Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

QUOTE=ahardie;34991415]The ruling has been made public. Looks like Sky will appeal so this could run on for years and with a new government likely that will be much more sympathetic to Sky's interests.

Just been a piece about this on BBC breakfast news it will apparently be appealed and will be heard by,the competition commissions appeals tribunal and could go on for years according to the expert on the programme.

On the other hand the competition commission has a reputation for being a lot tougher then ofcom but obviously there will be an election before that, though weather any politician would interfere with an ongoing competition commisssion appeal remains to be seen.

Although ultimately way down the line it could end up being taken to europe now they do not hold any candle for sky.

And of course sky would get a payback as picnic has been given the ok would have thought perhaps like ofcom, access by sky to millions of freeview customers wanting premium sports would have more then made up for a reduction in price,not to mention the extra price sky would be able to charge for ads with all those extra viewers. But sky are litigeous so and so's.

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

Can Ofcom really do that before the appeal? If so that is excellent news.

If they force them to give VM the HD channels though and then they win the appeal, couldn't we have a Sky basics situation again where Sky put up the price prohibitively and the channels are taken off cable?

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

So having just had a quick skim read of the full report, these are the main outcomes:

Sky sports 1 and 2 maximum pricing set.
Sky sports 1 and 2 HD having a "must offer" on "fair reasonable and non discriminatory" terms
Sky sports interactive services having a "must offer" on "fair reasonable and non discriminatory terms"

Zero change to sky movies, no must offer of sky movies HD.

Referring Sky's holding of subscriber vod rights to the competition commission as ofcom have no powers to deal with it.

In short, it's a joke of a review. The entire report sets out how Sky are abusing their position on sports and movies, and then at the end it's just a cheap cop out. That they aren't forcing a must offer on movies in sd and hd is ridiculous considering how a huge section of the report is slating sky for not offering them to other providers.

Hopefully they will refer the svod issues to the competitions commission as if VM can get their hands on the svod rights for first run movies they won't need the sky movie channels at all and they could offer a FAR superior service.

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

That is my understanding from what I have read elsewhere.

IF sky win on appeal but one would hope that the evidence is fairly clear about their abuse of their dominant position then hopefully any appeal in the courts will fail.

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

te review also gives sky the go ahead for the picknick project, Pay TV on freeview channels. and sky want to appeal, having their cake and eat it

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

ive had a quick skim through the ofcom report but must be missing the deal here

is there anything in it regarding sky sports red button?

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

Just that interactive services on sky sports 1 and 2 must be offered on "fair reasonable and non-discriminatory" terms.

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

kool,

and that means what? we have to pay extra for them?

sorry if i sound a bit thick its just way too early in a morning :)

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

It means pretty much nothing really.

It's just weasel words to avoid having to make any actual rulings.

You could easily argue that "fair reasonable and non-discriminatory" mean they can't actually charge for them though, as if they charge on top of the set wholesale price of sports then it brings the cost of providing the same sky sports service as sky back up to unprofitable levels. It would be price discrimination if they started charging a fair amount for it.

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

bugger, all i want is the red button included :(

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

I am in two minds about this.

1 - sky have invested heavily in sports and it is what is their driving force, if they are forced to reduce prices then I expect there will be a significant loss of quality, eg. sky may make cut backs on its sky broadband as their profits get slashed.
2 - on the other hand the main reason sky charge so much is because everytime they renew their deal they pay more for it even when they have next to no competition, its as if they deliberatly want footballers overpaid.

personally they have priced me out so I will gain from this. but I expect sky customers will feel the brunt when this happens as they will cut operational costs all over the place.

---------- Post added at 10:38 ---------- Previous post was at 10:31 ----------

I remember watching some games on sky 1 and sky sports news when cable had lost those channels :)

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

What a hodge podge bunch of old bunkum! And if that sentence doesn't make any sense then your half way into understanding Ofcoms ruleing.

Why rule on only Sky Sports 1 & 2? Why no definitive price structure on either the red button or HD?

It leaves Sky so much wriggle room they will be able to worm their way out of it.

Having said that, I believe VM will use Ofcom's waffle to begin proper negotiations with Sky over Premium HD content. VM may well offer JUST above Ofcoms price to secure Sky HD... we'll see i guess.

But honestly... 3 years, millions of pounds for an ill thought out rueling with holes as large as Rupert Murdochs change pocket.

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

My take on it is they charging VM MORE than what SKY users get as there charging VM a significant costs. Therefore using SKY platform as selling point if you want sport its cheaper here on ours.

Its no matter if they produce the content or pay for it they using other platforms as cash cow to support paying for it. On top they providing whether thats down to system or deliberate withhold inferior provisions.

I am disapointed OFCOM weakness to hit them harder and should linked Picnic as a if you accept findings you get picnic dont you get nothing.

This would held them to ransom to accept findings.

The movies is strange one its high subscribed but rubbish viewing and they attempted to rehash it several times. This must be costing them money I think this why OFCOM reluctant to do anything.

OFCOM could gone alot further and refer it to monopolies why content gets withhold shifting content sneakily so rivals cant watch it.

However I also feel VM shoots themselves in the foot they moan about SKY atitude withhelding content but look to consider selling there own channels to company who hell bent killing them.

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

I agree this ruling has led to more questions than answers as people on this thread have stated but one fact that has come to light interests me.

Sky sell Sky Sports to VM for £13.88 (Rates before this ruling, sorry can't remember the source but I'm sure I saw it somewhere)
VM sells Sky Sports to Customer for either £24 (TV M+ & L) or £20.50 (TV XL)

So if VM really thought about their customers then there is some room for improvement on their selling price and they can still make a profit!? Am I alone in thinking this?

PS. I am a loyal VM customer & hate $ky with a passion by the way.

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

According to ofcom

Wholesaling Sky Sports 1 and 2: Sky is required to offer to wholesale standard definition versions of Sky Sports 1 and 2. This remedy – known as “wholesale must-offer” – will ensure fair and effective competition. Ofcom has set a wholesale price of £10.63 for each of Sky Sports 1 and 2, when sold on a standalone basis, which is 23.4% below the current wholesale price to cable operators. Most consumers currently buy packages which include Sky Sports 1 and 2 and the wholesale price for this service bundle has been reduced by 10.5% to £17.14.

So the current wholesale price of the bundle of just sky sports 1 and 2 must be about about 19.50. Add in the extra VM have to pay for 3 and 4 and you can see how they are not making much, if any, money on sky sports.

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

VM don't really make anything on the Sky Sports/Movies.

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

Seems top up tv are getting the ball rolling.

http://www.topuptv.com/register+interest

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

So how will the whole Sky Sports thing work for Cable customers? Will we still get Sky Sports 3 and 4??

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

Yes.
This seems intresting,
http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2010...n-media-bt-sky

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

I'm sorry but Sky were the ones that invested 'so heavily' in sports, nobody told them to do that, and in this country we do not permit monopolies,so if they don't like it tough! They can take there Sky dishes and there over rated HD boxes together with there repeating channels back to Fox and take a hard long look in the mirror, because the prices they are charging people is disgusting, don't they realise people aren't as rich as them!

Besides, it may help themselves in the long run to lower wholsesale costs, if they lower the cost,more people will subscribe and what happens when a channels gets more 'potential' viewers? More TV commercials ect... which means fast money.

A clear example of this was seen when the Sky basic channels were switched off on Virgin Media, since they have been reinstated, the prices TV advertisers pay would have gone up since an extra 3 to 4 Million potential viewers can see the ads.

A monopoly? Imagine if BT held the same position over its phone service, imagine if BT had exclusive rights for offering calls to mobiles from landlines making it impossible for other phone companies to offer the same facility,i'm sure nobody would put up with that, well why should people put up with a dominant pay-tv company???

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

Interesting point raised how many people use digital TV all platforms in UK and how many love sport. If prices was in line to most people pocket and able to afford they could stand to MAKE more money. Maybe its greed they want to keep it artificially high and have millions pay the nose for it.

I see the premierrubbish are now moaning about ofcom. sorry mods but its linked to the story. Would sport be so crippled I doubt it just pay those prima donna balarinas (I mean those so called profesionals) less.


http://www.football365.com/story/0,1...067057,00.html

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

I am curious as to what security issues they have, for VM there is no issue as the currently broadcast the channels, weren't both BT and VM saying just a few weeks ago that they would be doing this by the summer.

In the end it just seems like a let down and the regulation didn't go far enough.

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

to make this even more interesting I remember reading somewhere sky sports itself needs subsidising from basic subscriptions.

to clarify what I mean is the recent rises on the basic mix on sky tv is to compensate sky for people cancelling sky sports as subscriber numbers are falling. This also has the affect of reducing the gap between sky's normal mix prices and with sky sports added on. So there is a cross subsidy going on there. It may explain why the wholesale prices dont seem favourable.

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

All this talk in the papers about the sporting bodies weighing in, concerned that their revenues will drop as Sky will no longer pay the big bucks as they will no longer be able to promote the pay dish platform as the best (and for non-cable areas, only) place to view sport. Absolute tosh.
Why are people ignoring the impact ESPN is having on the sports rights market? With the deeper-than-Murdoch pockets of Disney backing it, it will be a far more competitive bidding process for most sports going forward than the unbalanced Sky v Setanta bidding of yore. Better we have two well-matched heavyweights in competition than a self-serving monopoly, surely?

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

I think the impact of ESPN is very interesting a question i would ask is ESPN really in competition or are they too close to sky to really compete? Sky produce ESPNS football coverage using sky production facilities,and also sky do admin for ESPN seems like a very close relationship for two companies that are supposed to be fiercly in competition to me. Setanta was completely independant in a way ESPN are not at the moment.

As for the money sporting bodies will notionally lose,well if sky sports were available on freeview would that not more then make up for the revenue that may be lost by the price cut,i mean sky could potentially sell lots of subs either via picnic or top up tv. The sporting bodies really ought to get their nose out of skys backside they seem to be thinking of the cash cow rather then the public in all of this.

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

Just seen this :

http://www.virginmedia.com/myvirginm...sky-ruling.php

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

Thanks :tu:

anychance
 

with the latest ofcom ruling, strugglin 2 understands bits of it, so is there a chance we cud get sky sports 1 and 2 in hd any time soon or av i just read it wrong.

---------- Post added at 13:03 ---------- Previous post was at 12:34 ----------

any ideas any1

Re: anychance
 

Not according to this :(

Source: http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/digitalt...ut-impact.html

Re: anychance
 

1. There's a massive post already on OFCOM's findings.
2. You bumped yourself after less than half an hour.
[mod: comment removed]

Good day :D.

Re: anychance
 

Any more abousive comments will not be tollerated on CF, if members don't like a post then either reply in a civil manner or not at all.


Threads Merged

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

A very interesting piece from the BBC yesterday about the OFCOM ruling and the Murdoch and Tory alliance. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8601711.stm

Spot on, lets hope more senior Tories have the same thoughts, Government should be concentrating on education, health, the economy, etc. Not interfering in the job of the regulator, especially in media where government have the possibility of influencing and pushing a agenda on the public.

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

Sky and OFCOM come to a temporary agreement until the appeal is over http://corporate.sky.com/media/press...at_the_CAT.htm

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

Can not see the prices changing until after the the main appeal?

However, while the interim agreement is in effect, the three named competitors will effectively continue to pay the existing rate card price, with the difference between that and the wholesale must-offer price paid into escrow

Full link here

http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/digitalt...rrestrial.html

Re: anychance
 

That Digital Spy link is four weeks old (April 1st no less). Try this story from The Guardian today: Sky Sports HD is coming.

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

Looks like a compromise deal has been reached of between 10-23% cut in price for Sports 1 & 2, with effect from 14 May 2010.

http://business.timesonline.co.uk/to...cle7112109.ece

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

does anyone know if the prices for Sky Sports have gone down yet ?

I don't subscribe at the moment so for me even getting the SD version will be a bonus over last season.

A quick look on the VM website shows these prices

http://allyours.virginmedia.com/html...-channels.html

meaning I have to pay about £20 a month. Is the above any cheaper than last year and before this ruling ? If not is this price likely to go down ?

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

Prices came down on the 1st July.
I'm on the Sky Sports Collection and TV M+.
Before the 1st July, the cost of the Sky Sports Collection was £24 per month but now it's only £20.50 - I've already had a bill with the new price :)

Regards .....

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

If you're on TV XL you'll have to pay the same now as you did before. Everyone else (other than M) has been bought down to the TV XL pricing level.

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

The recent price change isn't connected to the OFCOM ruling. It was done to simplify the pricing so that M+, L and XL customers all pay the same for the Sky Premiums options

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

so does that mean the price should be going down further ?

Surely the OFCOM ruling has nothing to do with the deal between VM and Sky over HD channels and so should already come into force or are Sky appealing this ?

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

Sky are appealing the ruling

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

Makes you laugh doesn't it poor Sky.

Re: OFCOM ready to rule?
 

Why does it make you laugh, it is any company's legal right to challenge a ruling?