re: [Update] The UK votes to leave the EU
 

Not really, you don't often see Turkeys voting for Christmas do you.

re: [Update] The UK votes to leave the EU
 

This is not good at all:

1. Any deal we reach for the single market will cost nowhere near what we pay now as we won't be paying for the upkeep of the EU, only for the right to trade. We don't know about free movement yet. It may be we have to accept a percentage.

2. The economy is strong enough to handle leaving the EU. Growth is slowing, yes but it's the same the world over and has nothing to do with being in the EU.

3. Dream on. This is a once in a lifetime vote and if you vote to remain you are stuck with it for at least 50 years unless a majority of the public demand a vote and that's not likely if they vote to remain. The EU is NOT going to reform for the better or for our benefit. Plans are afoot for a European Army and Police Force. This with closer Political and Economic integration will mean the UK will have less say in what goes on as they have opted out of these things and would either have to join or be left out in the cold.

No, it's better to get out now as you won't be able to do it within the next 50 years and by then it will be so integrated there will be no chance of getting out without losing financially or otherwise.

re: [Update] The UK votes to leave the EU
 

The scale is different; the principle isn't ;).

Norway hmph :rolleyes:. Our economy is bigger, we have more trade clout. Losing our custom will hurt the EU. They're not that stupid.

re: [Update] The UK votes to leave the EU
 

Whichever way you do end up voting I am pretty much voting to Remain for the same reasons you listed there in the 2nd paragraph. However like you it's not exactly a ringing endorsement of the way EU does things that's deciding my vote, I think very few Remain voters don't think Leave has some good points. In the end for me I can't see what issues that affect me solves but I can see it causing new problem (i.e economic hit).

re: [Update] The UK votes to leave the EU
 

Wouldn't that have a lot to do with the large number of people of immigrant origins in London? Where they're entitled to vote (and hence show their support or otherwise for UKIP) it doesn't surprise me that they wouldn't support UKIP en masse. To properly assess UKIP's appeal in London you need to look at borough level and take into account the ethnic makeup of each.

re: [Update] The UK votes to leave the EU
 

A vote to remain is not a vote for status quo. The EU is changing and your democratic right of control of the issues that affect your everyday life will be virtually non-existent.

Our laws and democracy have served us rather well for hundreds of years; why give it up?

re: [Update] The UK votes to leave the EU
 

I don't think we can. this is i, I think

re: [Update] The UK votes to leave the EU
 

That's pretty much my thinking to. Perhaps if leave hadn't played the same tune as remain with the lies and scaremongering they'd have secured my vote

---------- Post added at 17:34 ---------- Previous post was at 17:33 ----------

Yes it's very interesting that people almost untouched by Immigration are so against it

---------- Post added at 17:37 ---------- Previous post was at 17:34 ----------

I said the same as pierre a few weeks back, we can only leave once but we can revisit leaving whenever the public wills it

re: [Update] The UK votes to leave the EU
 

I agree with Pat...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JFt-pRIvL9E

re: [Update] The UK votes to leave the EU
 

Forget the shenanigans of Leave and Remain. Read Chris's post:

re: [Update] The UK votes to leave the EU
 

Interesting that you've discounted the notion that the ticking financial timebomb in the EU is a bigger economic hit waiting to happen. :shrug: The problems in Greece, Spain, Portugal, Italy etc. haven't gone away and what makes you think that, if we stay in, we won't wind up suffering a worse hit - directly by being part of the club (bale outs) and indirectly? :shrug:

I know I've said this before but given the growing social, economic and political chaos in Europe why would anyone think being in it would be less risky than getting out? If things were looking up I'd agree that it would make staying in less of a gamble but so many things are getting worse not better. :confused:

Having said that, at least you have a reason - IMHO basing how to vote on the tactics of one side or the other is a pretty poor reason.

re: [Update] The UK votes to leave the EU
 

So very true. The EU has an agenda for a United states of Europe; they don't even hide the fact.

The paltry concessions that David Cameron 'negotiated' shows how Britain has got no chance of halting that. The promise from David Cameron of no more integration is worthless; integration will come via the back door through secretly negotiated trade deals such as TTIP.

re: [Update] The UK votes to leave the EU
 

Of course yes, I mean they really bottled it when DC went looking for renegotiated terms on the threat of UK leaving. They absolutely caved in they were so scared.

Everybody quotes the BMW/AUDI/VW factor that Germany will want to sort out a deal. But look at it from the other foot. We'll still want to buy them, if there is a levy put on those cars because we're out of the EU do you think we're suddenly all going to start buying KIA's. No BMWs will just cost more, and those that can afford to buy new BMW's still will.

Likewise with Champagne (I don't buy French wine anyway, more of a new world man)

If we come out I don't think the EU will be rushing to sort out our FTA and I don't think they give us any special concessions either.

re: [Update] The UK votes to leave the EU
 

Nobody in their right mind drinks French wine: The whites are battery acid, the reds stewed teabags and as for the sparkling stuff it's just a liquidated ash tray.

re: [Update] The UK votes to leave the EU
 

its jilly goolden -i;m getting ash tray old tea bag and a subtle hint of ever ready :)