Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Expanding on 'why' never seems to happen when the victims of an attack are non-whites. If we only did do that when the perpetrators were white don't you see that as biased? We either ask 'why' in each case or not at all.

---------- Post added at 11:32 ---------- Previous post was at 11:31 ----------

I don't know how true that is but if if so then that adds fuel to the fire.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

I think the points Damien is trying to make are

1) that Paedophile gangs can be bolack, white and asian.
2) the majority of paedophile female victims tend to be white girls (that's whats reported in most cases)

The question he is asking is did the asian gang target white girls because they are a) racist, or b) because they identified them as being the most vunerable targets they could find.

My opinion is (b) , also because one of the people responsible for bringing potential victims to them mainly associated herself with young white girls.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

We do but you're doing the same thing. You're not happy that why isn't asked when the accused is white so you're going to do the same when the accused is non-white? We should ask why all the time.

So why in this case? Because it's considerably more complicated than the fact the men were Asian IMO.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

One(amongst many other) hugely important difference is this:-
Derby case:-
There seems to be no indication of violent threats or coercion. It looks like they merely took advantage of the situation, rather than setting out to try to create or force a situation.

Rochdale:-
A key factor to look at is, if you asked somebody else in the same workplace, community, or street, how likely would it be that they would take part or not report you to the police. If somebody finds it easy, then it is a sign of an underlying problem with that area or whatever. It is an indication of the percentage of that group that is potentially willing, if approached, to take part. How would you establish whether people around you, were of a similar mindset? I suppose it's easier within a pre-established gang, but outside of one it is surely more difficult and dangerous(ie reported to police).

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

we are all just puppets to the media

Damien all you have done is expanded this thread. Perhaps if you made its own thread the results might have been comparable.

I personally do not read the news or watch the news or visit news websites. I would have heard of neither case had it not been for here

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

I just don't see that. Obviously nobody is saying that all, or even any more than a tiny minority of Asian men are like this.

But in such cases in the past when whites have attacked non-whites, I have never heard any 'why' discussions, or suggesting that it's more "complicated" than that.

It always seems to be a cut-and-dried case of them being racially motivated crimes. I say that should be applied here as it is in role-reversed situations. certain crimes are not committed by individual races only.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Yeah. I think I messed a bit there. To ascertain if there is a problem with the media, we need to know why the original case is more newsworthy, which means we need to ask why it's important, which brings us back to square 1. :dunce:

---------- Post added at 11:49 ---------- Previous post was at 11:47 ----------

But you're saying that wrong and advocating be apply it here too! It's injustice for all! :p:

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

We either ask 'why' in all cases or none. I don't see why it has only been suggested here and not in previous ones.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

No. In the original post Damien asked no question. He made an inaccurate post trying to compare two stories that were entirely different

and made the point that this story didn't get the same level as coverage as the Rochdale one, it didn't for obvious reasons.

Regardless of his mistake, he then went on for several posts seemingly trying make a point that the men guilty of rape and abuse in Rochdale were somehow given a rough deal?????????

They were guilty and now they're banged up. Everyone had a right to be angry, and the story had a right to be publicised, and we had a right to be outraged. Regardless of the colour of the men and regardless of the colour of the girls.

I fail to see what kind of point or distinction between this crime and other similar crimes Damien was trying to make.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

From the original story...

That is the reason why it attracted so much publicity.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

And you can do nothing but admire the man for standing up and saying that.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Oh that is a dishonest representation of what I was saying, I will not allow my posts to be characterised as sympathetic to child abusers. I was making the point that Asians got a rough deal with the constant invoking of their race as an important point while white people don't have their race mentioned at all.

Also The Guardian article did reference other gangs, or groups of people, even If I was mistaken with the actual incident I cited.

The use of race.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

I got that from after reading his subsequent posts, and what he was saying in them. I think he did mention more than once that paedophile victims are in the main white.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

People are trying to equate individuals taking advantage of the 'willingness' of a girl, with a gangs making plans to force girls into having sex. That is what may determine their relative newsworthiness,
A previous case in Derby
I remember in the mid '70s moving into new area and somebody on the school bus pointing to a girl(aged 14/15) from another village and saying "she's had more p***ks than a 2nd hand dartboard". He also made a unkind comment about her looks. The 2 things probably not unconnected(ie she was looking for approval/affection). I got the impression that adult men were involved, but still it was her 'willingness' that led to sex taking place and not any force.

There is a huge difference between individuals taking advantage of a girl who is 'willing' and gangs forming with the premeditated intention of entrapping girls as 'sex slaves'.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

I don;t for one moment think Damien is saying that they got a rough deal. He is discussing the manner in which the case was reported, not in the verdicts, nor is he defending the perpertrators. As I recall there is not one post in this thread defending what they did or saying they got a hard/harder time because they are Asian. I think the arguments in this thread is whether a racial motive was behind it or not, and some of teh insinuations made on the whole pakistani community.