Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Article 16 is not really court action though, it's just a device to convene talks (assuming this is what you're referencing).

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Remember when we were told our standards would improve and taking back control would lead to more accountability? Where's that now as Owen Patterson is basically let off for his egregious breaking of the lobbying rules, I've said it before but the levels of corruption are shameful and more akin to a third world junta than the mother of all Parliaments, most of the current incumbents of which aren't fit to clean the chamber, let alone make decisions for the rest of us in it

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

My SIL in France has been told by her neighbour that her son is leaving the fishing industry as the boat he worked on has been sold. Due to a lack of licences to fish UK/Channel Island waters.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

I'm sure this would have happened even if we were EU members but it makes it harder for us to hold other nations to account with such lax standards ourselves.

We know the cost of Brexit - a 4% reduction in GDP according to the Government's own figures. It's disappointing that our governance standards are decreasing as well.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

"We are dealing with ideologues. You cannot reason with them."

Disappointing that agreement has not been reached and yet more pressure on Johnson.

https://www.ft.com/content/e028f050-...a-48ed90b8671f

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

If the cap fits …

There is an equally idealogical commitment to the European project within the Commission - after all it was their reckless idea to hitch the Northern Ireland peace process to the entire treaty bandwagon in the first place, and their insistence on nonsensical provisions about the movement of refrigerated meats within the territory of a sovereign country that has got us where we are.

They are using strong words right now, but they have good reason to be uttering dark threats. If the UK invokes Article 16, it will have taken a legal measure within the provisions of the treaty which the EC will have no option but to challenge legally … and that process could take quite some time to see through. It’s all very well them complaining about Lord Frost et al being idealogues, but what’s really eating them up is the fact that triggering Art.16 might just give the UK as much breathing space as it needs. The EU will either have to fight it out, and lose all control over its precious market controls in the meantime, or else come to terms in order to salvage something.

They really don’t want the UK to trigger Art.16, while I suspect the UK really does. All else is theatrics.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Post 2926 refers. Although Brexiters may sometimes get triggered by the prospect of triggering Article 16, it just means the EU and UK have to discuss safeguarding measures for the NI protocol.
https://www.cableforum.uk/board/show...postcount=2926

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

I'm afraid I'm not party to Pierre's views on the psychology at play here.

We held all the cards for the easiest trade deal ever, so I'm surprised at the need to renegotiate a fantastic deal.

Johnson should have learnt from the Paterson scandal that trying to change the rules during the game rarely works.

Marking your own homework neatly describes what he wanted to do in Parliament by appointing a new standards committee dominated by the governing party. The Single Market is overseen by the ECJ and that's why it is involved in Northern Ireland. That link cannot be broken simply because the right wing of the Conservative Party have an ideological aversion to it.

Here's some information on Article 16.
https://davidallengreen.com/2021/09/...ng-to-trigger/

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

I think you’re missing the point. Nobody is floating Art.16 as “reprisals”, except, possibly, the EC, which has its own reasons for casting the UK position in those terms. Plus other assorted sympathisers with an interest in presenting a strawman as an alternative to the UK’s actual position.

The point about Art.16 is it is a way of suspending most, if not all, of the irksome rules the UK wants rid of *while that collaborative review takes place*. And if the UK’s use of Art.16 is questioned as procedurally unsound, its invocation continues to apply while that undergoes legal challenge. Either way, invocation sweeps aside lots of rules interfering with the UK internal market, for quite possibly an extended period of time.

Those opposed to the UK’s position are by now so entrenched in their “gunboat diplomacy” narrative they can’t but assume Art.16 is HMG’s endgame, or perhaps just a defiant, jingoistic broadside from HMS Victory. It isn’t. When it is invoked -as it almost certainly will be - the EC will lose much of the regulation over goods that it has been trying to hold on to, for quite possibly a long while. Will they tolerate that while pursuing legal challenges or collaborative processes? Or will they suddenly improve their offer for fear of the new reality on the ground (or rather, in the Irish Sea) becoming the de facto settlement?

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Major made the same point today when he said Johnson's government was behaving in unconservative behaviour and behaved in ways that were possibly politically corrupt.

For the record, I don't think everything Johnson touches turns to lead. I think he's done a good a job as any UK politician could do at COP 26, that kind of event is a good match for his skillset.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

I can’t believe that, Major being such a supporter of Brexit and the current government, how can he say these things?

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Mealy mouthed

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

He wasn't talking about Brexit. Maybe he just doesn't like the way populist governments operate, and who can blame him.