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-   -   Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge (https://www.cableforum.uk/board/showthread.php?t=33662671)

weenie 23-01-2014 09:47

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Could not agree more with the hassle bit
Could not agree more it has been a load of hassle for us but personally it is looking extremely good for us now as the Lawyer has found out stuff I would never have known about as I would not have known where to look in the title deeds. We can take the neighbour to a small claims court now still don't know if we will do that as we just want the cable removed...and do we really want the hassle of a small claims court...I know many people would have put a spade through it as this is the view from many of our friends but my eldest son is at uni studying social science and criminal justice as he wants to be a police man and I do not to jeopardize his chosen career... by getting a conviction... not that I would risk one anyway I am quite happy to have lived 44 years without one, the only one time I had reason dealing with the police and that was for one speeding ticket 23 years ago ...

deadite66 23-01-2014 15:55

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Charge VM rent.

weenie 23-01-2014 17:09

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by deadite66 (Post 35665400)
Charge VM rent.

I know I could if they leave it longer than my Lawyer has gave them to remove it, but have to give them the chance to resolve the matter "RECTIFY THE PROBLEM" fingers crossed it won't be long ...

Pauls9 24-01-2014 09:15

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by jb66 (Post 35665015)
If techs use a shovel to dig a line in the grass, how exactly are they supposed to get it deeper than a shovels depth? Ive never burried a cable but I have pulled them up to gel pack a split then reburried it in the same trench.

If cables are supposed to be buried more than a spade depth, installers should be provided with an appropriate machine to do the job.

tizmeinnit 24-01-2014 09:43

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
funny I have dug holes with spades much deeper than a spades depth. If engineers can not suss out how to dig trench then we are in trouble in this country

Simple guideline as to how to do it. Bring a small tarp about 2m square will do( dependant on distance) and lay it next to where you are going to dig. Cut a line few inches into the ground the length of where there cable will lie. Cut another line 4 to 6 inches parallel to the first line. Carefully remove the turf you should be able to do this in just a few pieces so it looks better when replaced. Lay carefully on the tarp. Then you dig your trench in the soil as deep as you want and lay a mound on the tarp. Lay your cable. Replace the soil disposing of a little so the turf when you lay it is flat and even relay the turf. Simple neat tidy and deep enough and its not rocket science. Instead of this we get idiots dig and turn the turf so its a mess and the end result is also a mess.

jb66 your post I hope was ironic

jb66 24-01-2014 10:43

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pauls9 (Post 35665532)
If cables are supposed to be buried more than a spade depth, installers should be provided with an appropriate machine to do the job.

I don't think they are supposed to be more than a spades depth, I'm yet to see one

tizmeinnit 24-01-2014 11:06

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by heero_yuy (Post 35665561)
You want to try that round here: After the first stony 6" you're into a matrix of interlocking flints and chalky clay. Spades just bounce off and forks shed tines like they're going out of fashion.

Gas people took 4 hours with kango hammers and picks to get down to their mole outside my front door when they were replacing the pipes.

pick axe and sweat then still can and should be done to guidelines :)

tizmeinnit 24-01-2014 11:18

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by heero_yuy (Post 35665577)
Agreed, but can you see a VM installer breaking sweat? :D

no lol I did actually shove my spade accidentally through my cable after they buried it 3 inches luckily it only broke the outer shell and not the cable itself

jb66 24-01-2014 12:18

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
I've never seen the deeper than a spades depth guidelines?

---------- Post added at 13:18 ---------- Previous post was at 13:18 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by heero_yuy (Post 35665577)
Agreed, but can you see a VM installer breaking sweat? :D

They are paid by the job, no chance

weenie 24-01-2014 13:42

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
I think they VM broke into a sweat when they received my Lawyers letter,Title deeds and boundary survey :LOL: as like I have said they seem really confused by the deeds and the conditions that has been applied to the property and land as it is under Scotland Land Register therefore under Scottish Law but like I say not my problem I never broke them ... :) Waiting game for me now ... it is now totally in the hands of the legal team my Lawyer and theirs ....

weenie 24-01-2014 21:42

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by heero_yuy (Post 35665752)
Cold sweat with any luck.:)

Following this thread with interest.

Thank you, I'm waiting with interest not nice being in this predicament but thanks with the support of the cable forum members it has helped me a lot so A BIG THANKS TO ALL YOU GUYS :D

weenie 25-01-2014 00:33

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Meant to add Hugh and Rob to my Thank You, as well as the cable forum team for their advice so thanks you guys ... ;) very much appreciated ... Hopefully soon I will be thanking my Lawyer ...

weenie 30-01-2014 10:50

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Thought I would have heard something by now. I hate this waiting game VM is doing to me, makes me feel like I'm mouse and they are the cat :( my health is suffering now through the whole experience Doctor said I am stressing out need to try and keep calm but it is so hard as it is constantly on my mind never mind waiting for a phone call/letter just to let me know what is happening surely that would be the nice thing to do. When I worked for customer service "not with VM" I would have been instructed to keep the customer or the person making the complaint/enquiry up to date with weekly updates ... Is this too hard for them to do :shrug: It seems they have no empathy ...

Chris 30-01-2014 10:57

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
The law moves slowly. You're not dealing with VM CS now, you're dealing with their legal department. Have patience, it will all work out, but you have to be prepared to give it a few weeks.

weenie 30-01-2014 11:05

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
It is so hard this waiting I feel it has gone on for ever, but you are quite right it has only just got to the legal team. Wish it was all over that's all :)

weenie 03-02-2014 12:01

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
:cleader: CABLE GETTING REMOVED THIS WEEK BY FRIDAY :cleader:

Chris 03-02-2014 12:02

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Yessssss!

Any further details to encourage future readers of this thread? Who have you heard from?

weenie 03-02-2014 12:06

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Legal team ... CEO ... do not know if I am allowed to say names but VM have been told they must remove them and if neighbour say's anything they have been informed to say they need to legally...as it is in my land...

Chris 03-02-2014 12:07

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Another victory for the little people. :D

weenie 03-02-2014 12:16

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Yes, I am so so happy and very pleased ... :D Once again thanks to all and all your support ...

Chris 03-02-2014 12:17

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Just make sure you recover all your reasonable costs. You should not be out of pocket over this.

SnoopZ 03-02-2014 12:32

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Would love to be there when this happens and see the neighbour's face!

tdadyslexia 03-02-2014 12:33

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris (Post 35668677)
Just make sure you recover all your reasonable costs. You should not be out of pocket over this.

I agree with you 100%

weenie 03-02-2014 13:34

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
TBH just glad it is all over and I personally could not go through the stress of claiming back a couple of hundred, I know it is a lot of money but I need to consider my health here as this has been really hard on me example crying all the time and generally feeling really low and stressed out and at the end of the day although I agree with I should not be out of pocket I got the result I wanted so money well spent in my book.
Neighbour is saying to VM she does not want the cable in their land and VM has told them it is getting removed on Friday the reason I have date now is because my Lawyer is just off the phone to me after he phoned their legal department and demanded a date to be given as the cable in my garden is between me and VM, service for neighbour is between neighbour and VM so in other words just give a date time to my client as to when the cable is getting removed.
weenie is so happy :D

Chris 03-02-2014 13:43

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
I appreciate you're relieved and just want it all to be over now, but just think, you want to block-pave your driveway and the money will come in useful. At least ask your solicitor what is involved. He will be more than happy to pursue them for your costs, because in the act of pursuing them he will run up more costs which VM will have to pay.

I wish we had a photo of your neighbour's face when she was told the cable was being moved though. She sounds like a right piece of work.

weenie 03-02-2014 14:00

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Believe me she is. No one in the estate speaks to her as she has fell out with everyone not kidding, even all her family members have disowned her, my eldest son studied sociology and thinks she has antisocial personality disorder as all the stuff he has read about she seems to do. Hubby is taking the day off work on Friday as I do not to be here when it all kicks off and believe me they will make a scene, whereas I would get upset my husband will just sit back quietly and watch the fireworks from afar...as my neighbour has truly had the wind taken from her sails as they knew nothing about us getting a lawyer & boundary survey so this would have come as a shock to them much the same as the one I had when I found VM cable in my property...

judgey 03-02-2014 16:40

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
can i just ask can your neighbour get VM through her garden? or was it that she can but did not want the cable buried in her garden ?

thanks

weenie 03-02-2014 16:50

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Yes she can and she did not want the cable installed in her garden which in my opinion suited VM as going via my garden was the easy option as my front garden is open plan and loose soil, bare in mind she told VM my garden was her land. Neighbours words to VM field manager was that she still wanted the service but the cable to remain in my property...that is what he said to me and my husband...This was a situation we were forced into and we could sit back and let someone make claim on our land ... :nono:

Mick Fisher 03-02-2014 16:57

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by weenie (Post 35668665)
:cleader: CABLE GETTING REMOVED THIS WEEK BY FRIDAY :cleader:

Good to hear at long last :)

insulatorpotty 03-02-2014 17:16

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
well done, as has been said, i would love to see the look on your neighbours face on friday. bet she has a change of heart about having the cable on her land when the pennt finally drops!!

judgey 03-02-2014 17:19

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
its either have the cable on her land or dont have Virgin :)

thanks for the reply

weenie 03-02-2014 17:39

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by judgey (Post 35668772)
its either have the cable on her land or dont have Virgin :)

thanks for the reply

NB and at the end of the day it is not my decision if they do not have VM, I am not the one stopping the supply to them if they decide they no longer want the service because the cable needs to go through their property...quite funny when you think about it....At the end of day I will be to blame for wanting the cable removed from my property two words to my neighbour cable trespass although I could think of another two for them :LOL:
:waving: bye cable...

joglynne 03-02-2014 18:31

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/local/2016/10/1.gif Just a thought but if she has only recently taken out her VM contract and tries to cancel because she does not want the cable to sully her garden I do hope VM press her to pay through the nose to cancel her services.

tizmeinnit 03-02-2014 18:33

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
excellent news. Make sure you recover your legal costs non of this is your fault and you should not have to pay

weenie 03-02-2014 18:49

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by tizmeinnit (Post 35668813)
excellent news. Make sure you recover your legal costs non of this is your fault and you should not have to pay

To be honest I am just glad it is all over, but I might send Tom Mockridge Chief Executive a email asking why this happened in the first place but do not really know if I want more stress as this really did send me with a mixture of emotions from really annoyed to really sad and down I mean really low, I do not think it helped with being the Christmas period :)
but once again a big thank you for all your advice some of your comments made me laugh when I needed a wee lift so thanks :)

tizmeinnit 03-02-2014 18:55

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
I would see the fact they are removing it as admission of fault a small claims court would easy give it you and chances are VM would settle before it even went to court otherwise it will cost them more but its your choice :)

1andrew1 03-02-2014 18:56

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by weenie (Post 35668822)
To be honest I am just glad it is all over, but I might send Tom Mockridge Chief Executive a email asking why this happened in the first place but do not really know if I want more stress as this really did send me with a mixture of emotions from really annoyed to really sad and down I mean really low, I do not think it helped with being the Christmas period :)
but once again a big thank you for all your advice some of your comments made me laugh when I needed a wee lift so thanks :)

Well done!

(If you contact Virgin I don't think they can say much more than that they were misinformed by your neighbour.)

weenie 03-02-2014 18:57

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by joglynne (Post 35668812)
https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/local/2016/10/1.gif Just a thought but if she has only recently taken out her VM contract and tries to cancel because she does not want the cable to sully her garden I do hope VM press her to pay through the nose to cancel her services.

I hope so too and if not charge them with having to move the cable

Mr.Lemming 03-02-2014 19:04

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Without having to read every single page of this thread… Who's cable was it.. its gone from Virgin to BT's and back to Virgin again from what I can see..

weenie 03-02-2014 19:12

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by tizmeinnit (Post 35668827)
I would see the fact they are removing it as admission of fault a small claims court would easy give it you and chances are VM would settle before it even went to court otherwise it will cost them more but its your choice :)

TBH I could not deal with the stress, I barely coped with this ... just glad it is over :) I need closure on this ... roll on Friday cannot wait :D

---------- Post added at 20:12 ---------- Previous post was at 20:04 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr.Lemming (Post 35668833)
Without having to read every single page of this thread… Who's cable was it.. its gone from Virgin to BT's and back to Virgin again from what I can see..

Not with me it has always been VM. My first post is on page 10 and the date was 23/12/13... ;)

Mr.Lemming 03-02-2014 19:13

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by weenie (Post 35668834)
TBH I could not deal with the stress, I barely coped with this ... just glad it is over :) I need closure on this ... roll on Friday cannot wait :D

---------- Post added at 20:12 ---------- Previous post was at 20:04 ----------



Not with me it has always been VM. My first post is on page 10 and the date was 23/12/13... ;)

Just gone through it all, thanks though :)

joglynne 03-02-2014 19:17

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr.Lemming (Post 35668833)
Without having to read every single page of this thread… Who's cable was it.. its gone from Virgin to BT's and back to Virgin again from what I can see..

Weenie's problem has always been with VM. She entered this thread at this point :- http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/35657107-post137.html

If you want to find out what a rotten time she has had getting VM to move her neighbours cable away from her property start reading from that post onwards.

weenie 05-02-2014 13:38

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
:LOL: Well this is a first Virgin Media turning up two days early to do a job, cable removed job done :cleader::cleader::cleader: Garden is mine again :D :clap:

Chris 05-02-2014 13:43

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Oh please tell me you have a picture of your neighbour's face. :D

Or at the very least, you must describe the scene. :Yes:

SnoopZ 05-02-2014 14:54

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by weenie (Post 35669348)
:LOL: Well this is a first Virgin Media turning up two days early to do a job, cable removed job done :cleader::cleader::cleader: Garden is mine again :D :clap:

Yes! And we need details damit! Lol

weenie 05-02-2014 15:12

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Very straight forward boy came with pair of pliers snipped cable at wall, pulled the cable from garden, raked garden never saw them again on my property :D more on subject to in way of compensation just waiting for it in writing :) all is good at the moment oh sorry worded it wrong according to VM it is called goodwill gesture ... happy with offer ... but will not believe it till I have it in writing as I have no faith in them at all ... for reasons obvious .... ;)
Neighbour did not show face and has been very quiet :tiptoe:

Chris 05-02-2014 15:14

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
So they haven't re-installed a cable in the neighbour's garden?

weenie 05-02-2014 15:21

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris (Post 35669373)
So they haven't re-installed a cable in the neighbour's garden?

As far as I am aware they rerouted through her property the way it should have been done at the start. :D cable is not anywhere near my garden job done :clap:

Pauls9 05-02-2014 15:24

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Congratulations :cleader:

weenie 05-02-2014 15:28

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pauls9 (Post 35669378)
Congratulations :cleader:

Thanks :D

joglynne 05-02-2014 15:36

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
So glad this is all sorted at long last weenie. I think a small celebratory drink is in order.

Just noticed you only joined us in December, your exploits have been so interesting it feels as though you have been with us much, much longer. I do so hope you intend to stick around. :D

weenie 05-02-2014 16:02

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by joglynne (Post 35669382)
So glad this is all sorted at long last weenie. I think a small celebratory drink is in order.

Just noticed you only joined us in December, your exploits have been so interesting it feels as though you have been with us much, much longer. I do so hope you intend to stick around. :D

Thank you so much for your kind comment, and yes I will be sticking around, I joined in December because I wanted some feedback on the situation with the cable in my garden and with all your support you really helped me :) and hope I can be of help of people in need of advice as I have found out by being in this brilliant forum this is the place to be for some great and much appreciated advice so thanks to all :nworthy:

tizmeinnit 05-02-2014 19:05

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
I see from the happy thought thread it got re routed through their garden then?

weenie 05-02-2014 20:26

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by tizmeinnit (Post 35669474)
I see from the happy thought thread it got re routed through their garden then?

Yes and could not be happier ... even got a goodwill payment so all is good ... :D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D Big smiles all round in my house anyway ;) cannot speak for my arrogant and stupid neighbour but I can say they were not to pleased...

SnoopZ 05-02-2014 21:43

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by weenie (Post 35669506)
Yes and could not be happier ... even got a goodwill payment so all is good ... :D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D Big smiles all round in my house anyway ;) cannot speak for my arrogant and stupid neighbour but I can say they were not to pleased...

I hope the payment covers your legal costs and you're not out of pocket? :)

Chris 05-02-2014 22:16

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by weenie (Post 35669506)
cannot speak for my arrogant and stupid neighbour but I can say they were not to pleased...

You can't keep us in suspense like this. We need a florid description of the look on her face. Has she been round yet?

weenie 05-02-2014 22:34

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by SnoopZ (Post 35669551)
I hope the payment covers your legal costs and you're not out of pocket? :)

Covers all expenses not a penny more and not a penny less, I know some people will think I'm mad at not putting in a claim but they offered a goodwill gesture and I accepted it, I never had any intention of putting in a claim as I was just glad the whole experience was all over, but then came a phone call from VM asking if I was pleased with the work carried out I simply replied I did not think it fair that I was out of pocket so was offered a good will gesture. Do not get me wrong hubby was shaking his head but said it was up to me... :) I just wanted closure with the whole horrid experience

---------- Post added at 23:34 ---------- Previous post was at 23:27 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris (Post 35669560)
You can't keep us in suspense like this. We need a florid description of the look on her face. Has she been round yet?

no think they have the message to stay away and if they come near me I will do what another neighbour has done to her and phoning the police as she scares me TBH very hostile and extremely verbal ... I do not like confrontation at all ...

Chris 05-02-2014 22:36

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Can't blame you for that ... Still, at the moment it's Weenie 1, Horrid Neighbour 0. Result!

tizmeinnit 05-02-2014 22:37

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by weenie (Post 35669564)
Covers all expenses not a penny more and not a penny less, I know some people will think I'm mad at not putting in a claim but they offered a goodwill gesture and I accepted it, I never had any intention of putting in a claim as I was just glad the whole experience was all over, but then came a phone call from VM asking if I was pleased with the work carried out I simply replied I did not think it fair that I was out of pocket so was offered a good will gesture. Do not get me wrong hubby was shaking his head but said it was up to me... :) I just wanted closure with the whole horrid experience

---------- Post added at 23:34 ---------- Previous post was at 23:27 ----------



no think they have the message to stay away and if they come near me I will do what another neighbour has done to her and phoning the police as she scares me TBH very hostile and extremely verbal ... I do not like confrontation at all ...

if you feel legitimately that you are under threat when she has a go that is assault

SnoopZ 05-02-2014 22:56

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by weenie (Post 35669564)
Covers all expenses not a penny more and not a penny less, I know some people will think I'm mad at not putting in a claim but they offered a goodwill gesture and I accepted it, I never had any intention of putting in a claim as I was just glad the whole experience was all over, but then came a phone call from VM asking if I was pleased with the work carried out I simply replied I did not think it fair that I was out of pocket so was offered a good will gesture. Do not get me wrong hubby was shaking his head but said it was up to me... :) I just wanted closure with the whole horrid experience

---------- Post added at 23:34 ---------- Previous post was at 23:27 ----------



no think they have the message to stay away and if they come near me I will do what another neighbour has done to her and phoning the police as she scares me TBH very hostile and extremely verbal ... I do not like confrontation at all ...

Just wondering what sort of age this woman is?

weenie 05-02-2014 23:10

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by tizmeinnit (Post 35669568)
if you feel legitimately that you are under threat when she has a go that is assault

I think she know's that I would get a restraining order, and anyway I do not think she would assault me, well hope not. I know she had the police to her after she assaulted a girl by pushing her off her bike "apparently" and the mother got the police to her. This happened before I bought my house and truthfully I do not think I would have bought the house if I had known what she was like and what I was moving beside. Anyway she knows that my husband comes from a family of police officers so I think I'm safe ... :erm: My son thinks she suffers from Antisocial personality disorder as he studied this behaviour in social sciences and she seems to tick all the boxes :shocked:

tizmeinnit 05-02-2014 23:14

Re: Garden Dug Up and Cable installed on my property without knowledge
 
you do not have to be hit to be assaulted you just have to believe you are in danger of being hit


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