Re: UK Energy Prices
 

When at OVO (Prior to Octopus) I sent readings every month.
I was then able to adjust my DD payment every month based on real readings.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Best to' adjust' your readings and time them, to make the best of any tariff changes. Smart meters can't do that. I might accidentally over read before prices go up at the end of the month. Easily done with my eyesight these days ;)

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

In other words, the real reason you dont like them is because you cant lie, cheat and falsify readings :dozey:

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Just buying energy in advance, like energy companies do. :)

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

And committing fraud ;)

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Definitely not pointless for me as I pay by DD which means I'm billed with real readings instead of their estimated readings.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Switched energy supplier. First time in a few years, seems worthwhile to do again. Not usually a fan of fixing but with prices going up in Jan, and also forecast to go up in April, now seems a good time.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Who's did you switch from and to?

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

From EON (leccy) and EDF (gas), to Outfox the Market for both. They have a good deal 12 month deal atm.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Never heard of Outfox the market, are your rates alot cheaper than what you had been paying?

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

I used Comparethemarket to see if I could get a better deal. Apart from fixing, which is a bit of a gamble, I couldn't save more than a few pence per year.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Trouble with comparison sites is they only show deals they get commission on. There will be an option to show all deals but they keep it hidden away.

---------- Post added at 11:56 ---------- Previous post was at 11:55 ----------

Saving over £200 a year.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

For fixed they seem average at best.

Their fixed electric is better than the current Octopus Fixed.
However its not better than the average Agile price on most days.

Their fixed gas is not as good as the current Octopus Fixed (or the previous Octo Fixed).

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Might also depend on usage/region. I'm a heavy electricity user, but light on gas. What's best for one household might not be best for another. Certainly the cheapest for me.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

I'm thinking of changing. Been following this thread. Then today...

'We had a smart meter installed by Octopus... the cost of making a cuppa went from 1p to £5 overnight'

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/...overnight.html

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Sensationalist drivel

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Yeah, that’s clearly a dodgy install by an incompetent installer - nothing to do with Octopus or the smart meter itself.

I’ve had 3 new smart meters; one in my old house (fine) and two in my new one, which have had various communication problems, but I’ve never been over charged by them.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Yep, and not even a Smart Meter issue, but an issue with how a CT Clamp was set-up.
(they are just external current sensors used in Solar Panel & EV Charger set-ups).

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

did he mention how to pay for it

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Seemingly there are quite a lot of meters installed wrong and people are being charged a fortune, This is not right,

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Links?

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

https://www.theguardian.com/business...-great-britain

search engine broke?

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

The Guardian ?! Now I know you've gone to the darkside ;)

Smart meters give all control to the supplier, if they work..

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

It’s generally considered good form when making a claim to back it up with some sort of link.

Anyways, who lit the fuse on your sanitary product ?

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

The article actually states ;
Not "all" people, nor does it say "a fortune".
Estimates (as I'm sure you know) are based on previous usage.
You can also supply actual readings to correct any estimated bill.

If a poster makes a claim like that then they need to back it up with links, not expect others to have to search.
Same as when starting a news based topic : https://www.cableforum.uk/board/show...php?t=33670445

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Uk has enough Gas says network operator.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c7vd57qzlqpo

It's interesting in another news article i read that Centrica immediately quoted they would have to raise prices, something they are well known for doing at the drop of a hat.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

My supplier must know something is up, or are relying totally on computer programs to make decisions.

A letter from them today said that they would reduce my DD from £140 to £136.44 from February.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

What use is that, hardly anyone uses Hydrogen.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

They will just change the rules so that you have to use it. They are already pushing heat pumps and if they change them to use hydrogen instead of Gas or electric then we are all flucked

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

The pathway to reducing our national dependence on natural gas will almost certainly involve mixing hydrogen into the public gas supply. There’s simply no way the purported alternative (everyone gets a heat pump) will fly. They require space not everybody has and when you have entire streets of them, they’re noisy. They also draw a lot of electricity which the regional distribution networks might not always have capacity for.

The greenest way of getting hydrogen is to use excess renewable energy to electrolyse water (the alternative involves converting natural gas but while it’s a more efficient process it’s also self defeating if we’re trying to reduce our dependence on it).

Centrica can probably make a credible business case for investing in Rough if it has a long term future, which under present government net zero policies it doesn’t, because it has a load of natural gas storage capacity everyone is telling Centrica they don’t need in the long term. But if they have permission to convert it to hydrogen storage they can probably work with that.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Aren't most modern boilers able to use gas or hydrogen?

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

I think the key word here is long term. Little use now as hardly anyone uses it, but this should change.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Some are what they call "Hydrogen Ready" which means they can be converted to run on it, you cant simply switch and they'll work.

I'd bet the majority of people dont have one atm since boilers are not something you often replace, they run for at least 10 - 15 years, longer if well serviced.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Hydrogen is being touted as "storage" for electricity.

Excess electrical power would be passed to electrolysis sites, where water would be split into hydrogen and oxygen. The hydrogen would then be stored until it was required to power steam generators to generate electricity for the National Grid.

Large batteries are also being built to store DC electricity.

But both methods have an explosive risk.

Being able to store power in these ways will have knock-on effects, of course. The UK is presently seeing a dip in the wholesale price for natural gas, due to a drop in demand. But the ability to store power could well prevent such dips from happening, as any excess could be passed to hydrogen plants and batteries. Our lack of decent levels of mass storage for natural gas is also a factor. So the days of those with smart meters having "free" or cheaper electricity could well be numbered.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Some good news I wasn't expecting on energy prices

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/clyn5keznpqo

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

That is good news. But I've just signed up to a fixed tariff. :( I don't have exit fees so I could come out of it but I'm sure I won't get a better deal before the next Ofgen price cap. Maybe there might be better fixed tariffs around now.

Saying that, they always lower the price in the summer months you don't save anywhere near the amount they state anyway. So it's a bit of a con as they'll put it up again around autumn when you'll use more.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

It's been previously explained that it's gas prices that are keeping energy prices high not net zero as renewables are cheapest.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

I signed up to an Octopus 12 month fixed with £59 exit fee on both fuels, I regret not staying on a Tracker Tariff for atleast Gas.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

That's not what's keeping them high. It's the link to gas prices.
https://www.theguardian.com/business...-done-about-it

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

It will go up again in winter

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

None of that matters, to your pocket.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Its not unexpected, the cap has been predicted to fall in July for months now, and possibly in Oct as well, then rise very slightly in Jan 2026.

https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/ut...ap-prediction/

Gas has been cheap for almost two months now, the Tracker price has been below 5p since the last week of April.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Maybe not to yours but to mine and countless others it does.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

How so?

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

If prices were not set by gas, they would be cheaper and we'd end up paying less.

As renewable generation increases, this is thankfully looking more likely.
https://www.carbonbrief.org/factchec...rices-so-high/

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

But they’re not, so we’re not.

Until it happens, it’s irrelevant.

We’re being charged exorbitant amounts of money and renewables are not lowering the price.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Renewables are significantly decreasing the costs of energy generation substantially. Whether the savings are passed onto us or not is up to the politicians.

Good to see a Reform UK mayor getting on board cheaper energy from renewables.
https://www.ft.com/content/973da1ee-...b-b4b04a1a7d7a

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

If the reduced costs are not being passed onto the customer, then what's the point. The consumer doesn't benefit

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

In time, they will and if you want to speed the process up, petition/advocate/vote for a Party that will get the reduced costs passed on now.

What's the alternative? As Chris explained, any oil fracked in the UK is sold at global market rates so there's no silver bullet.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

They really need to specify an end state for renewables, the grid swings around wildly depending on the weather already. This leads to instability and could cause blackouts like in Spain. They need to lay out when we have "enough" renewables.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

It’s the lack of inertia from big heavy turbines that’s the issue in a grid largely powered by renewables, not the renewables themselves. But you can build stuff in to replicate what was, after all, an accidental benefit of heavy steam turbines and not something that was deliberately built in as such. Asking when we have ‘enough’ renewable generation is the wrong question with regard to sudden loss of generation.

If you wanted an exclusively renewable-powered grid you would need overcapacity in wind and solar generation backed by enormous amounts of storage. There are various ways of storing energy - most hydro schemes in Scotland of any size are pumped storage. You can use battery installations; molten salt technologies are likely to prove useful at scale. You can even use excess power to electrolyse water and store energy as hydrogen, which can then be used to refill fuel cells or added to the public gas supply to reduce the demand for fossil gas.

Even so, the most reliable way to produce base load requirement is likely to be a fleet of small modular nuclear reactors in many more locations - in a way that will take us back to what things looked like in the 1960s with a large number of lower-output Magnox reactors in many more locations, as opposed to the fewer, much larger reactors we have relied on more recently (and which we are finally building again now).

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

That is not the entire story. Renewables energy introduces additional grid oscillations which require extra work to control.

There are ways of storing energy but really they aren't all that great. We just don't one want a situation where we have absurd amounts of energy one minute and zero energy the next.

For instance if everyone has solar panels they become obsolete since electricity on the grid would be free whenever the sun shines and when the sun isn't shining the power is expensive again.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

I believe I addressed that:

All you’re really doing here is rehearsing a 21st century version of the AC/DC debate that raged in the late 19th century. We need to generate and distribute power in the way that works best, however now our definition of best includes considerations around environmental sustainability. It’s no use saying a particular method isn’t all that great - time and time again we see when there is a market for something, that drives innovation.

We need batteries like never before, and that demand has driven improvement. The best Lithium Ion batteries can hold 50% more power than they could 10 years ago, and the most recent designs are more resistant to degradation from max-charging them.

Lots here: https://arstechnica.com/science/2021...der-your-nose/

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

We live on an island surrounded by the sea, so why is tidal power generation always getting blocked on "environmental grounds"?

A barrage from near Cardiff to Weston-super-Mare has been touted for many, many years, but it gets blocked to "protect migratory birds' feeding grounds". The whole idea is that rising sea levels are allowed past a barrage, then released through turbines before the tide starts to rise again. So the "feeding grounds" get exposed twice a day.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

They don’t get exposed in the same way they do naturally because the barrage and the turbines change the rate at which the tide comes in and out. They also fundamentally alter the way water flows in an estuary with not entirely predictable results. Given how critical these grounds are for a very large number of birds, the risk is too great. Creating an environmental catastrophe in the name of solving another one is not sensible.

There are other ways of exploiting tidal flow energy, such as creating reservoirs within the estuary that fill and empty with the tide, which would operate on a smaller scale than damming the entire thing. There are also turbines which can be placed somewhere there is a particularly rapid tidal flow.

Orbital Marine are pioneers in this area and they have successfully demonstrated a 2 megawatt turbine in some particularly fast-flowing tidal streams around Orkney. They’re now moving to full production and expect to be deploying commercial tidal generation machinery next year.

https://www.orbitalmarine.com/o2-x/

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

In time……not helping anyone now is it? What’s the point?

Cheaper gas?

Change it.

For both.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Neither is a half-built road or house. Only when it's reached critical mass or politicians' arms can be twisted will we benefit from the cheaper cost of renewables.

Pretty sure if that was remotely possible and beneficial someone would have tried it by now.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

It’s more than remotely possible to nationalise oil/gas production and/or requisition output for domestic consumption only. But there is a penalty in terms of our standing as a place to invest and do business. That’s why we don’t do it, and would not do it except in a crisis.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Yup, it's a trade off and if it was worthwhile doing everything considered, it would have been done by now.

Re: UK Energy Prices
 

Price Cap dropping by 7% in July.

Despite this people are being encouraged to switch to fixed.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cn7zdzz83y0o