Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

Do you really want a first lady with a huge backside? :erm:

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

Kanye West is not serious, I doubt he even has the organisation in place to get on the ballot across the states. Long term 3rd party candidates with a long history of contesting American Presidental Elections have struggled to do that.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

Kanye West is a three way marginal. Anyone could win it.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

Well, he's missed the cut off date for six states, and he has an album out soon, so I think this may, just may, be a publicity stunt.

---------- Post added at 12:57 ---------- Previous post was at 12:56 ----------

I see what you did there... :D

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

Don't think Trump can claim the upper hand on mental stability :erm:

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

Trump is barmy but that does not mean I have to have a melt down every time he speaks.

But Biden being nominated for the Democratic Presidential Candidate, give me a break....

Biden's latest Gaffes to date, top 30. :rofl:

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

Here’s some of Trump’s best words...

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

Joe Biden, Kanye West, Donald Trump. They're all up there in the stakes of orating incoherence with Donald seeming to have passed the point of finishing his sentences.

Kanye West does at least have the benefit of being able to burst into song if speech fails him. ;)

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

I dont recall President Obama being a white geriatric :dozey:

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

Biden is a weak candidate from what was a weak field. I thought Warren might be a bit better but here we are.

One thing that might help them is that Biden is from the old guard of the party and more to the right of a lot of where their supporters might have hoped he would be. To the right of Warren and Sanders for sure.

He is unlikely to be drawn into a culture war and no one thinks Biden is from the 'far-left'. He isn't as divisive as Clinton either. If he stays boring he might be enough simply that he isn't Trump, his best months of the campaign so far has been when he does nothing and leaves Trump to tweet.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

The Trump admin. has officially notified the UN of its withdrawal from the World Health Organization, a White House official says.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/don...m_npd_nn_tw_ma

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

Obviously, the headline is no revelation. The insight here is Donald Trump's approach arose from ensuring his father, Fred Trump, did not treat him with the scorn he had with his eldest son, Freddie
https://www.ft.com/content/2df89e5a-...a-bd618b8a8968

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

We got all this crap in 2016, since then there has been book after book of attacks on the president. He had 12 or so women make allegations of sexual misconduct against him, who then all mysteriously vanished after he won the presidency. We had a tape where we saw and heard in his own words, he “loved to grab women by the pussy.”

After all that, he still won. We know who he is now, trouble is, we knew who he was then. And who have we got this time as his rival for the presidency, Joe Biden. Good god man, if people think Biden is the answer to the potential “lunacy” of an extended Trump presidency, “four more years”, they will be sadly mistaken. This is the issue I had in 2016, I saw the Democratic Party for what was and still is, pathetic, and I saw Hillary Clinton for who she was and what she got away with and I still stand by today, that I’m glad she lost.

I have no real preference this year, (Damien, are you going to start another U.S Election thread? ;) )

I can put up with another 4 years of Trump. But Biden, I think is another Democrat party mistake, putting forward who they thought was a prize star, is actually turning out to be a bit of a senile lemon.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

I don't have a problem with Trump. In the face of tides of opposition he's trying to make America and it's people the first in the queue.

I'd rather have him than an arse licking toady of the politically correct brigade that tries to please the world and gets nothing done . . at huge cost.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

My issue is his basic competence which has meant too many of his citizens are first in the queue for Covid 19. At huge cost.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

Yes but we can thank China and WHO for that. WHO got this massively wrong in the beginning, China on the one hand trying to cover it up, WHO on the other hand, saying this was not a person to person transmission virus.

Getting this wrong in the beginning was costly and deadly, that was not Trump's fault. I know people like to instantly blame the guy but Covid-19 is not his fault.

How he's responded to it and how every single State in America has, remember it's the Governors of each State which decide what it is in lockdown, not the President of the United States (even though Trump erroneously made the claim he has the power).

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

The primary responsibility for handling Covid-19, lies with the individual states and their Governors. Just as Boris isn't responsible for Scotland, Wales, or NI.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

The problem I see is that you have two mainstream political parties, that are so entrenched in a bitter war with each other and they're constantly in stalemate. People might think Trump is unpopular, but Congress, favoured even less popular.

In 2013. Congress was less popular than toenail fungus and cockroaches.

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/nation/...nd-cockroaches

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

If only there were some form of over-arching institution, that could use National facilities and organisations to give direction and support to the individual States, and gather and distribute resources and information in a focused way to help those States most in need of support, and perhaps the Head of this institution could promulgate the messages and information the Health professionals gave them, to ensure consistent and accurate messaging...

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

So, so many ways that Trump has had a truly negative impact on Covid 19 reduction. Be it in advocating non-mask-wearing, talking down the problem, holding rallies and most recently, trying to get the universities to open up! That's off the top of my head.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

So how does any of that explain the major outbreaks in New York State, which mostly came BEFORE any of that. How is "most recently" relevant? When was mask wearing generally advocated anywhere in the world(India seems to be an exception, there may be others)?:rolleyes: Trying going out and about and see people shopping etc.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

And yet BLM can protest in their thousands and not give a shit about spreading the virus, and I don’t see you condemning them, typical one sided rubbish from you again Andrew.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

The virus has only been going a few months. Discrimination against black people has been going on for centuries. I'd be protesting too.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

They are both as culpable as each other as even now there are a lot of people still ignoring the social distancing guidelines.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

The question was about Trump's impact on CV-19 not an analysis of every protest group's impact on CV-19. I'm not in favour of mass gatherings such as these at the moment or at the time.

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These links illustrate sadly how the Trump administration's actions and inactions have assisted in the country sadly having such a high death and infection rate from Covid-19. The FT one is free.

https://www.ft.com/content/97dc7de6-...d-371e24b679ed


https://www.americanprogress.org/iss...onomic-crisis/

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/11/u...-response.html

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

And spreading the virus, disgraceful. :rolleyes:

5 black kids were killed at weekend in America by other black people. WTF don’t their lives matter?

Protesting that is now getting hijacked by a leftie mob and cancel everything culture.

---------- Post added at 23:13 ---------- Previous post was at 23:10 ----------

I’ve told you previously to stop posting links to news items behind a paywall.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

I don't get your point. :confused:
None of those links is behind a paywall. The FT usually is but as I've pointed out, it's free.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

Yes what did happen to them, seem to remember donny promised publicly in 2016 to sue everyone involved from the accusers to the newspapers publishing the details, speaking of promises he's broken their supreme court might make a decision on his tax returns today to.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

From FT article.
As I said, It had been going on before. The primary responsibility for actually doing anything was at State level.
Trump suggested imposing a lockdown on certain States. Those States kicked up a fuss, saying he had no authority to do that.

Link
All policies set at State level.
As I posted earlier, testing criteria, again, was set at State level. The tests are not done just at Federal facilities. It is just a type of test done in hospitals etc, that is done every day for other diseases.

Link

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

Absolute rubbish, he’s broken no promises on Supreme Court, in fact he’s more than fulfilled them with two Justices and literally filled most vacant seats for court judges around country and most of the appointees are young, so Trump has shaped the judicial arm of the land for decades with Conservative judges, a probable move by the Senate Majority leader, Mitch McConnell, to get as many of the Trump nominees confirmed by the Senate, while they control it to block local Democrat policies and litigation.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

Not really sure how you've extrapolated that from what was posted but I'll try and be clearer for you, he promised to sue everyone involved in the allegations live on tv and he promised to release his tax returns live on tv, he's done neither and now their supreme court is making the decision on his tax returns for him, possibly today

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

So were the Tax returns of former Presidents that were from the dim and distant past released? A key difference with other Presidents, is that his will be dominated by business, not personal.
Link

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

Missing the point with links and whataboutery are tried and trusted techniques for you, fortunately though just about everyone on this forum sees straight through it.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

FACT: There is no legal requirement for sitting Presidents to release their tax returns, and certainly not from the dim and distant past. It is trying to impose a new requirement that was never there before.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

FACT: He said he would release his tax returns, then didn’t.

In 2016
https://www.nbcnews.com/nightly-news...al-87106629958

In 2014
https://edition.cnn.com/videos/polit...comment-nr.cnn

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

Actually he said much later than that he would release his tax returns, when Crooked Hillary Clinton released her 33,000 missing, deleted emails.

Tell me this Hugh, why hasn’t she been indicted for many violations and potential crimes, like destroying evidence, i.e the deleted emails, smashing up phones and laptops, tablets, classified emails of hers found on an unauthorised system and more crucially, later discovered to be in possession of an unauthorised person, Antony Weiner's laptop.

This was a serious breach of classification laws, don’t see the FBI knocking on her door. But then they wouldn’t be when they, Peter Strzok and his mistress Lisa Page, also with FBI were touting for her victory in the 2016 election. I do wonder how they managed to do any work or have time for rumpy pumpy, when all they appeared to do was text each other of their dismay of Trump.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

Weren't the e-mails to Weiner classified after he had received them? I seem to remember something like that.

As for Trump, this isn't a mandated thing but now the result of an investigation New York state is doing. It won't come out until after the election now anyway.

---------- Post added at 11:50 ---------- Previous post was at 11:48 ----------

Probably should be in the future. It's odd the clearance to run for the President seems to have less disclosure than most other checks for high-level jobs. Obviously those jobs don't require it gets released to the public but they're the ones 'hiring' you in the end.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

It's purely a partisan fishing expedition.

Not much detail in tax returns. Just 2 pages looking at his 2005 return. Although the amended one for the Clintons for 2003 is 32 pages.
Love the bit on the 32nd page where it asks if you to contribute $3 to the Presidential Election Campaign Fund.:D

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

Does seem odd but then is there such a need for disclosure for our own government let alone the PM?

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

Well it was one thing that David Cameron did

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/t...come-and-gains

And I suppose it depends on what general oversight they have in the US compared to the UK Parliament Register of Interests, and the way tax works in the UK vs the US.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

Just read, Trump Commutes sentence of Rodger Stone, Stone had been sentenced to 40 months in jail and was due to report to jail on Tuesday but a very pissed off Don has stepped in and Commuted his sentence, his criminal record remains, so is not a full pardon which actually wipes the slate clean of any convicted person. I had a feeling he would either Pardon or Commute Roger Stones Federal prison sentence.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

Exactly Hugh, I can't be bothered to reply to that other chap, lifes to short but when someone looks down the camera more than once and says I absolutely will release them once the elections over and doesn't that to me is as good as breaking your word and for me that's unforgivable of anyone, in any walk of life. What should imo make it even more aggravating for everyone else is the fuss he made demanding Obama's records be released.


Got any thoughts on this? Mine is that the leader of a country pardoning someone found guilty by a jury of being nefarious to protect said leader is not a good look no matter how justified that leader claims it to be

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

I can honestly say I have no clue who Rodger Stone is.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

No me neither really, certainly couldn't pick him out of a line up!!

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

A Trump friend found guilty of witness tampering and lying to the Muller inquiry. Not the end of the world and his sentence being commuted is no surprise.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roger_Stone

Should bring everyone up to speed.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

Trump doesn't need protecting, he was acquitted in his Impeachment trial by the Senate. Had he commuted the sentence of Stone while the Robert Mueller investigation had been still live, then I would be nodding in agreement with you.

But Stone claims he was setup, also said his trial was met with unconstitutional blocks to his defense.

You need to re-read what I wrote, he has not pardoned him, he has commuted his sentence, the conviction remains on file. A Pardon removes all federal convictions and sentence is dropped, if time is still being served in a U.S Penitentiary.

You go look at who and what past presidents have pardoned, Bill Clinton pardoned his own brother.

There is no review of pardons. There have been historical attempts to curb the presidential pardon power, to no avail. This issue, too, was brought up in the Constitutional Convention, that pardons must be granted with the consent of the US Senate, but the measure was defeated on the vote of eight states to one.

The President need not provide a reason for a pardon and the courts and Congress have no legal authority to approve, disapprove, reject, or accept a pardon. Currently, the only way to change the pardon power is by constitutional amendment.

Clinton pardoned his older brother, Roger, for obvious familial reasons. He pardoned a pair of Hasidic Jews convicted of defrauding the government, restoring their civil rights but leaving monetary penalties intact.

In a controversial move, he pardoned fugitive financier Marc Rich, after application for clemency, in part, from the state of Israel, which had benefited from Rich's philanthropic gestures, a Federal Prosecutor was appointed to investigate this pardon, however they were later replaced by one and only, James Comey, who expressed that there were no illegalities in Clinton's pardon of Marc Rich.

President Gerald Ford pardoned President Nixon of any wrong-doing in order to put a close to the Nixon era for good.

President Jimmy Carter, pardoned all the Vietnam War draft dodgers to help in the long healing process the nation endured after that war.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

The pardon or ability to commute sentences is really dodgy but I think the main problem is when people use it for their friends and family as is the case with Clinton and Trump. Most of the time it does seem to be used reasonably responsibly.

What they should certainly do is remove the ability to pardon anyone between the November election and Inauguration if you are on the way out. Clinton's pardoning of his brother happened just before Bush took over. Obama's pardoning of Chelsea Manning happened just before Trump.

Each President seems to have one dodgy Pardon when they know it's their last time at it.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

Was he protecting him before or after his acquittal?

Judging by how close the Bush Gore election was I'm hardly going out on a limb by saying Clinton pardoning Rich got Bush over the line into the White House. Another one that springs to my mind is Casper Weinberger over Iran Contra, that had a certain kind of stench about it to.

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If I lived there the question in my mind would be, is it being used how it was intended to be when created, if it isn't it should be ammended or scrapped imo

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

There's a difference between releasing information to the public and the authorities. High judges have all sort of personal information combed over but that doesn't mean the newspapers get it.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

But an interesting fact arose just before Trump Impeachment trial at the beginning of the year. Former presidents can still be Impeached, the power to do so is in the Constitution, however, the primary objective of "Impeachment", is to remove from office, it would be extremely rare for it to be exercised after a president left office.

If Congress, in 1974 had imagined the possibility of President Richard Nixon, rehabilitating his reputation to a point where he may have thought to have a chance at holding a future office however much very unlikely it sounds, there is an absolute chance, a bipartisan House and Senate steaming ahead with an impeachment and trial, in order to bar that possibility through a judgement of disqualification.

---------- Post added at 12:58 ---------- Previous post was at 12:29 ----------

I do not agree it should be scrapped but it does seem that the pardon power oversteps the balance of powers of the other two branches of government, the legislature, House and Senate and Judicial branch, the Supreme Court, however, could a Supreme Court rule a pardon null and void, probably not, because the Supreme Court is bound by the written Constitution, that's why an amendment is required to change the system.

The Pardon and Commutation powers when used correctly do serve a purpose, Trump granted Clemency to one time drug trafficker, an African American woman, Alice Johnson, who was sentenced to life imprisonment with no chance of parole, in 1996, upon her release, she had already served over 21 years in prison, an absolute excessive sentence IMO. A campaign was sought to get her released, a petition was filed for her release, while President Obama was in office. Her application was denied just before Obama left office.

Re: Trump gets fact checked
 

Yeah, I think there is a role for pardons in the case of genuine injustices being corrected. Sometimes it's also used by a President to signal a change in policy. I.E Obama also pardoned a bunch of people who were serving long term sentences for drug possession who were basically caught out by the three-strikes rule. People could end up with lifetime sentences for minor drug possession charges.