Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

yes and what a nice suprise for the electorate after being given a third term. :rolleyes:

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

:D:D:D

I almost fell off my chair when I saw he's the favourite!

When are the Tories going to learn what Labour learned?

You can only get back to power by appealing to people who DON'T usually vote for you

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Actually, in real terms it hasn't been frozen.
By increasing the fuel escalator from 2p to 6p they gained several years worth of increases in a single year, and also prompted a national fuel shortage from the resultant protests.
Go labour! Gotta love the strikes they bring :rolleyes:

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

You were surprised??

Well I'm surprised :D
__________________

Yeah! Like the hundreds in the last two terms......

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Don't mind at all as long as it goes to where it is needed. I would point out though that the oil companies have been doing very nicely thank you and that neither of the opposition parties, perhaps, were not going to prevent such increases, and the Lib Dems were going to hit you with more tax rises, but then we can't be sure as their leaders failed to deliver any programmes for the economy.

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Labour hold harlow with 97 votes: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/shared/vote2005/html/300.stm

Labours majority increases to 66.

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

:notopic: At the moment I'm writing some very positive feedback to the BBC for their brilliant coverage of the whole election. I found that on the night the graphics were amazingly good yet clear, not too over the top like on the other channels I flicked through where I couldn't understand what was going so much. Also, the whole election tourbus thing throughout the campaign, the swingometer thing, the great presenters who knew what they're talking about. Congratulations beeb, some really good quality reporting there. :tu:

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Anyone know if Paxman's arugument with Galloway is available for download?

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

ohhhhh yes :D
http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/avdb/new...56_bb_16x9.asx

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Or decreases to 66, it was well over 160 before then.

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

i meant from before the harlow result. I was showing that it meets the exit poll, although guardian still has 55, maybe they gave harlow to labour already?

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Nice one, thanks.

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Nice one mate! It was much longer and better than the short clip I saw on HIGNFY.

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

That was easily the best moment of the night.. I have read a fair bit about george galloway, and TBH, if I typed my opinion of him, it would be libellous.

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Anyone know how to have a downloaded copy? So i can covert to mpeg4?

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Paxman goes up another few notches in my estimation :)

Showed <insert expletive here> up for the sort of person he really is.

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Right Click > Save As...

EDIT: Nope, that's just the link. :dunce:

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

OK, it was 165 majority out of 659 seats in the House of Commons including the Speaker. Boundary revisons applied in Scotland, which has had its allocation reduced from 72 to 59 being 13 seats less.

It is expected that the Labour gain from the 2005 election will be 66. Yes, ok we know that many seats were lost.

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

They could have done with more on-screen info like Sky had, when flicking or going to make a drink I found it hard to see which areas had already come in. Sky's vidi (sp??)printer was great for that!

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

I saved it in Media Player in a playlist. Perhaps you can convert it from whichever media player you save it on. ;)

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Why? That would mean you know your opinion of him is untrue. The main defence against libel is that your accusations are true. So, if you think they're true, they aren't libellous, so let's hear them. You've heard my opinion of him*.

*
Negative:
Up himself. Too left wing. Womaniser. Bit too keen on moustachioed dictators, although there's no evidence he actually supported Saddam's activities in the way, say, the US and UK governments did in the 1980s. In terms of effective political activity a zero (check the number of votes Respect got nationwide - it was about 1/3 of the votes the BNP got). Failed to condemn human rights abuses in Bangladesh despite standing in a constiuency with a large Bangladeshi community - check Private Eye 1129 for details of his recent visit there.

Positive:
Right about the war. Libelled by the Telegraph, won his case. Badly smeared by MI6 and their pet press people. Right about giving British Muslims a voice they've hitherto not had (considering that lack of representation tends to lead to revolt, e.g. the American War of Independence, the Suffragettes).

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Sorry, but Paxman went down a hell of a lot in *my* estimation.

Starting off with a blatantly loaded "attack" question like that was sheer pettiness and then trying to repeat it several times was pathetic and then finally saying "congratulations" in sarcastic tones was no way to conduct an interview.

IMO George Galloway was quite right to take Paxman to task for it and he was also quite right to walk out when it was clear that JP had no intention of conducting a reasonable interview.

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Theresa May would be a much better choice.

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Yes, I can see her bringing votes in from people who've never voted Tory before.

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Galloway is a prat. Its a shame paxman didnt give him a harder question instead of one he can easily get out of. If he asked about driving out a jewish MP it may have been better due to Galloways campain

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

You're free to hold that opinion. It has little bearing on the subject.

It's a shame Paxman acted like an arrogant idiot from the start.

Sure, let's attack him for "driving out" (good emotive phrase that) a *woman* and a *black* and a *jew*!! Wow! He's really racking up the Politically Incorrect points there...!! :rolleyes:

Of course there was also Oona King who claimed (without any basis that I've been able to verify) that Galloway was playing the anti-semitism card because his supporters were allegedly telling people "don't vote for her because she' Jewsish", so don't paint Galloway as the only villain.

However the fact is that he *was* elected by people who did *not* want to vote for someone who had supported the invasion of Iraq and wanted to point that out quite clearly to Tony Blair...

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Why are you so defensive about galloway?

Do you find it curious why galloway stood in a constituency like Harrow East? Why did he choose Bethnal Green & Bow?

Surely, Paxman is well known for his aggressive style of interviewing, many politicians of various parties have experienced his style, what's so special about galloway?

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

There's a very good article in this week's Private Eye about George Galloway.


I can't post a link, however, it's not online.

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Congratulations, I was waiting for someone to come up with that one... :rolleyes:

The point is not that I'm being *defensive* about Galloway, it is that others seem to think it's their "duty" almost to be *offensive* about him.

Whatever your opinions of him, what Labour did to get him out of the way for being "inconvenient" was despicable, the defamatory charges levelled against him by the newspapers have been demonstrated to be false and the way the Labour Party attacked him in the election campaign is in the lowest traditions of British gutter politics.

No. He chose a constituency where he had a good chance of winning. Why is that any different from the way the main parties "parachute in" candidates to seats that will get them into power?

As I said, Paxman went in for a blatantly loaded "attack question" right from the start (something which AFAIK he didn't do to other interviewees on Election night, especially not winning candidates) so it seems his only purpose was to make Galloway look bad. Unfortunately he blew it, Galloway didn't fall for the trap and Paxman was left blustering and looking petty.

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Where do you suggest a party with few resources, few candidates and little support stand?

1) Somewhere they can possibly win?
2) Somewhere they would probably lose?
3) A constituency picked at random on a map?

For that matter, why didn't Sinn Fein stand round here? Because there's about a 3% Irish community here, while in Northern Ireland it's nearly 50%, so it would be a waste of effort. No difference there to what Respect did.

Did you have a candidate for Independent Kidderminster Hospital and Health Concern? Should Richard Taylor have stood somewhere other than Kidderminster? Of course not, that's where people felt strongly enough to vote for him, he'd be loony to stand anywhere else.

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Would you care to provide the evidence to substantiate your allegation that "the Labour Party attacked him in the election campaign is in the lowest traditions of British gutter politics"
__________________


Or is it that he simply wanted to exploit the muslim vote for his own cynical purposes?

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

"AN ELDERLY man claims that he suffered a broken nose and wrist and a cut face when he was attacked after refusing to accept an election leaflet from supporters of George Gallowayââ‚à ƒâ€šÃ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢s Respect party. [...]

"Mr Dobrovolski, who is a Labour Party member, was treated in hospital for his injuries."

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/printFr...590512,00.html

However:

"When I check I realise that the leaflet wasnââ‚ ¬Ã¢â€žÂ¢t produced until two days after the assault. And when I check with the police, they say that in Dobrovolskiâââ€Å ¡Ã‚¬Ã¢â€žÂ¢s statement there was no mention of a Respect supporter attacking him. They put out an advisory to the press about this, which doesnââ‚ƚ¬Ã¢â€žÂ¢t prevent one or two papers running with the story."

http://www.sundayherald.com/49602

Does that sound to you like the finest traditions of British Politics?

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Unfortunately, yes it does. :rolleyes: :(

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Bringing it back to "who you supported":

Residents association candidate - no chance, and actually thought it was a rather daft idea putting one up.

Result, 4th place, best of the rest out of a selection including BNP (5th), Green, and a couple of other odds and ends - actually quite surprised and impressed by that result

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

What it doesn't sound to me is the labour party attacking him.
Perhaps you can provide evidence to back up your comment Graham?

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Excuse me? It was from a press release by Oona King, the *LABOUR PARTY* candidate.

Or are you just pendantically picking nits in a desperate attempt to score a point? If so, please tell me and I'll stop wasting time replying.

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Oh no, that's such a terrible attack on Mr Galloway isn't it? Doesn't even mention his name.

So again, can we actually have some evidence of how labour have attacked him in the election campaign?

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

I believe you grossly exaggerating this incident of being the Labour Party's action re gutter politics. The man was interviewed on TV: of course in such circumstances he was well known Labour activist he was indeed kicked and a leaflet from Respect was thrown at him, assume there were no witnesses to the incident. You will have to do better than this and issuing statements like you did lowers your own credibilty.
__________________


Reading your posts one gets the impression you are the pedantic one. You have not provided evidence to back your ridiculous claim.

Maybe you should read this Telegraph article, registered users,
Police move in
Which outlines the nasty behaviour of Respect supporters, even Ken Livingstone was horrified!

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Ah, it seems you *are* pedantically picking nits. By the way, it was Oona King who called the press to Les Dobrovolski's house to break the story about him being attacked by Respect supporters and them dropping a leaflet on him...

Oh and you may want to read the following article: http://www.thelondonline.co.uk/theli...p?articleID=53

"She says his supporters are running a racist campaign; he says she's running a corrupt campaign. She has eggs and rotten vegetables pelted at her at a Jewish memorial service; he says he's just successfully sued her for the second time. She says she wouldn't trust him to deliver a pizza; he says she's no more than a cog in a machine. Tariq Ali calls her a "warmonger", while Cherie Blair urges voters to "give Galloway a bloody nose"."

"TALK of administering †œa bloody noseââ‚ ¬Ã‚ÂÂÂ� to oneââ‚Âà ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢s political opponents is not the kind of language expected from the wife of the Prime Minister. But Cherie Blair has urged loyal Labour supporters to do just that to George Galloway, one of her husbandââ‚à ‚¬Ã¢â€žÂ¢s fiercest critics over the war in Iraq.

"Mrs Blair appeared to lose her cool while addressing an audience of 100 party members at a £25-per-head fundraising reception for Oona King, defending Bethnal Green & Bow for Labour. "

[...]

"Labour is worried and Mrs Blair is just the latest big gun †â€ÂÂÂ� after Gordon Brown, John Prescott and Charles Clarke †â€ÂÂÂ� to appear with Ms King. In her speech Mrs Blair went on to attack the media because they could not be relied on to †œdeliver the partyââ‚ƚ¬Ã¢â€žÂ¢s messageââ‚à ‚¬Ã‚ÂÂÂ�."

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article...7052_1,00.html

Do you really think that Labour were wheeling out the Big Guns (including the PM's *wife*!!) to support Oona King? Or were they just terrified that they'd suffer an embarassing defeat by Galloway and were doing their damndest to stop it by any means available?
__________________

A leaflet that wasn't printed until *TWO DAYS* after the attack? Hmm...

Oh and "no witnesses"? In which case I think "presumed innocent until proven guilty" comes to mind.

Is that the sound of axes being ground I hear...???

ROFLALALAL!!! :rofl:

Oh deary, deary me.

*WHY* is it that people seem to assume that because I'm "attacking" Labour, they think I *must* be *defending* Galloway.

They have absolutely *NO* basis for such a belief, but think I am "taking sides" instead of just pointing out facts. :dozey:

Oh and it's a bit rich that Ken Livingstone is accusing George Galloway of opportunism. Oh and quoting from that same article:

"Miss King added that Mr Galloway had reaped what he had sown. "Extremism breeds extremism. Everyone has been aware that the Respect party has been whipping things up particularly among one section of the community and I am not surprised things have turned ugly and now they are turning even uglier.""

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

You think it's pedantic nit picking when you are unable to substanciate your claim that the labour party have been attacking Galloway?
Personally I just call it asking for actual evidence, which again you've failed to provide.
None of the above show that the Labour party attacked him, in fact his comments directed about Oona herself by Galloway were rather unpleaseant.
So either retract your statement or show us some evidence that the Labour party attacked George Galloway.


__________________


I suppose those wounds were self inflicted then?

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Excuse me? Is Oona King not a member of the Labour Party?

Or how about "Miss King shot back: "George Galloway says he wants to deliver more money for housing. Mr Galloway couldn't deliver a pizza."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/p...ge/4432191.stm

Or "It seems to me that Mr Galloway has read a lot of stories about Ronnie and Reggie Kray and thinks everyone is a crook in the East End" Alan Barnard
Ms King's campaign manager

http://newswww.bbc.net.uk/1/hi/uk_po...ge/4455635.stm

His comments about Oona King are irrelevant to the point.

Xaccers, what the hell are you talking about? This man was attacked, yes, I don't deny that. What there is *NO PROOF* of is that it was done by members of the Respect Party and what evidence there is so far seems to demonstrate that these claims are fallacious.

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Thats not bad, thats normal election stuff. Howard called blair a liar, so thats nothing really.

Also I think what Galloway said is to the point

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Ooo such a scathing despicable statement! I bet he was really upset when he heard that a single member of labour said such a nasty thing :rolleyes:

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Also, there is the point they we dont have any proof that he can deliver a pizza. He needs to know addresses, how to ride a bike and so on. Also he hasnt spent long in Bethnal Green so will he know where places are!! By the time it arrives it would be cold and everything! Then of course if you try to get a refund he will call you a kangaroo court and march against you calling you a warmonger while saluting the courage of other lazy pizza boys!

Yes, This Pizza issue isnt a piece of cake

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

And on that note, I see absolutely no point in continuing with this thread.

:walk:

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Oona King on the radio just now saying that she agrees with Galloway on the Paxman interview - she finds being seen as just a 'black woman in Parliament' insulting, as do I.

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

You made ridiculous allegations in regard to the Labour Party and its campaign in Bethnal Green & Bow. You provided no firm evidence to substantiate your ludicrous claims.

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

And when that's pointed out, he departs leaving the rubble of his statement decaying in the dust.

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Ok, look, if it makes you happier:

Congratulations! You've trapped me with your clever web of words!

I put my hands up, I made a too sweeping generalisation and you've rightly taken me to task for it and proved that I was wrong and that it wasn't the Labour Party at all (just some of its members, although I'm not really sure what the difference is...) and you've demolished my proof and evidence (although I'm not sure you'd have even accepted a signed letter saying "yes, it wuz us, we done it, the Labour Party" at this point)

Bravo! Well done! Graham's got a taste of his own medicine...!!!

:shrug: :rolleyes: :walk:

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

For those who are interested, here is The Rockall Times' take on the victory

BTW, the Rockall Times is a satirical website.

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

I suggest you look at the comments made by Oona King:

BBC Oona King

You might find it more rewarding to consider there are perhaps two or multiple sides to a story, you can hardly ignore what Oona King has to say.

Whilst we are on the topic, I think Jeremy Paxman raised a valid point which even an amauter spin doctor like galloway could have replied to and moved on, galloway's own conceited pride made that difficult. Oona King's responses and her as a leading black MP are interesting, but I think the point Paxman made was valid in this case.

Let's face it, you hate Labour that's all there is to it so one cannot expect reasoned responses from you. I don't know what your agenda is nor do I care.

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Now that's the most sensible thing I've seen in the whole campaign!

Aww! Why did you have to spoil it?! :D
__________________

I wasn't going to comment again in this thread, but if this is what you believe, you have completely failed to understand what I have been talking about.

1) I do not "hate Labour". I disagree with their policies and the way they have behaved, I do not like what Tony Blair has done in government, but I do not "hate" them, nor do I let that colour my judgement.

2) My responses have been reasoned, unfortunately it seems that some people have assumed, incorrectly, that because I disagree with Labour's behaviour (or the behaviour of its members) I am somehow "supporting" George Galloway instead.

3) I have no "agenda". I have opinions which I have stated clearly and repeatedly, yet others seem to have done their best to misinterpret them in ways that have nothing to do with what I believe, but only with what they want to believe. I cannot be bothered to waste time correcting them any further.

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

Gogogo, did you hear the original interview with Oona King? I heard the whole thing (that BBC article is a summary of it, and misses bits).

Hence why I posted earlier in the thread about her stating that the whole 'black-woman-MP-is-somehow-special' thing that Paxman bought into was insulting to her, which I've been trying to suggest for a while in this thread. She had a lot of harsh words for Gorgeous George, unsurprisingly, but she *backed* him on the Paxman interview question ('was Paxman's question pointless, insulting and inflammatory?') which has to count for a lot.

If someone stands for Parliament, it's irrelevant what their skin colour, gender, sexual orientation or physical ability is - what matters is what they say and, when re-election time comes, what their record is. In the case of Oona King she backed the Government, got 34% of the vote and lost her seat. Diane Abbott, a short distance away in Hackney North & Stoke Newington, opposed the Government on Iraq and got re-elected with a 48.6% of the vote.

Oona King would still be MP for Bethnal Green and Bow if she'd taken the same line as Diane Abbott. Two black women, two similar inner east London ethnically diverse constituencies, two different views, two different results. Given that it's difficult to argue that her skin colour was the deciding factor - it was purely her decision to support her party leadership against the views of her constituents. Those two constituencies eventually elected candidates with highly differing origins, but with identical anti-war sentiments.

Re: The Cable Forum Exit Poll
 

OK. Remember the result between galloway and Oona King was close, less than a thousand votes. People have all sorts of reasons for voting for a particular candidate, I'm not sure how far, given the result was close, you can say with any certainty Iraq a deciding factor. From experience I know that when Labour voters are upset they tend to abstain or can't be bothered to vote for anyone. There may well have been numbers who normally support Labour but were attracted to galloway's party or Lib Dem. I haven't had the time to study the turnouts for Bethnal Green & Bow for 1992,1997 & 2001, but will do later.

On the issue of the Paxman statement to galloway. Having been at election counts I know what an exhausting and stressful experience counts can be and given the circumstances in Bethnal Green & Bow I'm sure the tension was greater than normal and I'm sure everyone was very tired. Paxman raised a point that galloway had succeeded at the expense of a black, jewish female MP, a good constituency MP by all accounts. I can understand her response, I have no problem with her position, I have a lot of respect for her, but I imagine the London Labour Party will be concerned at the loss of an exceptional MP and it will be seen as a setback for black advancement.

Now, galloway is capable of giving a reasoned answer and when challenged failed to attempt to answer the question, got stroppy threatened to walk off, but clearly decided to hang on realising this would not look good for him, David Lammy MP was sitting next to Paxman and clearly also felt this was a setback.

Dianne Abbot has her own problems, having decided to send her child to private school an unpopular decison within her own constituency party, no doubt her stand on Iraq became useful but then I'm a cynic at heart.

Hopefully, Oona King will be on a list for the House of lords she certainly deserves it in comparison to other recent promotions.