Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 36046914)

Wow! How to twist someone's words!

Quite how you converted "devolution is about the heart" to "motivation for the Scots is hatred of the English" says more about you than the Scots.

Just like you want the UK to be Sovereign from the EU, couldn't some Scots want to be Sovereign from the UK, without it involving hatred (I'm a Scot, I don't hate the English, and I don't support Devolution).

Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 36046914)

Wow! How to twist someone's words!

Quite how you converted "devolution is about the heart" to "motivation for the Scots is hatred of the English" says more about you than the Scots.

Just like you want the UK to be Sovereign from the EU, couldn't some Scots want to be Sovereign from the UK, without it involving hatred (I'm a Scot, I don't hate the English, and I don't support Devolution).

Originally Posted by Mad Max (Post 36046944)

Same here, and I don't believe that most English people think that Scottish people hate them.

Originally Posted by denphone (Post 36046949)

We have had several Scottish friends over the years and they are excellent company even though we might disagree on a few things.

Originally Posted by OLD BOY (Post 36046941)

Be honest, Hugh. You don't like me much. Maybe hatred is a little strong, though..:D

Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 36046974)

To be honest, OLD BOY, I have no strong feelings about you - I just don't care about some rando on the internet.

Some of your views, however, I find "unusual"... ;)

Originally Posted by OLD BOY (Post 36046880)

I will bite only on this little corner of the absurd views you are spinning on this thread, jfman.

The SNP is not acting in the interests of the Scottish people. Whatever anyone's views on Scottish independence, one thing is undeniable (although I expect that you will have a damned good try, against all logic).

England has the biggest population of the union. It makes the most money by far, and it subsidises Scotland very generously by various means, including the Barnett formula. You only have to look at the absence of that formula to realise how negatively independence would impact on the Scottish people. Add to that the various benefits Scotland derives from being part of the UK and pile on the costs of self government, and factor in the rapidly reducing benefits of North Sea oil, not forgetting the disincentives to entrepreneurism under the misguided leftist policies of the SNP, and you have a recipe for disaster. The fact tbat only one page of the SNP's 400-odd page document making the case for independence covered the financial implications of separation shows very clearly that they do not actually have a clue on how to manage an economy.

Separation from the UK will be nothing short of a disaster for Scotland, and for the sake of its people I hope that the economic and currency consequences of leaving can be properly explained to them by someone they will listen to.

Nobody wants to vote to be poorer, as they say in remainer circles. As an economist, you should understand this.

Originally Posted by jfman (Post 36047013)

Hook, line and sinker Old Boy. Unquantifiable evidence everywhere which disappoints me though. No speculative blogs?

I’m not sure it’s worth adding to your errr, comprehensive, calculations here. Of course Scotland is too wee, too poor, and not clever enough for you London types that solved the education mystery in a heartbeat.

Be lucky to get unionists to back that line consistently.

I’ll credit Old Boy here as he’s agnostic to ten in a row.

Originally Posted by jfman (Post 36047013)

Hook, line and sinker Old Boy. Unquantifiable evidence everywhere which disappoints me though. No speculative blogs?

I’m not sure it’s worth adding to your errr, comprehensive, calculations here. Of course Scotland is too wee, too poor, and not clever enough for you London types that solved the education mystery in a heartbeat.

Be lucky to get unionists to back that line consistently.

I’ll credit Old Boy here as he’s agnostic to ten in a row.

Originally Posted by OLD BOY (Post 36047024)

When you've finished with your antagonistic remarks, perhaps you might like to consider answering the points I have made.

Whether or not anyone adds links, and no matter the degree of veracity, you always find a way to try and put others down.

Please stop sniping and start debating. Alternatively, you could keep your anti-everything views to yourself, mate. Disagree if you want, that's allowed and encouraged. But to disagree without giving any reasons is pointless because it simply doesn't add to the debate.

Originally Posted by jfman (Post 36047013)

Hook, line and sinker Old Boy. Unquantifiable evidence everywhere which disappoints me though. No speculative blogs?

I’m not sure it’s worth adding to your errr, comprehensive, calculations here. Of course Scotland is too wee, too poor, and not clever enough for you London types that solved the education mystery in a heartbeat.

Be lucky to get unionists to back that line consistently.

I’ll credit Old Boy here as he’s agnostic to ten in a row.

Originally Posted by 1andrew1 (Post 36047093)

There's a lengthy article in the FT about this subject. Google "London’s ‘complacency’ puts Scottish independence back in play" if you wish to read it.

Points include:
- The threat was spelt out by Michael Gove on July 21 and the penny has now dropped in the Conservative Party.
- The move towards separation is being driven by Brexit’s unpopularity (62% voted Remain in Scotland) and the belief that Edinburgh has responded better to Covid-19 than London. Other factors encouraging it are the House of Lords unpopularity, the Conservative Party's unpoularity and as JFMan has said, a lack of a convincing narrative for remaining in the Union to meet the emotional arguments head on.
- The most recent survey, conducted by YouGov, this month found that Scottish voters willing to express an opinion would support independence by 53% to 47% per cent - the first time the Yes side has been consistently ahead in a series of opinion polls conducted months apart.
- Boris Johnson vetoed Michael Gove’s suggestion that Nicola Sturgeon be invited to atted cabinet meetings on special occasions as part of a suggested strategy to to work more harmoniously with Edinburgh.
- Michael Gove's strategy has led to UK government ministers visiting Scotland but few ministers have any popularity there with Rishi Sunak being a notable exception.
https://www.ft.com/content/2420501f-...5-46e56d325547

As one Scottish-based FT reader commented