Re: Brexit discussion
 

There is only one answer to that TD.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

A better question may be: Who will be selling it to them if we don't?


And in a quoted article from 1Andrew1 ...Andrew Turnbull, who led the civil service under Tony Blair . . . stopped reading it right there :rolleyes:

Posted by Mr K
Trump wouldn't let you in Mick, you're an alien. US first remember ?

We could benefit from that kind of thinking - UK first sounds good to me

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Seriously Mick if you love the US so much, why don't you live there instead of moaning about how much you want our country to be the same ? We have much more in common with our biggest trading partner, the EU. Presumably you have skills to offer Trump and you are the right colour, from the right country, and worship the right God ?

Re: Brexit discussion
 

To be fair Mr K, the same thing could be suggested about those who love being in the EU.

Once the UK leave, it's only a short swim for those who still want to belong :D

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Unfortunately for us Carth, a lot of EU NHS staff have already decided to do that. Why stay where they're not wanted, when other countries welcome them?

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Another Brexiter who does not bother to find out how the UK works. UK civil servants have to work impartially and Andrew Turnbull has worked his way up under Conservative administrations. That's one thing that makes this a great country.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew...Baron_Turnbull

---------- Post added at 11:03 ---------- Previous post was at 10:46 ----------

The impact report on the UK has been leaked. Sorry, don't expect to see any reports along the lines you have suggested as they defy the laws of economics and don't exist.
The impact report examined different scenarios depending on the hardness of the Brexit deal. All showed the country foregoing economic growth compared to if it had stayed in the EU. So, less money for the NHS and our armed forces because of Brexit.
It was the work of many departments as it would be daft to duplicate effort across Government. That's why the report was called EU Exit Analysis — Cross Whitehall Briefing
Hapless David Davis did publish some industry reports whose quality was found wanting. He also sought to convince the country that no impact reports had been produced. http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entr...b044d16725e56d

Re: Brexit discussion
 

More claptrap. The NHS has employed MORE EU doctors and nurses.

You just can’t stop putting false and wrong information because it suits your anti-brexit narrative.

Here are the actual facts:

Source: ONS and BrexitCentral.

http://brexitcentral.com/claims-exod...-nhs-own-data/

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Good news, Mick. Both you and Mr K are both correct. Mr K is talking about people's intentions. He's talking about people who have decided to leave but probably haven't left yet. You're talking about levels of EU nationals employed. What a great way to end the weekend on. :angel:

Re: Brexit discussion
 

But not for you, seeing as you keep going on about this very inaccurate leaked document, made up by biased Remainers in the treasury in a failed and weak attempt to thwart Brexit,

Get it in to your head, we are leaving the EU, as we democratically elected to do so!

Re: Brexit discussion
 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-42911538

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Where are the counter studies? Surely, as I said before, the financial might of Tim Martin of Wetherspoons and Lord Bamford of JCB could rustle up a few economists to perform a realistic study to counter the remain biased civil service? Hell, Jacob Rees Mogg is worth a few bob...

The only positive studies I have seen are from Patrick Minfords Liverpool Model which predicts a nearly 9% rise in GDP post Brexit at the expense of UK manufacturing. The model is interesting in isolation but ignores consumer choice (price may not be more important than quality) and location (importing from China is tougher than importing from Ireland)

For a more considered analysis of The Liverpool Model, see here - http://blogs.lse.ac.uk/politicsandpo...ws-of-gravity/

Re: Brexit discussion
 

To what end do we keep doing all these false and baseless studies?

It will not stop the result of the vote which what the Remainers hope it does. Accept the democratic result and stop peddling the continuing narrative of project fear, which has been repeatedly wrong again and again.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Agreed Mick, and I wonder why everyone is so keen on doing studies/analysis/reports on what *may* go wrong instead of doing the same things to discover how to take advantage of the Brexit situation . . . or maybe they are but daren't leak them?

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Because if you don’t do analysis, forecasts, and budgets, how can you plan for the possible scenarios, and know what you would need in terms of resources.

All reasonably sized businesses, like Governments, plan 5 to 10 years ahead, reviewing the plans and amending in light of what’s actually happened.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Firstly, your stuff about leaving the EU - wasted words as that is not in dispute.

And your point about the document - wrong.

"Cross Whitehall Briefing"
1) It's not about them being angry.
2) It's not just from the Treasury, it's from across multiple departments.

I think you owe our hardworking civil servants an apology for talking them down all the time. Do you honestly think that all civil servants who are are Remainers magicked their way onto the project and manipulated it? I know you can do far better than this. :(

---------- Post added at 17:13 ---------- Previous post was at 17:10 ----------

The analysis showed that taking advantage of Brexit would add 0.2%-0.4% to GDP. Compared to a 2%-8% disadvantage from it.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Then let’s get the best of the best, have them run some scenarios, make predictions and be clear about the levels of uncertainty in each case. How can we expect the government to make policy without at least a base understanding of what the effects of that policy might be?

Asking for the government to make educated decisions based on the best information available isn’t trying to stop Brexit, it’s trying to get the best possible Brexit based on scientific predictions

Re: Brexit discussion
 

The trouble is that many Brexiters are in denial. They felt that they would be better off outside the EU but were guided to ignore the overwhelming evidence that said otherwise. Do they now either eat their words or pretend all the analysis is fake news/Remainer conspiracies?

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Interestingly, according to a YouGov poll a while back, 61% of leave voters are OK with the UK being worse off due to Brexit, while 39% are ok with a family member losing their job. Economic damage seems to be a price worth paying.

Poll details - https://yougov.co.uk/news/2017/08/01...it-extremists/

Of course, that is at the level of individuals. Maybe the government needs to be a bit more pragmatic as a reduced tax take impacts virtually all government activities, hence the need to make plans and have at least some kind of educated approach based on predictions

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Here's another of those Brexiters Remoaners in denial


Andrew Adonis launches his drive to reverse Brexit

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...ond-referendum

Though this Blairite former Liberal Democrat is as far from his party’s current leadership as it is possible to get, he remains optimistic that Jeremy Corbyn can also be persuaded to change his mind on the merits of a second referendum

“I dread the thought of a second referendum,” says Lucy Smout Szablewska, a local remain campaigner who has nonetheless come along to hear the plan.


Well it was the individuals that voted, not the Government :D

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Andrew stop being so stupid or do you honestly believe only one impact study was done by the government to fit all the different departments far more then one were commissioned but only one was leaked. Also can you stop saying we all thought we were going to be immediately better off it's been said many times on this forum that in the short to medium term we will be worse off but in the longer term we will be better off. You constantly misrepresent things then wonder why no one takes you seriously and also stop pretending you have a clue about how the civil service is working when you think only one impact study was done to cover all aspects of brexit for all government departments.

You don't know anything for a fact neither do i and here's a shocker neither do the experts who haven't been right once so far but they keep coming out with guff because people call them experts and expect them to come out with something. This is unknown territory nobody can honestly claim to know exactly what's going to happen and it's time some people stopped pretending and shutup so the government can get on with it. Hell if some remainers had their way there would be no point in negotiations with the EU because we'd have shown all our cards at the start it's beyond stupidity.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

The trouble is, that you are wrong (as per usual), we are not in denial, far from it. Utter bullshit, I am not in denial about anything. I want out, I would vote out again and again. Roll on Brexit day, no denials here, not a chance.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

It did enter my mind that there might be an ‘under promise, over deliver’ mission and a pessimistic report was ‘leaked’ so when things come out better than predicted, the government can take full credit come 2022 election time...

I am off for a tin foil hat fitting now.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

It's the remoaners who are in denial, Andrew. Denial that this country can stand on its own two feet, as incidentally we did pretty well for centuries before we joined the then EEC.

The point you don't want to ponder is that we may actually get a trade deal that includes services when we pull out of the EU, and that on top of that, we will get increased business with the rest of the world. That would make us better off, not worse off.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

I hope you’re right, I really do! However, the current Brexit policy of the UK 100% guarantees that a deal with the EU will be worse than we have now due to leaving the customs union. Even if we have a complete free trade agreement, non-tariff barriers to trade will be there.

So who do we talk to, to compensate for potential gdp loss from EU trade? The US are playing more and more hardball with their ‘America First’ policy. TTIP has stalled partially due to US demands such as being able to sue governments if their policies harm businesses. Indian have mentioned a loosening of immigration requirements as part of a trade deal. Chile aren’t happy with tariff quota allowances and you can be sure that the rest of South America will follow. South Korea have already said they want to address the balance of trade with the UK before any agreement can be reached.

Liam Fox and his department have some busy times ahead...

Re: Brexit discussion
 

No one is saying that the country can't stand on its own feet. It's worth noting that the World has changed technologically, economically and politically since we joined the EU. Countries like China and South Korea now command massive economic strength and the best trade negotiations occur when you have most to offer ie a market of 500m not 65m.
The issue is that the UK will enjoy less influence in Europe (eg Europol which we heavily steer) and the economy will grow less strongly than if we had remained in the EU. Until a form of transport exists that can transport people and goods as rapidly and cheaply between the UK and Europe as between the UK and the rest of the world, trade deals with neighbouring countries will always outweigh those with more distant countries.
If you read the Government's analysis, you would realise that trade with the rest of the world would add less than 1% in GDP whilst leaving the EU would result in a 2%-8% reduction in GDP. That analysis makes uncomfortable reading for some and I appreciate you may wish to turn a blind eye to it.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

I've been thinking about this and you know something? I think Andrew is right, we're well up the creek and no paddles to hand.

We import crops from the EU because we don't know how to grow our own. We import meat because we can't rear livestock. Milk and Cheese are imported because we lack the technology to produce it Chickens? heck yeah, we have a country full of those. ;)

Cars, well I guess most of those come from abroad too . . along with TV's, Mobiles, Microwaves and Dishwashers.

Clothes, Carpets, Furniture, all mass produced and shipped in daily.

Service industries . . . well that's just a few computers in an office somewhere, could be anywhere in the world (that's cheap enough).

Banking? see above.

Gas & Electricity comes from . . . oh yeah.

So, after mulling over this little puzzle I realised the only thing we have in this country to generate cash for the economy is . . . speeding fines :D

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Without wishing to detract from your humourous post, I would like to emphasise that I don't think we're up the creek with no paddles. ;)

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Well, since 51% of our food is imported, we best start growing it tout-suite...

We only produce 38% of the gas we use.

85% of new cars bought in the UK are imported.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

I do wonder why & how things like wheat, corn, potatoes and milk are imported, surely it has to be cheaper to use our own produce . . . or is this where the EU tariffs come into play?

Well you've got me there . . . unless much of it comes from Russia? (not EU)

And that's a great deal of cars too . . . maybe we should all keep the old model a year or two longer, I'm sure it wouldn't hurt the manufacturers much, and the second hand car market would get a boost :)

I guess what I'm getting at is . . . if all the trade deals offered to us are really bad, who else are the EU going to sell to?

Re: Brexit discussion
 

No10 has confirmed we will be leaving the customs union so no soft brexit as being out of that pretty much gaurantees full exit from the EU happy days :).

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Damn! That must mean the New Zealand lamb I had yesterday was off!

Honestly, Andrew! The EU is not the only place we will be getting our goods from post Brexit.

I think you place too much reliance on forecasts when forming your opinions and making your comments, most of which have proved wrong in recent times. They tend to concentrate on negatives without adequate consideration of the potential benefits.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Lamb is a seasonal product and very popular in Britain and France. Britain in particular likes legs of lamb so supplies of domestic lamb are somewhat limited by the seasons and the fact that sheep only have four legs. To get around this, New Zealand can import over 200,000 tonnes in to the EU tariff free. Limited tariff quotas the EU uses work to fulfill demand while maintaining domestic business. Strangely, we import a lot of New Zealand lamb but also export a lot of lamb to France. Again, this is due to the UK market loving legs of lamb so a lot of the other bits are exported.

How about non-seasonal goods from cars to pharmaceuticals? What about industries such as the automotive industry that have notoriously short supply chains. I heard somewhere that Nissan in the UK holds less than half a days production of parts in stock. The further goods have to come, the more likely there will be delays and the longer those delays will be.

It's certainly not impossible that there are some sweet deals out there but the question is, are they sweeter than what we had?

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Where do they come from now? Are they made in 'Europe' somewhere or shipped to Europe and then the UK?

If shipped there's little difference, if made they can build a plant here too :)

Re: Brexit discussion
 

But they usually have a central plants/suppliers which supplies all their factories in Europe, for economies of scale.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Economies of scale. Suppliers tend to have one factory per continent making eg spark plus, tyres, etc. These are supplied to car plants across Europe. If you had to have one per economy - as you did 100 years ago- you don't gain the benefits of economies of scale that make cars affordable for lots of people.

---------- Post added at 17:59 ---------- Previous post was at 17:54 ----------

Jusging by your above post there's a chance it might have been. :D Nowhere in my post did I say that trade deals with countries were impossible. I just cited the laws of economics which mean that deals with countries closer to hand outweigh those with far away countries. NZ is not a significant trading partner.
What makes you think that forecasts don't consider the potential upsdes? Is this another conspiracy theory or one you have some evidence on?

Re: Brexit discussion
 

We also fought plenty of wars and invaded loads of lands to make sure we kept that position as well. It started to go down hill when we started to pull out of everywhere I tell you. Watch out India, we're on our way back.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Tory MP, Zac Goldsmith is claiming an 80 year old constituent who voted leave has been sent a letter threatening to be killed and signed it off with "The Real 48 Per cent".

https://twitter.com/ZacGoldsmith/sta...41047272112128

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Another warped nutter sadly who should be locked up with the keys thrown away.:(

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Don't forget we have the Falkland Islands... :erm:

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Totally disgusting. Whoever sent it should face lifetime in prison IMHO.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

But that shouldn't be a surprise. No new trade deals for us if we stay within the Customs Union.

---------- Post added at 19:12 ---------- Previous post was at 19:10 ----------

Well, the forecast chaos when we voted against staying in the EU didn't come to much, did it? That is not the only example by far.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

we not left yet we still in EU so still got our deals chaos will come when we leave

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Isn't is amazing how when positive news about the economy, job numbers are up etc etc we get some Remainers claiming it's down to us not leaving th EU yet.

But when there is news of job losses, price hikes and similar kind of negative economy news, Brexit is instantly blamed, some people have weird logic that really is utterly priceless.

Doesn't make any difference to me, I would still vote to leave, every time!

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Don't want to dent your confidence but no one cares if it makes a difference to you or to me.

---------- Post added at 22:51 ---------- Previous post was at 22:45 ----------

Unless you call interest rates rising, national debt payment being postponed for 10 years and the pound falling substantially against the Euro then yes, nothing happened.
Did Cameron et al pick the worse case scenarios? Yes. Did the Brexit guys pick impossibly good scenarios? Yes. That doesn't mean experts are wrong. Would you rather have Jim at No. 35 doing your heart bypass or someone who's qualified and skilled in the process doing it?

---------- Post added at 22:53 ---------- Previous post was at 22:51 ----------

From those in the know it's a case of BINO - Brexit in name only. :) Expect a customs union but called a customs alignment, a customs agreement etc. And nothing much will happen until 2020.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Well if it all goes stupidly wrong because the people in charge do a backflip on Brexit, I'm gonna quit work, live on the dole and let some other mug pick up the tab.

oh, and free health care too on the NHS (or Jim at No. 35)

Re: Brexit discussion
 

But that's precisely what the remain campaign said would happen with a vote to leave, Dave. Project Fear. It didn't happen then and it won't happen now.

People can parrot this nonsense as much as they like, but they are losing credibility as people wake up to the truth.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

You fail to see the difference between a Government committed to Brexit which has produced cross-departmental reports and exaggerated campaigns from Vote Leave and Remain.
To put it another way, Project Fear is dead. We're now looking at reality.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

I'll get your coat. :D One less undemocratic remoaner.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

You will have to buy a awful lot of coats old bean as at the last count it amounted to 16,141,241 million so you better start saving now.;):D

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Both sides speak with forked tongue and weasel words.

With a few exceptions politicians are seeking the best outcome for politicians.

I would expect differences though even within parties because our MP's represent differing constituencies that voted differently in the referendum and are affected differently. That said they should be working together to ensure the best outcome not flying off the rails with doom and gloom predictions and no solutions.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Very true tweetiepooh.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Not too impressed then? :D

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Nothing to worry about, tweetiepooh. There will be a deal and Andrew will be aghast.

Then, the rest of the world will be ours!

Re: Brexit discussion
 

the rest of the world is ours at the moment, thanks to being in the trading bloc that has the highest number of free trade deals of any trading bloc in the world. We'll lose it all in 2020.
Doubtless, there will be a poor deal with the EU which the Brexiters will drool over but the sane world will be pitying of. How it will all square with no border between the two Irelands I do not know.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

well said :clap::clap::clap:

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Well i suppose if it's going to be so bad in the UK after brexit there will be quite a few leaving our shores for the utopian paradise across the channel as it's unheard of for there to be problems across the channel only the UK will have problems. Ah well be sad to see em go but much like life outside of the EU we will initially survive to prosper later.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

The Irish border thing is another thing some Remainers cling on to as a major issue when it's not.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

You were itching to join them a few days ago.:confused:

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Yes and if i had the money I'd be gone I'm so sick of a sizable portion of the population that have turned into thin skinned moaning gits that do nothing but spurt negatives all day long. As for the irish border it's this hard we say things stay as they are, Eire says things stay as they are job done all sorted unless the EU have a problem with that.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

the Irish will take issue with you on that one it matters

Re: Brexit discussion
 

And the EU ;)
https://www.ft.com/content/ee480ee6-...7-42f857ea9f09

Re: Brexit discussion
 

it'll be a smugglers paradise will that Irish sea :D

How much is an old gunboat nowadays? ;)

Re: Brexit discussion
 

More on the crucial Irish border situation
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018...-threat-talks/

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Leaked EU document shows Brexit 'punishment plan'

https://news.sky.com/story/leaked-eu...-plan-11239487


Theresa May's chief Brexit tormentor, Jacob Rees-Mogg, has stepped up his pressure on the Prime Minister after claims the EU plans to punish the UK during a transition period.

According to an incendiary threat contained in a leaked Brussels document, the EU wants the power to restrict the UK's access to the single market during a transition period and impose big trade tariffs

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Noooo didn't you read the post 5 above, we say things stay as they are and that's an end to it, the whole thing really is that easy, job done, piece of piss, no need to send a text or go legal.

---------- Post added at 01:16 ---------- Previous post was at 01:14 ----------

No cash contributions then and they can stick this fair playing field malarkey to if they carry on seems like a reasonable response imo

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Well, if that is the czse, what has just happened in China? Did Theresa May go there for no reason?

Contrary to the view you seem to hold on this, the EU does not have comprehensive trade agreements with the rest of the world, including our biggest trading partner other than the EU, the United States of America!

Nothing will be lost in 2020 other than EU incompetence, EU restrictions and EU myths, which will be exposed for all to see. If the EU is this wonderful institution that allows us to trade with the rest of tbe world, how come we had to leave our Commonwealth countris behind as part of this wonderful project?

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Why make this so difficult: The vote was to leave, so LEAVE! :mad:

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Do you remember TTIP? The US and US have been working on a trade agreement for a number of years but significant issues remain. Here's an excerpt from the joint US/EU status report;

As for China, again, there have been talks but the issues with China include;

So yes, there aren't agreements with the US and China, but there are reasons why and the EU is clear why.

Here's the EU page on US trade - http://ec.europa.eu/trade/policy/cou...united-states/
And trade with China - http://ec.europa.eu/trade/policy/cou...untries/china/

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Because the government have to plan alternative arrangements for the regulations, legal mechanisms and other controls. The transition period has come about because of the sheer scale of the task. There is something like 40 of them and also don't want to have a period where businesses can't sell into the EU because of paperwork hassle. It's more than just dealing with the tariffs for now and sorting it later.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

But a "transition period" where nothing really changes, just kicks the can down the road and when the end of such a period looms we'll get the same old excuses and doom mongering about "cliff edges" and not being ready. A definite chop date in March 2019 would concentrate minds and stop the shilly-shallying.

Yes, there's a lot to be done and people need to get their fingers out, burn the midnight oil if needed, employ more staff and actually DO something.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

It does kick the can down the road but that's because 2 years isn't long enough. As far as know the civil service is already working longer hours etc but the sheer scale of the task isn't helping. It doesn't help the politicians are dithering into what they want.

Personally I think we should sign up to the EU bodies where there is no real benefit, trade wise, to having our own. I.E Do we really need to leave Euratom which regulates the transport, management and safety of nuclear material? Not really. What's the point of setting up and staffing an agency which on the face of it will do nothing but mirror EU regulation.

Stuff like that will speed it up.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

I agree 100%. The only issue is that the dispute resolution mechanism for most of these bodies is the ECJ which is politically unpalatable

Re: Brexit discussion
 

I think the EU is going to stitch us up big time during the transition period they want payback and are aiming to get it. They won't finish on just a divorce settlement they'll screw everything from us for years to come.

I think if we haven't got very far towards the end of the year and threats are still coming our way we should just jump the cliff and laugh at the stupidity of the EU as they run around looking for their next milk float

Re: Brexit discussion
 

So Theresa May refused to rule out the NHS being a subject of interest in post Brexit UK/US trade talks - http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...rade-deal.html (I hope the source is OK with everyone, didn’t want to cite The Guardian or Independent)

Vaguely corrected later by the PMs press office but worrying

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Apart from lost tax revenues due to slower growth which could be spent on our schools, housing, NHS and armed forces - nothing will be lost. :rolleyes:

Re: Brexit discussion
 

if that happens don't get ill unless you got a credit card with lots of money


Impact on UK regions revealed in Brexit leak as usual North East worse off

https://news.sky.com/story/hit-to-no...-leak-11240254

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Incisive analysis from Robert Peston. Full article worth reading.
https://www.facebook.com/pestonitv/p...=244+281088008

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Shh, nonsense fiddled figures from a corrupt civil service remember. Of course, if the figures were true (which of course they’re not, Jacob Rees-Mogg and John Redwood said so) then strangely regions like the North East which voted to leave are worse affected than mainly remain voting London

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Sometimes people just vote for change, any change in the hope it might be better, regardless of the possible consequences. . Doesn't help that they've been fed so many lies. I can seen our United Kingdom becoming very divided indeed.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

I'm sick of all these independent reports that do nothing but give informed analysis all the time. I yearn for the good old days when a simple happy clappy slogan could be painted on the side of a bus and I wouldn't have to try and understand GCSE economics. :D

Re: Brexit discussion
 

I've been fed lies for years, and I'm pretty sure most of the population has heard the same lies. We live in a society that lies about many things, we even lie to ourselves sometimes. But just because you hear lies doesn't mean you believe them. I voted out (and would again) because I personally was fed up with the direction our Country was being taken, not because someone told me to.

I see no difference between that infamous bus slogan, and these 'informed analysis' reports springing up - lies and deceit to convince the gullible

Re: Brexit discussion
 

You mean when WW3 was predicted if we vote out kind of lies just to try and make sure the vote was going the way they wanted

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Oh wonderful, the red bus argument rears it's ugly head again.... Must be Groundhog Day, cue Sonny and Cher.... pffft, forget it, CBA... :rolleyes:

I would still vote to leave the EU all the time. (Not tired of ever saying this though).

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Sadly for leave voters, the saying that what goes around, comes around seems to be true with Brexit. Parts of the UK that voted Leave in the referendum will suffer most as a result of Brexit, according to the cross-departmental Government impact assessment.
The north-east and the West Midlands would suffer the biggest hit to growth, while London, which voted heavily for Remain, would be least negatively affected.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

exactly and the Brextremists will be the biggest moaners ever when it happens

Re: Brexit discussion
 

So we have gone from guessing possibles economics to knowing how brexiters will respond oh my you remainers are clever people how could anyone doubt you. I voted leave would vote leave again and I'm on benefits so know I'll be amongst those who will feel the impact and I'm good with that if it means we avoid becoming just another state in the U.S.E and the glorious united european military and police. Hey you remember how nick clegg told people that a european military wouldn't happen bet he feels a bit silly now they have started on that.

Or how about the time the EU tried to have non eurozone countries responsible for the debt of eurozone countries that was a chuckle and I'm sure our remainer contingent would have been happy to pay for that (that ones on the backburner for now). Lets look at Mr macron who feels the UK voted for brexit as there wasn't enough regulation and free market attitude in the EU he has his thumb on the pulse doesn't he. Now we have a leak about how the EU plans to punish the UK during any transitional phase and our remainer contingent brushes past that as they do with anything that doesn't paint their beloved EU in a postive light.

You really don't have to look too hard for a miriad of reasons why getting out of the EU though painful initially will eventually be the best thing for the UK and why is it our media that hunts down any anti brexit stories with great enthusiasm still doesn't report on the german industry displeasure with merkel over the EU's negotiating attitude or the concerns the french have over a no deal it's always "british government this" never a thing about the circus going on elsewhere.

I voted leave without needing the red bus (that seems to have worked on remainers more then any leave voter I've so far met or talked too) no politician spouting garbage involved and that's why remain lost you were too busy patting yourself on the back for being superior and not realising that most leave voters had reached that decision a long time before we got the chance to vote.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

No we won’t because it won’t happen. Those Fake Forcasts created by project fear types are made up nonsense, just like all the other fake bullshit by project fear was false, in the immediate aftermath of the referendum vote.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

This latest report was done by David Davies’ department, the Department for Exiting the European Union.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Once we have left the EU, we will still be trading with the EU, but we will also have our own trading deals with the rest of the world. Slower growth? I doubt it, old chap.

---------- Post added at 07:34 ---------- Previous post was at 07:28 ----------

Project Fear remains alive and well. So transparent, to aim this at the staunchest Brexiteers. :p:

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Lets face it they'll never stop moaning and hating everything that moves. Wrong type of Brexit, Corbyn, May, faceless Whitehall bureaucrats, immigrants, all will be blamed for the Brexit shambles. They themselves are of course faultless; it was a good idea in principle after all, not their fault everyone else is a traitor and/or incompetent ?? :erm:

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Oh shut up MrK you constantly prattle on about the same rubbish and coming from you and others it's ironic given you've done nothing but moan, insult and insinuate since the referendum we couldn't match your remoaning without a good few years of practice. As usual you won't respond on anything negative about the EU so what is your view on the leaked document that shows the EU plans to punish the UK during the transitional phase??????.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

This is independent analysis produced by a pro-Brexit government. You would need to be smoking an unusual brand of ciogarette to think it's Project Fear! It's Project Reality!

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Another of the usual suspects that has selective viewing and won't answer a simple asked question not surprised par for the course these days.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

What question can I answer for you?

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Absolutely pathetic and exactly what I've come to expect from you and MrK.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

And where do you get all the negative EU stuff from - Farage ? the tabloids? or Torygraph, who uncover a 'secret EU plot' every day... The ' punishment' is nothing new, it's part of the deal we'd sign up to. If I was the EU I'd tell us to naff off with our transition, and let us flounder. We've created this mess, our problem.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Another label uncalled for to be perfectly honest as none of us are the usual suspects as everybody has differing views and opinions on here the last time l heard..

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Probably the same place you get most of your garbage from fantasyland seems to suit you well and the fact your ok with a punitive action by the EU speaks volumes about you and makes it abundantly clear this is not the forum for any discussion. I doubt there's a limit to how far you'd allow the EU to go demonstrates perfectly why this country is in the mess it is and while I haven't used the term traitor it would certainly be the closest term to describe some.

Well Denphone I've tried to be more to the polite side of things and it clearly doesn't work here and I'm tired of the constant claims of moaning to come from brexiters by a group that's done nothing but moan, whinge, bitch and complain since they lost the referendum. I have also put up good reasons why i and many i know voted leave only to have the ridiculous red bus rubbish resurface again and again. It's my mistake i thought maybe things had changed around here clearly not so I'll be off again maybe in six months things will change won't hold my breath.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

Why do you assume that being in the EU is the be all and end all of life? All these other countries that are not part of the EU seem to be trading ok. China, America, Russia etc if anything they are doing better.

We are being held back by outdated countries that live in the past, you want to trade with us well pay Billions in first then we let you trade and we make the rules on how you govern your country. I mean whats that all about? freedom of movement doesn't work for everything.

You can get skilled people without freedom of movement from all the said countries with it. the only thing freedom of movement brings is those wanting to take up low skilled paid jobs.

Once we have gone from the EU the cracks will appear all over it might take some more years before it shows but they'll be no doubt other governments will want to govern themselves on all aspects. they'll sit there for years to see how well the UK does on it's own. Then the shit will happen.

It's only the likes of a few EU countries like Germany as the ring leader with a few closer followers that while they might all have an equal vote. behind closed doors is where the real influence starts and Germany is at the top of the table with a few bully boys.

The UK as a few friends I think these will show in a few years they don't want to upset the apple cart yet.

Remain voters are followers they can't take the lead, they can't think for themselves hence the EU.

Brexit voters are strong people these are the people who in a war you want on side, strong willed, independant and know what they want.

Just take that into account when the EU falls apart and is no more the'll come running to us for advice.

Re: Brexit discussion
 

China, Russia and America have slightly bigger and stronger economies than us ! Being outside the EU will give us a much weaker hand in trade deals. Some Brexiters still think we have an Empire; we don't and we're relatively small.