Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

She's been used sparingly this year. Mostly as a sub.

That's why Rangers (IA) are quite justified in not paying Her Majesty taxes. ;)

Like all big clubs there are quite a few numpty Celtic supporters around but it is definitely a minority. Celtic are often the first choice for players of English teams when testimonials come around. They know there's bound to be a large travelling support and attractive football to help generate an atmoshphere. ;)

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

@shaunthebrummie, sorry,hadtoscrolluptocheckthatigotyournameright. Pause, whilst I inhale. Feel better now :D

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Stephen, l know exactly what you are saying, But the fact that you are saying that Celtic have worked hard this season, they are not the team they used to be, you have an aggressive manager in Lennon, But without the points deducted by Rangers, then it would have been the same scenario Rangers or Celtic.

IF, Celtic and Rangers left the SFA, you would not have football in Scotland, and that is not in a disrespect way. Many clubs would go under.

I firmly believe that the SFA MUST do something about the hatred between the two clubs, even today families in Scotland are divided.

In regards to the Orange march etc, l was in Glasgow one day when they were marching through the City, this is all part of the freedom that we have in the United Kingdom. But providing it doesn't cause trouble, then so be it, BUT, this is what causes problems arising from the years of troubles between the religious barrier that there is. And this goes from the parents, grand parents etc and this won't stop.

I would like to see someone brave enough to make a stand against this problem.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Arthur, Celtic are 20 points ahead - Rangers were deducted 10 points.

Just sayin'.....

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Arthur, as Hugh just mentioned, take off the 10 points Rangers were deducted and Celtic were still clearly ahead by 10 points. o celtic would still have won anyway. Just sayin.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Point taken, I would like to see both clubs join a league from Europe, just to see how good both clubs are with the elite sides.

I can see Liverpool, Chelsea, Arsenal etc wiping the floor with both clubs AS they are not as good as they were.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

I would have thought both clubs' recent uninspiring performance in the existing European tournaments gives you a pretty good clue how good they are compared with the elite sides...

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Or put another way:

If Rangers got their 10 points restored and Celtic went into administration and were deducted 10 points, Celtic would still have won the league:D

(Thanks to Mjallby's son for that observation)

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

It's still tainted.... ;)

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

I'm too full of Jelly and Ice Cream to argue;)

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Arsenal played Celtic in a qualifier a few years ago and it wasn't a problem at all. They have only dropped much further since then. They currently have 1 Champions League spot which is a early round qualifier and even that is at risk.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

One of your colleagues been a bit naughty Derek?

http://www.clyde1.com/news/police-of...firm-incident/

I'd post the link on you tube but it's got profanity overload. Worse than that there's some really ugly people there. ;)
just search for Celtic Park toilets and you'll get it.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Can't see how they figured out the toilets at the lego arena were damaged after the Rangers fans had finished with their remodelling. :shocked:

Hmmm, the Clyde story is missing a few bits and pieces from what I understand. Still if you are silly enough to A: Start spouting sectarian crap at the footie and B: get caught then I don't think he'll be any great loss to the force.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

It looks like Celtic Park will be hosting Full houses long after Ibroke has became a Tesco extra :D

The most unfortunate aspect of is that's is bound to strengthen the convictions of the more paranoid Celtic supporters.

Having said that much of the stuff I've argued against my fellow Celtic supporters about now appears to have more than a modicum of truth. The tax avoidance is nothing compared to other financial irregularities, possible phone hacking and dual contracts.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Let me know when they actually start having full houses bar Rangers games. There are a hell of a lot of Mothers days over in the East End. Either that or the fans are going dressed as seats. ;)

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

There'll be a full house for the next Glasgow derby..... once Partick Thistle get promotion. ;)

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

arthur...what goes on in scottish football between celtic and rangers does not bother us one bit in england..but you convineniently forgot to mention celtics anti english,provo loving,pub bomber worshipping,terrorist supporting stance....now deny it...its all over youtube....

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

london road...tax avoidance is bad....but the torbet affair is far.far..worse...especially the covering up and denying.....horrible.hypocritical..lying..club...

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

There was quite a good programme on BBC Scotland and NI 8pm tonight on the background behind Rangers current financial plight for anybody who is interested "The men who sold the Jerseys"

A lot of it is regurgitated Internet rumour that's been given a bit of flesh but even the involvement of the administrators is looking a bit questionable.
:shocked:
Perhaps this thread should be closed and replaced with will there be a Rangers football team next year?
Gist of it can be read here:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotlan...-west-18179264

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Oooft more fun and games with the Rangers and the raging incompetents at the SFA.

After imposing a sanction that wasn't available to them Rangers have managed to get the courts to agree making things up as you go along isn't particularly fair and the SFA have been ordered to forget the 12 month transfer embargo and £160k fine.

Now the SFA have to decide whether to fine Rangers up to £100k, expel the from the Scottish Cup, or expel them from Scottish football altogether...

Plus FIFA have expressed their unhappiness at Rangers resorting to domestic courts and this could lead to another stand off between Rangers and the SFA.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

The SFA will surely try and give a higher punishment. Expelled from the top league maybe?

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

What's to stop them going bust, buying a crappy 3rd division English team, renaming them to fc rangers thenmove the stadium back to Glasgow?

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

All they can do is the stated punishments of a maximum £100,000 fine, suspension or expulsion from participation in the game, ejection from the Scottish Cup or termination of membership.

The SFA already got a slap for making things up in their previous punishments, and that's after Celtic hired a QC last year that booted them square in the nuts for not following their own rules.

Either they back down, keep the lifetime ban on Craig Whyte having involvement in the game and impose the fine or they go for are harsher punishment and accept any sponsorship and TV deals will be nullified by Rangers not being involved.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

FIFA will do what they've done to other National Football Associations when member clubs have resorted to non-Sport Law. They'll tell them to punish Rangers heavily or there will be no international tournaments....

Scottish Fans are reported to delighted at the prospect of avoiding future embarassing occassions:D

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Seemingly the SFA don't recognise the Court of Arbitration for Sport as an appeal venue :confused: so Rangers were entitled to take the next step in their appeal.
Honestly you couldn't make this up, the SFA are a shambles from top to bottom and this whole incident has shown how much of an amateur hour outfit they are. It took them 18 months to realise Whyte was a shyster despite everyone and their auntie warning them and when they do finally get round to investigating make such a hash of things they get embroiled in court action.

:D

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

The SFA has been far too busy fretting over the existential threat of Scotsmen playing for Team GB in London this summer...

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Is it??, Rangers lost three games out of four after going into admin', you're not telling me that didn't have an effect on the team, also, would sellik have won the title with such ease if Rangers had not been deducted the points? We will never know, but there is a feeling that if Rangers had still been "in the hunt" would sellik have coped with the pressure?

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

That's what makes Football so great. Facts can always be set aside and possible outcomes argued.

IMHO Celtic would have won the league but any question of the teams bottle can only put to bed by them winning a game under pressure. The final old firm game of the season (possibly last one ever?)was probably the most one-sided OF game I've seen in many years watching football. Celtic walked it, but they weren't really under pressure.

How many titles in a row would Celtic have won if Rangers hadn't been cheating for over a decade? That's a good one to to debate;)

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

And please explain how they "cheated"? if you're deluding to the "big tax" case with regards to the EBT scheme , then nothing on that front has been decided yet, if Rangers are proven to have broken the tax rules, then yes, i'd say that they should be severly punished, but if you can take your green tinted specs off for just one moment, and have a look at the facts, instead of trying to make things up, you would see that Rangers included their employees EBT scheme and all payments made in their annual accounts, if they had "cheated" as you would like to hope was the case, then do you think that they would have come clean about the EBT scheme in their annual accounts?
And just to clarify the situation where people have accused Rangers of not paying their taxes etc, Rangers had never defaulted on any tax payments, and actually paid between £1.2 and £1.5 million pounds per month, for PAYE, National Insurance, and VAT, before Craig Whyte took, he then told the person in charge of those payments to stop making them, Rangers have been hung out to dry by Whyte and the club is suffering because of his actions, he'll be looking over his shoulder for the rest of his life!

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Rangers have been found guilty of misusing the EBT scheme. It's the result of the appeal we're waiting for.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

The tax man accusing them of misusing the scheme doesn't make them guilty. The tribunal is still to rule which side is right.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

HMRC hit Rangers with a bill for £24 million. The tribunal is Rangers appeal against Hector's assessment.

http://www.kinsellatax.co.uk/index.p...01returnid=468

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

That still doesn't make them guilty!! the court will decide if they were involved in any wrong doing, if they win the case then the tax man will have been proved to be wrong in their assessment.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

I know what you mean but, to be pedantic, as things stand they are guilty of tax avoidance. Only if the first tier tribunal appeal rules in their favour does that status change.
HMRC's assessment is a tax bill for those monies they have determined that RFC(IA) should have paid.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

You can argue this till the cows come home mate, and if you're not a Rangers fan/supporter then you will always have the view that they are guilty, and i do take on board your comment about being pedantic, but, at the end of the day thats what the courts are there for, HMRC are not the law of the land, and Rangers are innocent until proven otherwise, what gets me is the time that this whole "big" tax case is taking, and i'm pretty sure that the likes of Man U etc, who were mentioned in your posted link, and probably dozens of other English teams as well, will be pretty worried if HMRC win this case.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

I think the important point you're missing is that the HMRC are the law of the land. Argue all you want but the facts are Rangers FC (IA) have been hit with a massive tax bill by those authorised to do so by Her Majesty and her Government.

As is their right they are appealing that decision through First Tier Tax Tribunal.

From the Government's web site:

"First–tier Tribunal (Tax) hears appeals against decisions relating to tax made by Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs (HMRC)"

http://www.justice.gov.uk/tribunals/tax

I know many in the Scottish Press and a few Rangers spokesman keep repeating the mantra that they haven't been found guilty of anything.

They aren't renowned for letting facts get in the way of a good story though ;)

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

And they haven't, why would they be in court challenging it? you can throw all the links etc etc into the posts, it still does not make Rangers GUILTY, as for your last little dig i seem to recall an incident quite a long time ago with cfc, that they did there best to cover up, but we all knew what happened.........;)

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

No idea what you're referring to re CFC?:confused: Presumably if they didn't manage to cover up whatever you're talking about you can enlighten me.

Rangers aren't in court. They're at an appeal tribunal because they've been found guilty. Ignore facts all you want it doesn't change anything.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Again, as i said earlier, this will always be the view that non Rangers fans will take, you're the one ignoring the facts, they may be guilty in the eyes of HMRC but until the decision has been made they are innocent until proven otherwise, i rest my case....;)

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

But HMRC have made the decision already....

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

A decision that is being challenged, and a decision which could yet prove to be wrong, thats why its being challenged..:rolleyes:

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Not what you said They have appealed against the "guilty" decision.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Jeez, what you on? I suppose its how you perceive it, or in your case "the way you want it to look anyway" but, as i've said all along Rangers are guilty of nothing, yet!

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

when they've finished reviewing the rangers tax case...can they look at celtic's allowing collections for a terrorist organisation...which is an offence.....which is as bad as paedophilia......

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Got to love the "but someone else did something else, so it was OK for us to do something wrong" proposition......

btw, in the interest of "pot, kettle, black" scenarios, how are those designated terrorist organisations, the UVF and the LVF - still singing songs about them at Ibrox and fundraising at Orange Lodges?

Anyone who collects money for terrorist organisations should be prosecuted, no matter their religious inclinations.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

so you're saying the collections made at celtic's grounds with the blessing(pun intended) of the board of celtic....is ok..celtic have blood on their hands...and this is why we in england hate you and them...what other club has had paedophilia and terrorist collections,as part of the clubs "illustrious" history.....vile club,horrible fans...in the league they deserve.....

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

No, I'm not saying that - as I stated above (amended whilst you were typing), I think anyone who collects money for terrorist organisations should be prosecuted.

btw, nice avoidance of my question....

Anyhoo, in reply to your commentary on behalf of everyone in England - I'm in England, and I don't hate them; you may find you speak for a small (bigoted) minority.

Your logic is only surpassed by your command of the English language.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

so what you're saying is it's ok for celtic's fan to be allowed to collect money for a terrorist organisation at celtic's ground,with the blessing (pun intended) of the celtic board.this means celtic have the blood of innocents on their hands.what other club has terrorist support/worship and paedophilia as part of its "illustrious" history.vile club,horrible fans.and this is why we hate celtic and its paranoid,deluded fans.celtic and its fans think everyones against them.....of course they are...every one [Mod Edit - inappropriate word removed] hates celtic.....
---------- Post added at 12:25 ---------- Previous post was at 12:24 ----------

You will not insult Mods or other site members

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

It would be a good idea but the SPL would never allow it!
michael

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Hi Shaunn, IF, this is true that Celtic are involved in this collection stuff for terrorist organisations, then they should be expelled from the SFA, and the worlds governing body need to take action.

I am not a big fan of Celtic since Mr Lennon took over, Celtic used to be a big name for me in football, then they sang there anti English songs at Wembley, and that put me off Celtric althogether.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Rangers really are in trouble now, quite possibly this is their end: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18407309

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Lets hope not as it will be very sad to lose such a iconic British club.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

It won't be the end - well not entirely. There'll still be a Rangers playing at Ibrox next season. What league though?

The good thing is that HMRC are after those responsible. Previous owners and directors shouldn't require any laxatives for a while. I hope they get their just desserts.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

3rd Division hopefully.

And I think Craig Whyte should be very worried, not just from an early morning knock on the door from Strathclyde Police but there are some more, ahem radical elements amongst the Rangers support. :erm:

If they are willing to send fake bombs and death threats to Neil Lennon because he is Neil Lennon what do you thnk they'll be willing to do to the man that killed their club?

And i dont think moonbeams Murray isn't going to escape scot free either.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

I agree..they should drop to 3rd division...and former directors should be pursued by all legal means (sorry, don't agree doing anything illegal)

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

I didn't understand that. Part of HRMC's decision (other than the pathetic 9p in the pound offer) was so the people responsible could be chased after. Why couldn't they be held to account if HRMC accepted the deal?

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

The 9 pence in the pound deal was a best case scenario. There were something like over 40 unknowns, but one of these was the significant "big tax case". Depending on what paper you read on what day of the week that could reduce the CVA to less than 2 pence in the pound.

HMRC rarely accepts CVAs under any circumstances, especially when there seems to be evidence of tax avoidance/evasion on as large a scale as The Murray Group (Rangers previous owner) have been involved in.

This is one that's bound to run and run.... the EBTs, the dual contracts, the cosy relationship with Banks.....

Why did Graeme Souness get a tax free EBT loan from Rangers scheme while he was managing an English Premiership Club, 10 years after he'd left Rangers?

EBT stands for Employee Benefit Trust

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Yes, that was deliberate tax avoidance..i watched the bbc show about it...rangers were very unsubtle about the avoidance

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

one green bottle standing in a row..one green bottle standing in a row.......i'm sure you know how this ends......no green bottles standing in a row...

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Better green bottles than blue noses.....;)

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

The Blue Noses (2012) is the correct term ;) CEO Malcolm Green :D

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

IF Rangers don't play in the SPL, then bang goes scottish football.

Scottish football needs the big guns ie Celtic and Rangers for the revenue, from Tv etc. I personnaly think that the SPL should sit down and think about this seriously.

Without the big clubs, and really there are only Two, then the Tv companies will walk away. And l cannot see Rangers in the lower leagies of the SPL.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

There is a contrary view that having the entire national football scene dominated by just two clubs in one city has been bad for the Scottish game (when did they last qualify for an international tournament?).

The other SPL clubs might think twice about shooing Rangers back in when they realise that an SPL without Rangers in it might be easier for a club outside Glasgow to win. That in turn might renew wider interest in the game.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Plus although the clubs themselves are reportedly more inclined to allow Rangers in they are all under pressure from their fanbases not to do so. It's certainly not a given that Rangers will be voted back in at all.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

The actual loss of Rangers wouldn't have that great an affect in terms of gate money and sponsorship deals for the other SPL Teams.

Rangers don't actually have as large an away support as some people appear to imagine. It's been calculated that an increase of as few as 100 season tickets for a club like Aberdeen would more than compensate for loss of footfall from Rangers fans.

Before Rangers started financially doping Scottish Football, Aberdeen where debt free and had far larger crowds than currently. An Aberdeen FC with the potential to challenge for trophies could easily sell more season tickets.

Some clubs may benefit, e.g. if Dundee where to be in the SPL then both Dundee Utd and St Johnstone would have larger away attendances when Dundee visited.

The big unknown is the TV money. Both Sky and ESPN have indicated they have no intention of withdrawing from covering SPL football, but what happens when the next contract is due for renewal?

No matter what financial hit the rest of the Scottish football takes, Rangers or The Rangers or New Rangers, should not be allowed to play in the SPL next season.

Sporting integrity has left the planet when a team that has cheated for at least a decade, depriving other teams a level playing field to challenge for trophies, is allowed straight back into the top tier of football with less debt than any of the other league members.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Great post London Road:)

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

What team will Rangers fans support if their team is shut down, Celtic might have no love for Rangers, but if they go, they will just end up winning the SPL title all the time!

If Rangers is not allowed to rejoin the SPL (I hope the fans can restart the club from the bottom end of the League!), who will take its place?

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

still to be decided - either Dunfermline won't be relegated or Dundee will also get promoted.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18484238

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

I wonder how Dundee United will vote...

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

They might relish a tayside derby ...

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

The big question is though, will Celtic vote yes or no?

---------- Post added at 13:46 ---------- Previous post was at 13:46 ----------

Also if Rangers are shut down, will this improve Celtic's chances on moving from the SPL to the EPL?

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Celtic have no chance of moving from the SPL to the EPL.:nono:

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

I am sure the other 11 club (if Rangers is not among them!) would want a chance of winning the SPL title rather than Celtic winning all the time! (at least the EPL has 3 to 5 team who have a chance of winning it!)

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

I have a feeling they may vote no.

Also Rangers FC plc were shut down. The company was liquidated on Thursday. A new company called The Rangers FC was started on Friday, they may have the assets but they are NOT the same company/Club.

It is due to that reason I think they should not be allowed in the SPL this season. After all the are a brand new team who have never played a football match and technically don't have a playable team right now.

This was reflected by the SPL leaving them off the fixture list for this season.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

If the SPL desides to vote no for The "New" Rangers (The Rangers Football Club Ltd) to take the place of The "Old" Rangers (The Rangers Football Club plc). What would happen to Rangers afterwards. Will they have to start from either The Highland Football League, The South of Scotland Football League or The East of Scotland Football League?

The trouble is that if the SPL votes no, then Celtic will almost always win the SPL title each season, that is unless they move to the EPL

Also, if Rangers does close, what team will its fans support? (Certainly not Celtic!)

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

The Rangers would probably go into the Third division.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Thats not so bad, they have a very good chance to return to the SPL within 5 years!

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Well if they did start there and won each league they would be promoted back to the SPL after 3 years.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Which I am sure they can do, even with a weaker squad!

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

I think what people forget is, before Moonbeams Murray started throwing silly money about, The top tier of the Scottish game was very competitive. Aberdeen, Dundee United, Hearts and Hibs were frequently in the hunt for trophies. Both Rangers and Celtic finished in 5th spot on at least one occassion in the days before the Souness revolution.

All these clubs went deeper and deeper into debt trying to compete financially with Rangers. They bought expensive imports, many of whom couldn't lace the boots of the players they replaced, and paid ridicolous high salaries.

At the time of Celtic's near demise Murray famously stated "For every £5 pound Celtic spend Rangers will spend £10".. and they did.

It's just a pity it wasn't their own money ;)

The news isn't getting any better for the club who were Rangers

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18496571

"The Scottish Premier League says Rangers have "a prima facie case to answer in respect of [league] rules" over payments to players."

The history may have to be rewritten of the old Rangers to remove a few titles they won illegally.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Pffft. Given the SPL's record of enforcement I can't see that going ahead, even if it does they'll make a hash of it.

Still even if they do the titles will always be Rangers in the minds of their fans. Celtic count the goals they scored during WW2 even though they aren't officially theirs (funnily enough their record defeat to Rangers during that period isn't counted in their records ;) )

The other teams might want a chance to win but it doesn't change the fact the rules don't allow Celtic to move leagues and the English clubs don't want them.

They'll support the new Rangers team that will be playing at Ibrox.

They'll vote the way Lawell tells them to...

3rd Division is the way forward for Rangers. Stuff the rest of them, let them see how they get on with a vastly reduced media deal and the loss of two big home gates each season. Rangers should go on and rebuilt and let the investigations into Murray, White, Duff and Phelps and the rest run their course.

If the home crowds increase then happy days, I can't see it and think the crowds will reduce overall. Certainly after the initial boost the manky mob will see their reported gates drop off markedly without the Old Firm games. There are an awful lot of Mothers Days over in the East End. :D

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

I blame the decline of the new firm (which began when Fergie moved south of the border), for the continuing dominance of the Old Firm.

Celtic did face near demise in in mid-90s, but ironically they are now owned by two Irish businessmen, (Dermot Desmond and Denis O'Brien), a group a lot of which have faced financial ruin. Ironically it’s Rangers, not Celtic that is facing the same fate!

Craig Whyte and David Murray have ruined a long established football club, I feel that best thing to do is for the fans to buy the club, except relegation to 3rd division and rebuild the team so it become a challenge to Celtic again!

Until that happens, I hope other SPL clubs challenge Celtic for the title (not likely though), if not, then Celtic should move to the EPL

---------- Post added at 10:07 ---------- Previous post was at 10:03 ----------

The English Leagues have allowed the big Welsh Clubs (Cardiff, Swansea etc) to compete in their leagues already, whats to stop them doing the same to Celtic

Are you also suggesting that if the deal falls through Rangers fans will buy the club and start again the in the third division?

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Think there's a real chance Newco Rangers may not get off the ground either, looking bad for them with Smith walking away. Stories rife re the transfer of assets being dodgy and fraud involving the now deceased Rangers and an ex Rangers(RIP) manager.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Thats a historical anomaly, kind of like England, Scotland, Wales and NI having their own international teams despite all being part of the UK.

If teams start picking and choosing where they play it'll cause chaos and there is no way UEFA or FIFA would allow it as the bigger teams would start cherry picking where they want to play.

No. I'm suggesting the newco starts again in the 3rd division regardless of who owns them.

There is still life in this story. Down the line there is a good chance of criminal charges against people involved. Duff and Phelps could well find themselves having to answer to their regulators as to why they've ignored the rules for administrators and the diddy teams ganging up on Celtic to get 50/50 splits in all gate money and a fairer split in the reduced media deal.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

AHA, I'm beginning to spot the commonality of the Rangers Supporters' skills of debate.
Deflect your wrongdoing by introducing a comparison to another team, no matter how irrelevant it is... Don't show any contrition because "we're the people".

I can't say I've ever heard any Celtic Fans boasting of war time goals as one of their achievments? Perhaps as individual scoring records and usually with a footnote. It's generally agreed, as a matter of sporting integrity, that wartime records aren't official. Some Clubs had all their players on the front line and relied on guest players. Other clubs had players available because they were in vital industies - like the shipyards in Govan ;)

The Celtic supporters mostly remember those special achievements outwith the war years, like VE Cup, Coronation cup, Empire Cup, First team to achieve 9 in a row, first British team to win a big silvery thing in 1967... what was it called again.;) (They won everything they entered that year, it's so difficult to remember them all ;))

A big cup that Moonbeams wanted so badly that he's killed your club trying to achieve it, by any means - foul or, erm, fouler.

I love your Ben Johnson approach to Sporting Integrity. :erm:

It doesn't matter what the Rangers fans think - the history books will forever portray them as cheats.;)

History to be proud of:
RFC(deceased 2012) aka Scotland's Shame

won 49 Scottish titles *

*won 54 on the park but stripped of titles because they cheated.

Won European Cup Winners Cup 1972*

*Couldn't defend trophy after being banned from Europe for 1 year (Fans rioting in Barcelona)

Won the UEFA fair play award after their UEFA Cup Final defeat in Manchester
in 2008 due to their fans good natured banter. ;)

(One part of this may not be true ;)) :D

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

I'm sure you really don't want to get into a slanging match about the history and actions of teams, their officials and fans.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

That's what football banter is all about Deek :D

I'll never defend the lowlife who unfortunately follow the same team as I, nor the behaviour, on occasion, of some officials. I'm sure you can dreg my posts to find my criticism of our current manager. I've even gone on record for criticising the late and great Jock Stein.

Equally, I reserve the right to criticise the lowlife that used to follow the Rangers football Club (aka Scotland's shame)... and those who used to own and run it. Scotland's shame ... the establishment club, the Tesco superstore reduced to being passed around from one barrow boy to another.... if the support really cared about it they'd have done something about it.

Even after LLoyds had taken over the Bank of Scotland and noticed the large financial hole that was there the Rangers fans went on a "We deserve better walk" to protest at Moonbeams cutbacks. :rolleyes: Reality still hasn't struck. The acceptance that the Serco football club may have to start in div3 is seen as a way of showing the rest of the country how much we need the Gers. :no:

You must surely agree though that it was moonbeams aspirations to win the ultimate European trophy that killed Rangers.... well that and the willingness of some establishment figures and the press to pander to his dreams...

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

its like when celtic(sporting wing of the ira)come to england and sing the songs praising the bombs and murders of people in pubs and coaches..thats why their are hooligans,or some would say community patriots.we will defend our(england/english)towns from foreign terrorist invaders,who are known to have blown up pubs etc.also if celtic played in english football,you wouldn't be able to bring children to watch the matches..i..because of the violence that would ensue..2.. kids and celtic....i dont think so... "one green bottle,standing on a wall"........you know how it ends..

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

^^^
Yet another posting of utter nonsense and non truth.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Ridiculous post :mad: complete and utter nonsense

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Is there any chance that Rangers fans are prepaired to buy the "new" Rangers and restart it in the third division?

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

There doesn't seem to be an appetite for it.

The clubhas been up for sale for years and there's been no conserted effort from any of the fans groups to buy the club. Previous Share issues have been under subscribed.

The Fighting fund launched by Walter Smith and Sandy Jardine raised about quarter of a million pounds. A lot of money but a fairly low total for a club the size of Rangers.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

I find is very unusal that we are the only nation that is represented by seperate teams in the international stage (bar a few exceptions) and we have different national league systems as well.

I have called for Europe top clubs to leave their National Leagues to form a European Super League (so that smaller teams have a chance at the Top League Titles). I have also called for Top clubs from smaller European Nations to form a new league called the Atantic League (to compete better with top leagues of England, Spain, Italy and Germany)

Those suggestions will help Football overall, I see no reason why FIFA and UEFA disagree...

As for the Rangers debarcle, I hope that after all this Scottish Football is better in the long run

Also how does the SPL-SFL merger affect all this?

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Just found this out, "New" Rangers wanted to buy Bury FC (in League One) so that they compete in League One if they cannot get into the SPL

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2...ngers-takeover

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

That story has already been debunked.

Of more sigificance today is Hearts Mad Vlad's declaration that they will definitely vote against the team formerly known as Rangers getting into the SPL. A wee dig at Murdoch's empire in there too. I had them down as a probable yes.... what do I know;)

Of known declaration it's 1-1 so far, assuming Duff and Phelps vote correctly ;)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18539483

Update: 2-1 for sporting integrity after Dundee Utd meeting tonight. This is like a very slow Eurovision except one of the contestants is allowed to vote for themself

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

I wouldn't assume those jokers could do anything right, plus right now hey have to convince a judge in the Court of Session that having numerous previous dealings with Craig Whyte and being his guests at Rangers games before the excrement hit the fan wasn't a conflict of interest.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotlan...-west-18549293

I fully expect more teams to vote no, I think 4 have already received their orders from Mr Lawell ;) and now they have gone public it's a matter or SFL1 or SFL3. I hope it's 3 to give the remnants of the team a chance to regroup and grow.

Plus it sets a precident from when mad vlad finally runs Hearts aground and Dolly remember they aren't a big club and the 80s was a long, long time ago and follow Rangers into the mire.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

The wheels of justice are in motion ;):

http://local.stv.tv/glasgow/107835-i...-into-rangers/

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

And to heap on the bad news The new club, whatever name it will end up with, won't play in the top tier.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18577192

The dignified thing would be to withdraw their application and apply for the SFL.

They'll need time to ensure they have sufficient players to fulfill fixtures at whatever level they're admitted.

Re: Would you like to see Celtic and Rangers in the English league?
 

Dignified? Not in Mr Greens vocabulary I'm afraid. He's already shown the players what he thinks of them by ignoring employment law. Although the distinct lack of money coming in from season ticket renewals and TV money might be making him a bit worried about recouping his money and he'll re-think the offer to take the club off his hands.

Hopefully now Rangers go to Div3, build a strong youth team and rebuild. They won't be the last team to go bust and without the Glasgow stranglehold hopefully the top flight will be a fairer place money wise by the time they get back up there.

On the brightside we can all be thankful of three years without Celtic moaning about conspiracies. They might even be beaten fairly for the first time since 1888! :erm: :shocked: ;)