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-   -   George Osborne's autumn statement 2011 (https://www.cableforum.uk/board/showthread.php?t=33683168)

denphone 29-11-2011 17:41
Re: George Osborne's autumn statement 2011
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 35337312)
Two things...

A) People are living longer because of healthier living and better healthcare - how would you suggest the increased length of pension payments are funded?

B) The previous government didn't win any prizes for foresight, did it?
l think that the lack of foresight about pensions can apply to governments of whatever political colour they are for the last 30 years Hugh.

martyh 29-11-2011 17:54
Re: George Osborne's autumn statement 2011
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Fry (Post 35337315)
what i meant to say was

It will no do anything major to help the economy and the the public sector pay cap is really just proves the the government want to fight the public sector unions

Plus they are giving aid to other counteries when 20% of our fellow UK citizen are in poverty

This Country is going down the dogs and nether the Tories/Lib Dems or Labour has any policys to deal with the economy
yes they do ,they are trying to reduce borrowing, get unemployment down and reduce public spending ,for the forseable future that will be their policy .In this thread you stated you would prefer tax increases to cuts ,i'm sure that Osborne and the rest have considered that option but dismissed it because it doesn't help in reducing public spending/borrowing that much if unemployment is rising and will always be the most unpopular option

Hugh 29-11-2011 18:10
Re: George Osborne's autumn statement 2011
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by denphone (Post 35337211)
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/blog/20...statement-live

A £40billion credit easing scheme to help small firms;

A £5billion cash boost for over 500 infrastructure projects – including roads, railways, airports and broadband expansion. A further £25billion could be spent in future years;

A trimming Britain’s foreign aid budget so that it does not overshoot its 0.7 per cent spending target by 2013;

An increase in the Bank levy to raise £2.5billion;

An extra £1.2bn will be spend on education - including £600m for authorities that need new school places;

A £1billion fund to help the young unemployed;

Mortgage indemnity scheme to help 100,000 people get onto the property ladder;

£500m housebuilding plan in England;

January rise in regulated rail fares to be capped at 6.2%, not 8.2%;

A £250million scheme to ease the impact of climate change taxes on energy intensive firms;

£380m to double free nursery places for toddlers
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Fry (Post 35337315)
what i meant to say was

It will no do anything major to help the economy and the the public sector pay cap is really just proves the the government want to fight the public sector unions

Plus they are giving aid to other counteries when 20% of our fellow UK citizen are in poverty

This Country is going down the dogs and nether the Tories/Lib Dems or Labour has any policys to deal with the economy
You obviously missed these bits in the OP, or did your blinkers stop you seeing them?

Re public sector pay caps - do you mean just like the Private Sector?

---------- Post added at 19:08 ---------- Previous post was at 19:06 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by denphone (Post 35337318)
l think that the lack of foresight about pensions can apply to governments of whatever political colour they are for the last 30 years Hugh.
yes, but now that someone is trying to do something about them they are being lambasted.

---------- Post added at 19:10 ---------- Previous post was at 19:08 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by martyh (Post 35337326)
yes they do ,they are trying to reduce borrowing, get unemployment down and reduce public spending ,for the forseable future that will be their policy .In this thread you stated you would prefer tax increases to cuts ,i'm sure that Osborne and the rest have considered that option but dismissed it because it doesn't help in reducing public spending/borrowing that much if unemployment is rising and will always be the most unpopular option
I find it amusing when people advocate tax rises, they usually mean tax rises for other people....;)

martyh 29-11-2011 18:19
Re: George Osborne's autumn statement 2011
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 35337336)

I find it amusing when people advocate tax rises, they usually mean tax rises for other people....;)
or they don't actually work ;)

mertle 29-11-2011 18:34
Re: George Osborne's autumn statement 2011
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by denphone (Post 35337318)
l think that the lack of foresight about pensions can apply to governments of whatever political colour they are for the last 30 years Hugh.
agreed seems hugh assumed blaming just this current government.

Yes people living longer thats true but surely better to have less unemployed than high unemployed.

In reality would think there ideology working till 70's is madcap unworkable employers unlikely too keep them in work.

therefore the only people hurt those who will never stay employment.

Also with churn jobs not career by cameron own words of future employment private pension schemes likely less.

We just need better solution more people in work would surely negatate some issues.

Making the need to less tax credit with better basic wage could ofset too.

Getting the tax issue sorted would raise funds to all these would make the country able to afford better pension structure.

Like said not all would retire those who got something to offer would infact not retire with that teaching the generations to take those skilled jobs via aprenticeships.

It can be tackled much better than what been done for number years.

We have to find solution to the working numbers game hugh highering the retirement just going to make situation very much worse.

Whether we reduce retirement or cut hours of work banning 12 hour shifts something goto be done. It will take brave goverment to see the light.

martyh 29-11-2011 18:58
Re: George Osborne's autumn statement 2011
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mertle (Post 35337353)

Whether we reduce retirement or cut hours of work banning 12 hour shifts something goto be done. It will take brave goverment to see the light.
cut hours of work? ban 12 hour shifts? are you nuts ?

all that will achieve is to reduce productivity and increase companies overheads as they struggle to maintain a level of productivity to remain viable because some nutter banned 12 hour shifts .Many people who work 12 hr shifts rely on the overtime or bonuses achieved by working the extra hours

RizzyKing 29-11-2011 19:22
Re: George Osborne's autumn statement 2011
 
Just when you thought you had seen stupidity at it's best you can come on here and listen to some of the members and realise there are always new levels of stupidity to reach. This government and this chancellor as i have said elsewhere have got nothing to play with a previous government having blown it all in the good times and not putting a thing aside for that rainy day that turned out to be a monsoon season. When the pot is empty it is hard to do much at all and under the corcumstances this budget is not as bad as it could have been not that i expect some on here to ever give anyone any credit.

richard1960 30-11-2011 08:21
Re: George Osborne's autumn statement 2011
 
After having digested Geroge Osbournes autumn statement i have to agree he was caught somewhat between a rock and a hard place,in that there is not a lot of cash to spread around.

But i have to say what kind of a message does it send out when those on benefits recieve full uprating with inflation around 5%,whilst those that do go out and find a job are having their tax credits frozen, Also people in the public service like me (not on strike today by the way voted against it as i think its wrong) are getting 1% after our pay freeze ends (no negotiation there) in effect suffering a pay cut of around 16%,i do not mind takng my fair share of cuts but somewhere along the line the message being sent out to the low paid is not a good one,considering ian duncan smith wants to "make work pay"

Also my state pension age goes up in the april to 67 two months before i could have retired at 66 that is my contribution in the pot.;)

TheDaddy 30-11-2011 13:54
Re: George Osborne's autumn statement 2011
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by denphone (Post 35337211)
£380m to double free nursery places for toddlers
Seems like a waste of cash to me, let one parent stay at home with the child and some one else can have that job.

Ignitionnet 30-11-2011 18:00
Re: George Osborne's autumn statement 2011
 
This statement was pretty nasty actually, the savings seem to be from welfare rather than increasing the tax take.

I understand the need for cuts in everything but the richest in society are taking absolutely none of the pain from this statement and it had relatively little impact on those who aren't wealthy but have high incomes such as myself.

It really is time for a land value tax, many other countries tax in that manner without having huge social unrest. Money sitting in housing and other unproductive assets doesn't power the economy, money flowing through businesses does.

Introducing a land value tax and using the proceeds to reduce VAT would be a pretty good idea. Property millionaires in the same council tax band they were in before their asset tripled in value over a little more than a decade should be paying some more.

Big winner from it all is of course pensioners and soon to be pensioners, aka Baby Boomers, triple lock on their pensions while those of working age see some of their welfare frozen, winter fuel allowance remaining non-means tested, still no tax on properties beyond council tax.

All in it together my backside.

denphone 30-11-2011 18:09
Re: George Osborne's autumn statement 2011
 
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisf...tumn-statement


l think this sums it up.



Quote:
Class war, generation war, war against women, war between the regions: George Osborne's autumn statement blatantly declares itself for the few against the many. Gloves are off and gauntlets down, and the nasty party bares its teeth. Here is the re-toxified Tory party, the final curtain on David Cameron's electoral charade. No more crocodile tears for the poor, no more cant about social mobility or "the most family-friendly government" or "we're all in this together". Forget "vote blue go green", with this mockery of husky-hugging. Let the planet fry.
Quote:
What was missing from his list? Not one penny more was taken from the top 10% of earners. Every hit fell upon those with less not more. Fat plums ripe for the plucking stayed on the tree as the poorest bore 16% of the brunt of new cuts and the richest only 3%, according to the Resolution Foundation. Over £7bn could be harvested with 40% tax relief on higher pensions, while most earners only get 20% tax relief; £2bn should be nipped from taxing bankers' bonuses, but the bank levy announced was nothing extra. There was no mansion tax on high-value properties, though owners don't even pay their fair share of council tax, and property is greatly undertaxed compared with other countries.
Quote:
Instead came the great attack on public sector employees on the eve of the biggest strike in memory. This was a declaration of open class war – and war on the pay of women, 73% of the public workforce. After a three-year freeze, public pay rises are pegged at 1% for two years, whatever the inflation rate. That means this government will take at least 16% from their incomes overall. But the plan to abolish Tupe – the rule that ensures public workers are not paid less if their service is privatised – is outrageously unjust, and will lead to mighty resistance to all privatisation from senior as well as junior staff.
Quote:
But the direct assault on the poor is almost beyond belief. Watch how the big, powerful charities on Tuesday expressed uncharacteristic outrage. Along with the Children's Society, Save the Children is fiercer than I can ever recall, calling this "dire news for the poorest families – both in and out of work"; "A major blow", says 4Children; while Barnardo's calls it "a desperate state of affairs when the government's own analysis shows that a further 100,000 children will be pushed into poverty as a result of tax and benefits changes announced today".
Quote:
The gap between what they say and do is now exposed. The injustice of how the pain has been shared is breath-taking. A windfall taking just one year's bank bonuses would pay for all the cuts in youth services and the EMA for the next 23 years. That's just one example. Osborne is fatally wrong on the economy, as his deficit target slips by two years in just the past eight months. But even if his straitjacket were necessary, the pain would be politically acceptable only if justly shared. The Bullingdon budget tears the last veil of deceit, leaving the nasty party naked for all to see. But every school will get its King James Bible with Michael Gove's presumptuous foreword: is prayer all that's left?

nomadking 30-11-2011 18:12
Re: George Osborne's autumn statement 2011
 
Money is paid to somebody else for land and housing. That money is then moved around the economy.:rolleyes: You could say the same about the purchase of most things like TVs.

What kills the economy is money being shipped abroad one way or another, eg imports or people sending money abroad.

mertle 30-11-2011 19:17
Re: George Osborne's autumn statement 2011
 
squeezing the wrong people then seeing there austerity going to the toilet they squeeze more out the wrong people. Someone should tell osbourne you cant get blood out of stone but he sure trying hard.

When will this GOVERNMENT wake up do what will raise £££ and work on reducing deficet by the right way.

Leave the poor and low wages alone let them and middle class spend try drive and boost the economy.

Ignitionnet your right land tax might be good fund raiser.

Its absolute bonkers leadership will make FORCAST there latest fiasco will fail miserably we will just end up not decreasing but increase it. They wont even get close 2016 they listening to the wrong people who thinks where money can get raised.

The tax on bonuses got to be another great idea although my fear would they just trough more to ofset it.

I would not be suprised VAT will hit everything to try raise capital such essensial food. The way this government acting it must be on the cards.

Austerity was very clever ploy by the rich to put lesser well off back in there place. I really starting to believe this was all staged to create a bigger wealth bubble. However these silly rich who done it forgot who going to buy the goods which drive the economy. Minions who getting crushed spend they money that creates there wealth and drives jobs.

This will hurt private sector jobs like no tomorrow we will see waves unemployment. The world can recover but it need to be done properly.

Nobody say tax rich to hilth just make sure they pay there obligation.

I will say this there modern atitudes stink bet they would never give up some of there wealth like past wealthy did to support the war effort like those before.

This may not be using the gun but it is war like scenerio the COUNTRY NEEDS YOU to do the honourable thing stop offshoring wealth in tax havens. Pay up what you owe let country get back on its feet.

We could show the world the way with honesty commitment.

nomadking 30-11-2011 19:26
Re: George Osborne's autumn statement 2011
 
From the Radio Times write-up of a programme on BBC2 @ 9pm tonight(Wed 30th Nov).

Quote:
He illustrates how more than half of all income tax revenue comes from the top ten per cent of earners

richard1960 30-11-2011 19:31
Re: George Osborne's autumn statement 2011
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by nomadking (Post 35338032)
From the Radio Times write-up of a programme on BBC2 @ 9pm tonight(Wed 30th Nov).
Hmm you mean your money and how they spend it, with Nick Robinson BBC2 9pm i will watch with interest to see if that really is the case.;)

With top rate tax i gather it really is all smoke and mirrors.

See phillip green who has his company Arcadia in his wifes name who is a resident in monaco for tax purposes for details.


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