Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

As I made clear above, I mean support. In the US Supreme Court there are Constitutional originalists and those who think that it is a framework and thus open to interpretation.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Living_Constitution

Both views have perfectly valid arguments. I am a supporter of a living framework for our legal system. Many things would've been written into law if they were known about and a legal framework needs to be flexible to adapt to new challenges and more importantly, that people should respect the intention, as well as the letter of the law.

If a bad law is created, the best way to prove it is bad, and thus punish whoever thought it via the democratic process. In the case of Tax law, if certain tax classes are too high, then push for them to be lowered. In a country which running a deficit however, that is certainly up for debate.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Everyone's talking about tax havens and I hear a lot of TV commentators criticising them but how many of them run their affairs as limited companies to avoid tax? All perfectly legal of course but they can wind up earing far more and paying far less tax than ordinary people. Is that more of less morally wrong than having funds offshore and avoiding tax that way?

http://www.bytestart.co.uk/limited-c...dvantages.html

A quick check of the Companies House website will reveal how many wealthy celebrity types run their affairs in this manner.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Good news! Thanks for the link Hugh. :tu:

---------- Post added at 13:24 ---------- Previous post was at 13:08 ----------

And the not so wealthy. In my sector many one-man-bands like myself run our affairs this way and not just for tax purposes. As a limited company clients, suppliers etc can only sue the company, not myself personally, so long as I have acted in good faith and professionally. Only company assets can be siezed in pursuit of defaulted debt payments.

It is also the case that many larger companies that come to the independant sector prefer to work with a properly constituted limited company that is also VAT registered. I take care of payroll, VAT, dividends, liability insurance and sending out quotes, whilst the client just deals with specifications, contracts / purchase orders and final payment.

There is one other aspect where HMRC really needs to tighten up is where somebody, like a footballer, is only really employed by one employer (The club) and is likely to be in contravention of IR35. They seem to wangle a way round this.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Tax schemes usually operate within the letter of the law and are legal ,the only reason they fail is because a tribunal rules that more tax is due because certain criteria have not been met negating the benefits of the scheme .Tax evasion is the deliberate attempt to not pay tax through misrepresentation of facts.You simply cannot say that all schemes are evasion because they are not and 20% of people using such schemes face no penalties at all and even more have the liability reduced on appeal .Tax evasion makes you a criminal ,tax avoidance does not even if more tax is due after the tribunal.

Only in the court of public opinion .

Here's an example of deliberate avoidance .I had a choice a month ago to either buy a new van for work outright or lease one for 3 yrs , I chose leasing because the cost is 100% allowable against tax thus reducing my tax burden ,do you think that is acceptable or do you think i should be forced to take the less tax efficient option of purchasing a van because the country is getting less tax ?

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

That goes without saying of course, they're probably the majority. However, plenty of wealthy and high profile people do it simply as an easy way to avoid large amounts of tax. Think of some of our best known personalities and put their names into the Companies House website then see how many turn up their as directors with partners as secretaries etc. It's certainly not illegal but it is being done in many cases primarily for tax avoidance IMHO and I dare say a lot of major organisations also benefit from engaging their services by that means too - i.e. by not actually being their employer with all that entails.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Not only in the court of public opinion, but the opinion of HMRC and thus the Government of this country. As stated above, they now have the right to review any tax schemes before they are enacted and can rule them illegal. Before they had to discover them and then rule upon them.

Again, I am not saying that all schemes are illegal. If they are cleared by HMRC, then by all means, go ahead. However, the cycle of schemes that were re-written purely to get around rulings against them was dubious at best.

And no, your example is a case of intention of tax laws. Leasing is tax efficient for a reason. If you however said you were leasing for tax purposes but in fact bought it using a shell company (That you owned and controlled, but did not declare to HMRC) and "leased it" from there (i.e. from yourself) in order to claim the tax relief, that would be evasion*.

* Probably, this isn't legal advice.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Interesting article from the Spectator

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Well Saudi-Arabia doesn't have tax, but their names are on it, likely for .... other reasons.

I think the greater fall out from all this will be about the outright criminal money laundering rather than the simple tax evasion.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Yeah. BBc R4 ran an interesting programme on Tuesday night about how these companies are used by people who shouldn't have access to international financial institutions because they are subject to sanctions or are funding terrorists.

---------- Post added at 21:30 ---------- Previous post was at 21:11 ----------

Will the Guardian now investigate its own tax arrangements?
Amazing, gobsmacking hypocrisy. You couldn't make it up! :dozey:

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Dave's going to resign!

can you believe that the hypocrite with the slap head who thinks he's God is going to resign?!

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Bless...

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

You sound like my gran again.

can you go and find my post where I said ages ago about Dave, money and running abroad with it?

good boy :)

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Your understanding of finance is only exceeded by your wit.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

DC has lied to the Country, so he should resign. Osborne, walked out of an interview as he was asked about the Haven.

Why do you think all these millionaires, have so much money. Because they put there accounts oversea's.

If it was Joe Bloggs, we would get nicked. The same applies to DC. He should resign

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

http://www.itv.com/news/2016-04-07/d...ffshore-trust/

Which taxes did he avoid, Arthur?

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Does anyone actually understand what Cameron is alleged to have done or not? Everyone is angry, it's all over the papers and I don't understand it and suspect most people reading it don't understand either. We need to know more than 'tax haven' because if, as the interview said, he said tax on it then what taxes did he dodge?

God I wish some papers would just print a unbiased fact-check of why/how etc of these kinds of stories.

It's impossible to form a fair judgement of this if you don't understand what 'it' is.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Strange that Tessa Jowell got away with being involved with dodging paying tax and laundering money and Geoffrey Robinson got away being involved with a multimillion pound trust.

Quote:

Mr Robinson - a former chief executive of Jaguar Cars - is reported in the Independent on Sunday to be the beneficiary of an offshore trust with assets of more than £12m.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

I think the main reason why people are calling on DC to resign, is that after three or four dismissals, he has admitted that he DID have dealings in the Tax Haven, and sold them the shares in 2010 (according to Sky News).

Therefore he lied, and was PM at the time. He criticised lots of people, plus he said that he would BLOCK the tax haven scandal.

BUT, he was involved in the scandal HIMSELF. Therefore, he should do the honourable thing and resign.

This is what l think they are demanding.

He, l believe has breached the 'integrity and honesty code of MPs. and as he is the MAIN MAN, he should quit.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

People are smelling a rat with David Cameron at the moment. It's his own fault (or the fault of his advisors). When he's changed the story is it four or five times now it makes him look like he's squirming and has got more to tell. On the news tonight he looked very uncomfortable and the bead of sweat on his chin just made him look more shifty.

He's not done himself any favours these last few days and I reckon it'll be sometime until we hear him or George Osborne tell us we're all in it together because if nothing else he's shown that some of us are more in it than others.

Cheers

Grim

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

It was legal at the time. As long as tax is paid on any money coming out, that is all that matters. The company could have been based anywhere but the UK, and still not paid UK tax. Eg I could buy shares in a US company and that company not be liable for UK tax.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

I'm not bothered about it tbf. I'm more bothered about the way he called out the likes of Jimmy Carr for stuff like this.

As far as I'm aware, it was legal and paid UK taxes upon being withdrawn back to a UK account as well as occurring before he was even PM

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Starting with Cameron, he's in the clear legally, but boy has he made a hash of getting there. Going from "Nope, it's private" to "What tax haven funds, never seen them" to "Well I may have had shares but I put it through HMRC" was pretty dumb.

I don't think he's done anything wrong, but his "crime" is truth evasion, rather than tax evasion. No, he doesn't need to resign, and I'm sure he took his approach out of dis-respect to the press rather than the taxpayer, but it doesn't set a good example for honesty in politics.

Anyway, yes we are nowhere near the full facts of this whole leak due to the sheer magnitude of it. I want there to be a proper analysis of the "big" cases here categorised (By impartial economic experts, not journalists):

1: Tax Avoidance, those people who used Panama as a source of privacy, not to break the law
2: Tax Evaders, the people who used Panama as a way to lie to tax authorities and hide wealth from proper taxation.
3: Dodgy dealings, money laundering, sanctions evasion etc.

At the moment, we keep on getting spoonfed information that journalists are crowing about looking dodgy, but using ambiguous language as THEY likely don't know if it is category 1 or 2 either. Things like Cameron's family affairs are being presented as category 1 by some parts of the media when there is little actual evidence to suggest it when you properly look at it.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

I see Tom Watson is accusing the PM of hypocrisy by gaining money from an offshore company.

Is this the same Tom Watson, who accepted a donation from Sir Trevor Chinn, Senior Advisor to CVC Capital Partners, which is based in the Cayman Islands?

http://search.electoralcommission.or...tions/C0238610

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trevor_Chinn

http://powerbase.info/index.php/CVC_Capital_Partners

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Heh, not shocked one bit.

The joy of political muck slinging, everyone ends up covered in it.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Nothing surprises me from whatever party it is as most of them seem to have their noses in the trough.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Assuming everything Cameron says is true, the remaining implication Tom Watson seems to be running with, is that he profited from an overseers company helping people avoid tax.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

I saw this guy on the BBC news this morning.

BBC

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

That gentleman clearly knows his onions.

I'll repeat what I said before, that we need to find the truly dodgy stuff and hit those guys hard. People in the media have seen "Cameron" and have gone nuts without actually understanding what they're going nuts about. If the financial and legal industry are looking at this and saying a collective "meh" then it's nothing to really care about.

Of course, that's not going to happen. When have the media ever taken a pragmatic view on anything?

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

As long as income was declared on the money people paid in and any money paid out to them, then all is above board. It could be one person is liable for tax in the UK, another in Germany, and another in Monaco. The tax would be paid in the appropriate countries.

But if somebody receives a payment from a tax haven, and doesn't declare it as income and uses it to pay off a loan that was contrived to sidestep money laundering checks, then that is corrupt and criminal. But not apparently if a Labour Minister is involved, ie Tessa Jowell.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Maybe it's another Tom Watson and someone who isn't a hypocrite. :rolleyes:

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

I see the 'usual suspects' are trying to deflect any criticism from St. Dave ;)

He's been caught with his pants down as can be seen seen from his bright red complexion in interviews he gave yesterday. He had the opportunity to be clear earlier in the week, but the truth has had to be slowly wrung out of him. The plonker wrote a letter to other EU leaders on 2013 advising against offshore trusts being opened to scrutiny, wonder why? Saying one thing and doing another, silly boy. He may not have done anything illegal, but he's certainly been hypocritical. He's doomed, just a question of when and which inbred public schoolboy is next.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Could you point out what illegal act he has committed, or which taxes he hasn't paid, or is that irrelevant?

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Don't think you've read my post Hugh.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Not Gideon:

Linky

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

So he should have said earlier in the week that he had paid all his tax and not committed any illegal acts?

So he's been hypocritical by selling his shares before he became PM, three years before he sent the letter to the EU.

The thing is, people like Tom Watson are comparing apples and anchovies, and deliberately conflating two different things to create a cloud of confusion and smear.Jimmy Carr's (and others) schemes were to avoid paying tax on dividends and earnings, whilst it has been shown that any dividends and earnings from Blairmore shares were taxed in the country of the share-owners' residence, in Mr. Cameron's case, the UK. But let's not let facts get in the way of a witch-hunt.

Regarding the letter to the EU, here is the actual information, rather than Tom Watson's twisted version of it - context is all.

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/0e7c0a20-f...#axzz45EpVDNix

btw, your inverted snobbery is showing with phrases like 'inbred public schoolboy' - I am sure you would be the first up in arms if someone called you a common inbred working-class oik, but it's OK to do the reverse.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Was he supposed to declare his off shore activities in the register of members interests? Wonder if the committee for standards in public life will be interested.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Only if the shareholding was worth more than a year's salary - an MP's salary in 2009 was £64,766, and the shares were sold in 2010 for around £30k.

http://www.publications.parliament.u.../735/73504.htm

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016...m-fathers-off/
Apparently they are going to be wanting a word with Dave. And JC has to overtaken him in the popularity ratings... Never mind Dave, at least there's no Scottish/welsh/council/London mayor/referendum votes imminent... ;)

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

The registers(past and present) are available on the internet and so are the rules(past and present). At some point everything will have been handed over to a blind trust, so that he would have no idea what was going on.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2016/04/21.jpg

On his way to the airport with suitcases full of money :)

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Look at it this way. The arrangement maximised income for the shareholders, which in turn MAXIMISED the tax they paid.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

I will look forward to a labour landslide in the election then. LOL

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Gary L at home




See what I did there? Random picture, attach words to it :dozey::D

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

A letter in Friday's Times.

http://www.offshoreumbrellacompanies...x-avoider-too/

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Now if l hear any more politicians come out with "We are all in this together" then they will get this :upyours:

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

I think a new phrase is needed: "They're all in it together"

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Its still early in the morning old bean.:)

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

It's nothing like the Jimmy Carr affair . Jimmy Carr used the K2 avoidance scheme ,Cameron invested £12,000 in an offshore bank account and paid tax on the profit from the interest he earned

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

I think the shares issue is a sideshow..I want more pressure/leverage being used to get this government to actually to ensure more transparency over offshore companies/individuals tax affairs and to finally get some of the tax being salted away back into this country's coffers so we can pay down the country's debt.

Soon there is going to be no more fat to pare down to pay off that debt.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

It may have escaped your notice, but in this country tax is NOT paid on capital or money invested. It is paid on the income that arises from it.

If the fund had been set up in a non-tax haven country that wasn't the UK, the amount of UK tax paid wouldn't have been any more and might have been less as the tax on the company income(rather than the fund income) would have cut into the dividends and REDUCED the UK tax paid by any UK shareholders.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Would you be happy having all your financial affairs posted for all to see .I think things are getting ridiculous now where people are pilloried for being well off or financially astute

---------- Post added at 10:14 ---------- Previous post was at 10:07 ----------

Here's another way to look at this. This country has one of the lowest corporation tax limits in the world meaning that companies set up here instead of other countries because the tax rate is lower ,most definitely tax avoidance just of the sort we approve of because we benefit

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Some folks clearly are so keen to jump on the hate bandwagon that they haven't bothered to first take a look at their own affairs. There is an astonishing amount of hypocrisy going on right now and Cameron's certainly isn't going to be the only red face which is going to be exposed for all to see. Of course they rely on the often short and highly selective memories of those they aim to influence. Unfounded innuendo is all that's required for some people to present as facts...

It's all rather familiar isn't it - the usual suspects rushing rabidly to grab the headlines before they scuttle off when their cynical opportunism backfires and they're exposed to be what they really are.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

For info, here is a table of Countries Corporation Taxes.

https://home.kpmg.com/xx/en/home/ser...tes-table.html

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

I see those 'thousands' are out marching again, this time demanding Cameron's resignation about well, I'm not sure they really know ,apart from him being a Tory who at this stage has done nothing illegal and something an awful lot of other people/organisations have done (including those who've queued up to stick the knife in) without too much scrutiny or complaint from anyone much.

Anyway, from what little I've seen so far, the 'thousands' don't seem to be that many and I'm actually wondering whether they're the same countless 'thousands' who thronged towards and managed to half fill Trafalgar Square a while back to worship the likes of Corbyn and Sturgeon as they denounced Trident.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...pers-leak.html

Wow I'm staggered by the numbers who feel so outraged. :rolleyes:

(* 'Thousands' sounds a lot more impressive than 2 or 3 thousand doesn't it.)

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

yes its awful when people play tricks with numbers and hide the true facts about those numbers ;)

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

You have deliberately misunderstood me.My financial affairs are beyond reproach so I have nothing to worry about..and I'm not envious at all for people who are hard working and making money.I just want tax loopholes plugged and for there to be less avenues for money laundering and for EVERYONE to pay their fair share of the tax burden.It's criminality I want to be sorted out.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

This.:tu:

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Even more so when they actually break the law doing so eh? ;)

Anyway having heard Red Ken pontificating oh so morally again this morning on LBC I found this interesting:

http://order-order.com/2016/04/08/ke...tax-hypocrisy/

On LBC this morning he actually called Cameron "the most dishonest prime-minister of my lifetime..."

Maybe his memory is as suspect as his morals.

:rofl:

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

It's the old 'throw enough *stuff against the wall, some of it might stick' ploy - see Tom Watson, John Mann for other examples; they both knew the value of Cameron's shareholding was under the reporting limit, but still bloviated on about it anyway....

*ordure

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Given that Cameron's the stay's fan boi, sticking mud is a Brexit's dream.:D

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

I seem to recall Livingstone using ignorance of his financial affairs as an excuse. Odd how he seems to be more interested in Cameron's than his own? :confused:

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/mayor...t-7660632.html

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Really I thought it was the old stall, tell half truths and general sneakieness that allowed for the muck to be slung. If he'd told the truth at the start this would've gone away in an afternoon and I still don't think he's being truthful about not benefiting from off shore cash.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

well he's in the limelight now

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...pers-leak.html

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

I agree that he should have told it all at the beginning - that was an error on his part (which he has owned).

---------- Post added at 21:15 ---------- Previous post was at 21:13 ----------

Class War and Socialist Worker - it doesn't take much to get them marching.... ;)

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

The usual suspects.

Still waiting for any of Gary's predictions to come to fruition... :D

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

I think the problem is with all this, is quite simple. When someone becomes a councillor or MP. They have to disclose anything to do with a second job, financies.

This is what DC has failed to do, with the tax haven. And the worse thing is that he critised heavily people that were doing this, and he was going to close these havens.

And hey, he had shares in a Tax Haven, he sold these shares. So what did he do with the money ?

To me DC is a hypocrite, he may not have done anything illegal - as people have said. But he has lied, lied and lied about the whole issue.

And he should do the honourable thing and resign.

IF, he had told the relevant people about this, then everything would be fine.

Its like me, if l told a future employer on an application form that l didn't have something wrong BEFORE l joined. And they found out l did. Then you could get fired, and you don't have a leg to stand on.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

He hasn't owned it at all, it's owned him and it might even bring him down, his love of a meaningless soundbite could do for him, all that pontificating when he was naming and shaming celebrities whilst he was benefitting from the exact same thing make him look like the hypocrite he is, the fact he insisted the EU water down proposals to exclude the very sort he benefited from make him look dishonest and all his attempted weaseling
out of it make him look like the shyster he is. He even wheeled out another meaningless soundbite earlier, lessons have been learnt, really Dave what lessons exactly and whilst you're keen to show us your tax returns dating back to 2009 the one I most keen for the public to get their hands on is 2008.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

:clap::clap::clap:

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

He wasn't doing the same thing at all ,there have been no allegations of using avoidance schemes .

Trusts where not excluded ,they still have to revealed ,the only difference is that trusts are declared in private to HMRC and shell companies are declared publicly ,which is perfectly understandable

and when that one shows no irregularities should he then produce the years before and so on .He has gone over and above what should be expected of him .

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Ian Cameron left PM £300,000 when he died in 2010 while his mother gave him an extra £200,000 some months later
It meant he avoided paying Inland Revenue £70,000 inheritance tax that he would have paid on a £500,000 lump sum
All bequests over £325,000 are subject to a 40 per cent tax levy - PM source says he denies any wrongdoing


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...#ixzz45PGJDsOs
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

From previous editions of the Daily Express, Daily Mail, the Telegraph, and the BBC, giving advice on how to mitigate/minimise Inheritance Tax.

http://www.express.co.uk/finance/per...nheritance-tax

http://www.express.co.uk/finance/per...mily-household

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/money/new...heritance.html

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/p...-avoid-it.html

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-29756520

And this one, from a Mail on Sunday financial reporter.

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/b...-avoid-it.html

So all these papers feigning outrage at Cameron doing what they recommend to their readers.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

This just shows how desperate people are to find some wrongdoing .In this country there is no inheritance tax on estates passed to a spouse or civil partner ,in this case the portion of the estate left to Cameron(£300,000) had tax paid on it.The £200,000 gift from his mother may be subject to inheritance tax under the 7 year rule if she dies within 7 yrs of making the gift but that i'm not sure about because usually gifts are not classed as income and therefore not subject to tax

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

https://www.gov.uk/inheritance-tax/overview

https://www.gov.uk/inheritance-tax/gifts

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Still waiting for the full tax returns, not just the edited highlights he's chosen to reveal. What's there is embarrassing, make you wonder what details have been omitted. 200k from Mum - nice; my Mother is going to have to up the stakes on birthday presents!

What it does show is that we are clearly not 'all in this together' and austerity and paying full tax is only for one section of society ( the 'not we').

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Well he hasn't done anything wrong, has he? Inheritance tax planning is absolutely standard. Everyone whose estate is likely to qualify does it, and it's entirely legal. The law even allows for gifts being given prior to death (of Cameron's mother in this case), via the seven year tapering liability which Hugh quoted above.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Things like inheritance tax planning and overseas tax havens are irrelevant to 95% of people. The fact that these loopholes haven't been closed shows where the govts. priorities lie. Doing something wrong and something illegal are different things. Call me picky but I'd want the standard for PM to be a little higher than ' he's done nothing illegal'.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

If you've ever filled out a tax return you will know that the first 4 or 5 pages are simply questions about name,DOB,NI,are you registered blind ,have you received any UK benefits etc .The majority is not applicable to most people in Camerons position

In what way are they embarrassing?

What it shows is the enormous chip on your shoulder against people more wealthy than you

---------- Post added at 10:09 ---------- Previous post was at 10:02 ----------

Are you serious ? plenty of the 95% of people you speak of profit from inheritance tax planning ,it's something that anyone who owns their house has to be aware of ,it is nothing like a tax haven

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

this is a quote from dave in 2014
“I think we should be very clear — tax evasion is illegal, and for that you can be prosecuted, you can go to prison,” he said. “These very aggressive tax avoidance schemes, they are wrong, and we should really persuade people not to do them.”
he's not talking about himself obviously or his tax affairs :)

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Calling Inheritance tax planning a loophole is like calling your personal tax free allowance a loophole

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

In law, "wrong" and "illegal" are exactly the same, and as the law is the only code upon which we all agree, what else is there? Morality is a very slippery thing unless we can all agree what is its source and definition. You're going to have to pin something legally dubious on the PM if you're hoping for a resignation.

The Cameron family's inheritance tax planning is precisely what every family in their position does. That may be only 5% of estates but we are still talking about something like 40,000 estates per year. It is a far, far larger number than that of the super-rich who spend a small fortune on accountants in order to save a large fortune in tax. And given the meteoric rise in property values we are also talking about plenty of people of relatively modest means.

These "loopholes" as you call them have been in the system for a very, very long time, so making insinuations about this government's "priorities" won't wash.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

No he's not because he's just proven that he's not doing any of that despite how much some people wish he was

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

well lets not get too exited about his innocence/guilt just yet, i'm sure more evidence will be dug out in the coming days " the truth will out" .;)

April 2015: an Election Pledge to Crack Down

“Tackling tax evasion and aggressive tax avoidance and tax planning is an important part of our long-term economic plan,” Mr. Cameron said ahead of his Conservative Party’s electoral victory.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

If the evidence you speak of is anything like the deliberately misinterpreted and grasped at straws we've seen the last few days i wouldn't hold your breath.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Why does inheritance tax exist? To raise money certainly. Also to encourage those with money to put it into the economy and make the next generation earn their way.

What has DC done to earn his millions. Nothing, he's inherited it, as we now know some of it from his Dads dodgy tax haven. No jobs before politics and a paid for Philosophy degree from Oxford; very useful that. Never mind his tax affairs how on earth did he become PM?

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

i will wait and see what comes to light before i come to a conclusion ,i am sure this matter will be well scruitinised over the coming days ,if there are any skeletons in the cupboard they will be brought to light and if he is squeaky clean this will also be brought to light.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Just listening to George Galloway on the Sunday Politics asking people to believe that whilst his non-parliamentary earnings were handled via a company and subject to corporation tax (substantially lower than the relevant personal rate) he really believes people like him ought to pay more in tax than they do. Surprisingly, he didn't confirm whether his awful quilt about this unfairness extends to donating the difference in the tax he actually paid and that which he would have been required to cough up (had he chosen to run his affairs differently) in order to benefit of all those poor and needy he'd just cited. When pressed about what he actually paid on his earnings outside of parliament (c.£250k in 2014 apparently) his reply was "I paid a very, very, great deal/amount of money in tax exactly as I was required to do..." Sounds rather like Cameron then.

Just another rose tinted hypocrite amongst a very extensive list of those champagne socialists.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

You appear to have already come to a conclusion...

Cameron paid tax on his dividends, he paid tax on his sale of the shares, and his mother gifted him money under existing HMRC rules, which my mother-in-law has done to her grand-children, like lots of others - could you please highlight which very aggressive tax avoidance schemes Cameron has undertaken?

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

no i'm awaiting input [not selective tidbits]

i never said he had undertaken aggressive tax avoidance -i quoted the man himself
this is a quote from dave in 2014
“I think we should be very clear — tax evasion is illegal, and for that you can be prosecuted, you can go to prison,” he said. “These very aggressive tax avoidance schemes, they are wrong, and we should really persuade people not to do them.”
he obviously never mentioned fluffy tax avoidance .

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

So basically instead of backing up your assertions that Cameron is a tax dodger you've resorted to calling him a lazy thicko:rolleyes: It must be very hard work hating everyone that's done better in life than you

---------- Post added at 13:39 ---------- Previous post was at 13:36 ----------

The sound of your backpeddling is deafening

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

So the SNP and Labour want tax returns and confirmation that the cabinet are not using tax havens, i hope the Shadow cabinet will do the same to prove they have nothing to hide ether?. I dont think the others will be willing to divulge there information however as in true Labour process they will stick to "what's yours is mine but what's mine is my own"

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

is that a real word ?

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Someone who sells backs?:D

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Martin Lewis, of the Moneysavingexpert website, just posted this on FB.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

is that the martin Lewis who advised locking into an energy tariffs before they went up- only they went down :dunce:

i'm waiting until jamie oliver backs him .

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

More on the Guardian's staggering hypocrisy so typical of the left:

http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2016/04...-arrangements/

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Strange - if you look at his tax returns, most of his money has been earned, by being the Prime Minister...

And as for 'no jobs before politics', you obviously missed the seven years he worked at Carlton - remind me again of Jeremy Corbyn's extensive employment portfolio (outside of being a Union rep, councillor, and MP)...

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

Some folks really do find differentiating between facts and fiction difficult don't they. On the other hand they might just be reduced to clutching at straws. I imagine a good few of them learned all about hypocrisy from the Guardian.

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

He's the one that runs Britains's biggest consumer and personal finance website, with 15 million users per month, and 10 million receiving a monthly advice update email, yes...;)

Re: Tax havens exposed in huge law firm leak
 

so the same martin lewis who wrongly advised millions over fuel bills .