Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

Not noticed it lately but there have been several rumours that it's coming real soon now...

60kb/s?
Like 8kB/s? or 60kB/s? :erm:

I'll do some evaluation downloads later this evening but could I suggest you do the Glastnost test?
(Probably best to wait until the post-9pm rush settles down, if at all possible.)

Background info on the Glasnost test from TorrentFreak

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

lol

well put it this way... i have a 2mb connection and my limit is only 300mb a day. now that is absolutely ridiculous. i have my PC, xbox 360 and PS3 all running from that connection so that means i will reach that practically everyday.

300mb is a couple of game trailers downloaded on xbox live. because my connection speed isn't that fast to begin with, it means stuff like game demos and movies that are digitally distributed over xbox live would take a matter of hours. when they cap you, it will take twice the amount of time, so what was like an hour and a half download, suddenly turns into 3 hours.

i pay money for xbox live. my usage of the service is being restricted so i'm losing out.

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

Some would say that 2Mb is insufficient for what you are trying to do with it.

BUT... we pay for speed of connection not the amount that can be downloaded. So it may take five times longer to download a file on 2Mb than it does on 10Mb, that would be my choice.

SO... if VM are trying to force people to pay for a faster connection AND insist on keeping the crappy STM, maybe they should re-advertise the tiers as download thresholds rather than speed??

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

I've had a reply from the ASA about my complaint which goes to several pages.
Unfortunately my scanner is down at the moment otherwise I would make the full text available to you all.

It is worth noting that there are only 2 pages of the missive in reply but also
5 pages of their Adjudication which are watermarked "confidential" (why send them to a member of the public?)''
.
The total number of complaints is 30 one of whom is BSkyB.
So much for all those bitching on here about the service!

I know that my next quote can be construed incorrectly and when my scanner is up and running again the full text will be available.

Virgin Media said

"Virgin said they followed CAP guidance and always qualified their use of "unlimited" and stated that "acceptable use policy applies". They explained that their policy did not limit the amount of data a user could download over any period of time, and it did not have any price implications for heavy users.
They explained that, if a user was found to affect other users bandwidth, they would temporarily limit the speed of that user's internet connection. They said those user's would receive their full connection speed after 240 minutes. They said they planned to publish a list of Frequently Asked Questions on traffic management shortly. They argued that there were no limits to the amount of material that can be downloaded by customers and that the claim "unlimited downloads" was not misleading.

The above paragraph is an extract taken from paragraph 2 of the response by VM to the ASA.

As soon as I get my scanner working again I'll give you a link to the full text.
Forgot to add 750Mb between 4.00pm and 12.00p does not add up to 240 mins!

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

So was the complaint upheld or not?

So they follow CAP guidelines?

7 TRUTHFULNESS
7.1 No marketing communication should mislead, or be likely to mislead, by inaccuracy, ambiguity, exaggeration, omission or otherwise.

VM advertise broadband as: 'no download limits'
Yet bury the fact that there is a usage allowance which, when exceeded, initiates Subscriber Traffic Management.
You are referred to the T&Cs and the acceptable use Policy...

Cabled T&Cs
B About our services
4.i. We reserve the right to monitor and control data volume and/or types of traffic transmitted via the interactive services on your Virgin TV and/or Internet access. In the event that you exceed any usage allowance applicable to your Internet access or your use does not comply with the 'acceptable use policy' which you can read on the Virgin Media website, we reserve the right (at our sole discretion) to reduce, suspend or terminate your Internet access.

No mention of actual STM or link to the STM which contains details of the usage allowance, referred to in the T&Cs, before being throttled.

The AUP does not mention or link to the STM, only a link to section J (Ending the agreement) of the T&Cs

So where are the STM details?
Hidden under the 'Need to know' tab.
Omitted from the package sales details.
Omitted from the AUP and T&Cs

I would agree that there isn't technically a download limit. whether on 20Mb or 2Mb, you can still download a large file... it just takes ten times longer.

The misleading advertising for me is the fact that I pay for a 10Mb connection but for up to 9 hours a day it can potentially be as little as 2.5Mb because I have exceeded a usage allowance that is not clearly defined on a no download limit connection.

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

icsys, Virgin do not place any limits on the amount of data that can be downloaded. If you download a file or files non-stop for an entire month your connection will still work and no extra fees will go on your monthly bill. That is what an unlimited connection is.

As for your complaint about STM, it is in the small print and you agreed with it when you signed up.

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

Trial BitTorrent downloads on my 4Mb/s connection late last night and this morning produced monitored speeds of 2.5Mb/s and 3.2Mb/s respectively regardless of having encryption set on or off.
Which suggests that (in my area, at least) there's no obvious throttling of the most likely candidate, bittorrent, right now.
:angel:

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

STM serves its purpose and is generally fair when it works properly but the upcoming STM on business customers (currently being secretly trialed) doesnt make much sense.

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

No longer a trial for some.

Some already have the 20mbit upgrade with the same STM limits as residential.

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

and so they should unless they want to pay a proper price

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

The trial will last until it gets rolled out nationally then it won't be a trial anymore:D
Think the end of June and you won't be far wrong!

---------- Post added at 15:29 ---------- Previous post was at 15:24 ----------

Business 20Mb/s Broadband has different (higher) STM Limits from residential.. If users are not seeing that then they have the incorrect config.;)

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

I 'm not sure why you are referring me to this as I clearly stated the same albeit in a different way...
I am not complaining per-se about the STM. If the threshold limits were reasonable (I consider 1200MB to be reasonable for the 'L' tier in the evenings) then there is no real problem. Naturally though, I would prefer a totaly unlimited broadband experience.

For your information. STM was not in existence when I signed up in 2002 (and if by some chance it was, it was not brought to my attention).

Above all, The STM needs to be consistent, and hopefully when the trials are completed there will be fairer thresholds and full transparency so that everyone will know exactly what to expect.

I do not recall being informed that my area was to be placed on a STM trial. I had to find out through public forums. People were finding their speeds reduced during the afternoon without reason and when querying why, finding out about the extended trial hours.

Are we likely to be told when the trial ends and what the new STM is going to be?

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

Afraid you are wrong there. When *I* signed up back in April 2000 there was no such thing as STM, so I certainly COULDN'T have agreed to it could I? :dunce:

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

You agreed that the terms of use could be changed at VM's/Telewest's/NTL's discretion, AFAIK.

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

There is a clause to that effect

I would argue that because customers are not notified of changes to T&Cs (other than changes in pricing) then it is impossible to know whether any change is 'significant' and warrants cancellation of the service.

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

Someone has been printing these off and posting them in the area's around here...lol...

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

Im from blackpool & the new traffic management times dont make any sense to me.

why are they trailing them without telling us? with the experiment we are currently blind, and when they implement it, we will no longer be blind and therefore the results drawn from the experiment will no longer be cogent because people will alter their downloading appropriately.

I just started downloading at 9:03 and immediately i got traffic managed. i had downloaded quite a lot before 9 but stopped before i got managed. i dont think they stop the traffic management policy quite at 9 o'clock.... like any company they want to get the most money they can by manipulating the situation as much as possible. i won't be renewing my contract.

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

Heres the link explaining how the traffic managing thing is supposed to work IT ALSO STATES THAT
"The updated traffic management policy is now in place across the network."!!!!! .
It seems virgin have secretly started using it without informing any of its customers as I have been having problems with my broadband as it has been very slow recently and thought i would investigate.
This is copied from

http://allyours.virginmedia.com/html...t/traffic.html


Here at Virgin Media, we want all our customers to get the best service possible from their Broadband. That means speedy downloads for all users - not just a few.

When someone is downloading and/or uploading a particularly large amount of information over a long period of time, it can slow down the Internet speed for other users who might just be checking their email or browsing online. So to make sure our service is fair for everybody, we sometimes moderate the speeds during peak times (4pm till 9pm) for customers who are downloading and/or uploading an unusually large amount at these times.

This ensures that the service doesn't get blocked up with people using more than their fair share – which means a lot fewer traffic jams.
Will my download speed be affected?

Your speed won't be moderated unless you're in the top 3% of users (uploaders and downloaders). Our boffins ran a trial to see how much our service was being affected. They discovered that, in certain areas, just 3% of customers were uploading and/or downloading such a large amount of content that it was affecting the service for other users in these areas.

There is some overlap in the 3% of uploaders and the 3% of downloaders. Our data has identified that the top 3% of uploaders and downloaders makes up fewer than 5% of all users.

And we're not talking about just a few video clips. In some cases the top 3% of uploaders and downloaders were using as much as 3GB, just during peak times. That's around 750 music tracks in the space of a few hours.

So, unless you're using an unusually large amount of information at peak times, we won't restrict your service and you can use to your heart's content.
Aren't you simply trying to cut costs?

We've never believed in cutting costs for the sake of it. We want to deliver the best possible value to all our customers - and that's exactly what we're doing. That's why we've recently doubled the speed of our top broadband package up to a supersonic 20Mb, and will be launching 50Mb broadband services in the future.
When will this new policy be launched?

The updated traffic management policy is now in place across the network. The policy for the 10Mb profile of the 'L' broadband package is rolled out as the package speeds are increased from 4Mb. More information can be found at www.virginmedia.com/evenfaster on the timescales for the rollout.
What traffic management policies are you applying to the heaviest users?

That depends on the broadband package you're signed up to. And it's important to remember that these traffic management policies only apply during peak times (4pm till 9pm) - as this is when the speeds are likely to be affected by people using more than their fair share.
The Technical stuff

Here are some details about the different thresholds for each broadband service:
Broadband Size: M

During peak times, the top 3% of downloaders on the Size: M package download at least 300MB of traffic each, with the top 3% of uploaders uploading at least 150MB of traffic each.

Any users hitting this amount during peak times (4pm till 9pm) will have their broadband speed temporarily traffic managed - their download speed will be set to 1Mb, with their upload speed set to 128Kb. This will last for 5 hours from when the traffic management policy is applied.

Even if a Broadband Size: M user has their speed temporarily traffic managed, they can still download over 2,500 music files per day.
Broadband Size: L

During peak times, the top 3% of downloaders on the Size: L package download at least 800MB of traffic each, with the top 3% of uploaders uploading at least 325MB of traffic each.

Any users hitting this amount during peak times (4pm till 9pm) will have their broadband speed temporarily traffic managed - their download speed will be set to 1Mb, with their upload speed set to 128Kb. This will last for 5 hours from when the traffic management policy is applied.

Even if a Broadband: Size L user has their speed temporarily traffic managed, they can still download over 5,500 music files per day.

Note: We are in the process of rolling out a speed uplift for the Size 'L' broadband tier, that increases customer download speeds from up to 4Mb to up to 10Mb.

As customers are upgraded, the traffic management policy for the upgraded package changes accordingly.

In areas where 10Mb speeds are available, the top 3% of downloaders download at least 800MB of traffic each during the peak period each evening, with the top 3% of uploaders uploading at least 400MB of traffic in the same period.

Any users hitting this amount during peak times (4pm till 9pm) will have their broadband speed temporarily traffic managed – their download speed will be set to 2.5Mb, with their upload speed set to 128Kb. This will last for 5 hours from when the traffic management policy is applied.

Even if a Broadband: Size L user has their speed temporarily traffic managed, they can still download over 14,000 music files per day.
Broadband Size: XL

During peak times, the top 3% of downloaders on the Size: XL package download at least 3GB of traffic each, with the top 3% of uploaders uploading at least 1250MB of traffic each.

Any users hitting this amount during peak times (4pm till 9pm) will have their broadband speed temporarily traffic managed - their download speed will be set to 5Mb, with their upload speed set to 192Kb. This will last for 5 hours from when the traffic management policy is applied.
How do we know this will work?

Well, as we said, we've carried out a trial in which we looked closely at when the heaviest users were affecting the service for everybody else.

We found that this small minority of customers were actually downloading or uploading enough information to significantly affect the service for other customers' broadband service. To put it another way, just 3% of uploaders and downloaders were affecting the service for the other 97% of uploaders and downloaders during peak times (that's between 4pm and 9pm).

What's more, we noticed that when we restricted the speed of the service for this 3% of users who were uploading and/or downloading, we had a positive response from customers (there were less calls into our technical support teams regarding problems with broadband performance). We also noticed that the broadband speed was faster for the vast majority of users.
Will the thresholds change?

The way that our customers use their broadband is changing all the time, so it's possible that in the future we may increase or decrease the thresholds - don't worry though, we'll always let you know on our website if we're going to make any changes, and we don't expect the thresholds to change very often.
How can I tell if I'm nearing the threshold?

There are several tools that you can use to check how much you're downloading or uploading. One particularly useful tool you can download is called DU Meter*.

If you'd like to use a different tool, you might like to www.tucows.com*

---------- Post added at 22:59 ---------- Previous post was at 22:52 ----------

In terms of avoiding the traffic management the bit torrent client program Azureus has an encryption thing that can help you avoid it see:

http://www.azureuswiki.com/index.php...raffic_shaping

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

thanks for the tip with Azureus. going to see if this works

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

Encrypting will help if VM are blocking/throttling torrent traffic but it wont make any difference to upload/download limits, so if you upload/download more than the stm allows you'll still get capped.

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

Hi all, just signed up here.

What the hell has happened to my internet service over the past year? Virgin Media have completely ruined what used to be a great service, Ive taken a couple of low blows from them since they took over but this latest one finally has me ready to accept the hassle and change my phone and internet providers.

Im on the 20mb service and pretty much for the last 4 days I have been getting an average of 5mb 24/7. At first I thought they were maybe working on some technical issues and this is quite funny, maybe optimizing the service so that it might run a little better. Then I check here (I always end up here trying to find out about why the service is bad) and find this news. It really is the end of the line for me, Im jumping ship on this bad internet service. They've spent all of their money advertising for new customers whilst slowly destroying our once great service. Unacceptable.

Ive always been on the cable line, never had a DSL connection so I guess I'll be in the 'other isp' section asking a few questions tomorrow.

*Another angry VM customer*

God I miss Blueyonder.

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

VM have completely lost the plot with the original customer base be it NTL TW etc. However I have had a good result for a month. They've knocked £9.00 off my monthly bill if I stay with them for the next month (Discount permanent!)

Could be because I sent them an email threatening to leave because of STM and they were in breech of the original T's&C's

They have been told and accepted that if the service doesn't improve in the next 30 days I'm off to a new ISP.

If I stay with them (if they improve) I can keep the £9.00 discount.
Does that mean that all the years I've been with my cable company (ninex,c&W ntl,VM) I've been overcharged?


I've NEVER had a problem until VM took over and I've always paid for the premium service.

They are on a 30 day countdown!

---------- Post added at 00:53 ---------- Previous post was at 00:44 ----------

I seem to remember an actress by the name of Uma Thurman saying someting like "You can download me as many times as you want" but I could be wrong! Having said that she did NOT say it would mean that my B/W would be throttled!

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

downloading 2400 KB/s here, no problems - sorry :)

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

I can do this at this time of night!

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

I seem to remember that VM place no limits on data transfer, only speed. The data is still getting to you and you aren't being charged extra.

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

But that seriously affects online gaming. I didnt even know anything was up until I tried to play some online fighting games and got extremely poor ping tests for a server that I usually get around 13-15ms ping from. For the last week Ive been averaging around 25-60. I got around the 60 mark a few times, Id only ever get it that bad if I had a whole bunch of torrents running, but everything was clear. Regardless of my ping with this server, lately a few minutes after playing and the whole thing would go rubbish, skipping all over the place and leaving the whole thing unplayable.

Thats when it becomes a little to much for me. Ive been using that gaming service for years on the same server, and Ive never gone higher than 15ms, ever. I can learn to live with a download limit, it was annoying but I got over it. But when I cant do simple things like online gaming and it even has webpages loading much slower than usual, its to much of a step down and nowhere near worth the £35 odd that I pay for it every month.

I really am so disappointed with the service. I spend a lot of time online and when Telewest were in control it was without a doubt the damn best ISP about. Virgin do seem intent on spending X ammount of money on advertising for new customers whilst giving the middle finger to their loyal customer base. Well Im not staying loyal for any longer! Ive havent been on the internet through a phone line since the dial-up days but I guess it is time to give that a try again. BE seem to be a popular choice and a website that I found seems to think that I am 700m real line distance from my exchange, so hopefully I can find the kind of service I want elsewhere. And like I said in my other post I have been lurking here for a while without an account. Do any of you remember that website bulldog hell? This place seems quite similar but for the Virgin service, since Virgin took over. (No offence to the actual website, I think it is great.) Just noting that there are a LOT of unhappy Virgin customers!

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

5mb at the moment, havent downloaded a thing all day, just browsed a few sites. Tried to do some online gaming and it was awful. Screw this.

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

Online gaming on a 5Mb connection is anything but awful unless you're trying to stream the entire game.

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

Being capped @ 1mb when i should have 4mb and playing cod4 (call of duty 4) is what can i say dam right stupid more lag then the local prison's put together totally un called for I dont download and if i do its only for patch's Im a gamer not a torrent user this is toally unfair why I should suffer becouse some peeps want freebies such has film's porno's games etc, from there torrent sites.

VM get ya ACT together or Im gone

NTL why did you sell the that PRAT Branson pickle HEAD moffo
all i can say is F.U.B.A.R..................................... :mad:

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

Seems VM are sending out more letters:-

http://www.cableforum.co.uk/article/...sage-customers

Re: New Virgin traffic management - so that's why it's slow!
 

What a complete and utter joke this service is becoming.

STM for daring to use your connection.
Port Throttling (Coming soon to Bittorrent and News)
Phorm Spyware (Selling your data to a dodgy Spyware company)
Threatening letters about your usage
Veiled threats of £130 charges by other companies in the above letter (could that be coming soon ?)

When 50 meg is released what is the bloody point when you will not be able to use the sodding thing for fear of having you browsing sold, your speeds dropped, and then port throttled. I knew VM was in trouble money wise but i never thought they would become bloody AOL in another form.

Please for Gods sake bring back Ntl.

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

This ISP is becoming a joke.

Re: New Virgin traffic management - so that's why it's slow!
 

When they start port throttling news on port 80, that's when I'll be downgrading my service to the lowest tier until then I'll continue to schedule downloads during the night.

VM are still better than the competition IMHO.

Re: New Virgin traffic management - so that's why it's slow!
 

You mean ports 119/433, don't you?
:confused:

Re: New Virgin traffic management - so that's why it's slow!
 

From what i can figure out its type and port of traffic so if your News is on 119 or any other port they will just throttle that TYPE of traffic no matter what port :(. So i am led to believe.

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

No, port 80.

Currently I use port 563 with SSL, but non-ssl sessions work over port 80 also. When Giganews decides to switch on SSL over port 80 then the only thing VM will be able to do is traffic manage by IP address.

This just about covers it...The ship sinks
 

I have a few days left with Virgin (now serving 30days to leave) and i am on adsl now been on it for a week (much better in my area for me) and i came across this on the Front page of cable forum

http://www.cableforum.co.uk/article/...sage-customers

I might have missed someone elses post sorry but i had to post it and make a point ............... Get ready for Phorm.........thats next

Virgin the Titanic........................... Quick run for the lifeboats

Dam they have been oversubscribed.....but you can use em while your asleep between 12 am and 4 am LOL :dunce:

Re: This just about covers it...The ship sinks
 

I am fine thank you

Re: This just about covers it...The ship sinks
 

So what VM are saying in their round about way,as usual, is that they are now going to extend stm times to almost half the day, 10.00-15.00 then the usual 16.00 to 21.00. But of course it's still unlimited! this is what grates me, VMs pure snideness in the way they sell their broadband as "unlimited".

Why oh why are they boosting up the speeds, but then bringing in more and more restrictions to the service, presumably we now have the extra stm to allow VM to sell the 50mb service without stm, initially, I'd like to bet that won't last. I can understand the need for stm if the network is overloaded, I can't say I like it, but that's life, it's just the bs Virgin come out with, a few are ruining it for everybody, the language they use when someone who pays for their unlimited service dares to download a lot. What will it take for the advertising standards agency to come down on VM for misrepresenting their product.

New STM Confirmed
 

http://www.virginmedia.com/help/traffic-management.php

Read it and weep folks.

No more downloading at all without being classed as an "abuser"

Re: New STM Confirmed
 

It states "Last updated: 28 March 2008"

Re: New STM Confirmed
 

Ignore that, and read the new STM Rules.

10am-3pm STM applies (3gb limit for 20mbit)
And then 4-9PM as well.

Re: New STM Confirmed
 

Why,

Tell me how its going to stop me downloading when i normally do after midnight. Or are you saying that they will come round and turn it off :)

Do me a favour Think about what you are going to say before you open your mouth

Virgin Media's New policy will NOT stop me downloading will it ?

Re: New STM Confirmed
 

Overnight STM trials have now started.

It's a waste of time trying to download if your going to get 75% of your connection taken off you :rolleyes:

Re: New STM Confirmed
 

I have come the conclusion you are talking ********. I like you have contacts, My contacts last week :rofl: at your last lot of comments :). There is No trials of overnight STM at this time.

Re: New STM Confirmed
 

this will effect next to nobody, anybody who it does effect needs to get a job
9gb from 10am-9pm is plenty.

well done virgin!!

Re: New STM Confirmed
 

Oh yea, just like you argued with me this STM trial wasnt running till alex said it was? or like this stm wasnt going to be rolled out...oops it has.

Overnight STM is being trialled, dont care if you dont believe me, you'll just look stupid when it's rolled out :)

Re: New STM Confirmed
 

you spout some rubbish!!

Re: New STM Confirmed
 

Can we have less of the arguments please. Thanks. :)

Some people work nights! :fit:

Re: New STM Confirmed
 

Oh ok, see, VM enjoy customers like you, they know they can rip you off, take 75% of your connection away from you and you'll still sing praise to them.

Oh well.

Re: New STM Confirmed
 

Whats your problem. Your not a customer according to your services info. So are you just here to stir up trouble and gloat ?

Re: New STM Confirmed
 

I have issues with people calling me a liar...especially when i've proved so many times not to be.

Re: New STM Confirmed
 

for the price I pay they can stm'd all they like I WILL STILL CONTINUE TO DOWNLOAD AND GET MY STUFF I WANT

Re: New STM Confirmed
 

But your happy to call others the same ?

Re: New STM Confirmed
 

Only when they start it.

If you had pm'd me and had a chat about the new stm i would of been happily to do so and share some of my information with you, but coming on here to mouth me off for no reason is unfair, dont you think?

Re: New STM Confirmed
 

What annoyed me is the way you gloated about it. I see you have changed what you posted now. Telling people that they can no longer download was incorrect no matter how you worded it.

Re: New STM Confirmed
 

I didnt gloat about it, i said read em and weep.

It's a common saying, i did NOT mean to come across as gloating.

Although one should note i did say this was going to be rolled out nationally and had people calling me a liar then as well.

I just get sick of people doing it when i've been spot on 100% all the time (for the most part) your info is usually spot on as well, but you are wrong about the overnight stm.

Re: New STM Confirmed
 

I knew that was about to happen as well. However my source would have never given me any more info if he had seen me post about it. ;)


Just made a call to someone in the know, who said he knows nothing about overnight STM running on a trial at the moment. Says it was ruled out of the equation for now. ? He might be wrong but his info is normally accurate and has matched a lot of your posts in the past.

Re: New STM Confirmed
 

Firstly - Do not use caps please - shouting is extremely bad net ettiquette.

Secondly - you may still get what you want but it will take you longer to obtain it at a reduced speed.

Seems strange to pay for a price for a service only to see it get reduced dramatically in some cases.

Re: New STM Confirmed
 

My sources never get caught :p:

But back to the topic at hand, i find it hard how they can still class this service as unlimited when you have all day STM.

---------- Post added at 20:27 ---------- Previous post was at 20:23 ----------

Exactly! the toothless ASA says this is still unlimited though :rolleyes:

Re: New STM Confirmed
 

the advertising language is something that needs sorting with all isps the adverts are just plain wrong

Re: New STM Confirmed
 

I was happy with STM until I saw they are now doing daytime throttling as well. Why don't they just tell everyone plain and simple "we can't give you the speed you pay for" instead of fobbing us all off with lies and excuses as to why they are dropping our speed.

To me, a few GB in the evening is nothing. I do a lot of web design and graphic design. I can easily push a few GB in a few hours with that. I also collect beta software which can come in the GB's every day as well.

They say they're not cutting down on costs, but thats obviously a lie when they are cutting our speed and telling us its because we use too much. Who are they to judge if I'm using too much? They don't know my browsing habbits. They don't know what I need to use my connection for. Who are they to say what I can and can't download and at what times?

Re: New STM Confirmed
 

On that page they have clearly said that there are limits, and quite clearly stated what those limits are. before you could download X amount, now you can only download X amount. on another page they are saying that they are still UNLIMITED.

It is ridiculous to be putting the blame on the customers. now they have officialy opened the gates.
Think of how many people receiving this letter and how it is the first thing they've ever heard of the thing called STM.

Re: New Virgin traffic managent - so that's why it's slow!
 

10am - 4pm on a weekday is now peak?

So after stopping users from downloading after 4pm (i.e. when they actually want to), and forcing them to download during the day, now that people are doing it, VM are now calling 10am-4pm as peak time. By the end of the year off-peak will be down to 3:30am - 4:00am

Re: New STM Confirmed
 

That is exactly what needs to be done - I fully take on board VM have to protect their network for stability.

What I am taking exception to is that Virgin Media are advertising it as a No limiting service. So customers who see this will assume this is exactly what they can do.

Yeah downloads can continue, but a reduced speed. So regardless of all the semantics in this, Virgin Media are applying download limits.

Re: New Virgin traffic management - so that's why it's slow!
 

I never thought I'd read that in a CF thread....:D

Re: New STM Confirmed
 

The trials were made public (to certain staff) today after a meeting, only a small amount of people know about it right now.

Pm me for more info.

Re: New STM Confirmed
 

They can protect it by stop selling the product 100 times over.

And they know that is what a customer will assume. they want him or her to assume. if you were to tell the top man this is what's happening, he'll say tough we can get away with it.

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

I think they should know how much bandwidth you use and how long per month you've been throttled then recalculate the bill accordingly.

I hope this gets all the negative feedback going and hope some rules change. (Though I seriously doubt it).

I think I might have to vote with my feet on this one. :(

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

FFS, I've been STMd after less than 700MB and out of hours!

I'm in TS5, just had the upgrade to 10Mb and I've been out all day. Came in from work downloaded 10.5.3 for OS X (420MB) at about 5PM, almost hit 1000KB/s for most of the download. Then I started on the iPhone SDK (1200MB) at about 9:15PM.

After 300MB of the iPhone SDK I can't get any faster than 300KB/s. I've opened some other downloads from ubuntu.virginmedia.com and I get no faster than 300KB/s :(

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

There has been a lot of reports of people being STMd either out of hours or well below the allowed limit. support say they are reporting it but nothing has come back from them. what is to stop VM from applying reduced speeds to anyone no matter how much they download or what ever time of day just to keep things from grinding to a halt and to enable them to add new customers?

Absolutely nothing.

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

whats the bloody use of the new STM management policy...the old one (4-9pm) which is still currently going on btw, is just as bad.

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

The next step will be to turn off Broadband at midnight with the excuse that only 3% of users ever use it after midnight anyway so it won’t impact on most users, and you can still download 15,000 mp3’s each day.
Everywhere Branson goes the pox is sure to follow soon after.

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

The only reason they use mp3s as an example is (1) they think you're an idiot, and (2) it amounts to thousands. where do you get thousands of legal mp3s from and how much would it cost you?
This isn't Branson's doing, it's NTL's.

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

http://www.cableforum.co.uk/article/...sage-customers
i think virgin are on a sticky wickett if they try to dictate at what times of the day and how mutch you can d/load by the way as annyone noticed how quick they are to reduce your connection and how long after the time its supposed to be back to full speed it takes to come back to a reasnable speed

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

This is typical Branson, I have been stitched up with him before, why do you think he is always smiling, it's what he does for his kicks.

The next phase will be to gradually reduce the amount you can download before STM cuts in, I await Traxdata's next announcement.

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

I always tell myself the grinning is from something stuck up his bum.

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

Wed, 28 May 2008 22:39:07 UTC

Test 1: 1024K took 13828 ms = 74.1 KB/sec, approx 611 Kbps, 0.6 Mbps
Test 2: 1024K took 14750 ms = 69.4 KB/sec, approx 572 Kbps, 0.56 Mbps
Test 3: 1024K took 14766 ms = 69.3 KB/sec, approx 571 Kbps, 0.56 Mbps
Test 4: 2048K took 40500 ms = 50.6 KB/sec, approx 417 Kbps, 0.41 Mbps

Overall Average Speed = approx 543 Kbps, 0.53 :shocked:Mbps
by the way im suposed to be on 4 meg

---------- Post added at 23:50 ---------- Previous post was at 23:47 ----------

its now 10 am till 3 pm as well next it will be 9 pm till 10 am

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

What?! O2 broadband is looking even more promising now.....

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

its now 10 am till 3 pm as well
http://www.cableforum.co.uk/article/...sage-customers
check the link

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

Branson does not OWN virgin Media.He has merely allowed the Virgin trade mark to be used in return for financial gain.

The failures of VM are down to those who were so hopeless at running NTL before the merger with telewest.

But of course it's much easier to blame the hirsute one than the real villains.

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

Agreed coggy, out of everyone I imagine Richard Branson is pretty peeved with the almost daily drip, drip of bad news coming out of VM. He must have asked himself why he ever got involved with this bunch of amateurs, all they have managed is to bring the Virgin brand down, down and down. In my opinion the first half decent offer he receives you won't see him for dust.

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

I was on the trial STM being 10am to 3pm and 4pm to 9pm before they rolled it out nationally. I have had to put up with this for over 2 to 3 months now. I get the feeling they will push the STM times more and more, just to see what they can get away with.

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

Hell... Even Tiscali is looking better than this crap! (And I never thought I'd hear myself say that either!)

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

I'm really getting fed up with VM now. What a joke :mad:. Whats the point of BB if I cant use it

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

I'm fairly sure I read somewhere that STM can only affect customers once every 24 Hours. Could I just download 2GB in the morning when I'm at school and then be STM-free for the rest of the day, or will VM change the rules?

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

^ oh if its like that then im kind off ok with it...

Q. Can you trigger STM more than once over a 24 hour period?
A. Under the existing rules, No.

Time to kill off morning STM here...then keep 4-9pm free :)

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

It can effect you more than once.

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

oh damn.

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

can someone confirm that is indeed true? Otherwise I'd be one ****ed off customer...

http://www.virginmedia.com/help/traffic-management.php

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

oh yeh just saw that now, have not been on cf for a while, but don't know why i haven't....:shrug:

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

What will happen if you're still affected by the daytime STM at 5pm and will then be affected by the evening STM at the same time!

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

Ridiculous i know! So much for 'unlimited' broadband, well this is a limit isn't it, one that limits how much you can download in a certain space of time

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

"In extreme cases ...... that'll have an impact on just 1% of our customers".

That sounds like a huge number of people. What is the number in less "extreme cases", 10%, 25%, 50% ??????

I am a very light user and have never been concerned by any of this but if a letter like that arrived on my doorstep, I would be disgusted and would have a heck of a lot more to say about it.

I don't think much of the condescending language VM seem to use these days either.

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

I know that Branson does not own VM, but he IS a major shareholder.
The ntl board thought his brand would be the answer to all their problems so we can assume that they value, and take heed of, his input at meetings.

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

I'm on 'M' service(2Mb) at the moment, if I upgrade to 'L' and end up on 10Mb, even when affected by STM I can still download at 2.5Mb which is a slightly bigger impact than 2Mb non STM affected service. So if 2Mb is a problem, why isn't a minimum of 2.5Mb also a problem, never mind if I upgraded to 'XL' with a minimum of 5Mb.

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

Exactly.
They know that they can’t sell 5Mb/s for £37 but by gradually reducing the STM download quota over time they will in effect be doing just that, except for a few hours a day when you will be tucked up in bed.

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

All this STM thing makes be believe VM 50Mb will carry stm and it will be something like 4Gb then you capped to 5.5Mb

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

All this so they can have a headline of 50Mb speed without providing that actual level of service.

Re: New STM/Virgin traffic managent confirmed - so that's why it's slow!
 

So now I know why I've been getting pathetic speeds. I'm clearly not happy about this.

I signed up with VM just 2 months ago for the 4mb BB Service and telephone line rental. Their sales pitch was a free upgrade to 10mb, why tell me that if I can't freely use it?, I guess the answer to that is blatantly obvious.

As an ex-Telewest customer just over 18 months ago, I was unable to migrate my services to my new home, I was told they were already over-capacity in this area yet within months I started getting leaflets and letters in my mail informing I could now have VM services but too late, as I was already under BT contract. What had changed?, obviously nothing, they've simply oversold their service and now can't cope with demand.

The thing that grates me most, like most people here, is their "unlimited" spiel. With BT, I was restricted to 40gb a month, not a huge amount but at least I knew for sure where I stood. It's the same with most other companies, you have your limits and they're clear before you sign. VM clearly fail here and as such, their actions are nothing short of scandalous.

To make matters worse for me, yesterday when I tried to end my contract for failure to install my telephone line after 6 weeks, I happened to mention about slow internet speeds. Their immediate reply was "did you call technical support"?, alas, no mention I might have had my speed capped for exceeding download limits. If it wasn't for reading this forum, I would still have no idea about my speed reduction.

Just one final question. If the peak hour is 4-9pm, why am I being punished until 1-2am?