Re: Britain outside the EU
 

If Article 16 was invoked, it would run and run. I think the government's sensible enough not to deploy it unless it still buys into the Cummings' play book of putting out one fire with a larger fire.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

It would, but that’s the whole idea. There has been much talk of “retaliation” from the EU if the UK invokes Art.16 but this misses the fact that any such retaliation can only be within the legal framework set out in the treaty. The EU can’t justify any actions outside of the treaty because in invoking Art.16 the UK isn’t acting outside of the treaty.

The EU can challenge the legality of the invocation - the time-consuming process for which is specified in the treaty - or it can enter into the required arbitration and review process. Again, this process is defined in the treaty and takes time to complete.

As you say, this could be construed as putting out one fire by starting a bigger one, however if this really is the strategy they’ve been following from the outset then it has to be at least possible that there’s a defined objective in mind. My guess is that HMG thinks whatever conditions develop on the ground while the arbitration plays out will become the de facto arrangements for the long term.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

I like the fact that the presumption that this Government have a plan has been demoted to “at least possible” therefore acknowledging the perhaps more likely possibility that there isn’t one and they are merely leaping from crisis to crisis.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Why bother having a plan if nobody follows it? ;)

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

The plan has to be capable of being workable in the first place, otherwise it’s a wish-lust, not a plan…

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Easy tiger, cold shower time;)

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Miaaaooowwwww….

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Brexit doesn't seem to be meeting the conventional definition of taking back control of our borders.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...k-refugees-say

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Start sinking the boats, they'll soon pack in

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Probably not the best move, as that would be murder…

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Maybe you have misjudged the power of the ECJ!

---------- Post added at 02:42 ---------- Previous post was at 02:40 ----------

Or maybe collateral damage?

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

No, not under International Law (or our own Military Regulations) - undertaking acts whose sole purpose is to kill civilians (and if you sink boats and leave people to drown, that’s what you’re doing) would be an Unlawful Order, and would be refused.

It’s no better than machine-gunning civilians who present no threat to your life - just slower.

The sociopathy is strong in this thread…

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

I’m pretty sure you know that the Brexit discussion around border control was to do with EU free movement. It’s in rather poor taste for you to be using a humanitarian crisis to try to keep pushing your agenda.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

The French don't seem to mind letting them climb aboard unsuitable boats (many not even wearing a life jacket) at their end . . is that culpable homicide, assisted suicide or something?

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

<in a Yoda voice>Denial is strong in this one</in a Yoda voice>

Pearl clutching does not become you. The Brexit was all about "controlling our borders" and actively encouraged xenophobia. Andrew's article is right on point and the irony is off the scale.

There is no agenda here, only reality.