Fat Alec's career prospects will take a steep nosedive after 2014. A lot of people will wonder what the SNP is supposed to be for, with the separatist question decisively settled.

The SNP has a majority now, because even though Scotland couldn't bring itself to vote Labour in 2011, no matter how desperate things get, it's not going to vote Tory. By 2016 the Labour brand will be sufficiently detoxified, Salmond will have been in office for 9 years and the SNP will be looking irrelevant.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

The SNP get voted in on issues other than Independence don't they? Otherwise this would be a closer referendum.

Alex Salmond must be up to something. I think they know this is a lost cause for now and are keeping their own brand away from being too closely associated with the campaign, instead using it to either help them in 2015, to get devo max, or to test the waters for a more concerted effort in a generations time.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Salmond is a gradualist. He has always hoped that the case for separation could be grown slowly, from the ground up, to the point where the case for a referendum was so compelling, one or more of the main parties at Holyrood would break ranks and support a referendum bill, or at least abstain. The last thing he wanted was an outright majority at Holyrood. It has left him with no reason not to hold a referendum right now. All he has been able to do is to take a wild shot at holding it when Scottish nationalist feeling is likely to be at its highest. The Commonwealth Games are in Glasgow next year and it is also the 700th anniversary of the Battle of Bannockburn, which to all intents and purposes is Scotland's Hastings (except Scotland won).

When you look at what the SNP is saying about how an independent Scotland will look, it is not actually that different to what "Devo Max" might look like, except with separate Scottish representation at various international bodies like the UN and EU. The strategy seems to be to try to win round the undecideds and some of the nos by convincing them they might as well agree to something that will hardly be different at all, except for the removal of "London" from the equation (which is as close as SNP ministers ever get to discussing their deep-seated hatred of the involvement of England in Scotland's affairs).

Of course, once Scotland became an independent country, any or all of the remaining ties to the Union could be ditched as a matter of party policy, without any further referendum.

Salmond's right-hand woman, Nicola Sturgeon, has been on the TV this week insisting, against the evidence of every single poll taken since the referendum was announced, and against the evidence of almost every poll ever conducted before that, that there is a "natural majority" in favour of separation. The SNP's line seems to be that we want independence, we just don't know it yet. Which is a bit odd, because we didn't want independence when all we had was the SNP telling us how great it would be, and now we have a well-organised campaign, for the first time ever, rebuffing SNP assertions about independence and challenging their ludicrous claims.

In the meantime, yes, the SNP gets elected as it is the only mainstream alternative to Labour in Holyrood. The Scottish electorate is every bit as sophisticated as that elsewhere in the UK and gives the SNP more votes for Holyrood than it does for Westminster. I haven't looked at the figures but I suspect the "natural" level of support for independence in Scotland lies with those who voted SNP in 2010 for Westminster, and will do so in 2015. That number is quite a lot lower than those who voted for the SNP for Holyrood in 2011.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Another SNP scheme backfires:

[img]Download Failed (1)[/img]

All the teens aged 14+ who were quizzed for this poll will be of voting age next September, thanks to Fat Alec's great wheeze about giving 16s and 17s the vote (because he thought they would all be so grateful they would do anything he told them).

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

you mean those ungrateful young wippersnappers had the audacity to think for themselves ,outrageous :D

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Looks like he will have to get Braveheart on repeat from now till polling day to get anywhere near a yes vote.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

I heard Salmond's getting so desperate now he's going to demand the English have a vote. :D

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

That might be because he knows the majority of English would support independence but of course we'll never be given a vote.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Another day, another kicking for SNP claims.

http://news.stv.tv/politics/229512-s...dent-scotland/

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

They really are getting desperate aren't they.

I've been having some fun lately arguing with the cybernats on the Herald website over the ridiculous stooshie they've been trying to whip up over last week's edition of Question Time. They actually seem to think that when the programme is recorded in Scotland, the only elected individuals on the panel should be elected to serve in Scotland, and if independence is likely to come up as a question, the panel should be constituted half and half unionists and separatists.

The Greens are particularly aggrieved because they have a Holyrood seat or two and Nigel Farage doesn't. The Lib Dems are also annoyed, because 'Gorgeous' George Galloway got the other seat on the panel and they didn't. Not that I've heard them moaning when they've been left out of a panel during a recording made in England, which does happen from time to time.

The SNP are whinging because that's all they can do, now each and every one of their arguments for separation has been debunked. Apparently they think that it would be good editorial policy for the BBC to stack a Question Time guest panel, for an edition to be broadcast to the entire UK, based on one political issue that will be decided within Scotland, rather than acknowledging the programme is made for a UK audience and has to have a panel that reflects the broader views of society as a whole.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Yes, the SNP tends to forget they are elected to represent the whole country, not just the SNP.

Embarrassing at times

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Blimey you lot (Scots not subscribers to the thread) still here, hoped you'd have gone by now, no offence :)

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Barring Mr Salmond suddenly finding a couple of million yes voters down the back of his sofa we aren't going anywhere.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

If you take a closer look, Scottish National Party is an anagram of "Oh nasty tartan politics" and Alex Salmond is an anagram of "all mad, no sex"

Unattributed...

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

If Salmond's Tartan Twits lose the vote the Scots may well have cause to blame them for stirring up a whole lot of anti-Scottish feeling amongst the English. I'm sure Salmond believes this cross border angst serves his purpose but it could backfire very badly.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

I'm not sure, so far the English have been led to believe there is a big demand for independence and that independence = hate England. Come the announcement of the results, a convincing defeat for the seps may well come as a welcome surprise down south.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

He should look for them in England, we'll give him what he makes out he wants.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Not sure why people would think that.

It's not as if we hear so much about BMP etc, and think everyone in England is racist

Or do we :D

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Well of course nobody can be sure of the long term effects at this stage which is why I used the phrase 'could backfire'. The point is that this debate is exposing a whole lot of argument much of which, from the SNP side, is designed to denigrate the English and the relationship with England in one way or another and stir up nationalist sentiment. As these arguments are more fully exposed people in England are not only going to be made far more aware of the how they are being represented but of the counter arguments which seek to show how well Scotland does out of the union - by definition at the expense of English taxpayers. These subjects are going to be exposed in more detail than ever before in the next couple of years and a great many more English folks might just resent this and form the impression that something must be done about things like the West Lothian question. I think there's could be a whole lot more resentment and nationalism south of the border for Holyrood to contend with if Salmond's Tartan Twits don't win.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Being an Englishman living in Scotland, with both Scottish and English family, I see things from a different angle than many. Also, running a B&B we get lots of English visitors here, and whenever the subject comes up, they all think Scotland is going its own way next year.

This really isn't surprising, because all they ever hear about the matter on their telly boxes is from Fat Aleck or Angus Robertson, who if possible is even more smug than his boss.

Oh, and it doesn't help that Scotland's sporting anthem is a folk song about the longing for independence, likening the Union to an English occupation that needs to be sent homeward to think again. After a "no" vote next year, that choice of song is going to look pretty incongruous. ;)

The balance of the panel on QT last week should have gone some way towards correcting that, seeing as it has presented the balance of views for and against separation broadly in line with the consistent evidence of the opinion polls. That will be why the SNP was so miffed by it.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

A funny take on things...

http://www.thespoof.com/news/magazin...h-independence

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Now Alex Salmond has threatened to use his McNavy to blockade the North Sea if he doesn't get EU membership on favourable terms for a separate Scotland.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukne...embership.html

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

If we get independence, we are shipping glasgow to the south. That will allow rangers (who were always quasi-english) and celtic (who are only going because they want to beat rangers) to play with english teams.

We haven't worked out the terms for the exchange, but we definitely don't want millwall, and I refuse to accept any team below the championship :)

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

:LOL:

Once again acting like a drunken bum spoiling for a fight when the barman decides it's time for him to go home to bed.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/local/2013/06/2.jpg

So now the EU, whose membership for an independent Scotland is very much up in the air, will provide billions of pounds to plug the budget black hole.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

In the current economic climate, I think there is more important things to be thinking about than separating. Plus, look at all we've been through together in history, lets just leave things the way they are. Some of us for whatever reason don't like each other, some of us do. But one thing I do believe is that we're all stronger together whether it be any of our home countries. Just my opinion.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Some good news for the Yes campaign.

Finally they have managed to get a poll to show something other than a crushing defeat for the separatists.

Obviously the question would have been very balanced and the people questioned weren't grabbed outside the SNP conference.

Meanwhile back in reality.

http://www.scotsman.com/news/politic...-yes-1-3073754

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

The most amusing thing about this is that all the cybernats have been queuing up to quote the Homebase Panelbase poll on any open comment thread anywhere on the entire Internet ever since it came out. Some of them actually believe that it shows a trend towards 'yes', which takes an impressive degree of mental discipline. Or maybe just an exceptional ability to stick your fingers in your ears and go "Laaaaah!".

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Loved the bit at the bottom of the SNP page on the poll.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

908 isn't a brilliant sample size. However, of somewhat greater concern are the other questions on the poll, which you could argue helped make the subjects more receptive to saying 'yes' to the main question.

Also, with anyone able to join Panelbase, I wonder how far in advance the SNP decided to make use of their services and how many SNP activists joined Panelbase before the poll was conducted. Even if Panelbase drew a random sample of its Scottish members, there is ample opportunity for the SNP to stack the sample in their favour.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

What I want to know is whether our Scottish Mods will still be able to exercise their powers south of the Border if Salmond's Tartan Twits get their way?... ;)

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Just another reason to vote for independence of they can't :D

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Five minutes before the SNP's separatist agenda is due to be published, the official website goes mammaries skywards:

http://www.scotreferendum.com/

If they can't even manage a website at a period of entirely predictable demand, how in the blue blazes are they to be trusted to run a country?

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

I only hope that, whatever the outcome, then that's it. assuming it's a No vote, we don't get to do this again, next year or in 5 years ad infinitum until Salmond gets what he wants. Is there any kind of framework there to stop that?

There's also the possibility of gaining power by stages, with unending concessions until Scotland ends up self governing anyway, is that a likely possibility?

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

http://news.sky.com/story/1173661/sc...ildcare-pledge

After watching this item, it has been said that any Scot no matter where they live - Except for the UK. Can vote for the referendum.

Why are the Scots in the England being excluded.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Seems to me some people have a personal agenda against Salmond. Im sure someone questioned Salmond's personal agenda against Westminster?

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

They were talking about citizenship Arthur, not who gets to vote in the referendum. The referendum is restricted to people who are on the electoral roll in Scotland.

---------- Post added at 11:43 ---------- Previous post was at 11:40 ----------

Considering Salmond is attempting to dismantle the nation state we were born into and have known all our lives, I think we're entitled to take it personally.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Sorry, but I think you take it too personally.

SNP are putting a question to the scottish folks. Today they released the document to hopefully answer most questions.

It will be then upto the the people registered to vote in Scotland to make the descion. Salmond/Nicola have said for a very long time that we can do things better ourselves. This has been the main base point of Salmond's argument for years.

Sorry, but I don't see whats changed on this??

Edit...after going back some pages on this thread after typing my post. Some people has some mis-guided views on what the SNP represent. The last 6 months before the vote in 2014 are the most important months, taking into account the white paper being released TODAY. I think you will find the voter % will change sharply.

If we talk about assests and finances - I will certainlly say, we have less than 10% of the UK population, we pay more that our 10% in tax pro-rata. We have more or less 90% (please google search it!) of oil reserves where the VAST majoirty does not come back to Scotland. Really, do you need me to do the maths???

No campagin/alistair darling...sorry but if you going to take jibes at big Eck...then I would seriously recommend that you do some homework on AD and find out of how much of a failed politican this guy really is.

I am still waiting on David Cameron's 670 page document of why we shoud stay. I assume we will get a 4 page double sided leaflet through the door with nice bright colours in due course.

Whilst I fully acknoeldge that running no government can be easy, the UK government has done nothing for over a decade to reduce the poverty gap within the UK, making families go to the brink of collapse.

Someone famous once said, decades ago, that the Scotland would never have its own Parliament!

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

My choice is currently NO and will not be changing. There is nothing Salmond can say to convince me otherwise. Its a bad idea and they haven't yet afaik got all the answers that everyone wants/needs.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Great points, you've got my vote, plus you didn't even include that every Scot will be six hundred pounds a year richer.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

'the UK government has done nothing for over a decade to reduce the poverty gap within the UK, making families go to the brink of collapse.'

I could not agree with this more. Whatever government is in power ALL MPs think only of them self.

Each day when l go through Hounslow, l see all the despartion of people looking for work, more and more of these community sectors opening up asking for donations of food to be given to those that are on extremely lowe wages and seeking help or the victims of the dreaded bedroom tax.

We have a Labour leader that is so limp that does not have the guts to take on Cameron and give him Hell like any other Labour leader, who looks after the working class.

And yet, we have a Prime Minister who WON'T give the voter the chance to vote on Euope, and yet spend billions of pounds of OUR money, on aid on other countries - some that don't need it. Whilst his own people beg, steal or borrow to survive.

We know why Cameron won't intefere with the Scottish people - he wont win. The Scots cannot stand the Tory party.

My wife is Scottish and is very proud of it.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

I am very proud to be Scottish. But I believe we all need to stick together as one UK. I don't like the Tory Party as they have more bad points than good. But it is not between Tory and SNP only. Labour voters will remember this too. We were in Bulgaria on holiday and they wanted to give us less money for our Scottish bank notes than the English ones. So cannot trust Salmon to keep the pound. A YES vote it too risky,

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/i...-2013112681467

:D

---------- Post added at 16:46 ---------- Previous post was at 16:44 ----------

Well said.

There are proud Scots of my acquaintance who will leave Scotland rather than live in the navel-gazing nirvana Fat Alec has planned.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Well Salmond seems to believe in the EU so presumably he'll keep asking until the electorate give the 'right' answer...

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Mariano Rajoy has just torpedoed Fat Aleck's assertion that Scotland could negotiate terms of accession to the EU, and then complete accession, in the 18 months between a 'yes' vote and separation day.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/...lex-salmond-eu

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Having read through the summary of the independence book released yesterday i think Salmond has made a few assumptions ,one being an automatic entry into the EU ,another being to use the pound and have the Bank of England as their lender of last resort for their banks

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Assertions is what he does, he's been doing it for years. The difference is, now there's actually a referendum happening, there is an organised opposition calling him out on them.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Well in the unlikely event I have just renewed my passport.;)

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

will they have customs checks on the border - stopping you bringing in a sly haggis or whatever?

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

An Independent Scotland where their currency is controlled by Frankfurt and Government decisions are made in Brussels. There's nothing independent about that.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Alex Salmond and Nicola Sturgeon something fishy going on here.


KEEP THE UNION

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Exactly. I'm baffled as to why Salmond is so desperate to get out of one union and jump straight into another.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

I've been wondering how long it would take for someone to realise that a request by Scotland to share the currency of RUK would almost certainly lead to a referendum being called in England, Wales and N Ireland ...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/poli...eferendum.html

---------- Post added at 10:28 ---------- Previous post was at 10:27 ----------

Four legs good, deux legs better. ;)

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Given all the promises and rhetoric he's issued over the years, Salmond is in between a rock and a hard place now. He can't back down or he'll be seen for what he is so he'll continue his policy of denial and carry on promising what he can't deliver knowing that the naïve will be taken in. I think Salmond is far more fixated on what he feels is his rightful place in history than he is the greater good of his people. If he were to win, he'd go to his grave believing he'd set Scotland free and blaming others for the chaos which ensued. If he loses I don't think he'll accept defeat because doing so will deny him any chance of ever being known as Alex the Great...

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

That's no guarantee that we'll issue you a visa :D

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.n...26099694_n.jpg

:D

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Thing is a white paper is supposed to have all the answers to help people make a decision.

It's not of much use if all it does is leave a load of open questions.

Salmond can't make promises on things when he doesn't have the say so. it beggars belief, and surely no one in their right mind would follow this guy off to his version of Oz.

Just on the Europe question alone. Does he really think he'll be allowed to join the EU as a separate nation and bring Sterling to the party? And that's If we let him have it?

just that question alone is a fundamental question for the Scottish economy that remains unanswered and will probably still be unanswered come polling day.

how can you vote yes, with that question unresolved?

And that's just one, the so called White Paper is littered with these assumptions.

I would hope the vast Majority of Scots believe that they have their own identity ( IMO they do more than the English ) and that they have enough self governing powers without risking the theirs and our future on this chancer.

I hope he is trounced on the day.

---------- Post added at 13:39 ---------- Previous post was at 13:38 ----------

Thing is a white paper is supposed to have all the answers to help people make a decision.

It's not of much use if all it does is leave a load of open questions.

Salmond can't make promises on things when he doesn't have the say so. it beggars belief, and surely no one in their right mind would follow this guy off to his version of Oz.

Just on the Europe question alone. Does he really think he'll be allowed to join the EU as a separate nation and bring Sterling to the party? And that's If we let him have it?

just that question alone is a fundamental question for the Scottish economy that remains unanswered and will probably still be unanswered come polling day.

how can you vote yes, with that question unresolved?

And that's just one, the so called White Paper is littered with these assumptions.

I would hope the vast Majority of Scots believe that they have their own identity ( IMO they do more than the English ) and that they have enough self governing powers without risking the theirs and our future on this chancer.

I hope he is trounced on the day.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Just read on FB from a Scottish soldier stationed abroad but is not allowed to vote. This is an disgrace.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

There was a soldier, A Scottish soldier who wandered far away
and gave his vote away...:(