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-   -   Help - NTL refusing to pay compensation/refund for loss of service (https://www.cableforum.uk/board/showthread.php?t=24552)

N00N00 24-02-2005 15:27
Re: Help - NTL refusing to pay compensation/refund for loss of service
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by poolking
Well you do get charged if you report a fault and an engineer comes out and finds no fault.
Well I didn't realise that. I guess it vindicates my position of being cautious. As for whoever moaned about "finding" faults - well I'm only doing as I was told and I was just going to tell them about all the problems that I have discovered over the years and not reported -( I just have to confirm they haven't been fixed yet). You can't have it both ways - sorry.

I should add that I've had plenty of problems with my NTL BB in the past but hoped I had fixed everything by ditching the TV service and going to SACM.

Many thanks to those offering words of support.

nostra 24-02-2005 15:46
Re: Help - NTL refusing to pay compensation/refund for loss of service
 
nobody states that you must contact ntl everytime something goes wrong even when it doesnt.

but if you expect a refund for something like loss of service ntl will need to see it on the system thats all

N00N00 25-02-2005 12:20
Re: Help - NTL refusing to pay compensation/refund for loss of service
 
Well the internet went off again - phoned up NTL IMMEDIATELY and they have admitted they STILL haven't fixed the problem and an engineer will have to come out.

The good news is that i got my £17.99 back for this month, but it would be nice to have a connection that works properly.

Given that ADSL prividers are increasing their speeds I may have to switch roadband providers, though I will probably stick with NTL until I can swich to a telephone service other than BT.

v.bampton 25-02-2005 13:03
Re: Help - NTL refusing to pay compensation/refund for loss of service
 
So can I just check... exactly who, on what number, should we be phoning every time we get a problem, and what should we be telling them?


We've had problems for the last 2 years, and after numerous emails are still not getting any further. It doesn't help that we're in Southampton, and as you'll note from their server status page, they've been admitting problems in Southampton since April last year!

I don't have the option to change ISP's at this point in time, but I'm fed up with paying for a completely unreliable service. Up until now it's just been an annoyance, so I haven't bothered to log or report everything, but I've had enough now.

So, who do I need to be calling? And what kind of response can I expect?

Thanks!

N00N00 25-02-2005 13:39
Re: Help - NTL refusing to pay compensation/refund for loss of service
 
All I know if that you have to report every single fault to the faults center. The woman there said people need to stop putting up with problems and stop being so British about things. They said they don't know if we're having problems, so we have to tell them.

Personally I would have thought NTL might be able to teest things occasionally, but perhaps they have cut things back so much that they now rely on customers completely to find out when there are problems?

Anyway - make sure you start reporting everything as you obviously can't rely on NTL to fix things without some encouragement.

fatnose12 26-02-2005 09:28
Re: Help - NTL refusing to pay compensation/refund for loss of service
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by fatnose12
This will be my first time on a forum, but let me share a few little things I have found out, regards complaining to NTL, find out who the current MD is and his address. It took me some time. Write to him specifying problems,dates times etc. I had a problem of massively slow speed, disconections, over a 3 month period. I got a reply from him in 2 days,and a follow up call from the local (Luton) office. Get the name of the poor sap you are going to vent your anger at and gentlely remind he or she that you will call them every day relentlessly until the fault is fixed. They sent out their senior tech, who over a cup of tea and a fag told me that the Luton proxy server was kak and was being overhauled, but the public was being told it was a numerous amount of problems, viruses seeming to be the biggest lie, the engineer then promptly set my PC up to use the Swansea proxy server, as it is the server their tech support uses, and hey presto access to the world wide wait was back. But be warned you need to keep the pressure up, keep writing and keep putting the pressure on, at the end of the day I got 2 free months access:). And when it failed again 2 months later, I got 3 months free access:):):) And of course tomorrow morning I am going to be Pi**ing someone else off at NTL because I have no Email access, I wonder what I will get this time.
I went to customer service first, NFU, Then to the MD. The customer service manager at Luton, who sent the senior field tech? Fixed. Then it went again and I contacted a 0845 number which the tech guy had given me, which was tech support in Swansea. They then sorted the problem out, If I have to speak to someone in India I will hang up, most of my banking and CCards are in call centres in India. And most of the time couldnt find the own backside in the dark if someone set fire to it and gave them a map

absl 26-02-2005 13:12
Re: Help - NTL refusing to pay compensation/refund for loss of service
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by fatnose12
I went to customer service first, NFU, Then to the MD. The customer service manager at Luton, who sent the senior field tech? Fixed. Then it went again and I contacted a 0845 number which the tech guy had given me, which was tech support in Swansea. They then sorted the problem out, If I have to speak to someone in India I will hang up, most of my banking and CCards are in call centres in India. And most of the time couldnt find the own backside in the dark if someone set fire to it and gave them a map
... boring (yawn)

timmyf2371 27-02-2005 08:26
Re: Help - NTL refusing to pay compensation/refund for loss of service
 
Your best bet may be to read up on the Sale of Goods act and also the Unfair Contract Terms act.

Firstly, the Unfair Contract Terms act states that a trader selling goods cannot exclude liability for a breach of a consumerââ‚à ƒâ€šÃ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢s rights under the Sale of Goods Act. With regards to services, contractual exclusion clauses are not illegal but they are not enforceable if they are unreasonable - something which ntl's attempt to get out of paying compensation could very well be deemed as.

Now, onto the Sale of Goods act.

 According to the DTI website, any goods supplied in the course of the service must be as described, of satisfactory quality and fit for their purpose. If they are not the consumer is entitled to a repair, replacement or compensation. It also mentions that any goods supplied in the course of the service must be as described, of satisfactory quality and fit for their purpose. If they are not the consumer is entitled to a repair, replacement or compensation.

I'd be interested to see how ntl staff would try and escape their obligations under the above mentioned acts.

scrotnig 27-02-2005 10:40
Re: Help - NTL refusing to pay compensation/refund for loss of service
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by timmyf2371
If they are not the consumer is entitled to a repair, replacement or compensation.
But only if they actually inform the vendor at the time. The vendor is not expected to be psychic!

The vendor is also not expected to offer anything if the buyer informs them months later that something went wrong months earlier. Expediency is expected within this law.

Chris W 27-02-2005 10:40
Re: Help - NTL refusing to pay compensation/refund for loss of service
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by timmyf2371
Your best bet may be to read up on the Sale of Goods act and also the Unfair Contract Terms act.

Firstly, the Unfair Contract Terms act states that a trader selling goods cannot exclude liability for a breach of a consumerââ‚à ƒâ€šÃ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢s rights under the Sale of Goods Act. With regards to services, contractual exclusion clauses are not illegal but they are not enforceable if they are unreasonable - something which ntl's attempt to get out of paying compensation could very well be deemed as.

Now, onto the Sale of Goods act.

 According to the DTI website, any goods supplied in the course of the service must be as described, of satisfactory quality and fit for their purpose. If they are not the consumer is entitled to a repair, replacement or compensation. It also mentions that any goods supplied in the course of the service must be as described, of satisfactory quality and fit for their purpose. If they are not the consumer is entitled to a repair, replacement or compensation.

I'd be interested to see how ntl staff would try and escape their obligations under the above mentioned acts.
hmm good try... but not guaranteeing a fault free service on a residential contract is not unreasonable. It is also reasonable to expect a customer to report a fault that they are having-> otherwise the company may have no way of telling that there is a problem, and therefore can't do anything to resolve it.

With regards to your second comment- a customer will get a repair/replacement modem etc when necessary- but this can only be organised if the fault is reported. Again, it will happen within a "reasonable" time- perfectly acceptable within a residential contract.

A business contract will have Service Level Agreements and compensation for breach of these, but this is completely different to the consumer residential contract- the way of dealing with faults/compensation in ntl residential contracts is not unreasonable.

scrotnig 27-02-2005 10:42
Re: Help - NTL refusing to pay compensation/refund for loss of service
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by monkeybreath
the way of dealing with faults/compensation in ntl residential contracts is not unreasonable.
And it's not illegal either.

Have you noticed the number of people on this site who suddenly think that they and they alone have found a hole in a contract that dozens of highly paid qualified lawyers have failed to spot? Makes me snigger it does.

Chris W 27-02-2005 10:56
Re: Help - NTL refusing to pay compensation/refund for loss of service
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by scrotnig
And it's not illegal either.

Have you noticed the number of people on this site who suddenly think that they and they alone have found a hole in a contract that dozens of highly paid qualified lawyers have failed to spot? Makes me snigger it does.
yep i have! tis nice to see people investigating their legal rights through, but it is best to leave the interpreting of contracts to those with the legal qualifications. The ntl contract will have been written by a team of highly paid solicitors so i am sure it is legal :)

scrotnig 27-02-2005 11:12
Re: Help - NTL refusing to pay compensation/refund for loss of service
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by monkeybreath
yep i have! tis nice to see people investigating their legal rights through, but it is best to leave the interpreting of contracts to those with the legal qualifications. The ntl contract will have been written by a team of highly paid solicitors so i am sure it is legal :)
On here lately, people don't "investigate" their legal rights, they simply make them up themselves and swear blind they are correct.

gooner4life 27-02-2005 11:18
Re: Help - NTL refusing to pay compensation/refund for loss of service
 
Jesus H - fatnose the problem in Luton was oversubscription on the UBR's NTL have now added another UBR for most areas in luton and surrounding (stevenage, Hitchin, Hatfield etc), I know because I was the poor schmuck working overnight to help the Headend tech.

I worked in the Luton office before they made us redundant and people like you were the absolute pits to deal with, maybe if you spoke to people like human beings they would be a little bit more forward in resolving your issue.

And I had to laugh at this entire thread really - Help I didnt report a problem that my neighbour had but it looks like I can get a free lunch :mad: people in this country today

ian@huth 27-02-2005 11:37
Re: Help - NTL refusing to pay compensation/refund for loss of service
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by timmyf2371
Your best bet may be to read up on the Sale of Goods act and also the Unfair Contract Terms act.

Firstly, the Unfair Contract Terms act states that a trader selling goods cannot exclude liability for a breach of a consumerââ‚à ƒâ€šÃ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢s rights under the Sale of Goods Act. With regards to services, contractual exclusion clauses are not illegal but they are not enforceable if they are unreasonable - something which ntl's attempt to get out of paying compensation could very well be deemed as.

Now, onto the Sale of Goods act.

 According to the DTI website, any goods supplied in the course of the service must be as described, of satisfactory quality and fit for their purpose. If they are not the consumer is entitled to a repair, replacement or compensation. It also mentions that any goods supplied in the course of the service must be as described, of satisfactory quality and fit for their purpose. If they are not the consumer is entitled to a repair, replacement or compensation.

I'd be interested to see how ntl staff would try and escape their obligations under the above mentioned acts.
If you care to research further you will find that the first step if you have a problem is to contact the vendor and give them the opportunity to rectify the problem. Until you do that the law would say that no problem exists. If you delay informing the vendor then the law would assume that the problem is of little consequence to you and therefore would not involve the payment of any compensation. The vendor would only be liable to pay compensation if he failed to rectify the problem in a reasonable time after being notified of it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by monkeybreath
yep i have! tis nice to see people investigating their legal rights through, but it is best to leave the interpreting of contracts to those with the legal qualifications. The ntl contract will have been written by a team of highly paid solicitors so i am sure it is legal :)
I agree with what you say to a point except for the last sentance. The laws of this land are written by very highly qualified legal people but how many loopholes are found in them? :)


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