Re: Brexit discussion
 

Doesn't worry me OB, don't eat any meat ;)

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Or better still, completely ignore the bull crap posted in the guardian. :)

---------- Post added at 11:33 ---------- Previous post was at 11:33 ----------

Neither do I, we do have something in common. :erm:

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Ah, that's nice Mick ! There's hope for you yet :)

Re: Brexit discussion
 

True. Belonging to the EU, you're never really sure if you are eating horse.

---------- Post added at 12:14 ---------- Previous post was at 12:12 ----------

You don't eat meat, Mick? And there's me thinking you ate cow pie for breakfast!

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Actually my Dad said the me when he was younger several local outlets sold pies with horse in even though they would not admit to it and in the 1930's it was eaten far more widely in the UK and l myself have tasted it as it tends to taste a bit like a rump steak IMO.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

If you eat meat, don't see what peoples problem with horse is ? Or dog, cat, rat ? All the same...

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Yes I've been sucked in, I only spend part of my working week in hospitals and am a member of the London ambulance trust. A good friend of mines son works for a private ambulance company, he's all but a paramedic and is one of the best paid front line staff, he's on 10 pounds an hour, he's colleagues are mainly on less and to be frank mostly aren't even worth that, this was emphasized a while back when he had to tell another crew that their patient had actually died whilst they were quing at hospital without them realising, they agreed she was " very very ill". I brought this up at the future of the ambulance service meeting at st Thomas hospital for the trust amongst many other horror stories staff had told me and it did cause some shock in the room before it turned into the usual snake oil sale of shysters trying to flog their wares and networking. Yes I'm the one who has been sucked in, imo we are in a race to the bottom and the best advice I can give to anyone in London is don't get ill.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

That is sad to hear, but the NHS has its fair share of horror stories.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

More than half of British adults think the government is doing a poor job in Brexit negotiations.

https://uk.kantar.com/public-opinion...rexit-britain/

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Well even a lot of Brexiters think they are doing a crap job on negotiations; if you can call them that, as we've given the EU most of what they wanted. The trouble is our Govt. is more focused on who can grab power when St. Theresa falls off her perch.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Well, you've said that before, Mr K, but I will remind you again that the EU did not get the £100bn they wanted and they've accepted less than half of that. Judging by Labour's comments during the Phase I talks, they would have capitulated.

The only reason a lot of the public are not confident the negotiations are going well is because they are given minimal information by the government. This is necessary because of the way the EU conducts itself.

What most people do not understand is that the EU needs us and as time passes, they will start to get anxious about doing a deal. When that time comes, the government will be ready to lay more cards on the table.

The government is playing the long game, and with good reason.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

You can always rely on Mr K, getting things wrong and inserting his own miserable and incorrect assertions and narrative in to the mix. It’s just a daily routine of his, shout down Brexit, shout down President Trump, rinse, repeat. :zzz:

Re: Brexit discussion
 

I don't know about you but my confidence regarding brexit has never been higher after this announcement

It's a shame in some ways though as I've always fancied myself as a bit of a road warrior

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-43120277

Re: Brexit discussion
 

I sometimes worry about how all those countries that don't belong to the EU manage! :D

Re: Brexit discussion
 

When you're being assured that we won't become a dystopian wasteland you get the feeling they're lowering expectations really.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Of course they are not. He's just addressing all those negative prophets of doom who seem to think that the world is about to come to an end.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Addressing them by being even more doom laden, unless he thinks the false prophets believe it'll be worse than said dystopian wasteland

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Might be something to do with not being ripped off by a sky high membership fee perhaps? ;)

Re: Brexit discussion
 

That's twisting it a bit, isn't it? Perhaps you'd like to read the comment again. He's saying what will not happen!

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Desperate stuff designed to reassure the declining leave vote it won't be so bad.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

And on what Data are you using to state the Brexit vote is in decline?

Re: Brexit discussion
 

It's been previously discussed on here so I won't go over old ground. Anyone wishing to see them can use the forum's search tools.
The speech as reported doesn't seem the great vision I was hoping for. I will be interested to read it in more depth later before judging fully.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Personally Andrew, I'd rather watch paint dry than read a David Davis speech. Brexit will be not quite as bad as the apocalypse, sounds super to me ! The guy has vision, got to give him that.

Meanwhile in the Torygraph money section desperate wealthy pensioners are asking how they can 'Brexit proof' their investments. Not very confident are they ?

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Don't shrug off your statement as though it is fact, when it is not and no it has not been discussed on here of any official data of any kind, no official data exists of the leave vote being in decline.

The leave vote is not in decline at all and I can say that because that was the end result on June 23rd referendum, no other large scale referendum has took place to say the leave vote is in decline. It is just Remainer fantasy to say it is in decline, so do not state something as fact when it is not and you have no idea.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

If you want to revisit the debate about the poll then you're welcome to. I doubt your views won't have altered on your beliefs in representative sample sizes, the unbias of polling organisations so we'd only go round in circles. ;)

Re: Brexit discussion
 

:p:Here you go Mick, a nice graph to keep you happy ;)

Doubtless it's all lies by the liberal lefties...

https://www.cableforum.uk/images/local/2018/02/16.png

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Now come on, we all know that as far as these polls go they ask a certain amount of people and then discard half of the results they don't like.

Did people really believe that 9 out of 10 cats preferred whiskas, or that every family had 2.4 children?

Polls and statistical analysis are flawed, tell me another . . . .

Re: Brexit discussion
 

l agree statistics and polls can be twisted and massaged to suit ones political agenda as governments massage statistics all the time in just cherry picking one bit that suits their agenda and not mentioning the other 99 bits that don't suit their agenda.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

That's why polling companies publish their questions, underlying data and methodologies.

All polling isn't equal. A poll commissioned by a company to help sell a product is obviously more suspect than a poll commissioned by The Times newspaper who publish the same poll every month irrespective of the result.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

And he's setting the bar low, really low, I thought it was a joke when I first heard it

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Sorry, but that is a ridiculous argument. He was answering those remoaners who were painting this picture.

As you well know.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

It looks like the Dutch are now preparing for a hard Brexit by recruiting more customs officers - https://news.sky.com/story/dutch-act...he-uk-11258568

In other news, 11 months after invoking Article 50, the Prime Minister is hosting a summit to thrash out the UK Brexit negotiating position - http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...it-summit.html

Note, I do not endorse the Daily Mail, I thinks it’s an awful paper but I thought it might be more palatable than other news sources

Re: Brexit discussion
 

JC is now putting pressure on the Government with his statement that the UK must have a customs union with the EU. He's playing Brexit quite shrewdly, following the public mood as it moves away from Brexit but not alienating the many leavers in his party and beyond.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

What if the majority of us want to live in a mad max dystopian wasteland, why won't that man respect the will of the people. Let me guess brexit won't cause this future outcome but electing Corbyn will, let me paint a picture neither outcome will make that much difference to the vast majority of us, we'll just plod along as before brexit or before Jez or before Trump or before who or what ever.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

I think DD was throwing a bone to the Brextremists before telling them that regulatory alignment will pretty much continue as the world operates to increasingly global standards.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Brextremists. Look away!
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...-a8220976.html

Re: Brexit discussion
 

For once l agree with the government.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

It's almost as if we don't want to leave...

We triggered article 50 and chose the date. No point in begging for a reprieve now.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Press now reporting no leave date put into transition request from the UK!
https://www.ft.com/content/a613ac10-...c-25c814761640

---------- Post added at 15:54 ---------- Previous post was at 15:14 ----------

In other news, rumours abound that Unilever will consoilidate its HQ in the Netherlands, attributed to Brexit uncertainty but let's see what the company says first.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

yawn
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aFW6yUlgGdI

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Re: Brexit discussion
 

I'm not concerned about increasing the transition period. It is, after all, an implementation period, and it will take as long as it takes.

However, what the government should be pressing for is a freeze in those EU laws that continue to apply to us during that time (or alternatively a right of veto on new EU legislation) and we should have the right to forge our own trade deals as well.

I would be flexible on freedom of movement during that period, although some may not be happy with that.

---------- Post added at 19:04 ---------- Previous post was at 19:02 ----------

That's just the remoaners having another hissy fit.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Definitely some ‘can kicking’ there... Tow possible reasons spring to mind - the first is that would we won’t have a deal by the end of 2020 despite Liam Fox saying this one be one of the ‘easiest in human history’.

The second reason is that we have a general election in 2022. If things go pear shaped or look bad at the end of 2020, it will be some tough spinning to make the government look good in the following year or so.

Personally, I think it’s a bit from column a and a bit from column b

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Nothing from the 5th column then? ;)

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Indeed, another toy/pram moment. Easily ignored. ;)

Re: Brexit discussion
 

How long a 'transition' period would you be ok with 1 year, 2 years, 20 years ? All to do with the next election and trying to postpone the Brexit fallout.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Well, they ARE Remainers! Anti-Brexit battlebus gets STUCK on streets of London as activists launch campaign to stop Britain leaving EU

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...#ixzz57mafTeKT
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

Re: Brexit discussion
 

It's been banned from parking in Oxford to :D

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england...shire-43141927

Not sure what it is with the bus obsession, the strong and stable one blew over, the brexit one has become so much of a stick to beat the cause with Nigel says they shouldn't have used it and the best one of all imo saying we send the BBC 71 million a week, let's fund our NHS with it instead never left Twitter

Re: Brexit discussion
 

It's as long as it takes to actually set up the arrangements to avoid disruption. 1-3 years I would be happy with to avoid such disruption, but I wouldn't have thought any more would be justified.

This process needs to be done and dusted by the next election but the sooner the better.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Another remoaner fox, shot. :)

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Depends who you believe, the Sun , and very biased 'migration watch' or the Office for National Statistics.

https://www.cableforum.uk/images/local/2018/02/13.jpg

they would appear to back up the recruitment crisis the NHS is having.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Interestingly, the cap on skilled non-EU immigration (Tier 2 visas) has been hit for the last three months. About a third of Tier 2 visas go to staff heading for the NHS. These will most likely be doctors due to the £50k minimum wage limit now - http://uk.businessinsider.com/nhs-st...a-rules-2018-2

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Yes, spot on. I don't know why people paste stuff from The Sun unless it's on sport or celebrity gossip.

Meanwhile, it's looking closer to a five-year transition stage. The FT states this is the case because:
1) Impossible to see a new UK-EU trade agreement being completed by 2021 as the inclusion of services makes it more complex than anything that's gone before.
2) Building new customs infrastructure at the channel ports will take five years
3) Ministers are not taking decisions now. Last August, the Government laid out two alternative customs options for trade with the EU. Is still hasn't decided which to adopt. Similarly, the Government's white paper on immigration has been delayed to this Autmn.

https://www.ft.com/content/3fd137d6-...6-4a6390addb44

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Isn't that the definition of "Having your cake and eating it"?

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Cliff edge here we come hahaha!!!!

Re: Brexit discussion
 

OK, credit where it's due. The cabinet has signed up to a common Brexit negotiating position. And what happens?

EU boss Donald Tusk responds https://news.sky.com/story/irish-pm-...rexit-11263689

Rebels press May to stay in customs union
https://www.ft.com/content/7cdae51c-...c-25c814761640

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Well, once we have left the EU, the transition (or implementation) agreement would simply be the instrument to smooth the change. This will benefit both UK and EU businesses.

---------- Post added at 11:56 ---------- Previous post was at 11:53 ----------

I don't think we need be too concerned about the EU negotiating stance at this stage of the negotiations. You present this as evidence that a deal cannot be done! I don't buy that at all. A deal will be done because it will benefit both sides.

Those arguing that we should remain in the customs union still don't seem to appreciate that this would prevent us from forging our own trade deals. Brexit won't work without the ability to do this, so Anna and Chuka's contention that we should actually go for that is a wrecking tactic. Brexit while remaining in the Customs Union would be ruinous for us.

Some sort of agreement on customs arrangements is fair enough, but not an agreement that prevents trade deals, which is the key to a successful Brexit.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

A customs union or whatever it's called will be necessary to adhere to the Irish peace settlement or Ireland could veto any deal. Looking like Bino; Brexit in name only or a hard Brexit. You can't have your cake and eat it or every country would want this option, it's not a hard one for Theresa to understand and I think she does.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

You are confusing the customs agreement solution with that of remaining in the customs union.

You do appear to have bought the EU's aggressive stance. It's just a negotiating tactic.

We are leaving the EU with a trade and services deal, Andrew, enshrined in an overall agreed position on customs arrangement.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

If only it was that simple. All 27 EU Governments have to agree to the deal. It only takes one to veto and we are stuck out. 40+% of our trade will never, ever be replaced with trade deals with Argentina, the Cayman Islands or wherever you are wanting to strike deals with.

You don't shut out your biggest customer - it's simple business and economics. Our business is currently trying to work on its five year forecasts - we cannot get past next year at the moment. We are seeing businesses refusing to commit to anything past the next year. Yesterday, I had the unpleasant task of making 9 people redundant as a result. I have another 10 to follow next week. That is is just me - I have colleague who are telling me similar situations. These are high quality, highly paid jobs. So yeah, they may be able to find jobs picking fruit or whatever but it is not quite the same.

So if you were one of those 27 Governments and someone came to you and said we would like frictionless trade on motor vehicles because its suits us both - if you are in the Czech Republic where all your cars are made either there or in Germany would you say yeah lets go for that. But we get through that so we move on to dairy products and we say we don't want to trade in that because we want to protect our own fathers - the French Government says well sorry - you can't have the cars then.

And so it goes on and on and on.

I think some people really need to wake up and take the caffine smelling test. The EU have been consistent - you can't have your cake and eat it. We do need them more than they need us - and no matter how much you convince yourself otherwise by saying it over and over again - when you look at the cold bare facts, when you look at people being put out of work because of the uncertainly, when you look at what is happening away from the rhetoric and bull that comes out of those who will benefit from watering down of regulation, employment rights and everything else, then you realise this is real and real people's lifes are being affected.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Leaving the EU does NOT mean we won't be trading with the EU so your supposition that suddenly we'll have 40% less trade is just not valid.:rolleyes:

Re: Brexit discussion
 

I never said that. I said you will never replace the 40+% trade. Different. We will of course trade, but on different conditions, with barriers in place that make it very difficult and much more expensive (tariffs, border costs, extra administatrion costs etc). The supposition is that we can replace this with free trade from other countries in a land far, far away.

But I go back to my main point - what is happening now and something has to happen quickly. March 2019 to come out with a last minute deal is no good to business. It will takes years to recover from that.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Germany - I mean the EU just wants to control everything that happens especially with those in the EU. It's the 21st century we need to move on from the restrictions of paying into an old boys club the EU needs to open up to the world for trade and support all not just those that have a few quid to throw around.

We talk about humanitarian crisis in certain countries then you look at the top players in the EU says it all really.

We will be much better off out and stop listening to the crap that comes across from over the border.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

My God, Bircho, how on Earth, as a businessman, can you not see beyond this blinkered view?

You talk about Argentina and the Caymen Islands! What about the US, India, China, Australia and the other big players?

Take your blinkers off and look at the opportunities!

That's what businessmen/women do, right?

And by the way, those other EU countries want an agreement with the UK, too. Don't get sucked into Barnier's rhetoric!

Re: Brexit discussion
 

I also said some other country in a land far far away. But go on then, I'll bite. You tell me, and those people now being put out of work, how logistically deals with US, China, India and that economic powerhouse Australia will replace the deals we currently have in the next couple of years or so. And be realistic and take out the theoretical claptrap because that is all we have had for the last 2 years and we are still no further on.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Business people know that Brexit just adds to costs and red tape. The countries you mention like China, US and India are the epitome of protectionism. Good luck any country signing a free trade deal with those three, it won't happen. Owning an airline operating in the US? Forget it, US shareholders have to control the company. Building a car factory in China? Foreign companies have to set up a joint venture with a local company; imported cars have massive import taxes on them.

---------- Post added at 09:51 ---------- Previous post was at 09:47 ----------

Spain wants an agreement with the UK - joint management of Gibraltar’s airport. No wonder the residents of Gibraltar voted to remain.
https://www.ft.com/content/907fb2d8-...6-4a6390addb44

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Spain go jump off The Rock, in Gibraltar. If it thinks it can take or seize power of another countries port. NO DEAL.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

You can call the government's objectives claptrap if you want to, but you are using the same old wrecking arguments we have been hearing for the last two years from remainers.

You may not believe that the government will get a deal with the EU and you point out that all has been words or 'claptrap' as you put it. And yet, within a year, you will be proved wrong. The UK will get a good deal (it's in the interests of both sides) and on top of that, we will be free to negotiate our own trade deals.

So not only will we still have pretty much the same ability to export to the EU without tariffs and with an agreement on the customs arrangements (outside the existing Customs Union), but the trade deals we want with other countries will be on top of that.

The leaders of some prominent EU countries have been voicing concern about Barnier's hard line approach, and as we near the deadline, he will have some climbing down to do from his high perch.

---------- Post added at 14:27 ---------- Previous post was at 14:22 ----------

And how is that, Andrew? They don't know what the deal is yet! :p:

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Bookmarked.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Nails it! We'll be back on worse terms I suspect.
https://www.ft.com/content/0faac65e-...a-4574d7dabfb6

Re: Brexit discussion
 

I suppose that kind of talk appeals to a certain mindset. It would be good to have a more serious discussion.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Repeating the names of protectionist countries like China, the USA and India is not a serious debate.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Neither is rehashing the same old crap & fear mongering BS from the Anti-Brexit media.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

of course the Brextremist media never tell lies

Re: Brexit discussion
 

I wouldn’t know I don’t read/watch it/them.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Clearly, it doesn't suit your argument to talk about trade deals with these countries. I understand, Andrew, it must be a difficult position for you to maintain. :hugs:

Re: Brexit discussion
 

the point is OB they are protectionist countries and a deal will suit them more than us it not be as easy as Brextremists say it will be

Re: Brexit discussion
 

If you took that defeatest view every time you had an opportunity you'd never get anywhere, Dave.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

there protectionist countries OB they not suddenly gonna change just for UK are they be realist man

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Countries most likely to sign trade deals are small developed countries. Developing countries like China and India don't want their industries and services to face well-developed competition. China even bans Facebook and Google so free trade is a long way down its list of priorities. The US is traditionally protectionist in many ways and more so under Trump.

---------- Post added at 23:59 ---------- Previous post was at 23:33 ----------

Boris's apparent lack of honouring his commitments is not going down well in Ireland!
https://www.independent.ie/irish-new...-36651385.html

Matters got off to a bad start on Radio 4 earlier in the day when he compared the border issue in Ireland to crossing between London boroughs, forcing Theresa May to come to his rescue.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Have you forgotten the Chinese visit already, Dave?

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...e-post-brexit/

Donald Trump is anxious to strike a deal with the UK and......wait! No amount of good news will stop all this negativity. I guess we'll just have to wait and you'll see for yourself!

Protectionism will obviously rear its ugly head, but there are plenty of areas to exploit that will be mutually beneficial. Financial service agreements with China are particularly attractive for us.

---------- Post added at 10:46 ---------- Previous post was at 09:10 ----------

I don't believe that the US is a small developed country and you conveniently forget that Donald Trump has an affinity for the UK and has promised us a trade deal.

Theresa May has received some positive vibes from China and has managed to get some good commitments from them. Australia and New Zealand want a trade deal and India too looks promising.

All of this will add to the trade we currently have with the EU and other countries, so why you and other EU protagonists are so down on the idea of leaving the EU is hard to fathom. It's simply betraying an utterly defeatist mentality that assumes the worst possible outcome in the new relationship with the EU and the countries outside the EU blocking our every move to arrive at trade deals that would be of benefit to us.

You will be proved wrong on this, Andrew. This dystopian view you have of our future is worthy of a fantasy novel.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Who needs to read fantasy novels and fiction, when there is pages of the failed doom and gloom predictions, right here on this forum, and people can read it for free....

Re: Brexit discussion
 

You could also call it democracy and free speech which we should be proud to have in this country.:)

Re: Brexit discussion
 

The Government and the EU has proposed that Northern Ireland will stay in the Customs Union in the event of no deal

Re: Brexit discussion
 

That's really hilarious given the attempt by many to thwart the democratic result that was decided.... by trying to demand another referendum. ;)

Re: Brexit discussion
 

No one has said that. The rest of your statement is just pure fantasy island, as divorced from reality as Claire Foy is divorced from Stephen Campbell Moore.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

That's an EU proposal that has been rejected by May and the DUP out of hand.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

My mistake. I had read it as the terms of the beginning of the deal. :tu:

Re: Brexit discussion
 

By a few l would say as most have accepted the Brexit result but that does not mean people should accept any old Brexit agreement willy nilly as people want a agreement suitable for all the country and not just for some and a agreement that makes us prosper and not end up in the poorhouse for the next 10 years.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

There is no such thing as 'any old brexit agreement' The choices on the ballot paper were clear, leave or stay, not stay half in, half out.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

What Brexit actually means, could mean a wide range of things depending on what's agreed. There is a strong argument for the people to have a say on the agreement if they ever come up with one. That isn't redoing the Brexit vote, it'd be a totally separate and more important question.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

And that is one of the points l was making as thus so far no agreement is in sight or likely to be the way talks are progressing as the government can't even form a united front on many issues.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

But then you would just want another vote when that didn't go your way .

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Er, I think that is precisely what the government is proposing! It's Labour's current ruse that would end up making everyone poorer, as most of their policies would.

A Brexit with a customs union would be the worst possible outcome. That would mean we couldn't forge our own trade deals, which is the whole point of Brexit, and we would also end up making a financial contribution to boot! Poorer for us on two counts.

Brexit means Brexit. Not a half hearted attempt to make it look as though you're listening to the people and not succeeding.

---------- Post added at 15:47 ---------- Previous post was at 15:45 ----------

Nobody mentioned shutting down debate or letting people have their say, Den.

---------- Post added at 15:49 ---------- Previous post was at 15:47 ----------

'Countries most likely to sign trade deals are small developed countries.'

Who said that? Oh, look, you did!

As for Fantasy Island, I think that is where you are right now, Andrew, given your unrelenting negativity and clutching at straws with every left wing or anti-Brexit view you can muster. You can tell yourself you are right if you like, but you are in for a big disappointment before much longer. We are getting out of the EU, single market and customs union. That's all there is to know at the moment.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

:D :D which means what exactly??

No one knows. Even the govt,. is still having meetings/arguments with itself to try and find out. No wonder the EU is confused by our negotiating position, our ministers are saying different things on different days !

Re: Brexit discussion
 

but the Brextremists will tell you that's all the EU's fault our government don't know what it wants :D:D:D

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Perhaps you need to listen to a former prime minister of the Conservative party as he thinks the prime minister’s has a very “unrealistic” Brexit strategy and one that is doomed to failure if it continues on its present course..

https://www.ft.com/content/3a136f9a-...a-43db76e69936

http://www.cityam.com/281428/john-ma...ferendum-table

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...ndum?CMP=fb_gu

Re: Brexit discussion
 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qyAMBd_AC_Q

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OyU8qmzGsEg

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Not as good as the Maggie one IMO.;)

Re: Brexit discussion
 

I'd rather not. Listening to John Major is nauseating at best. John Major never even gave people a vote or a choice when it came to the signing of the Maastricht Treaty in February 1992. The guy is an utter bloody hypocrite.