Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

And that's why Smurf the country is in big trouble. Regardless of Brexit, one half of the country ignoring the other is a recipe for disaster. United we stand, divided we fall.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Your only moaning about being ignored because you wanted to remain if remain had won you wouldn't care about ignoring leavers opinions hell you don't care about ignoring them now imagine if you had got your way.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Exactly. Posters need to remember that we're a United Kingdom and act accordingly.

---------- Post added at 15:02 ---------- Previous post was at 14:58 ----------

Leavers' opinions had been taken into account pre-2016. We didn't join the Eurozone and we had numerous opt-outs and a sizeable rebate.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:

---------- Post added at 15:24 ---------- Previous post was at 15:19 ----------

[QUOTE=1andrew1;35906697]Exactly. Posters need to remember that we're a United Kingdom and act accordingly.[COLOR="Silver"]

what by selling out to the EU ...

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Nope I posted pre vote when everyone thought remain would win it was a sad day no matter who won based on the campaigns and that they should all hold their heads in shame.

I never said you had made a mistake what I said is you can't speak for everyone because people did, we saw it on here, members saying they voted leave as a protest against the government, that we were leaving the echr and when you saw it in the media it was magnified nationally much worse, I don't see how anyone can complain when people reach conclusions based on things like rational facts just because you disagree with them, I can however see why people complain when I heard a call on the radio from a woman who purported to have worked for the EU and was voting leave as it was undemocratic, it was all going well and sounded reasonable until the presenter mentioned voting in the EU elections and the caller said she didn't know what they were and had never voted in them and that was coming from someone who claimed to have worked for the EU

Oh yes I'm bitter, when my biggest complaint about leaving is that we didn't do it ten years ago, my posts are still on here, don't remember you having much to say on it back then though. A glorious day for democracy, would it have been a glorious day if remain had won? For me a healthy, active democracy is where people participate and are informed all year round and not where a whole lot of people go into the booth factually ignorant or with heads filled with lies and switch back of the second they've ticked a little box, we carry on like this and eventually someone you don't like will win an election, someone like corbyn, would that be a great day for democracy to.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Correct. :tu:

---------- Post added at 17:37 ---------- Previous post was at 17:35 ----------

[QUOTE=papa smurf;35906699]:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:

---------- Post added at 15:24 ---------- Previous post was at 15:19 ----------

Yep - the single united Europe they want and the EU is totally fixated on achieving. That inevitably involves diminishing the UK, the usual suspects really can't have it both ways but as we all know they'll try to get what they want by whatever means they can even if it means sabotaging Brexit.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

You do know that the bananas myth is just that? The rest of your post about kicking out criminals is factually incorrect too. I don't mind which way people voted but if they were misinformed about such things it's not a great day for democracy. https://www.channel4.com/news/factch...ess-bananas-eu

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Hah, the bare-faced cheek. We're still leaving and we still don't give a bugger.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Please don't cull my sentences to give them a different meaning however well intentioned your motives are. The sentence actually read "I don't mind which way people voted but if they were misinformed about such things it's not a great day for democracy. "

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

The full text is there for everyone to see no need to get uppity. We're still leaving, you're still coming with us and we still don't give a bugger :D

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

48% of voters fell for project fear but hey what the heck you'll know better next time, the thing is though we got the right result no need to feel bad those of use who knew what we were voting for carried it off so all's well that ends well .

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Yup, a government sponsored project it was too. They tried every trick in the book to keep us in the EU but you only ever hear remainers whining on about a statement on the side of a campaign group's bus. It's pathetic really.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

it's the only fight back they have it's driven by their embarrassment of being duped and wasting their vote .

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

I can see I've really offended some by suggesting we're part of the same country and our interests, if not opinions might be mutual ! This confrontational I've got to win and you've got to lose approach, is all that's wrong with this country atm. We're stuffed big time if the views on this forum are representative.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Yep, it must be terrible lying in bed all night trying to think of ways to promote the EU in spite of the reality... :D

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

The only thing Brexiteers have to moan about is the tactics or certain remainers when it comes to accepting due process. They're the ones who lost, they're the ones who can't accept the result and they're the ones doing 99% of the whingeing. :D

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Totally disagree on everything you said here. Corbyn should not even be a bloody MP, the traitor to this country that he is. We just had an election and he lost.

As for leaving EU. Many people had made their minds on leaving years ago. You go on about the lies, yes there were lies, on BOTH sides.

If people really really wanted another shot at a vote to stay or leave, then why didn't the Liberal Democrats win ? Over 80% of the votes went for parties that respected the Brexit result, I certainly would would not say people had their heads still switched off as you put it.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Oh Gawd, here we go again , 'you lost', blah, blah , blah.
:banghead:. That's half the population, if we've any chance we have to take everyone's views on board.
With a pragmatic Philip Hammond there is hope, with that daft increasingly demented PM there isn't.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Team members will decide what constitutes rule breaking. I will not have anyone dictate Forum Policies to me or any other team member.

---------- Post added at 20:11 ---------- Previous post was at 20:01 ----------

He did not give your post a different meaning, those are your words, albeit snipped out. The post is still available in it's entirety. This is still allowed.

If my misquote rule is read properly, changing a post by adding words or sentences that was not originally said, this is what is not allowed.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

How weird it is that some of those who came out on the wrong side of both the referendum and the election seem to think that govt. policy ought to reflect their views. A good many remainers seem to think we still shouldn't leave the EU and Corbyn's cronies reckons he has a better mandate than May FGS! You couldn't make this up. :spin:

---------- Post added at 20:33 ---------- Previous post was at 20:29 ----------

Oh Gawd here we go again. :banghead:

The majority who voted decided to leave not stay. Half the population certainly didn't vote to remain. We didn't vote to leave partially or take into account what the losers wanted and if the result had been the other way around I doubt very much that you'd be here banging on about taking the losing Brexit side's views into account when deciding how to proceed. No, it would have been full steam ahead for ever more Europe and ever closer union. Blatant hypocrisy as usual.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

The morning after the vote I went on my usual walk with the dog. It was a beautiful sunny day and I actually felt that the grass was greener and the sky was bluer. I don't mind admitting that I had tears of joy in my eyes. I still get choked up about it now :)

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Yeah but that's only because you were confused, misled, blah, blah, blah... ;)

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

i went to bed thinking we had lost -too many voting for holidays and roaming charges , who will make my coffee and other stupid things but when i turned the breakfast news on the following morning i could not believe it we had won ,i also still can't get my head around the amount
of treachery and backstabbing that's followed it and the utter contempt the losing side have shown for democracy and those who chose to leave

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Yup. When they give up trying to subvert the process we'll no longer need to point it out. Simples.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

I can't believe the lack of respect directed at people who chose to vote an alternative way to them. We all need to respect one another's choices but that doesn't mean everyone suddenly changes their opinion or ceases to point out factual errors or consequences of decisions.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

I respect people who voted opposite to me, however, I do not respect people who do not respect my vote choices, we have had nothing but contempt and mockery from some folk right from the get-go. Telling us we have made an error or been misled. When neither of those things had any impact on the choices I made.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

You disagree that it's better to have a well informed, active, healthy democracy that engages fully in politics all year round and not just one day every four years and you think that the opposite is good for democracy, really?

I thought I'd said that both sides campaigns should be ashamed of themselves but to some the result is all that matters regardless of how much they degrade themselves and the democracy they claim to care so much about.

Who has said any of that here, who has belittled you or told you personally that you made a mistake? And I personally respect any one that made an informed decision whether I agreed with their decision or not, those that based their decision on anything other than that or couldn't be bothered to inform themselves, well not so much respect going towards them from me.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Er MrK has repeatedly talked in that way the Daddy and 1andrew1 has talked in less then positive terms as well, are you seriously going to say you haven't noticed the behaviour of a lot of the media if only the constant harping on about that stupid bus banner that pretty much everyone universally agree was wrong though there has been argument over it's true meaning. Leave voters have had a fair bit of rubbish thrown at them since the vote and yes some leaver's have resorted to less then helpful language in retort probably including myself on occasion.

The arrogance of some remain supporters has been very clear and it has not been pleasant pretty much like both the campaigns that were waged during the run up to the vote. A lot has been mentioned about xenophobic little englanders pulling up the draw bridge and cutting ourselves off from the world you must recognise that language as it's been used on here and in the media. Leave voters have had all their reasons lumped into two categories those who believed the bus and those who are xenophobes not a shock that many of us get a bit angry.

Where you and i do agree is on the disappointment in those on both sides who voted in total ignorance be it immigration ignorance or those who voted remain as they believed leaving meant no more roaming charges or holidays in any EU nation. There was stupidity aplenty on both sides and sadly both campaigns played to that rather then give out factual information for people that were undecided to help them make an informed choice. It was a low point in the democracy of the UK and a little embarassing but we better get used to it because campaigning on the politics of fantasy seems to be the preferred method now.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

it's nice that we all respect each other :rolleyes: but there's a couple of thousand posts that suggest the opposite :)

and now it's only democracy with specified caveat's

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

We can all interpret posts in different ways. One man's insightful humour is another's patronising sarcasm. That's a constraint of forums.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

so you wish you had voted leave :tu:

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Well, staying in the EU has meant an end to roaming charges but I do agree that political campaigning seemed to change for the worst in the Brexit campaigning.
But on the positive side of things:
1) a lot of people did take an interest in Brexit and bother to vote
2) Subsequently, a lot of younger voters who have ignored politics are now taking an interest and registering to vote
3) the fact-checking services like FullFact have surfaced which are very useful in understanding highly politicised issues.

---------- Post added at 09:43 ---------- Previous post was at 09:40 ----------

lol, no Re-grets from me. :D

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

why are romans being charged ???

so really sad then [ i like this interpreting posts in different ways idea ] ;)

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Quite.

The facts about the bus banner is that it was created by a campaign group, was not government policy (far from it with DC and GO so opposed to Brexit) and could not have been a pledge or promise because the campaign group responsible for it had no power to either issue or deliver such. It's perfectly clear to those who want to see but will forever be cited by some as a broken promise which it categorically wasn't and until Brexit is completed we won't have any idea how much money will have been saved and thereby made available for public spending at HMG's discretion on the NHS or anything else for that matter. Then and only then can the figure quoted in the banner be properly judged.

And here we go again - another leading remainer who just won't let it go.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-40547733

It's a bit rich whining on about Brexiteers taking umbrage all time when we're subject to a diet of this sort of thing on a daily basis in spite of the referendum result. The 'letting go' has to be done by those who lost the vote not the other way around.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

This is my view Andrew about both sides of the Brexit debate on here .

People are very much entitled to their views and opinions in the rules and constraints of a forum as we know whether they believe in Brexit or not as democracy involves free speech unless some have forgotten that as the last thing we want on here is patronising and superciliousness which IMO there has been too much of lately as yes disagree with someone else's opinion but don't bloody patronise or decry them because their view is different from somebody elses.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Having a view is one thing, making stuff up by claiming a bus banner was a government pledge is quite another and deserves to be ridiculed. ;)

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

I voted for Brexit because I had 'gone commando' on voting day. If I had been wearing underpants who knows what could have happened.

It was the unrestricted sense of freedom that did it for me. Were you perchance wearing tight fitting string underpants on voting day? If yes, try changing them now and see if it makes you feel differently.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Source

Bit different to Obama's "end of the queue" rubbish made at Cameron's request to bolster project fear.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Yup - which side was pulling out all the stops when it came to scaring people? They even roped in a US president to tell the UK it'd go to the back of the queue FGS. Utterly, shamefully, pathetic.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Sadly things were made up on both sides Osem as IMO the behaviour by some during the referendum and since has been nothing short of disgraceful as we would have thought grown adults could debate and have rational discussions about a good many issues but sadly that is too much to ask from our self serving politicians these days.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

if we have learned anything it's that politicians follow their own agenda once the voting is over .

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Nobody is seriously disputing that but just look at the evidence to see which side was responsible for most of the lies and scare stories. ;)

Now what we're seeing is the losing side refusing to accept it and trying every trick in the book to overturn the result. That is perfectly clear and utterly reprehensible.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Vince Cable said this morning that he can see Brexit not happening. The Libs have replaced a windbag with an old windbag.

If democracy is out of fashion in this Country, I shudder to think what might replace it.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Yes one should have accepted the result as that is democracy at work like any other election or forthcoming elections which this country is likely to face as that is the ballot box speaking and one should respect that past , present and in the future even if they don't like the end result...

---------- Post added at 10:51 ---------- Previous post was at 10:50 ----------

You are a very wise man sometimes.;)

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Yet, you have Democrats in the US constantly moaning about Russia meddling in the 2016 US Election. Yet, here we had a former Democrat US President, coming here and making an intervention by blackmail. Pretty sure this is still meddling in a foreign election/referendum by the former US Commander and Chief. It should never have been allowed.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

It was the most blatant exercise in propaganda I think I can ever recall. A truly shocking attempt to scare the public and influence the referendum perpetrated by our own government. Appalling.

I think it could well have been Obama's intervention which swung the vote so I suppose we ought to be grateful to those responsible for underestimating the will of the British people and their refusal to be bullied by smooth talking suits from over there.

If you look at what Osborne is doing now, it's perfectly obvious what his intentions were in the run up to the vote and that was to scare the public into remaining in the EU despite the abject lack of concessions made by them.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

He's not ceasing to let it go. He's analysed the situation and has said that no Brexit is a possibility. I can't see why anyone could be offended by someone talking in theoretical terms. HS2 may never happen. Heathrow airport expansion may never happen. I think all three will happen but I can't see any offence in mentioning the possibility however slim. Our forefathers fought for freedom of speech and we shouldn't ban politicians from espousing views that we personally disagree with unless they incite others to commit crimes etc.

---------- Post added at 18:51 ---------- Previous post was at 18:45 ----------

We will have to disagree on this. In my opinion, neither side were angels but the Leave campaign were guiltier with blatant factual lies whereas the Remain campaign talked about what might happen.
If the country does continue to change its mind in 2019 when the deal is announced (and currently 54% are in favour of remaining) it does put politicians in an impossible situation.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

The lies from the Leave side are being exposed by the day. 'Remains' to be seen what the public think of it all when they are substantially worse off. They won't be happy and feel cheated I predict, but sod all they can do about it by then. So long as someone 'won' and someone 'loses', that's the main thing :rolleyes:

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

What lies are being exposed??? some detail would be good.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Ooh, you could try these ones for a start

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

excerpt's from a communist blog :shocked:

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Obviously haven't done your homework there Smurf, this is from a guy who has been critical of the EU and advocated reform.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Corbett

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

I know what you mean. I was called and idiot and worse.....by remainers.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Yup. Some folks have short and highly selective memories about all sorts of things when it suits them.

A bit like all the Labour morons who think it's perfectly OK to smash up the offices of other parties, try to set fire to buildings, deface war memorials, display effigies of the PM's head on a pole. What lovely people they are eh?

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

The atmosphere on here is just increasingly mean and angry.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Think you're thinking of Tory MPs after the General Election...

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

I don't remember three quarters of those even being mentioned in the referendum campaign much less being pledges or promises you really are grasping aren't you to use anything to support your anti brexit position. Damien you'll find a lot of forums are becoming more fractured and contentious it seems to be the way things are going cable forum is far from being the worst or even in the group of worst perhaps people are just becoming more passionate in their beliefs that's the optimistic way of looking at it.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Yes but apart from them, what lies

I liked the comments, particularly from the leaveaholic who didn't realise each link was click able.

Not on here you haven't, unless things have changed since we last discussed it, which I hope isn't the case to btw

There's plenty to be angry about, the talks are desending into chaos apparently...

http://southendnewsnetwork.com/news/brexit-talks-chaos/




:D

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Not by l.:)

---------- Post added at 05:31 ---------- Previous post was at 05:29 ----------

l think you can apply that to both sides Osem.;)

---------- Post added at 05:32 ---------- Previous post was at 05:31 ----------

Perhaps a bit of meditation and yoga will calm some of them down.;)

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

i'm always calm relaxed cold and calculating ;)
unlike some who get wound up tighter than an eight day clock

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

More super Brexit news (please don't shoot the messenger, although I know you will....)
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-40530700

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Using your above comment, I guess we can ignore climate change too as it's just a prediction. Who cares about those 'so called experts' even though over 95% of them agree.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

One side being far worse than the other when it comes to scares, insults, intimidation, violent protests etc. etc. ;) When did you last see Tory supporters under a Labour govt. trashing buildings, defacing war memorials and so on? It's perfectly clear on which side the real nastiness is harboured.

---------- Post added at 11:12 ---------- Previous post was at 11:05 ----------

Logic would dictate that climate change has indisputably been ongoing since the birth of our planet and will continue until it's final demise for all sorts of reasons which are beyond our control. Humanity's contribution to climate change is quite another thing and there is quite a bit of disagreement about the significance of that when compared to those factors we can do nothing about.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Nastiness exists on the far right and far left of the political divide...

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Yes I've said that. I pointed out which side was worse and gave plenty of examples of the sort of behaviour which is not only tolerated but actually applauded by the likes of the Shadow Chancellor. Show me the last Tory who said such a thing and kept his job. ;)

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

On this point you are wrong. Over 95% of scientists agree that humans are responsible for the relatively rapid changes occurring right now.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

your argument might carry more weight if you posted links to the scientific data behind your theory .

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Happy to oblige:

https://www.skepticalscience.com/glo...termediate.htm

The above link will give a precis before allowing you to go straight to the academic paper on the subject.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

As for the 'everyone knows what they voted for' I don't think it's that simple. People voted for Brexit but there are a huge number of questions as to what happens next that cannot be answered by 'leave means leave'. One of them is what do we do about the huge number of regulatory bodies of which we're a part? Stay a member? Do our own version? Find another one?

The latest one is do we stay a member of Euratom as the government says no: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017...aty-allies-eu/ This is a treaty that allows joint research, smooth transport of nuclear materials and parts and so on.

This was never mentioned in the referendum. Even the campaign manager of Leave is joining those in the nuclear industry and scientists in thinking this is stupid.

https://twitter.com/odysseanproject/...54037956718593

And this the problem with the 'Brexit means Brexit' line and the 'we know what we voted for' response to any concerns about any approach in how we leave. We're deciding the future of our membership in a pan-European nuclear agreement based on a 52%-48% answer to a question which had little to do with how we manage nuclear research. So at the moment we're pulling out of a working agreement against the advice of almost everyone connected to the industry because Brexit means Brexit.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

There are quite a number of parallels. Are you happy to stand by your post regarding predictions? Are experts generally wrong in your considered opinion?

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

You could say that about voting for anything. When we vote for a govt. we don't know what we're going to get do we? We don't know whether they'll honour their promises, perform admirably or mess up the entire economy and we don't get a chance to change it for 5 years. In 2010 lots of people voted thinking there'd be no student fee increases and look what happened to that. When Brexit is complete I have no doubt that whatever mutually important agreements, understandings or whatever which are required in areas such as this with the EU will be reinstated in one form or another.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

You obviously don't know me well. I always stand by everything I post, including instructions to remain on topic. I suggest you follow them.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Looking at thier past record YES!

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

I am staying on topic. :)

So do you feel it is correct that we should dismiss all predictions by 'experts'? Especially since many of these people have spent much of their careers working in their respective fields? If a majority of reports surrounding Brexit suggest that the outcome will only make us poorer we should simply ignore it because it is a 'prediction'?

I am only aware of one study which showed a net gain for the UK in event of Brexit, and that specific report has been wholeheartedly debunked in recent months.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Absolutely. No expert has worked in the field of leaving the EU and I don't know how many times I can make myself more clearer. I stand by my post(s)!

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Brexit isn't a science and who's to say where we or they will be a few years downs the line. There are plenty of very serious problems simmering away within the EU that have yet to come to a head. How does anyone know how badly they'll affect the UK whether inside the EU or not? How many financial experts predicted the problems in 2007/8? Most of the so called experts may have been opposed to Brexit but the majority decided the other way and that's all that matters now. What we didn't vote for is an outcome which people would try to change after the event. It doesn't take an expert to see that.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

l accepted the Brexit result pure and simple but one cannot expect people not to express their opinions and views like others do on here.:)

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Exactly!

I am no expert but the unbalance of the whole EU Economics, can only lead to a financial catastrophe. Only 10 out of 28 Countries paying in substantially more than they get back, the rest piggy backing, others requiring more bailouts, like Greece for example. I don't need to be an expert to say, I made my right to choice to vote leave. #StillNoRegrets

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Expressing opinions and trying to change the result are very different things. ;)

Remainers are welcome to carry on telling us how wrong it all is until the cows come home. They just won't be EU cows... :D

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

So far you appear to be trying to discuss "Experts" and if they should be believed or not other than Brexit which is what this thread is about.

You mention a report that has been debunked yet don't provide a link to it. Don't expect forum members to do the research for you. If you want to discuss a report about the impact of Brexit then link to it.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

They obviously don't know the meaning of democracy then.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Academics model things all the time. Brexit is effectively an amalgam of some of these models. Should we just discard these as all being wrong? Thus far they are actually proving right. The game theorists alone are looking pretty spot on which is why Varoufakis work is often looked to (and I definitely don't share his politics, but I do respect his academic work, in which he has been a leader in the thinking).

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

I think the world accepts Academics or that E = MC². However, Brexit is not something than can be worked out in simple terms. Nobody can be an expert in brexit.

The Australian PM has just said in a Press conference in Downing Street that, Australia has had uninterrupted growth in Free Market Trade for 26 years! If they can prosper, so can we and we can the ditch the corrupted entity, the EU once and for all!

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

It looks like I have done more research than most then! Regardless, happy to oblige. Now I need to get back to my real day job. :)

https://blogs.sussex.ac.uk/uktpo/201...percent/#_ftn2

---------- Post added at 13:34 ---------- Previous post was at 13:31 ----------

What a ridiculous statement to make. Of course you can model things that have not taken place. These same models can be remarkably accurate. This is what science and economic science is all about!

Also what has Australia got to do with the price of fish? It's an apples and oranges comparison with two vastly different economies. Whilst the cultural similarities are undeniable, the countries overall operate very differently and are on totally different scales (large country, small population, etc, etc ,etc).

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Complete rubbish. Noone can model brexit!

I totally disagree and I repeat, noone is an expert on Brexit. Noone knows what amount of trade deals we can get, noone knows how much we could actually prosper by and on our OWN terms.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

If you want to bury your head in the sand, go for it. Modelling is definitely possible and done on all manor of different topics. Obviously the more variables you can account for, the better the model.

I'd also suggest you read up on game theory and try and at least have an appreciation for how blocs work and why they are advantageous to join. I've already mentioned one of the leering academics in this field, so it's definitely worth starting there.

At the end of the day, whilst I don't accept Brexit is the right way forward, I do believe it will happen. When you end up substantially poorer, please don't complain to those whom did our homework.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

My suggestion is, don't suggest to me anything that involves reading theory on misery and false doom and gloom. :zzz:

My mind was made up, based on years of failures already experienced in the EU and the corruption that exists within it and the unbalanced economics of the entire group, staying in a corrupted mess, makes absolutely no sense and I am glad and will always be glad with my vote that contributed the right result.

Has it sunk in yet that I always stand by my posts ?

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Er, in case you hadn't noticed, the predictions of what would happen immediately after a 'leave' vote have been widely astray, and the economy has done better than many on the remain side thought.

Experts have been proved wrong before, and if you believe everything they say, you are a little gullible, I have to mention.

I don"t see why so many remainers think that trading with the rest of the world is such a bad thing, and also why some of them believe that our trade with the EU would dry up when we leave. That isn't going to happen!

---------- Post added at 16:49 ---------- Previous post was at 16:43 ----------

I wonder what a model would say about the future UK economy if EU trade remained broadly the same, with no tariffs, and the UK was able to agree respectable trade deals with the other major economies of the world?

---------- Post added at 16:51 ---------- Previous post was at 16:49 ----------

How is trying to change a democratic vote democratic, Den? Or did I misunderstand your comment?

:confused:

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

You misunderstood it OB as even though l did not vote for Brexit we should respect the democratic vote.

That does not stop anybody having a opinion and a view though as free speech is part of democracy as well as some seem to have forgotten that on here...;)

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

You can "model" pretty much anything, but that doesnt mean the model is actually useful or right.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Correct. They don't. ;)

---------- Post added at 17:29 ---------- Previous post was at 17:25 ----------

Don't fret. We won't be complaining but we might remind you how much worse off we'd have been inside the EU when it finally implodes.

:D

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Care to explain this then?

So much for experts!

Link

Getting back to Brexit and economic forecasts by "experts" there are several models which can be used to predict an outcome.

You have to balance which model was used to get the result that the commissioning party wanted. You can use statistics to predict anything you want.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Except that an opinion that says the vote was wrong so we'll have another one, and then the best of three, is not being democratic!

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Agreed if anyone had actually said that. They haven't.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

I was just explaining the way the remainers seem to want to operate. Of course, they will not actually say it, but try to foil Brexit, they will.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Although that prospect does seem less likely than it did even a year ago.

Part of the problem with science stories in the press is they report findings of individual studies as if they're breakthroughs. There have been plenty of health stories ("Red Wine is good for you!") that are based on shaky or incomplete research that get overpromoted by a excitable press - also see every 'miracle' cancer cure - and then later found to be baseless leading to sneering from those very papers which promoted it in the first place.

But still they go on and because of these experts we know about the risk of smoking, we have dramatically reduced cancer rates and even wiped out diseases. It just takes time, false starts and very smart people.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

Crikey in your world free speech would be frowned upon unless it agrees with your view but l can assure you until l have my last breath OB l won't be short of a opinion or two whether people like it or not...

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

In fairness, May's government has ignored every industry representation (except tactically underwriting some guarantees to Nissan) so it just seems to have treated the nuclear industry the same way it would financial services, etc. This is coming back to bite it. The influential Evening Standard has a headline piece today warning that leaving Euratom could threaten the supply of vital imported radioactive isotopes used to treat cancer patients and that some Tory MPs are rebelling over this.
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/re...-a3584076.html

I think you will have a very hard job convincing people that they didn't know what they voted for when they voted leave, Damien although your evidence supports this. The Aaron Banks cue card reply will say the same applies to voting Remain.

Re: Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !
 

A small minority but not l or many other remainers.