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-   -   Putin warning... (https://www.cableforum.uk/board/showthread.php?t=33699519)

Osem 30-12-2014 15:30
Re: Putin warning...
 
Quote:
Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny says he is defying house arrest to attend a protest in central Moscow.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-30635874

Apparently he's been rearrested en route to the demonstration. Not exactly a surprise...

Osem 29-01-2015 07:10
Re: Putin warning...
 
Russia's tactics of military deception explained:

Quote:
Russia's annexation of Crimea last year caught almost everyone off guard. The Russian military disguised its actions, and denied them - but those "little green men" who popped up in the Black Sea peninsula were a textbook case of the Russian practice of military deception - or maskirovka.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-31020283

Quote:
Maj Gen Davis calls the first convoy "a wonderful example of maskirovka" because it created something of a media storm. TV crews breathlessly followed the convoy, trying to find out what was really inside the green army trucks which had been hastily repainted white. Was this a classic Trojan horse operation to smuggle weapons to rebel militias? And would the Ukrainian authorities allow the convoy in?

Lorries part of a Russian humanitarian convoy are parked not far from a checkpoint at the Ukrainian border some 30 km outside the town of Kamensk-Shakhtinsky in the Rostov region, on August 20, 2014. The Russian humanitarian aid convoy - a classic case of maskirovka? "All the while at other border crossing points controlled by the Russians - not by the Ukrainians - equipment, personnel and troops were passing into Eastern Ukraine," says Davis. He sees the convoy as a clever "diversion or distraction".

The fog of war isn't something which just happens - it's something which can be manufactured. In this case the Western media were bamboozled, but the compliant Russian media has also worked hard to generate fog.
The trouble is nobody believes them any more...

Gavin78 29-01-2015 23:40
Re: Putin warning...
 
Russia isn't helping them self by testing different countries airspace will be interesting to see what EU support the UK would get if Russia continues to do this

Ignitionnet 30-01-2015 07:04
Re: Putin warning...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gavin78 (Post 35756066)
Russia isn't helping them self by testing different countries airspace will be interesting to see what EU support the UK would get if Russia continues to do this
Precisely none I'd hope, this comes squarely under NATO's remit.

heero_yuy 30-01-2015 08:05
Re: Putin warning...
 
Quote:
Russia's ambassador to Britain was summoned to the UK's Foreign Office on Thursday to explain why two Russian bombers were flying over the English Channel this week, a representative of the office said.

Two Russian bombers "caused disruption to civil aviation" when they flew near, but did not cross into, British airspace on Wednesday, the Foreign Office representative said.

Two UK Royal Air Force jets intercepted the bombers, both capable of carrying nuclear weapons, south of Bournemouth, England, over the English Channel, a UK defense spokesman said Thursday.

The British jets escorted the bombers for about an hour-and-a-half until the bombers left the area, the defense spokesman said.
Linky

Aparently they also had no transponders on them ( or turned off ) so could not be identified by civil avaiation.

It only takes a moments misjudgement to provoke a potentially dangerous crisis. :rolleyes:

nomadking 30-01-2015 08:24
Re: Putin warning...
 
NATO wouldn't do such things would they?
Quote:
According to the Swedish news media, the episode on July 18 occurred as the RC-135 aircraft was flying near Kaliningrad, a heavily militarized Russian enclave between Poland and Lithuania that includes a major port for the Russian Baltic fleet.
After being approached by Russian aircraft, the RC-135 pilot sought to avoid the encounter by maneuvering his aircraft into Swedish airspace, flying over Gotland Island.
Sweden is not a member of NATO, and the European Command said in its statement that the RC-135 had been directed toward Swedish territory “incorrectly by U.S. personnel.”
...
On April 12, Russian SU-24 attack jets flew near a Navy vessel, the guided missile destroyer Donald Cook, which was operating in international waters in the Black Sea.
...

On April 23, a Russian aircraft flew close to an RC-135 that was flying over the Sea of Okhotsk, between Russia and Japan.
Quote:
Nato has ordered the huge Awacs radar plane to monitor Russia’s Black Sea fleet and army activity on the ground.

DABhand 30-01-2015 08:31
Re: Putin warning...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by heero_yuy (Post 35756082)
Linky

Aparently they also had no transponders on them ( or turned off ) so could not be identified by civil avaiation.

It only takes a moments misjudgement to provoke a potentially dangerous crisis. :rolleyes:
Russia is infamous about doing this, to test borders.

They did it a couple of years ago with a nuclear sub if you remember.

One bomber pilot forgetting their transponder you can chalk up to being a mistake, but 2 at the same time, no... this was a test to see how far they can get.

And that is a scary thought, if it wasn't for civil aircraft they may have gotten further.

Osem 19-02-2015 08:43
Re: Putin warning...
 
Quote:
There is a "real and present danger" of Russia trying to destabilise the Baltic states of Latvia, Lithuania and Estonia, the UK defence secretary says.

Michael Fallon said he was worried about "pressure" from Russian President Vladimir Putin on the ex-Soviet states, which are Nato members.

Russia might use tactics there similar to those it used in Ukraine, he said.

Mr Fallon said Nato must be ready for aggression from Russia "in whatever form it takes".
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-31528981

I heard somewhere that whilst we've been cutting defence spending etc. Russia has almost tripled its own spending.

I reckon we have a big problem looming. Putin is doing what Hitler did and stirring up all sorts of nationalist sentiment in order to deflect attention from the country's economy and pursue his own agenda. There's no doubt in my mind that he will carry on with his current tactics and I have a feeling it's just a question of time before he makes a major miscalculation and all hell breaks loose.

Maybe the EU will come to the rescue eh? :rolleyes:

heero_yuy 19-02-2015 09:33
Re: Putin warning...
 
Perhaps if we stopped interfearing in the affairs of Middle East and looked to our own back door we all might sleep easier in our beds.

Uncle Peter 19-02-2015 12:56
Re: Putin warning...
 
Fallon in stating obvious shocker as defence and shadow defence secretary size up the size of their next slice of budget pie.

Putin has rather a lot to worry about at the moment before inflicting pressure on other Baltic states which are demographically and culturally very different to Ukraine.

On the other side of the coin there's a real threat to Russia if the US start sending lethal weapons to Ukraine.

Osem 19-02-2015 16:15
Re: Putin warning...
 
Let's hope you're right.

Gary L 19-02-2015 22:29
Re: Putin warning...
 
How big is our tiny army?

Sirius 20-02-2015 05:15
Re: Putin warning...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary L (Post 35760428)
How big is our tiny army?
I don't think its big enough to be called an Army any more. I think the Boy scouts is bigger :)

Osem 20-02-2015 09:53
Re: Putin warning...
 
Putin knows we're overstretched and that there isn't the will to put boots on the ground in Syria or Libya let alone in Europe facing the Russians. I reckon he's going to carry on grabbing what he can - saying one thing and doing another - and using the damage being done to his economy by the evil west as a rallying cry to his people. If he bites off a bit too much he'll give some back. If not so be it.

Uncle Peter 21-02-2015 00:28
Re: Putin warning...
 
You have to laugh at the media being whipped up into a frenzy over this supposed increase in Russian naval aviation activity. This has been going on for at least the past 5 years since someone decided to station a Patriot air defence detachment 50 miles away from the border with Kaliningrad.

There's nothing covert about this as it's just a supposed show of strength. TU95s and Mig 31s are not the stealthiest of adversaries: in terms of radar cross-section it's like a flying tower block being escorted by a flying house. The Russians still run their strategic radio nets in the clear on HF albeit with coded messages but anyone with a basic receiver can hear activity when they're out and about. They still use CW (Morse code) when operating well out of theatre!

Osem 20-06-2015 10:52
Re: Putin warning...
 
More bad news for Putin to blame on the west.

Quote:
Russia has protested to the Belgian ambassador over the seizure of Russian state assets in Belgium - a move triggered by a court ruling over the now-defunct Yukos oil firm.

The ambassador was told that the asset seizure was "an openly hostile act" that "crudely violates the recognised norms of international law".

Last year a court told Russia to pay Yukos shareholders $50bn (£32bn) in compensation, after Yukos's break-up.

A Russian state firm took over Yukos.

In July 2014, an international arbitration court in The Hague said Russian officials had manipulated the legal system to bankrupt Yukos, and jail its boss, the oligarch Mikhail Khodorkovsky.




On Friday, President Vladimir Putin said Russia did not recognise the court's authority.

Responding to the asset seizure, he said Russia would "defend our interests by the route of justice".
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-33197782

Kursk 20-06-2015 23:39
Re: Putin warning...
 
A World War Two veteran has received a surprise package in the post - a medal from the Russian government to honour his 1940s wartime service. Link

Former Merchant Navy Seaman Harold Boudier said he was delighted to receive the medal commemorating the 70th Anniversary of victory in the “Great Patriotic War 1941-45” - Russia’s name for the years it fought alongside Allies against the Nazis.

A letter that arrived with the medal from the Ambassador to Russia in London says: ”On the instruction of President Vladimir Putin I have the honour of presenting to you the Commemorative medal marking the 70th anniversary of the victory in the Great Patriotic War.

It is a huge privilege for me to thank you on behalf of the Russian Government for the invaluable contribution you and your comrades in arms made to the defeat of Nazi Germany.

What you did 70 years ago, taking part in what Sir Winston Churchill rightly called ‘the worst journey in the world’ was extraordinary even among what is considered to be beyond the call of duty.

Your heroism will always be remembered in Russia”.

Hugh 21-06-2015 09:09
Re: Putin warning...
 
The 'Great Patriotic War 1941-45'....

I wonder what they call the bit just before that, 1939-41, where, in conjunction with Nazi Germany, they invaded/annexed parts of Poland, Lithuania, Estonia, Finland, Latvia, and Romania - the 'not so-Great Sneaky War 1939-41'?

Osem 21-06-2015 09:12
Re: Putin warning...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 35784217)
The 'Great Patriotic War 1941-45'....

I wonder what they call the bit just before that, 1939-41, where, in conjunction with Nazi Germany, they invaded/annexed parts of Poland, Lithuania, Estonia, Finland, Latvia, and Romania - the 'not so-Great Sneaky War 1939-41'?
I dare say that was the west's fault too...

Uncle Peter 21-06-2015 13:39
Re: Putin warning...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 35784217)
The 'Great Patriotic War 1941-45'....

I wonder what they call the bit just before that, 1939-41, where, in conjunction with Nazi Germany, they invaded/annexed parts of Poland, Lithuania, Estonia, Finland, Latvia, and Romania - the 'not so-Great Sneaky War 1939-41'?
Not to mention formenting the Ukrainian nationalist genocide against the Poles in the Kresy region of what was Poland at the time (now North Western Ukraine) that came to a head in 1943.

Kursk 21-06-2015 16:43
Re: Putin warning...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 35784217)
The 'Great Patriotic War 1941-45'....

I wonder what they call the bit just before that, 1939-41, where, in conjunction with Nazi Germany, they invaded/annexed parts of Poland, Lithuania, Estonia, Finland, Latvia, and Romania - the 'not so-Great Sneaky War 1939-41'?
I wonder if just after 'The Great Sneaky War 1939-41" the 22 million Soviets that died in "The Great Patriotic War 1941-45" in any way reconciles that misdemeanor?

Hugh 21-06-2015 19:46
Re: Putin warning...
 
Probably not, as the first part will have been written out of their history books, and the millions of Russians (and other nationalities) that the Soviets killed during the pogroms before, during, and after the war, would be missing as well.

http://www.ibtimes.com/how-many-peop...n-kill-1111789

Quote:
Most other estimates from reputed scholars and historians tend to range from between 20 and 60 million.

In his book, “Unnatural Deaths in the U.S.S.R.: 1928-1954,” I.G. Dyadkin estimated that the USSR suffered 56 to 62 million "unnatural deaths" during that period, with 34 to 49 million directly linked to Stalin.

In “Europe A History,” British historian Norman Davies counted 50 million killed between 1924-53, excluding wartime casualties.

Alexander Nikolaevich Yakovlev, a Soviet politician and historian, estimated 35 million deaths.

TheDaddy 22-06-2015 00:58
Re: Putin warning...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kursk (Post 35784279)
I wonder if just after 'The Great Sneaky War 1939-41" the 22 million Soviets that died in "The Great Patriotic War 1941-45" in any way reconciles that misdemeanor?
Misdemeanor? All those people that died in the sneaky war are classed as a misdemeanor, gawd knows how you classify the mass rape of East prussia and silesia at the end of the Patriotic War then

Kursk 22-06-2015 20:26
Re: Putin warning...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDaddy (Post 35784354)
Misdemeanor? All those people that died in the sneaky war are classed as a misdemeanor, gawd knows how you classify the mass rape of East prussia and silesia at the end of the Patriotic War then
I just knew the deliberate use of the word wouldn't distract someone with the intellect of Hugh. All that was needed was the right sort of sham-affronted nitpicker to come along.

And here you are :D.

TheDaddy 23-06-2015 00:36
Re: Putin warning...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kursk (Post 35784587)
I just knew the deliberate use of the word wouldn't distract someone with the intellect of Hugh. All that was needed was the right sort of sham-affronted nitpicker to come along.

And here you are :D.
You really are a piece of work, deliberately using one of the worst crimes of the war for wumming just about sums you up. Might be best you go back on the ignore list, not entirely sure how you got of it unless it was something to do with your last holiday from the forum.

Kursk 23-06-2015 15:36
Re: Putin warning...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDaddy (Post 35784628)
You really are a piece of work, deliberately using one of the worst crimes of the war for wumming just about sums you up. Might be best you go back on the ignore list, not entirely sure how you got off it unless it was something to do with your last holiday from the forum.
Please, please put me on your ignore list. Your contributions just get in the way when grown ups are talking.

Osem 23-06-2015 17:19
Re: Putin warning...
 
I bet David Cameron wishes the BBC was as supportive of him as RT is of Putin. Therein lies the truth about the relative freedoms of the two nations and the extent of Putin's control of the media.

Uncle Peter 23-06-2015 17:41
Re: Putin warning...
 
US have deployed an armoured brigade across six of our most Eastern neighbours. El Presidentski not happy

Not many tanks in the great scheme of things but many of the Russian front line tanks are of limited combat value against modern NATO tanks. The 1000 or so crappy old T62s and T72s they've "sneaked" across the border to Eastern Ukraine are of no real combat value under similar terms.

Ignitionnet 23-06-2015 18:13
Re: Putin warning...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Peter (Post 35784750)
US have deployed an armoured brigade across six of our most Eastern neighbours. El Presidentski not happy

The 1000 or so crappy old T62s and T72s they've "sneaked" across the border to Eastern Ukraine are of no real combat value under similar terms.
Russia are doing nothing more than bringing a clapped out tank to a drone fight.

They are quite hideously outmatched conventionally, and even Mr Putin isn't stupid enough to push the big red button.

The fact that he's so outmatched conventionally actually helps keep things stable - he knows the US have no need to resort to nukes, they can happily hand his arse to him without them and both know it.

TheDaddy 23-06-2015 18:38
Re: Putin warning...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kursk (Post 35784707)
Please, please put me on your ignore list. Your contributions just get in the way when grown ups are talking.
You should pay more attention to Gary L, he is an occasionally amusing troll at least, no need to beg either

Maggy 23-06-2015 18:55
Re: Putin warning...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kursk (Post 35784707)
Please, please put me on your ignore list. Your contributions just get in the way when grown ups are talking.
I suggest that you consider using the same action..


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