Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

mini riot on my street last night :)

I rang police at 4am about alarm going off for 40 mins, squad car came but then was about to drive off saying they wouldnt do anything then a load of my neighbours came out and we argued with the police for about 10 minutes, then they backed down and the fire brigade broke in to shut it off.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

And it's all kicking off. Again :rolleyes:

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Bunch went right by my office, heading up to St Pauls.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

looks like its having some effect

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-11874406

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

he'll look a right idiot if he does

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

The Liberal Democrats are realising how they are about to lose one of their large constituencies. Not just students, who aren't all registered to vote, but the recently graduated as well.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

hows this work then i thought we had the same government
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-11878033

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

English money probably -we do love to subsidise the other uk Nations .

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

If you want to look at it that way, London subsidises the rest of England. ;)

For the purposes of budgetary control, the Welsh Assembly and the Scottish Executive are effectively just Government departments. They receive a grant just the same as Education or MoD does in London. The only difference is, these 'departments' are responsible for a range of services, not just one. So they have some freedom to decide how to divide up the money between the services they control.

Wales is not, however, getting more money in order to protect its students from fees. It is simply making university education a higher priority than something else. Once they spend the money on this, it won't be available for whatever else.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

that may be true but its also the place that gets most investment. so its a circle.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Kinda. To be more exact London and the South subsidise the rest of the UK, Scotland is the 3rd highest value per head region, ahead of all of England apart from the above, however it has higher public spending.

The most subsidised area is Wales, followed by the North East then the North West. The South East and London subsidise the most, the South West is the only other region, full stop, that pays its own bills.

http://www.statistics.gov.uk/pdfdir/gva1209.pdf
http://www.hm-treasury.gov.uk/d/pesa0809chapter9.xlshttp://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/20...n-page-13.html

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

None of which is remotely surprising in a country that has valued extreme centralization of both business and government over many years.

The trend has thankfully begun to be reversed in recent years (the decentralization of the BBC is a good example of it). Scotland suffers to an unreasonable degree because of this. It is, historically and even today in terms of much of its legal and administrative infrastructure, a distinct nation in its own right (much more so than Wales, which has never had any political identity in any meaningful, modern sense).

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Why can the Police in the UK not do this? They trashed a van a few days ago and seemingly got away with it, well apart from one poor soul who it seems posing in stolen riot gear has 'ruined his life' . . .

I do not live in London thankfully, but if i did and had to put up with these hooligans i would be all for it.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Oh really. So what are they cutting back on?:rolleyes: Along with Scotland they get more money per head of population than England and so can give out this and many other freebies.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

apparently

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Doesn't that mean that they are effectively taking money from Welsh Universities and giving it to English ones?:D

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

This has been going on for decades in Britain and many many other countries also, its totally unrealistic to expect each area of a nation to be as competitive and productive as its regional neighbours.
The idea is that we all pull together and money is spent in the areas of greatest need, thats what nations do.
I mean we are hardly going short in the south-east and London...as mentioned above if the Welsh Assembly choose to subsidize their higher education it means they'll have less to spend on other public services.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

If the level of extra need was genuine, then they wouldn't have these surpluses because they would be spending it on that extra need.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Here:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-11878033

"He" is Leighton Andrews, the Welsh Assembly's education minister. He is effectively telling the institutions themselves that they will have to spend less on teaching.

As regards who gets 'more' and who gets 'less' in the UK, why whinge about Wales and Scotland getting more than England when different regions within England get more or less than each other? Or do the differences in spending levels between, say, Birmingham and Newcastle not matter, because they're both in England?

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

But the English regions cannot give out freebies like this because apart from anything else, the amount of extra money is not as great as for Wales and Scotland.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

There are no freebies - what is spent in one place cannot then be spent somewhere else. And don't try to quietly ignore that there are variations in regional spending in England as well. ;)

What English regions lack is the ability to vary spending priorities from Westminster ... if you don't like that, why not campaign for regional devolution? Prezza actually tried to introduce it a few years ago, but the good people of the northeast voted against it.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Until recently, Wales and Scotland had so much extra money they could dish out things like free prescriptions without finding the money from other areas. Nowadays the extra money has already been allocated elsewhere and so they do have to find it from other places.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Oh please :rolleyes:

Do you honestly think the devolved sections of the UK get a huge extra wodge of cash basically stealing food from the mouths of poor, starving English folk?

They get broadly the same amount and considering other factors like it's greater geographical area it's not really a huge difference.

The free prescription thing is a fairly useful gimmick hat isn't actually that expensive to implement. The powers that be up here and in Wales decided that it would be better to do that and do without other things.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

well it looks like English students have support in europe.

Greek police clash with students at British embassy

http://uk.reuters.com/article/idUKTRE6B12WS20101202

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Scotland and Wales have their high population density areas(eg Edinburgh, Glasgow, Cardiff, Swansea etc), just as England as low population density areas. That does not justify £1,000 per person extra, regardless of whether they live in a large city or in a remote rural area. If there was truly an extra expense in providing the same level of services as in England, they wouldn't have the surpluses that they have. What have the Welsh and Scottish reduced spending on, in order to fund these supposedly cheap schemes?

If it was so cheap(per person) to have free prescriptions etc, then it would also have been cheap to implement in England by the last Labour government. It only seems cheap as a total amount because of the smaller populations of Scotland and Wales.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Nomad, the simple fact is, devolved government allows for different spending priorities. It's as simple as that.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

The question still remains, exactly which policy areas have they cut back on spending to fund these things, in comparison to before the devolved government?

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

It's a good question, and I'm sure if you looked hard enough you could find the figures - the budget document will be on www.scotland.gov.uk somewhere.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Once again the students are revolting... :erm:

Things are getting a bit tasty down parliament way. Looks like some of the protestors have been studying the work of the 'wombles' judging by the shields / signs and improvised armour.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

lol Derek.

I can understand protesting, but when you start lobbing fences, bricks and god knows what else, it's just gone to far.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

some pics - warning its the daily mail

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...arliament.html

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Video - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-11566509#video

Oh this is lovely, a guy on there saying the NUS don't represent him, he's protesting against all public cuts, no mention at all of student fees.

Bandwagon anyone?

EDIT: Nothing lends gravity to your point quite like screaming and cheering for the BBC cameras and wishing hello to mum. Seriously half of them are probably just there because it's 'cool' and the current bandwagon, another quarter are there to protest austerity measures, some more are there because it's a protest and they are full time protesters, oh with the odd person who is actually concerned about the impact of fee cap increases.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

The man from del monte he says YES to raise the cap on tuition fees to £9,000 per year from September 2012

Yes. 323
No. 302
Maj. 21

And before any says i am not taking this seriously why should i when there are idiots fighting with the police, throwing fireworks and injury police officers . If the students want to be taken seriously they should stop fighting and smashing up public property like a bunch of football hooligans, Role in the tear gas i say, Meet force with force

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Could have at least got their facts straight with that one.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Class statement from a protester:

'Most of the students here are not on courses that will give them a good income.'

Good to know the courses are so valuable.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

After watching this terrible aggro in London, l simply cannot see how the students are blaming the police for over zealous behaviour in tackling these damn students.

They are protesting against an increase in fee's which is understandable, But the students are complaining about the tough tactics of the police, so is it the police who have started fires in the Square, was the police who are throwing bollards, fencing being moved above the students, to use as weapons and who are throwing paintballs, it is certainly not the police.

There are students using scarfs to hide there faces, not to be seen, this country prides itself on free speech, BUT this is NOT the way to do, l hope that any students that get arrested, get the punishment they thoroughly deserve.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Ok both votes have gone through, Now let the police clear the hooligans, Sorry students off the streets. To quote 10cc load up load up with rubber bullets :)

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

I must admit, I did shake my head at all the idiots laughing and jeering at the cameras.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

they don't need to worry then as they wont have to pay it back!!!:D

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

For once we agree.A good post Arthur.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Indeed ,that makes 2 ,i would rep him if he had it turned on ,but since he hasn't :clap::clap:

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

So the hooligans are in the treasury building now. Any sympathy i had for them as gone west.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

i fear this may turn into camerons/cleggs "pit strike" ,it is going to drag on and on and end up getting realy nasty .Unless the true protesters can manage to seperate themselves from the idiots thay will get no-where and lose any public sympathy they may have had

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

3 :shocked:

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

is some CF history in the making ?:D

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Shocking

I mean this, The police should meet force with force. Why should the police have to stand there and take this

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Yep just read that on sky news ,what point are they trying to make in defacing the churchill statue? :mad:

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Protesters are trying to force their way into the treasury.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Looks like the hooligans are in. Bet you they set it on fire.

***Edit***

Nope the police stopped them.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

which i was there to support them

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

So i take it you support the holigans who are using violence and attacks on public property and police.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

where is the water cannons or hose pipes.
cold water on a night like this will sort them out
https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2010/12/82.jpg

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

care to elaborate why you support the students ,that is serious question, as not many people in this or the other student thread have spoken up for the students.For the record i disagree with the protests ,and i disagreed with cleggs policy of scrapping the fees eventually

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Now that would get my support

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

I agree, I would not mind helping the Police out.

Bloody students :td:

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

There is no way i am calling them students. Hooligans and thugs fits the bill far better.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Well I would have said *******s really... ;)

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Car attacked in London containing Prince Charles and Camilla.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Breaking news

The hooligans have reportedly attacked Prince Charles in his car.

Shops on oxford street and one other site. Links to follow.

http://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/new...tacked_by_mob/

http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2010/12/09...s-and-camilla/

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

lol, they are lucky they didn't get fired at!!!

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Indeed

---------- Post added at 19:59 ---------- Previous post was at 19:57 ----------

It would have made some peoples day :LOL:

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

It seems like the students are starting to act out the lyrics for THE SMITHS - PANIC:erm:

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

The Sex Pistols - Anarchy in the UK

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Except they're singing:

Hang the LibDems, Hang the LibDems, Hang the LibDems
Hang the LibDems, Hang the LibDems, Hang the LibDems
Hang the LibDems, Hang the LibDems, Hang the LibDems
Hang the LibDems
Hang the LibDems
Hang the LibDems
(Repeat to fade) :erm:

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Looks like Sky news are focussing all the attention on Charlie and her now.

I expect there will be criticisms of them going out while London's in the middle of a mini riot.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

I would not mind betting that Charles would have had no qualms in telling them where to go.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Indeed why should people have to change there routine because of a bunch of hooligan students.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Can I point out that most of the rioters will probably be "professional" rentamob protestors, such as SWP, anarchists, and such like....

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

And can i point out that the students could point them out to the police but don't seem to be doing that. The protest organisers would have had a good idea that this was going to happen because of past experience.

If the real protesters wanted to ensure the hooligan students were dealt with then they should have made it known to the police who the troublemakers were

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Agreed.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

and the remainder will just be students having a peaceful protest -not hooligans and *******s- just people .

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

That might be but you have to admit there seems to be a LOT of hooligans and *******s. why have the real students not identified the idiots and kept away from them ?

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

The thing is that on the BBC news I seem to be watching two different events.One is the pushing and shoving,throwing of missiles and attempts to enter buildings and roads that the police are defending.

Then there is the nice cosy interviews with what appear to be rather earnest and slightly naive young people whom are neither throwing missiles or attacking the police..they don't even have placards and aren't even shouting slogans.

So which is the reality?

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

both i would imagine ,as has been said there will some genuine,peacefull protesters and there will be some rent a mob louts

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

i doubt the police are in listening mode [too busy] - a few strategically placed pockets of rent a mob are probably responsible for the violence and i don't think there have been many arrests .

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

I have looked at itv, sky and the bbc and they are all showing hooligans smashing windows, attacking police, trying to enter buildings, The student leaders should have known that there would be hooligans at this event, all they had to do was remember what happened just the other day. Yes there are real law abiding students at this event but there does seem to be a large amount of hooligan students as well !!!!!!

I have just been looking at the photo of a student swinging from a flag at the cenotaph as well. I honestly feel that there is a very large group of hooligans and *******s intent on starting as much trouble as they can.

---------- Post added at 21:52 ---------- Previous post was at 21:46 ----------

The next bunch of hooligans the police are going to have to deal with on our streets will be the union renta mobs

mark my words.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

I have been watching this on each channel, and to be honest how the police did not retaliate, beggars belief from me, they were totally professional against a bunch of thugs who don't deserve to go to any college, apart from Feltham remand centre.

As l have said early in this thread, we pride ourself on free speech, but this was beyond me, if l was a parent of any student today, l would throw them into to Thames and let them freeze there todger off, it was dispicable behaviour, l felt sorry for the police dogs, that would have had to bite them, dogs need excecise to bring down criminals, the students weren't criminals - they were packs of animals who need caging.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

what will they be protesting/rioting about ?

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

The genuine students are playing a clever game. They know they need exposure for the cause and violence will disorder wll gauantee that. They know the only reason they've had unlimited coverage today on all channels was because it was going to kick off. And then they give an interview now and again with some mild platitudes criticising the destruction.

It certainly isn't in their interest to dicourage the rent-a-mob.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

You missed a word or two out, Arthur.....

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

looking at the footage the 'wombles' were involved. Professional rioters and I reckon we will see a resurgence of their tactics in the coming months.

Fun and games ahead... :erm:

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Im sure they can voice their opinions in a different way instead of resorting to violence!

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Some mouthpiece on BBC News right now.

It's all the fault of the Police seemingly, if they hadn't reacted when being pelted with bottles and fireworks the disorder wouldn't have happened.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

i blame lying politicians for this mess .

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

What ever the union anti Government louts want them to. This type of trouble will play right into there hands. Punky saw it for what it was and i and everyone else will see it over the coming months from other groups with a vendetta against the Government and anyone they dont like in particular.

---------- Post added at 07:54 ---------- Previous post was at 07:48 ----------

I blame the hooligan students for this mess, I did not see a single member of the Government involved in any of that trouble last night. I did not see them attacking people, smashing up buildings and trying to rob shops, unless you saw differently ?

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

i don't think this would have happened if politicians hadn't signed pledges about fees and then done the exact opposite -so in my opinion it was the politicians who started this mess .

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

We have people rioting and causing mayhem and destruction in our capital city, no other country would accept this happening especially after the previous demonstrations turned ugly.

It is quite right that the Police used their horse against the the rioters but more should be done to control the crowds.

As we do not have our own we should borrow water cannon from other countries and arm the Police with baton rounds to control the crowds, if I remember correctly we had water cannon in Northern Ireland.

I am not a royalist either but no other country would allow rioters to get near their royal party as armed men would prevent this happening, any terrorist seeing that will now be thinking that an attack on a royal could easily happen.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Don't excuse the rioting idiots.

I hope they are weeded out and prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

A degree and criminal record don't sit well together on a CV.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

Regardless of what you think of the protests, the fact that the royal couple were caught up in it suggests a massive breakdown of communications. It's not so much a matter of allowing rioters to get near the royal party, but rather allowing the heir to the throne to get near a rioting mob. I suspect that those in charge of security of the royal couple will receive a right rollocking, and rightly so.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

+1

I was going to post saying they should have used a water cannon, it would have put the fires, flares and firecrackers out.

And made them bloody cold.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

don't tare all students with the same brush ,most of them went to chant and hold placards not riot.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

I saw that, and got so annoyed - she berated the newsreaders for focussing on the violence and damage caused, then steadfastly avoided answering any questions they asked, and just parroted pre-prepared points.....

She's got a future as a politician.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

He didn't. He referred to 'rioting idiots', not people chanting and holding placards.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

This was not just a few rent a mob idiots, There was a sizable amount of students getting involved as well and i did not see them being forced in to doing it.

Like it or not there was a riot last night that did NOT just involve a small bunch of idiots but involved a sizable amount of students as well. Now you might have a pair of rose tinted glasses on but i don't and i know what i saw on the news last night and cannot ignore what was shown on ALL the major news channels last night. If you want to say that it was a SMALL amount of idiots i would love to see what you call Large

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

She was probably the same person on the BBC morning news earlier on BBC1 who was more upset that the Police used horses than about the rioters who were causing the issues.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

The 10 o'clock news did make depressing viewing last night. I couldn't help wondering why there was nothing that could be done about the animals that were smashing up the Treasury. And as for the attack on Charles and Camilla ... I am quite certain that had that happened in the USA, the protesters would have been staring down the wrong end of a dozen SIGs, and damned lucky not to be filled full of holes.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

I was surprised no one pulled out some MP5's to be honest and the glass did not look to be very bullet proof considering whose car it was.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

regarding the attack on Charles and Camilla.
i know the hooligans were totally out of line
but i am a bit concerned that anybody got that close to the car
what if had not been paint and students
what if had been something and someone more deadly.

Re: Students Rioting in London.
 

So according to the student hooligan leaders on the news at this moment they SUPPORT the violence last night and are stating that there was NO violence last night and are threatening MORE including using union rent a mobs.