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-   -   Russia has invaded Ukraine (https://www.cableforum.uk/board/showthread.php?t=33710768)

Paul 28-02-2025 22:06

Re: Russia has invaded Ukraine
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pierre (Post 36192082)
But why should Russia have to accept it when the USA wouldn’t?

I didn’t bring it up, Gavin did. But it’s a valid point.

Of course its not valid. Russia already accepted it - for 18 years.
Not to mention you dont need to be on the border to aim missiles anymore.
Its 2025, not 1962.

jfman 28-02-2025 22:09

Re: Russia has invaded Ukraine
 
Bad timing for Zelensky to be out the country having upset the world’s pre-eminent supplier of regime change.

Chris 28-02-2025 22:10

Re: Russia has invaded Ukraine
 
Well, it’s on the news at length now.

As I said: this is what happens when a narcissist realises he can’t control you.

Pierre 28-02-2025 22:23

Re: Russia has invaded Ukraine
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul (Post 36192083)
Of course its not valid. Russia already accepted it - for 18 years.
Not to mention you dont need to be on the border to aim missiles anymore.
Its 2025, not 1962.

Of course it’s valid, just because it has happened doesn’t mean you accept it.

Ask any beaten wife.

Russia had no choice but to accept it, it happened, and Geo politics were much different at the time.

1andrew1 28-02-2025 22:25

Re: Russia has invaded Ukraine
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gavin78 (Post 36192076)
Trump is right in one way he's brought Russia to the table. What comes of that I don't know.

But you have to ask trump this, when Russia installed nukes in Cuba it was nearly WW3 then so how is it any different now.

Trump and the USA need to get a grip

Ukraine did have nuclear weapons until the 1994 Budapest Agreement. Ukraine got rid of rid of its nuclear weapons in return for Russia, France, the UK and US guaranteeing its borders. An agreement breached by Russia in 2014 when it invaded Crimea.

Chris 28-02-2025 22:26

Re: Russia has invaded Ukraine
 
It is quite likely Ukraine could re-acquire the ability to make a nuclear warhead without too much difficulty. And after today it has to be more likely that they will.

ianch99 28-02-2025 22:26

Re: Russia has invaded Ukraine
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul (Post 36192080)
They already did, before 2022 (Estonia & Latvia, joined in 2004).
Since 2023 Finland has also joined in, directly due to Putins actions.

Very true. You have to be pretty dim not to get this. Pointing out the obvious, but if Russia had taken Ukraine 3 years ago and made it part of Russia, guess who would be on its new border?

Chris 28-02-2025 22:27

Re: Russia has invaded Ukraine
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by jfman (Post 36192084)
Bad timing for Zelensky to be out the country having upset the world’s pre-eminent supplier of regime change.

Krasnov’s handler is already trying to effect regime change, without success, despite 3 years of trying.

Pierre 28-02-2025 22:33

Re: Russia has invaded Ukraine
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris (Post 36192088)
It is quite likely Ukraine could re-acquire the ability to make a nuclear warhead without too much difficulty. And after today it has to be more likely that they will.

It’s not “likely” at all, no idea what you’re basing that assertion on.

---------- Post added at 22:33 ---------- Previous post was at 22:32 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1andrew1 (Post 36192087)
Ukraine did have nuclear weapons until the 1994 Budapest Agreement. Ukraine got rid of rid of its nuclear weapons in return for Russia, France, the UK and US guaranteeing its borders. An agreement breached by Russia in 2014 when it invaded Crimea.

Wasn’t it also breached by France, U.K. and the US?

Chris 28-02-2025 22:38

Re: Russia has invaded Ukraine
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pierre (Post 36192092)
It’s not “likely” at all, no idea what you’re basing that assertion on.

The fact that nobody with any serious qualification to opine on it doubts that they can do it. They have the fissile material and the expertise.

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/world...ay/ar-AA1tD3qs

https://www.iiss.org/online-analysis...n-for-ukraine/

The calculus until now has been whether it is politically too costly for them to do so. Up til now the consensus has been that it would be too costly. The political calculus is clearly now changing.

Pierre 28-02-2025 22:50

Re: Russia has invaded Ukraine
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris (Post 36192096)
and the expertise.

What are you basing that on?

The Soviet era was 36 years ago. I seriously doubt they have the skills to build new war heads.


Btw, I’m doubtful Russia can as well.

Chris 28-02-2025 22:54

Re: Russia has invaded Ukraine
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pierre (Post 36192100)
What are you basing that on?

The analyst opinion I generously provided you links for ;)

Pierre 28-02-2025 23:00

Re: Russia has invaded Ukraine
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris (Post 36192101)
The analyst opinion I generously provided you links for ;)

Oh those that’ said it’s highly unlikely to happen,…….those two.

Chris 28-02-2025 23:06

Re: Russia has invaded Ukraine
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pierre (Post 36192103)
Oh those that’ said it’s highly unlikely to happen,…….those two.

Yes, those.

To repeat, with emphasis:

nobody with any serious qualification to opine on it doubts that they can do it. They have the fissile material and the expertise.

The calculus until now has been whether it is politically too costly for them to do so. Up til now the consensus has been that it would be too costly. The political calculus is clearly now changing.

“Unlikely to happen” is because of the political cost, not the technical challenge. The political calculus is changing.

Hugh 01-03-2025 00:20

Re: Russia has invaded Ukraine
 
If people are siding with a person who assassinates his opponents in their own country, fixes internal elections to maintain power, invades other countries and murders prisoners-of-war and kidnaps children, they may wish to re-evaluate their life choices…


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