Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

The lying to Parliament will doubtless prove the trickiest bit to swerve.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Of course, rules don't apply to them like they do the little people and as much as some people might be bored of it I don't think it's going away

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

The Secret Barrister on Twitter has bought a bit of clarity on what the fines mean;

Mind you, you can be pretty damn sure that the Police have got ironclad evidence to take the political risk of sending a penalty notice the the PM and Chancellor. Getting this wrong would be severely career limiting for some poor copper.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

I’m trying to be even handed …

Yes, I totally agree it’s awful. While our own family inconveniences were limited to missing a couple of notable birthdays and anniversaries, I can well understand the anger of those who missed things that can’t be replaced or mitigated for, like the death of a loved one.

That doesn’t mean the rules weren’t necessary,though I think there should have been a bit more room for compassion and a lot less room for those who thought they knew better, like BoJo et al.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

fyi, whilst he did resign, it was apparently, symbolic. I read later that he was still at the sidelines and had his thoughts and advice listened to by the govt and sage.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Johnson & Sunak should make the same symbolic gesture, then…

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Could Johnson and Sunak just claim they decided to pay the fines so they could focus on the big issues facing the country whilst denying their guilt?

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

We won't get stability at the top with Johnson in No. 10, for as you say, he'll slip up again. And will probably be emboldened if he gets away with just a fine or two.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

This made me laugh, seen on Twitter:



---------- Post added at 17:56 ---------- Previous post was at 17:53 ----------

But he is the definition of instability? You, being in a small minority of Tory supporters on this forum, have called him out as unfit for office.

He is a serial liar, with no moral compass. This country deserves better.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

I don't think we do, we have allowed politics to sink into the gutter because "they're all at it" and this man is the result and the future will be even more extreme versions of this man because all but the extremists have given up

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

I expect there to be absolutely no come back at all. They will just continue onwards until the next election. If the electorate make their feelings known at the ballot box in sufficient numbers then maybe we will have a change of government.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Boris says sorry but REFUSES to resign over partygate and he vows to get on with job


The fine has been paid time to get on with the day job.

https://www.express.co.uk/news/polit...ess-conference

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

He's never done a day's work in his life, so that will be tricky.
Great news for the opposition if he does stay.

Do we get to see the Sue Gray report now?

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

What opposition...:D

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Don't think the police have done yet. Borris has no doubt more fixed penalties coming. Will be a few weeks until the report sees the light of day - definitely won't see it this side of the local elections in May.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Didn't stop the Conservatives in 1940, or the Coalition in 1916…

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Well, he says that cake was presented to him on his birthday in the committee room where he was attending a meeting, and the extra people who dropped in were his work colleagues that he associated with all the time. It lasted all of 10 minutes.

He said he did not regard that as breaking the rules, which would mean he didn’t knowingly lie to Parliament - he was simply mistaken.

This is why Rees-Mogg describes this incident as ‘fluff’.

Of course his opponents will flog this one to death, but I still feel, when you look at the circumstances, this was no big deal.

---------- Post added at 20:14 ---------- Previous post was at 20:12 ----------

Quite. So where’s the harm?

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Precedents of changing PM in time of war - fairly relevant to the current situation (except we are not actually actively involved in a war)…

Anyhoo, when is Boris going to take disciplinary action against himself and Sunak?

https://www.reuters.com/world/uk/loc...on-2022-04-12/

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Of course they apply, but this has been blown up out of all proportion. He was bounced into that situation. What was he supposed to do - jump out of the window in panic? 10 minutes. 10 minutes. With colleagues he worked with all the time.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

The Police disagree with you…

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

He won’t. Move on anyway, this getting really boring now.

---------- Post added at 20:19 ---------- Previous post was at 20:18 ----------

What do you expect from the bungling Met? They have form, you know.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Or…

"Sorry, guys - nice thought, but this is against the rules we’ve asked everyone else to follow, and as the people setting the rules, we have to set an example; please return to your desks".

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Technically. But we all know it was the scientists who set the rules. Boris was never an enthusiast.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Sorry, you’re sounding bit muffled - isn’t it uncomfortable being that far up Johnson’s fundament?

---------- Post added at 20:22 ---------- Previous post was at 20:20 ----------

I’ll try that next time I get stopped for breaking the law…

"I know you guys (the Police/CPS) didn’t set the rules, but I’ve never been an enthusiast about them…". :dozey:

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Well, Chris, if you consider that 10-minute birthday presentation by people he was surrounded by all the time during a quick break from work a ‘party’, you must have had a very hard childhood.

---------- Post added at 20:27 ---------- Previous post was at 20:22 ----------

What, like Starmer? Give us a break!

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

… and here comes the deflection. I have to admit this is poor even by your standards. You’ve had all afternoon.

The question is one of moral authority, and specifically whether a leader still has it after telling everyone to refrain from certain behaviour for the safety of the nation, then behaving that way themselves.

Does such a leader retain the moral right to govern, or to legislate for our behaviour?

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

That may happen at the local elections, but the public will still vote Boris at the General, simply because he is the best candidate and he is achieving his goals as set out in the manifesto (modified due to Covid).

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Rishi has paid the fine and is getting on with his job.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Hardly comparable. Churchill was picked to stand up to Hitler, which Chamberlain refused to do, preferring appeasement.

---------- Post added at 20:37 ---------- Previous post was at 20:31 ----------

You are so perfect, Hugh. Nice to see how you must never do anything that could ever be questioned in your life. So admirable. I think you should be the PM’s personal advisor to guarantee he never gets into trouble again.
:no:

---------- Post added at 20:44 ---------- Previous post was at 20:37 ----------

Oh, do come off it, Chris. I am merely pointing out that there are degrees of wrongdoing, and this is pretty borderline.

And I haven’t been thinking about this all afternoon. I don’t spend all day on this forum, I do have other things to do in my life.

If that incident was a blatant full-blown party, I would agree that this was a more serious issue, but looking at what actually happened, that puts the matter into proportion.

Those who are out to get him will kick up a huge fuss. But, sorry; it is rather pathetic.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

None of which addresses the actual issue. This is desperate stuff.

Just admit it - you went out on a limb defending Bozzer and he’s let you down. He’s been caught in a piece of sickening hypocrisy which everyone who had to forego a visit to a loved one’s death bed, or cancel a wedding, or hold a funeral without mourners, will find extremely hard to forgive. And all you seem to be worried about is being wrong on the internet.

Deflect, deflect, deflect … Hugh gets your faux moralising, I get your faux outrage. Sorry but it won’t wash.

I repeat: this is nothing to do with where this sits on the standard scale of fixed penalty offences. It’s to do with his moral authority to lead at a time of crisis. Unless and until you can adequately answer in those terms, all of this is just hot air from someone who has a very hard time admitting they could ever be wrong about anything.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

On the big ticket items, he’s called it right. I see no need for him to go.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

👍🏻

---------- Post added at 21:03 ---------- Previous post was at 21:03 ----------

🙄🙄🙄

---------- Post added at 21:07 ---------- Previous post was at 21:03 ----------

Johnson is no Churchill. Far from it. He lacks gravitas.He’s a clown.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

:DReally? Inflation running out of control, and the biggest cost of living crisis since the 2nd World War, NHS in terminal decline. Tax take at a record high. He's played an absolute blinder.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Well inflation is a global supply & demand issue coming out of COVID. Compounded by Ukraine but it was already on its way up before that.

Cost of living crisis is mainly inflation + fuel, fuel again compounded not caused by Ukraine, but I will say that this Governments (and the Wests) misguided drive for Net-Zero has helped cause the fuel cost crisis. We should have been in full fracking production by now, opening up new North Sea oil & gas fields ( I think just one gas one has opened) and had several new nuclear in the pipeline.

“Record” tax take, I don’t think it’s a record.

He got Brexit (and the mood of the country at the time) right.

He got Furlough right, it cost a lot, but saved many businesses and families (we do have to pay for that now though)

He got Vaccines right.

He got opening up right.

He (and previous Con Govs) got Ukraine right……so far.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Just like he let down all those past wives and the children he refuses to acknowledge in public

He has played a blinder, if you're a chum, party doner or via Lane member you've made off like a bandit under this parliament, for anyone else, not so much

---------- Post added at 22:04 ---------- Previous post was at 22:02 ----------

He got furlough wrong, any normal country paid it through peoples tax they didn't just leave it to the employers and bosses to be honest and end up 5 billion in the hole to fraud

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

I’m no expert. How would that work exactly?

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

The energy crisis could also have been helped if our country wasn't so short-sighted with nuclear energy. Net Zero is fine but it's the lack of investing in alternatives for decades that's making it worse. Nuclear energy generates a lot of energy cleanly and would make us more independent. It's why France can soften the blow more than we can as they have a national energy supplier who owns nuclear power plants.

Same as the NHS and Social Care which the Government let run close to the limit each winter leaving no slack at all for something like COVID.

I think the Government got quite a lot of key decisions right during a crisis but was left in a difficult position because of their previous decisions.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Actually , the issue is whether this was really a party. It was nothing more than a small break from work. Just like in Kier Starmer and his beer on his break. What’s the difference?

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

The difference is Borris broke the law and Kier didn't.

You seem very keen to give us what you try to pass as absolute facts when it backs up your beliefs but when others try and do the same and you don't like it you want them to wait for the report etc.

Just accept you backed a loser, something most of us have known since the early pages of the thread.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Whataboutery is the last defence of the indefensible. If Starmer has broken the law he’ll get a fine, and then we can talk about his moral authority as leader of the opposition.

For now, Bozzer has been fined and his moral authority is compromised. You have been swerving that issue all afternoon - I suspect you know perfectly well that there’s a problem here which is why you’re avoiding the question rather than outright denying it.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

In this case, whataboutery is perfectly valid. If the PM gets a fine in similar circumstances to the Leader of the Opposition, who didn’t get a fine, how does that figure?

Both had a break from work amongst colleagues. Does a cake constitute a party but not a beer?

Well, you won’t agree with even the most logical argument on this subject, so we’ll have to agree to disagree. I have more important stuff to worry about than this nonsense.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

As I said … you’ve been desperate to avoid the issue all afternoon.

You know Boris Johnson’s moral authority has been tanked. But you’ve stood by him throughout, so admitting that is admitting you’re wrong. Which you seem ill-equipped to do.

Hence transparent deflections like the above.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

I think Peston nails the seriousness of things here. Even those who have voted Conservative all their lives must appreciate the likely weakening in British democracy if Johnson stays.
https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1513874052242419722

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Both of your examples refer to wartime Governments (as if you didn't know) Asquith was replaced due to the shortage of munitions and we all know why the other idiot was replaced.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

You don't need to be an expert to know a scheme that lost 5 billion pounds to fraud isn't a right call, I'm sure all the other countries that paid through their equivalent of PAYE had some fraud to btw

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Sunak's Hansard entry in Hansard when he told the House that he did not attend any parties.https://twitter.com/JolyonMaugham/st...0KtvM6X00tYQJg

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

It seems the police have a cake investigation dep't but don't have a pizza n beer investigation dep't ,probably put too many resources into the kebab investigation team.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Plenty of people arguing that now is not the time to replace Johnson as the West is at war with Putin.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

So you don’t know either.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Yes, because they didn't regard a 9 minute presentation of a birthday cake by colleagues while at work a party. So no deliberate intention to mislead.

---------- Post added at 08:36 ---------- Previous post was at 08:30 ----------

I think the number of posts I have added to this thread since it was revealed that the PM had been fined shows clearly that I have not ducked the issue at all. I didn't think he would get fined, and I was wrong about that.

However, having heard what he was fined for, I believe that decision by the police to have been wrong. But to appeal would just drag the whole thing on even longer. I think the public will come to see this as the trivia it is over time. This may impact on the local elections as they are now imminent, but not the General Election.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

First it was 10 minutes, now it's 9 - by the time of the Local Elections, OLD BOY will be saying that it was a couple of seconds, and if we could all just wait for the Sue Gray report, that would confirm this...

(and when it doesn't, it will be a litany of cake/Starmer/fluff/trivia/get on with the job/whatever the latest line he gets from the Whips' WhatsApp feed)

Remember all those day/weeks/months ago when OLD BOY said we shouldn't make up our minds before we knew what the outcome of the Police investigation was, because he was keeping an open mind, and we should too - his comment above shows he was as economical with the actualite as Johnson was...

He was obviously keeping an "open mind" as long as the Police verdict agreed with his preconceived outcomes...

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

To much of the general public it always has been 'much ado about nothing', however it's been a nice little earner for clickbait article writers, a Godsend for political activists, and an ongoing filler item for news channels that couldn't be bothered to find other subjects for their 'experts' to discuss :p:

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Have to disagree - I know lots of people who couldn't visit relatives in care homes, didn't visit friends/families because it was stressed how important it was to keep to the rules, and they are (mostly) pissed off that there seems to be one rule for selfish gits and other rules for everyone else.

Anyhoo, might just head out and break the law - not knowingly, of course, just for a few minutes - I mean, the laws are so stupid and there are so many of them, and they are so confusing.

Or, seeing as according to some on here and in the tabloid press, we shouldn't investigate "crimes that happened in the past", and we no longer need to worry about "crimes that didn't take long" and "crimes when there is armed conflict going on anywhere in the world" either, I might join the police - sounds like an easy life.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

This isn't true though. You're assuming you represent the 'general public'.

Their polling fell since and hasn't recovered.

Yesterday's snap polling on the issue itself shows a majority of the public wants him to resign: https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/1514108508236623872

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

All you need to know:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FQK6CtWX...jpg&name=small

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

They are still not sorry.Not even about being found out.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

This tells me absolutely nothing, and I wonder why supposedly intelligent people still fall for it.
75% of how many?
61% of how many?

Was it an average result of 20 million people asked in the streets throughout the UK?
Was it a carefully selected selection of people affiliated to political parties?
Was it a 'phone in' poll conducted by a local radio station with 238 listeners?

People throw this 'statistical' garbage around like it actually proves something :rolleyes:

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Yeah, I don't think the lawbreaking is as wrong as the contempt they show for everyone by lying about it, claiming they weren't parties, claiming no one told Johnson it was a party and now telling everyone to 'move on' after they're caught. It's just complete arrogance and a matter of telling the plebs to know their place.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Exactly -a poll on GB News this morning said 67% wanted Boris to stay,33% wanted him to go and 12% were bad at maths;)

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

It's not perfect (and incidentally pollsters find a cross-section of society, it isn't a twitter poll) but it's better than going off what you reakon.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

If all these polls were an accurate reflection of the wishes of the general public, we'd still be in the EU . . .


. . . as it is, they were (once again) wrong ;)

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Since ignorance isn't a defence Boris could have been in attendance at an event he did not believe to breaking the law but if investigation found that it was breaking the law he could be fined.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

The polls were a few percentage points wrong on average, around 2-3% off. When it's close to 50/50 then that happens.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Is that an admittance that polls can be wrong . . or misleading? ;)

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

That polling is not a precise science but usually gets pretty close. You should expect them to be within a few percentage points - what's why there is a margin of error - but if you think about it being able to relatively reliability get within a few percent of the actual result of a vote in which millions took part is pretty good.

If it was wrong the other way, let's say Remain won by 54% instead of the roughly 51-52% the average of polls suggested, everyone would be saying they were pretty accurate.

The issue with Brexit wasn't so much the polling itself but pundits had when interpreting the polls that they were underestimating the Remain lead giving more confidence to the Remain lead than worrying about how close it was.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Brexit was just an example, many more have been wrong too . . whether that was down to polling the wrong people, poor 'pundit' interpretation, or simply bad wording in the poll itself who knows.

Suffice to say some people view polls as acceptable data, others see them as manipulation devices . . each to their own ;)

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Think you've got good points about opinion polls, but Borris still broke the law, has been caught and has paid the (monetary) price. Whatever the actual percentage of people who feel he should pay what in their opinion is the true price is still a pretty big junk of the population and that's whatever the margin of error is.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Generally they’re seen as acceptable to those whose views are confirmed by them, and manipulative by those who don’t like it when the polls contradict them. ;)

In fact, the statistical process underpinning opinion polls is very robust and their results are always delivered with caveats. It’s those who then take the results and use them for campaigning that add the veneer of either acceptability or manipulation.

For starters, there is always a margin of error. On a properly weighted sample of 1,000 this is typically +/- 3 percentage points, which from the outset should show very clearly that no poll can accurately forecast an outcome that is determined by a gap smaller than that. The Brexit referendum result was well within the polling margin of error.

Secondly, there’s the issue of properly weighting the sample. You can’t get an accurate result from interviewing the first 1,000 people you meet on the high street on a Saturday morning.* You have to have a sample that reflects the demographics of the electorate. So you have to know age/social background of your respondents. You also have to know something about their voting record on the issue at hand. That’s easier for a general election poll but next to impossible for a one-off vote like Brexit.

Again, polling experts like Prof John Curtice at Strathclyde University, who often pops up on the BBC when major voting events are afoot, are always candid about these issues. Whether they make it into the popular consciousness is another matter.

* This, incidentally, is why the “they never asked me, so they can’t be accurate in any way” objection is nonsense. You may feel like a unique individual, but at the population level you really are just a series of fairly predictable responses to major issues. :D

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

This generation isn’t worthy to lick her boots.

https://www.cableforum.uk/board/atta...1&d=1649850403

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

I don't think any generation should aspire to be subservient enough to want to link anyone's boots!

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Pretty sure Dorries would do it if it was a challenge on a reality TV programme…

That’s a thought - Nadine could be our next PM, if Johnson resigns (and his machinations have made sure Sunak won’t be).

Go Nads!!!

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

I was keeping an open mind because I didn’t know all the facts. I knew about this one, but didn’t consider it a breach of the rules, particularly when Starmer was not fined for having a beer with colleagues on his break. I say again, how is this any different? Is a cake more of a Covid risk than a beer?

The 10minutes has been widely quoted, but it has been clarified now that it was actually 9 minutes. Not that it makes much difference, but I like to keep up. :rolleyes:

---------- Post added at 13:51 ---------- Previous post was at 13:47 ----------

Yes, if only Boris didn’t see that cake. But wait….would that really have meant those families could have visited their relatives?

It is a ridiculous argument.

---------- Post added at 13:54 ---------- Previous post was at 13:51 ----------

So what was the difference between what Kier did and what Boris did? The only difference I can make out is that one was a beer and the other a cake. You don’t need to answer. I know that you cannot. You just want to get Boris out of office, and that’s all that matters to you.

Well, he’s going nowhere. Sorry to disappoint.

---------- Post added at 13:56 ---------- Previous post was at 13:54 ----------

They weren’t sorry because they were not aware they did anything wrong until all this erupted.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

I know you are only repeating the CCHQ party line, but repeating that argument (cake) only makes you look as shallow & callous as they are…

It’s irrelevant whether there was cake - it’s relevant that they repeatedly broke the rules and laws that they repeatedly insisted that everyone should followed, then denied/lied that they had ever done so…

https://www.cableforum.uk/board/atta...4&d=1649859969

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Just for the sake of transparency, are you actually engaging with a discussion here or are you simply feeding approved CCHQ “lines to take” into the thread?

Because I’m increasingly under the impression that I’m just talking to a press release and it’s getting a bit tedious.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

If it was Boris's boots I'm sure she would be on the case. She might face some tough competition though.

---------- Post added at 16:11 ---------- Previous post was at 16:07 ----------

The only rational answer is that Old Boy is on a Forum wind-up.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Deliberately avoiding that difficult question - what was the difference between what Boris did and what Kier did? It was essentially the cake wot did it. Somehow, that makes it a party.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

The difference is that the evidence the Police gathered showed that one broke the rules, and the other didn't.

You seem to have difficulty accepting the fact that the Police believe the evidence shows the rules were broken - wonder why?

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

H’mm. Maybe that’s because you are ignoring the elephant in the room.

Cake/beer. His colleagues definitely should have stuck with the beer.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

I like the line that they didn't know what they were doing was against the rules. Boris Johnson was educated at Eton and Oxford, while Rishi Sunak was educated at Winchester, Oxford and Stanford. If they didn't understand the rules in place at the time, what hope did people who went to their local comprehensive and left at 16?

At the very least, you would think shrewd political operators would never put themselves in a position where there was even the possibility of looking like you did something wrong, even if it is within the rules

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

The elephant in the room is the denials in the House of Commons.

Things they should have avoided include bring-your-own-bottle invites, late night parties and furtive trips to the Co-op with suitcases for wine. But above all they should have avoided hypocrisy.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

From what I've read and seen on TV reports, seems like the word party is a bit misleading imo, must have been pretty boring parties.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

You do realise just how few people are taken in by this amateurish misdirection? No, on reflection you probably don’t.

He broke the law. He has accepted that in law, because he has accepted a fixed penalty notice. So you are defending someone with arguments they aren’t even using to defend themselves. Which seems a bit pointless to me.

Except of course that the reason you keep banging on about cake and beer is that it allows you to push your line without having to engage with the larger, uncomfortable truth. The actual elephant in the room is that we now have a Prime Minister who lacks the moral authority to lead the country.

This scandal does not carry the same moral weight as a speeding ticket because the context is not the same. By now, I am quite convinced that you know this, and have no answer for it, because if you did, you would have said so by now.

Every time you try to deflect the discussion onto Keir Starmer, cake, beer or whatever, you simply show the rest of us that you’re wrong, and you know you are.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

:tu:

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

:tu: :tu: :tu:

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Justice Minister resigns…

https://www.cableforum.uk/board/atta...8&d=1649868610

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Don't let the door hit you in the arse on your way out.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

With that, I agree. But the PM appears not to have been involved with that.
My concern is simply with the inconsistency of fining Boris when Kier has got off scot free for virtually the same offence.

---------- Post added at 18:21 ---------- Previous post was at 18:18 ----------

And yet you still haven't addressed the stark difference in treatment in extremely similar circumstances. I'm afraid you are the one who is deflecting.

Re: All those No.10 lockdown parties
 

Yes, a meal break is exactly the same as a birthday party, an ABBA party, and a drinks party in the garden…