Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Yes, we are missing out big time on all that Sky Atlantic programming. That is Virgin Media's serious content deficiency, and they have no alternatives available to balance that with what Sky provide.

If anyone doubts how much we have missed, they only need to subscribe to the Now TV Entertainment Pass. Incredible.

In my opinion, VM need to address this as a matter of some urgency if they don't want to haemmorage TV subscribers.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

There isn't a lot they can do if Sky wish to keep the channel as an exclusive.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Setting up their own channels and buy must see content would be the way to go but personally l cannot see it happening.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Exactly.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Almost everything decent is already tied up in long-term content deals. I'm sure Sky also like it having Virgin TV customers subscribing to Now TV to get Atlantic as it means they get paid twice for the other channels. Sky added 205,000 new customers in the last quarter - their best growth for a decade - and Now TV customers made up a big chunk of that.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Which is exactly why VM should have Now TV access on their boxes. Yes, we would pay more, and directly to Sky, but those of us with the wherewithal do that anyway. So much better if all of our streaming services were on one box instead of via numerous devices.

---------- Post added at 17:09 ---------- Previous post was at 17:05 ----------

That's true, but it's all smoke and mirrors. Some say that Sky want to keep SA exclusive whereas others say Sky are simply charging too much for the channel.

Who knows what the truth is...:mad:

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Sky Atlantic is 5 years old. If people were going to leave over it, they would have done long ago.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

I have seen anything much worth watching on it, I have no idea why people think its so good.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

That's a pretty complacent attitude to take if true from Virgin.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

I don't agree, spiderplant. You can't have failed to notice how much discontent has been expressed on these forums lately about how we are losing out to Sky on content, with no compensating alternatives available.

As people progressively realise what they've been missing, they will take action to rectify it. I have already taken action by getting Now TV, but it will not take much more for me to jump ship.

---------- Post added at 20:13 ---------- Previous post was at 20:11 ----------

Really? :eeek::shocked:

You don't like dramas, then, presumably.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Unless you get a Ruko where you can get all your legal streaming services on a single box

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

But it is additional to a VM box!

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

If true, VM customers must be a bit thick, 'cause it's taken them five years to realise they were missing Sky Atlantic.

And of course it isn't true, and VM customers aren't thick because they have known for years that Sky has better content, and still chosen VM.

In fact, for a couple of years now, it has been very easy to remedy that situation by adding a Now TV box, meaning that you don't have to move to Sky to get the missing content; now you have a best of both worlds scenario.

Nothings changed recently, content wise, in Sky versus VM. But Sky are about to launch a shiny new box, and suddenly for some the content differences that have been there for years are suddenly relevant.

They're also moaning about a five year old PVR because it doesn't look as good as the forthcoming new Sky box. Of course it won't look as good; five years is a long time in the tech world. But they aren't prepared to wait to see if VM also come out with a new box.

---------- Post added at 23:40 ---------- Previous post was at 23:30 ----------

So what? You can pick up a now TV box for £15, or one with 3 months entertainment pass for £19.

Why depend on a cable box for streaming services which has a five year replacement cycle? That five year cycle means that after a couple of years, it's going to be relatively slow and lack recently launched services compared to low cost streamer boxes that are updated annually.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

I get my passes on eBay, 3 month pass for £7.50, Im dropping all my VM services in March, mainly due to cost cutting. Moving my phone and BB will save me nearly £60 a month.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

You just have to accept that the world has got messy and there is no one box and no one service provider that can provide everything anymore. In time there will be more consolidation but since streaming services entered the market I think overall consumers are in a much better position for choice and price.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Dish have released their new box, makes even Sky's effort look poor:

http://www.techhive.com/article/3028...annel-dvr.html

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Brilliant how do we get one ? Oh wait..........

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

I sense some serious bar-raising going on here.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

These things I don't miss due to watching about an hour of linear TV a fortnight :)

Interesting how the bar is being raised for sure. Shame the cost bar continues to follow.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

If you ask me that SkyQ UI already looks outdated! If VM came out with that in 2016 I think I would be unhappy.

Saying that it's still miles better than what VM has at the moment. VM need a new box and a new UI to boot.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

This.
I too don't see all the fuss over Sky Atlantic.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

I am currently with sky until June is , I tweeted Virgin media a couple of nights ago about there plans for a new box in light of the new skyQ box


They told me they have no plans for a new box? Can this be right?
:shocked:


Cheers


Stephen

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Well they are not going to reveal their plans to customers until they are good and ready..

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

maybe not but maybe they could have said "work is ongoing" or something along those lines without giving anything away but they didn't say that they categorically said no new box.

Now Im not saying you're wrong but they seemed pretty certain! :)

Anywhoo I guess we will see in the next 6 months or so

Cheers


Stephen

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

It could be that the person replying to the tweet has not heard of any plans for a new box. AFAIK, Virgin don't generally tell their customer facing staff about any new hardware or service upgrades until they are ready to announce it to the public. Apologies if this is not the case with VM, but in my experience, a lot of big companies operate like that.

I think there are several reasons.

1. Some companies (not saying VM is like this as I don't know) test a lot of different hardware or changes to their services. It does not mean they will launch them quickly, or at all. This is what makes me laugh about Apple rumours based on what they have patented Apple come up with ideas for a *lot* of devices and services that they patent. Those ideas don't usually make it any further than testing (if they even make it that far), yet the media frequently publishes the patents as if they are a new product.
2. They may wish to reduce the number of people who know about the new box or service to limit the chances of it leaking to the public. The problem they have when it's leaked to the public is that if it's delayed or cancelled (for whatever reason), the public will complain.
3. Most companies don't want their competitors to know what they are launching before they are ready to launch it.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

May be wrong here but if VM were to deploy cloud recording couldn't they do all this with its current TIVO STB's ?

When recordings are moved to the cloud doesn't the tuner issue become irrelevant ? I must admit to having limited knowledge here however in bits I've read on the subject it seems with cloud recordings the provider can set whatever amount of simulataneous recordings they see fit and can also sell storage amounts up and above the norm. I believe in the US cable co Comcast boxes still record local with a copy made available in the cloud also thus allowing for tablet/smartphone viewing and other STB's in the home.

I'm sure Spider will correct my mistakes.:D

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

I see no mistakes. :tu:

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

New and existing NPower customers can get an entertainment pass for free.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Other than the first series of True Dective, I fully agree. Have had Sky 7-8 months and other than the less than impressive second series of True Dective, and the very average and predictable plots set around of the sex and violence of Banshiee, I have not watched anything on it.

I will admit I have used Sky box sets to watch Sopranos and The Wire - which should have stopped after the third series.

Before I joined Sky I had no desire to watch Sky Atlantic. Now I have it, I still could not care less about it.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

I'd imagine they would use the could app already installed on the TiVo to deliver the access to cloud recording service so every chance the current box could support it with the existing recording functionality remaining unchanged.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Isn't one of the cited advantages of cloud recording, cheaper boxes? I.e. less hardware required, the obvious one being no need for hard drives.

And the processor in the current Tivo is still five years old. It's acceptable, but really should be updated so that it is more speedy.

So if VM do move to the cloud for recording, I would expect an updated box which will be less expensive for VM to buy.

Is it too soon for VM to move to the cloud? Would a change such as that be better in a couple of years time? I'm honestly not sure. But if cloud storage is only a couple of years away, what should VM do about the current box? Struggle on with it and patch it up a bit, or provide a new faster box?

If only we all knew what Spiderplant knows :D

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

And we all know his lips are sealed one suspects.;)

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Id rather they say that than "coming soon" like 4g on virgin mobile 2 years ago

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

When things are moved to the cloud isn't the processing done in the cloud ?

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

I don't use catch up or watch on demand via Tivo, but people always seem to moaning about it for various reasons.

I suspect it is like Netflix access via Tivo; slow compared to streamer boxes, but perfectly adequate all the same.

But people are always going to compare Tivo's speed to streamer boxes (without stopping to think about the fundamental differences).

Without the extra processing required for hard disc recording, my thinking is that a new Tivo designed for cloud recording should be pretty fast.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Yes, cloud recording/playback isn't really any different from VOD as far as the STB is concerned. You ask the server for a programme and it gets streamed to you. In theory any VM STB made since 1999 could do it.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

The storage for cloud record would be huge. OK you could keep each program once and users tag the recording as theirs. Then you could stream updated ads into the recording as it is played. But you need to keep all recordings at least until the last customer deletes their link.

Issues though would include FF/Rew are usually less good on streamed content than local and at least local recording are still viewable in many circumstances when VOD services aren't.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Interesting you mention adds. On a hard disc recording you can FF the adds. Would Fast forwarding even be an option for cloud recordings? Obviously it would depend on the deals worked out with the broadcaster, but I can see them wanting to hang on to adds

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Have the copyright issues regarding cloud "recording" been sorted out? I wasn't aware they were.

And as said, you don't really "record" the programme, the programme is already kept on the server, you just create a link. There won't be thousands of copies of the same programme kept on servers, so it really isn't any different to VOD now.

I would still prefer the option to keep recordings where ever I choose, not where a company decides. Especially if you then unsubscribe to a channel or the channel stops broadcasting and you find "your" recordings have been deleted. Meaning they were never yours to begin with.... I see no evidence that VM are going to go down that route unfortunately.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Last time I read info on Cloud recordings it was claimed the platforms wanted to use a shared option (basically your provider would hold a copy of a particular show with all users accessing it) the other option was private where each user had an individual copy of each show they record.

A question if I may Spider what is the hold up with rights issues , I not asking you to give specific info I meaning in general for all providers.

It seems crazy when people like myself are prepared to pay for the content and just want the flexibility that cloud recordings bring.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

I'm guessing paranoia and greed,

Content producers are scared people will find a way to extract the content and make it available for pirating, and they want to screw more money out of service providers for the privilege of distribution on a wider number of devices.

What else drives the entertainment industry? It certainly isn't an interest in the artistic side; well unless they can see dollar signs attached.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Personally, I don't think we'll see cloud recording any time soon or in the near future either on VM or Sky.

I've been doing a few cloud things recently and have found the whole experience a pain in the neck. I suspect pay tv companies may be running into similar issues.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Looking at the link Spider has posted things don't bode well in my opinion..

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Yes, if ads are unskippable (if present at all) on the cloud, I will stick to recordings, thank you very much!

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

This is probably the only 4K channel that Virgin Media will be able to get their hands on

http://advanced-television.com/2015/...hannel-for-uk/

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Virgin, being owned by Liberty Global, can probably afford to get their hands on ANY 4k channel. They don't currently see a market for it. They may have a point. Most people would have only bought their HD sets in the last few years, they wont be looking to upgrade for a while.

Sky backing 4K does not mean it will succeed. Sky enthusiastically backed (and promoted) 3D, and how well did that do?

Don't get me wrong, I actually believe 4K will take off, it's just going to take a few years.

http://www.cableforum.co.uk/article/...pt-4k-ultra-hd

Re: Sky Q and VM answer????
 

Re: Sky Q and VM answer????
 

I'm not sure if it will be the same as in Ireland but a TV product is already live there.

https://www.vodafone.ie/home/tv/

Re: Sky Q and VM answer????
 

Right. Not sure, not been keeping up with the score!!

Re: Sky Q and VM answer????
 

It won't be ;)

Re: Sky Q and VM answer????
 

To be honest personally I wouldn't touch Vodafone from previous experiences.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

This is a decent hands on video with Sky Q.

http://youtu.be/1uhhvil84u0

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Good-looking interface. As a TiVo user that's the kind of speed I can only dream of. The reasons I stuck with Virgin Media and didn't jump over to Sky were the extra tuners and the on-demand library. Looks like the world has changed.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Sky's on-demand has been better than Virginmedias for years.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

In the last couple of years it has sadly..

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Good Lord look how quick and smooth it is... makes Virgin TIVO look absolutely appalling and antiquated...

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

So why no demo of the really new bit; the extra tuners and streaming to tablets etc.? The flashy interface looks nice but in reality, cosmetic rather than innovative functionality.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Who cares what it looks like? They can navigate the menu without having to wait 40 odd seconds after pressing each button!!!!

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

1) you need to ring VM faults if you have to wait 40 seconds after pressing each button.

2) you missed my point. The innovation of Sky Q is the extra tuners and streaming to tablets etc. Why not show those parts rather than cosmetic changes that add little extra functionality.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Extra tuners what's to demo , it'll record 4 things while you watch a 5th.

Sky Q app
https://youtu.be/cIJKxZyuLbI

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

The point still stands; the person who did the demo didn't include the innovative bit's.

Why not show streaming to tablet, and the range of channels that can be streamed to a tablet? Given the abysmal number of channels Tivo's MRS can stream, this is the sort of thing that will make Sky Q a truly significant bit of kit; if Sky have got loads of channels that can be sent to secondary devices.

Any brand new box will probably have an updated interface. It's the new functionality we need to see demoed.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

As far as I'm aware all channels work on the Sky Q minis with the exception of third party add ons like BT Sport the only restrictions I've seen is on download to tablets which at launch won't work with every recording however Sky said they are working hard to tie the rest of the rights up. From launch remote record also won't be a available.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

To be fair if it's 4K your after the streaming services currently have quite a lot available. Most of Netflix's originals this year will be available in 4K as will Amazon's.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Yeah,I bought a John Lewis/LG 4K tv a couple of days ago and the best 4K content is on You Tube. Not keen on the Netflix and Amazon content so when my months trial is up I won't be subscribing.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Cloud recording may not be as cheap as you'd think.

Where a programme is available via the VM on demand service (which would be pretty much everything on most of the major channels apart from films), they can just send that programme to the user's box from the on-demand system. This would cost VM very little as they already have the infrastructure and rights in place to do it. The real cost for these programmes is adapting the software.

Where a programme is not available (i.e. it's a film, or it's on a channel with no on demand option), or the user wants to record in HD and the on demand version is only available in SD, the user is going to need space on a server somewhere. VM can minimise the space requirements for a programme by only storing the data in one file then giving any user that "records" that programme a link to that file. For example, say one of the channels shows "Men In Black". Thousands of people will want to watch this, so if VM stored a complete copy of the film for each viewer, they would need a *lot* of storage (potentially hundreds of Terabytes).

So, to reduce this, they would start storing the data when the first user hits record. Every user who "records" this showing of MIB would then get this file when they watch the recording. This file would only take a few gigabytes of storage.

Why would this cost a lot? Simply because VM would need the infrastructure in place to do it. They would need more servers in the various head ends and may need to build up a new content delivery system. They still have the cost of adapting the STB software to deal with this.

I suspect at least some of the Tivo's speed problems come from the use of Flash in it's interface, so, as long as Tivo and VM are willing to devote the manpower to minimising Flash use, we would get some speed increase.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

Keep cutting that cord like the wind, people. OTT seems to be where it's at now. Even Sky make tacit admission to this with the presentation and conception of Q - very OTT-like.

Re: Sky Q and VM answer ?
 

It doesn't properly have Flash since the 'plum' release when they dumped Adobe Air. While TiVo still uses the OpenFL Flash engine in the UI, all the Flash ActionScript was translated automatically into the Haxe language and compiled, so that now starts up quickly and runs fast.

The reason it is slower than it should be on the hardware it has is because the TiVo engineers hadn't finished optimising performance for the new architecture when Virgin got its last build in May 2015 and there hasn't been one since.

Maybe VM decided to cut back on how frequently they do releases of the TiVo software as part of their cost cutting and lack of interest in TV. Maybe there were complicated configuration management issues that made it difficult to bring in recent changes to the core TiVo software onto VM's version. Maybe it was something else...