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Damien 16-02-2011 18:20

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDaddy (Post 35175838)
Yes you should be punished, how does changing allegiance to Tottenham sound...

:shocked: Some things we DON'T joke about.

Actually I don't really mind Spurs. Was quite pleased when they scored, well until I got the 'Like to see Arsenal (<-- they used a different word ;)) do that' stuff from Spuds fans. If they were not our local rivals I would quite like them then :D.

DocDutch 16-02-2011 18:44

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Damien, hope you have fun matey and see us win :D do take some nice piccies if possible :)

DocDutch 16-02-2011 22:10

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
is it me or does this look like a barca training video their passing bloody hell and arsenals is more like a non day in passing

---------- Post added at 20:28 ---------- Previous post was at 20:07 ----------

is there a team that can beat barca when they are on a roll. Why did we get barca of all teams

---------- Post added at 21:10 ---------- Previous post was at 20:28 ----------

another thing okay i know we commit to quite a few fouls but the barca players go down at no contact

TheDaddy 16-02-2011 22:30

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DocDutch (Post 35176000)
is there a team that can beat barca when they are on a roll.

Maybe one team...

DocDutch 16-02-2011 22:35

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
omg thank you van persie and arshavin for those brilliant and needed goals

---------- Post added at 21:35 ---------- Previous post was at 21:31 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDaddy (Post 35176074)
Maybe one team...

yeah okay tonight we have been lucky but dont know what will happen at camp nou

danielf 16-02-2011 22:40

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Cracking game. Fantastic result. Good stuff :tu: :)

Damien 16-02-2011 23:56

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
That was amazing. The place went unbelievable when we scored the 2nd goal! Incredible. Best of all Barcelona played well! We didn't catch them on an off-day! Although let's hope we do at the Camp Nou :D

Niles Crane 17-02-2011 00:41

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
For anybody that doesn't realise, there was an FA Cup replay tonight too. Wigan 0 - 1 Bolton. In front of just 7500 fans.

I'm sure the match would have a low attendance anyway, but it was foolish to schedule it head to head with Arsenal vs Barcelona on free TV. The Genoa derby, Hamburg derby and Fiorentina vs Inter were all played earlier so they wouldn't clash.

Inter won. St. Pauli won. Arsenal won. What a great night! But i can't really feel comfortable celebrating Arsenal's victory unless we make it through to the quarter finals.

danielf 17-02-2011 00:43

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35176128)
That was amazing. The place went unbelievable when we scored the 2nd goal! Incredible. Best of all Barcelona played well! We didn't catch them on an off-day! Although let's hope we do at the Camp Nou :D

Regardless of what happens at the Camp Nou, I would imagine tonight's game is one of those games that you will remember for a looooong time. :D

Shadow Demon UK 17-02-2011 01:16

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Great comeback from Arsenal, i thought the second goal was very good. I always enjoy goals scored on the counter-attack and that was a great one. I still think this was a decent result for Barca though.

adzzzbatch 17-02-2011 14:00

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Last night was such an F-ing incredible experience at The Emirates!!!!! :D:D:D

The atmosphere was amazing!!!! :D:D:D

Damien 17-02-2011 14:06

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by adzzzbatch (Post 35176412)
Last night was such an F-ing incredible experience at The Emirates!!!!! :D:D:D

The atmosphere was amazing!!!! :D:D:D

It was amazing, where were you sat?

adzzzbatch 17-02-2011 14:22

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Block 97, Row 5, above Red Action.

What about you?

Damien 17-02-2011 14:32

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
block 16, row 2. Lower tier, right on the half way line.

Shadow Demon UK 17-02-2011 16:27

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Did you get your free flag?

Damien 17-02-2011 16:54

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadow Demon UK (Post 35176518)
Did you get your free flag?

Yeah. Didn't take it with me though. Drenched in coke.

adzzzbatch 17-02-2011 19:21

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
I ended up with two, one red, one white,

danielf 17-02-2011 19:25

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35176432)
block 16, row 2. Lower tier, right on the half way line.

Posh Git :)

Damien 17-02-2011 19:48

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by danielf (Post 35176652)
Posh Git :)

They are actually amongst the cheapest. The same position as me, but up the upper tier are the most expensive ticket because you get a better view of the pitch.

ChrisLUFC22 18-02-2011 18:31

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Damien, do you believe that Arsenal can go through? I think if they go there and, not necessarily "park the bus", but be a bit more cautious than they normally would, they stand a really good chance. Although I would expect Barca will throw everything they've got at ya. Imagine a Spurs Arsenal tie at some stage, with both teams not exactly keen on defending that would be some tie...

Damien 18-02-2011 20:14

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ChrisLUFC22 (Post 35177387)
Damien, do you believe that Arsenal can go through? I think if they go there and, not necessarily "park the bus", but be a bit more cautious than they normally would, they stand a really good chance. Although I would expect Barca will throw everything they've got at ya. Imagine a Spurs Arsenal tie at some stage, with both teams not exactly keen on defending that would be some tie...

Arsenal cannot park the bus, or even go into a game looking to preserve a lead from the first leg. If we don't go for it, we're going out. Let's bear in mind that a team far better equipped to hold Barcelona out, Inter, with a manager who excels at just that, Mourinho, went there last year and still lost 1 - 0 with a perfectly valid Barcelona goal ruled out.

The best chance we have is to play as we did in the first leg. We'll attack but we'll accept that they will have more of the ball than us, and we'll press them as much as we can. Arsenal have been so much better off the ball this season, we press in a fashion similar to Barcelona do. What I think we learnt is that while we can't out Barcelona them, we can do it for longer than them. If we're still in the game by 60th min, then we stand a chance. The worry will be surviving the first half, we were 3 - 1 down by that time last year.

I don't think we'll do it. Barcelona are by far the best team in the world and it's one thing having an idea how to beat them, quite another executing on it.

Spurs vs Arsenal? Possible, would rather not. I find it ironic that the closest team to Arsenal in teams of style in the Premier League are also the closest in terms of distance! However in much the same way Barcelona beat us, I think we would beat them. We play a similar game but Arsenal have better passers of the ball, and better pressing off it. Over the two legs I fancy beating them. Of course look at the game this year to show it wouldn't be easy....

ChrisLUFC22 18-02-2011 21:03

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35177501)
Arsenal cannot park the bus, or even go into a game looking to preserve a lead from the first leg. If we don't go for it, we're going out. Let's bear in mind that a team far better equipped to hold Barcelona out, Inter, with a manager who excels at just that, Mourinho, went there last year and still lost 1 - 0 with a perfectly valid Barcelona goal ruled out.

The best chance we have is to play as we did in the first leg. We'll attack but we'll accept that they will have more of the ball than us, and we'll press them as much as we can. Arsenal have been so much better off the ball this season, we press in a fashion similar to Barcelona do. What I think we learnt is that while we can't out Barcelona them, we can do it for longer than them. If we're still in the game by 60th min, then we stand a chance. The worry will be surviving the first half, we were 3 - 1 down by that time last year.

I don't think we'll do it. Barcelona are by far the best team in the world and it's one thing having an idea how to beat them, quite another executing on it.

Spurs vs Arsenal? Possible, would rather not. I find it ironic that the closest team to Arsenal in teams of style in the Premier League are also the closest in terms of distance! However in much the same way Barcelona beat us, I think we would beat them. We play a similar game but Arsenal have better passers of the ball, and better pressing off it. Over the two legs I fancy beating them. Of course look at the game this year to show it wouldn't be easy....

That's a good point, do you reckon the players will be able to keep their cool for that long though? With respect to Arsenal and their undoubted ability, Barca, as you say, are simply the best team in the world and could easily make Arsenal look average or even poor. If Arsenal players truly believe, and keep calm and collected, I reckon they'll go through.
As for Spurs, I think you're right what you say, however, I think it would be a bloody good game for the neutral.
Would you like to see Leeds back in the Prem? We had quite a good (friendly) rivalry with your lot in our last few seasons in the Prem. I'd love to see us back there but I think anyone being realistic will see it could be a disaster at this moment in time, espescially as we have no real money to buy that quality that is a must for survival. I'd love to go to The Emirates aswell, unfortunately I couldn't afford a ticket for the FA Cup tie :(

Damien 18-02-2011 21:09

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ChrisLUFC22 (Post 35177553)
That's a good point, do you reckon the players will be able to keep their cool for that long though? With respect to Arsenal and their undoubted ability, Barca, as you say, are simply the best team in the world and could easily make Arsenal look average or even poor. If Arsenal players truly believe, and keep calm and collected, I reckon they'll go through.

The players will keep calm. They proved that can do that in the home tie. I hope we get an early goal though, need to cancel out that away goal. Still think they will though.

Quote:

Would you like to see Leeds back in the Prem? We had quite a good (friendly) rivalry with your lot in our last few seasons in the Prem. I'd love to see us back there but I think anyone being realistic will see it could be a disaster at this moment in time, espescially as we have no real money to buy that quality that is a must for survival. I'd love to go to The Emirates aswell, unfortunately I couldn't afford a ticket for the FA Cup tie :(
I would love to see Leeds back in the Premiership. The FA Cup game, the replay at Elland Road, was probably the best game involving Arsenal I had seen this season until the Barcelona game. It was fantastic. As were Leeds, you couldn't help but admire their style and attacking intent. The Premiership needs more teams like Leeds in it and less like Birmingham.

I thought you went to the FA Cup game at The Emirates?

iadom 19-02-2011 22:25

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Great result for the Toffees. :D

United game was a bit of a non event, Obertan & Bebe would struggle to get into the Crawley Town team TBH.:rolleyes:

Jim.

nffc 19-02-2011 23:52

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
woo go us.

2nd with a game in hand.

Russ 20-02-2011 10:30

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Roman's Billions fail again...:D

iadom 21-02-2011 12:15

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
So Man City fans are the true fans of Manchester....yeh right.;)

Old Trafford on Saturday attendance just under 75,000.:)

City of Manchester Stadium on Sunday attendance just over 27,000.:rolleyes:

Says it all.

TheDaddy 21-02-2011 17:47

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Gattuso given 4 game ban...

Hom3r 21-02-2011 18:13

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDaddy (Post 35179224)
Gattuso given 4 game ban...


GOOD

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/foot...pe/9398824.stm

iadom 22-02-2011 20:18

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Did anyone see the Man City subs bench on Sunday, all sat in a row warming their 'ickle hands' on individual sky blue hot water bottles......the big TARTS.:rolleyes:

I would love to get a picture of that if anyone has a link.;)

ChrisLUFC22 22-02-2011 21:37

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35177556)
The players will keep calm. They proved that can do that in the home tie. I hope we get an early goal though, need to cancel out that away goal. Still think they will though.



I would love to see Leeds back in the Premiership. The FA Cup game, the replay at Elland Road, was probably the best game involving Arsenal I had seen this season until the Barcelona game. It was fantastic. As were Leeds, you couldn't help but admire their style and attacking intent. The Premiership needs more teams like Leeds in it and less like Birmingham.

I thought you went to the FA Cup game at The Emirates?

No, was supposed to be, but the person supposed to be getting my ticket didn't get back to me in time so I made other plans :(

SB_07 23-02-2011 22:25

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Theo & Fabregas injured tonight :( Theo's looks quite bad (Ankle) But HOPEFULLY Fab just has a slight thigh strain.

Damien 23-02-2011 22:41

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Team is so much calmer with Sczesney...

iadom 26-02-2011 18:44

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by iadom (Post 35180035)
Did anyone see the Man City subs bench on Sunday, all sat in a row warming their 'ickle hands' on individual sky blue hot water bottles......the big TARTS.:rolleyes:

I would love to get a picture of that if anyone has a link.;)


Well, well, I wouldn't have thought that this post would have generated a certain 'response':rolleyes:

A 'sense of humour' shortcut methinks.

Every footy forum on the net I read echoed my words precisely.;)

In fact if you google for Man city hot water bottles, all bar one link on the first two pages is related to this very topic.

PS. I am very pleased with my teams performance ATM.:D

Jim.

Arthurgray50@blu 26-02-2011 21:44

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
City players are paid thousands, and it all comes down to a £2.99 hot water bottle, but a bunch of pansies.

They could have donated those bottles to the people who live around the ground who can't afford a cup of tea, and don't have a home or heating, It always makes me laugh, when a player comes off the pitch, the coach gets up and raps a coat them them, never seen that on a cold Sunday morning playing football.

iadom 26-02-2011 23:29

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Careful Arthur, you are risking your 'reputation' with comments like that.;)

However anyone who professes to be a true supporter of the noble game would surely be more than a bit put out to see six grown men warming their hands on little blue 'hotties' when the temperature was above 10°C.:rolleyes:

In fact I have several friends and relations who are City fans and every single one of them agreed that they looked like a big bunch of Jessie's.

And to suggest I posted as I did because I was disillusioned with my own favourite sides performance is utter drivel.:p:

Jim.

Damien 26-02-2011 23:41

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
If they are cold what's the harm in warming them up? It seems rather stupid to be cold and not doing anything about it.

iadom 26-02-2011 23:55

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
I thought that was what all the gloves and the girly snoods were for.:rolleyes:

They will be sat under individual patio heaters or sun lamps before long.:D

But Man City are not the only snood fan boy teams are they.;)

Matty_ 27-02-2011 19:07

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Arsenals first trophy for 6 years....................oh wait!!!

Congratulations to Birmingham, maybe not a thoroughly deserved win (why do Arsenal not like shooting :confused: ) but still the League cup should give a boost to the squad.

Mal 27-02-2011 19:20

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Matty_ (Post 35183261)
Arsenals first trophy for 6 years....................oh wait!!!

Aren't you a Man City fan? ;)

DocDutch 27-02-2011 19:21

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
shame that rvp had to come off and dont know why arshavin got taken off as after that the game slowed would've thought ros should've gone and yeah agree with ya matt in regards to shooting themselves

Paul 27-02-2011 19:22

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Well done Birmingham.

Matty_ 27-02-2011 19:37

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mal (Post 35183273)
Aren't you a Man City fan? ;)

Sure am, still good result against Fulham today...............Oh wait, we`re a proper team now, yeh right!!!

Twas flicking between the cricket (cracker of a game) and the football, but from what i saw of Arsenal they seemed a bit of their game. Sometimes they can be so frustrating to watch, you just shout at the telly "hit the damned thing towards that guy standing between them white sticks, soon one will end up in that place called the net" :)

Let`s hope there saving themselves for the Nou Camp.

Damien 27-02-2011 19:38

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Arsenal lost because the whole performance was terrible, it's not as if the mistake cost us a win. It cost the chance to take it to extra time. Focusing on the single incident that gifted them the goal is counter-productive, that happens in football.

Matty_ 27-02-2011 19:43

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35183288)
Arsenal lost because the whole performance was terrible, it's not as if the mistake cost us a win.

Maybe not, but it meant you lost!

Wenger sticking with his current keepers is/was a massive mistake in my humble opinion.

iadom 27-02-2011 19:59

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Matty_ (Post 35183261)

Congratulations to Birmingham, maybe not a thoroughly deserved win

On the contrary, Birmingham hit the post, should have had a pen and Arsenals keeper red carded in the first half, they were up for it and Arsenal were not, a thoroughly deserved win in my book.:)

I had best not comment on the lame performance from Man City in case a certain person who has the power to reprimand me;), accuses me of being disillusioned because my team are only four points clear at the top of the Premiership, still in the FA Cup and the Champions League.:rolleyes:

Jim.

PS. Rooney should also have walked for his stupidity yesterday and no mistake.

Mal 27-02-2011 20:00

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Matty_ (Post 35183287)
Sure am, still good result against Fulham today...............Oh wait, we`re a proper team now, yeh right!!!

No, I just laughed when I realised that a City fan was having a pop at another team for the length of time since their last trophy ;)

Arthurgray50@blu 27-02-2011 20:09

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Brum deserved there win, Arsenal were so well below par, and they were hot favourites to win this game.

Arsene, must go into the transfer market in the summer, Brum fought for every ball and played for the pride of there shirt, Arsenal rae having problems and will continue unless they get some new blood - well done Brum.

nffc 27-02-2011 23:09

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Matty_ (Post 35183293)
Maybe not, but it meant you lost!

Wenger sticking with his current keepers is/was a massive mistake in my humble opinion.

Who could he get? Decent keepers cost a packet and to be honest if your defence is awful it wouldn't make much difference. Though I suppose a decent keeper can galvanise a defence which simply needs organising behind it (like Lee Camp did as opposed to Smith at Forest, and shh but Camp is rather good) but that isn't going to compensate for centre backs who are quite simply not good enough (like Arsenal's).

They would purely be better off bringing on Sczezeny (or however it is spelled) - he's young, and he isn't too bad - and getting in some decent centre backs who aren't afraid to do the simple things well.

ChrisLUFC22 27-02-2011 23:15

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35183288)
Arsenal lost because the whole performance was terrible, it's not as if the mistake cost us a win. It cost the chance to take it to extra time. Focusing on the single incident that gifted them the goal is counter-productive, that happens in football.

There does exist an Arsenal fan that talks sense :)
Has Fabregas accused Birmingham of being a rugby team yet :LOL:

---------- Post added at 22:15 ---------- Previous post was at 22:15 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by DocDutch (Post 35183274)
shame that rvp had to come off and dont know why arshavin got taken off as after that the game slowed would've thought ros should've gone and yeah agree with ya matt in regards to shooting themselves

Who?

Damien 27-02-2011 23:15

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Sczezeny is fine. First mistake I have seen him make to be honest and it was a mix up that any defender and keeper could make at any level. It's magnified because of it's timing but that's just unlucky, it's football.

My bigger concern is the mentality of the team, they played awful for ages. If we were ahead that goal would not have been fatal.

TheDaddy 27-02-2011 23:18

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by nffc (Post 35183411)
Who could he get? Decent keepers cost a packet and to be honest if your defence is awful it wouldn't make much difference. Though I suppose a decent keeper can galvanise a defence which simply needs organising behind it (like Lee Camp did as opposed to Smith at Forest, and shh but Camp is rather good) but that isn't going to compensate for centre backs who are quite simply not good enough (like Arsenal's).

They would purely be better off bringing on Sczezeny (or however it is spelled) - he's young, and he isn't too bad - and getting in some decent centre backs who aren't afraid to do the simple things well.

Reina is avaliable and despite his clanger is still the best in the division imo, Given is quality and is going to be avaliable on the cheap soon, both better options than Szczesny.

In other news some sort of illness has spread through the Arsenal changing room following todays debacle, Szczesny is the only one not worried by the outbreak though, he can't catch anything... :D

---------- Post added at 22:18 ---------- Previous post was at 22:18 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChrisLUFC22 (Post 35183417)
Who?

Robin van Persie...

Quote:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Damien http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/im...s/viewpost.gif
Sczezeny is fine. First mistake I have seen him make to be honest and it was a mix up that any defender and keeper could make at any level. It's magnified because of it's timing but that's just unlucky, it's football.
To be fair to him Sczezeny did shout loud enough for the ball for it to be picked up on tv, apparently.

ChrisLUFC22 27-02-2011 23:19

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35183419)
Sczezeny is fine. First mistake I have seen him make to be honest and it was a mix up that any defender and keeper could make at any level. It's magnified because of it's timing but that's just unlucky, it's football.

My bigger concern is the mentality of the team, they played awful for ages. If we were ahead that goal would not have been fatal.

You weren't bothered about the Carling Cup anyway, were you?

Damien 27-02-2011 23:20

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ChrisLUFC22 (Post 35183424)
You weren't bothered about the Carling Cup anyway, were you?

Not anymore ;) It changes depending how Arsenal do.

ChrisLUFC22 27-02-2011 23:21

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDaddy (Post 35183422)

[/COLOR]

Robin van Persie...

Yeah, I got that :rolleyes:, but I just have to laugh when Arsenal fans refer to him as "RvP" as though they know him. I don't refer to Kasper Schmeichel as KS, FFS...

---------- Post added at 22:21 ---------- Previous post was at 22:21 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35183426)
Not anymore ;) It changes depending how Arsenal do.

:LOL:

Damien 27-02-2011 23:27

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDaddy (Post 35183422)
Reina is avaliable and despite his clanger is still the best in the division imo, Given is quality and is going to be avaliable on the cheap soon, both better options than Szczesny.

Given isn't a better option than Szczesny. He suffers from the same problem Almunia had, that he is a great shot stopper but has weaknesses in dealing with crosses and set-pieces. Commanding his area and settling the defense. Buying him would get a whole lot of nothing. Szczesny is much better at crosses and set-pieces and can command his area. Since he became no 1 the defense has been a lot less jittery (today excluded).

Reina is better but I would rather we stuck with Szczesney, he isn't at all bad and is very young. Yeah, he will make slightly more mistakes than an experienced keeper but he is already a decent keeper and will only get better. Might as well let him get the experience and we have a top keeper for the next 10, 15 years!

DocDutch 27-02-2011 23:28

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
but Chris at Notts County Schmeichel wasnt too bad okay a bit of a liability sometimes.

Regarding Arsenal and keepers I think Szczesny will be the number 1 soon enough, problem is in the defence where it hasnt been as stable as it should be, Sagna I would class more as an defending midfielder then rightback, Koscielny is alright but needs to have a solid centre with him as well as Djourou again isnt much of a central but more defending mid I think.

Best person on the arsenal side I think was Wiltshire today, okay 1st goal came out of a mistake between him and Song (do see Songs name coming up quite often with defending mistakes)

To be fair to the team it is still young and hopefully will stick together :) but we have 3 more trophies to play fo :D

Damien 27-02-2011 23:32

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Szczesny is number 1 at Arsenal now.

ChrisLUFC22 27-02-2011 23:42

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DocDutch (Post 35183438)
but Chris at Notts County Schmeichel wasnt too bad okay a bit of a liability sometimes.

[/B]

What does that have to do with what I said :confused:
He is a good 'keeper, still learning the ropes but he has huge potential, not as big as his Ol' Man, but still very athletic and commanding and capable of split second saves. If he's half the player Peter was, we have a very good 'keeper.

Shadow Demon UK 27-02-2011 23:45

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
I'm not looking forward to next season when we might be going through what Arsenal are with keepers this season. On yesterdays showing Van Der Sar is still one of the best around, it will be a big loss when he goes at the end of the season.

nffc 28-02-2011 00:12

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDaddy (Post 35183422)
Reina is avaliable and despite his clanger is still the best in the division imo, Given is quality and is going to be avaliable on the cheap soon, both better options than Szczesny.

In other news some sort of illness has spread through the Arsenal changing room following todays debacle, Szczesny is the only one not worried by the outbreak though, he can't catch anything... :D

My whole point is that with a good enough defence you can get by with an average keeper. The defence should shield the keeper as much as possible.

---------- Post added at 23:12 ---------- Previous post was at 23:09 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35183435)
Given isn't a better option than Szczesny. He suffers from the same problem Almunia had, that he is a great shot stopper but has weaknesses in dealing with crosses and set-pieces. Commanding his area and settling the defense. Buying him would get a whole lot of nothing. Szczesny is much better at crosses and set-pieces and can command his area. Since he became no 1 the defense has been a lot less jittery (today excluded).

Reina is better but I would rather we stuck with Szczesney, he isn't at all bad and is very young. Yeah, he will make slightly more mistakes than an experienced keeper but he is already a decent keeper and will only get better. Might as well let him get the experience and we have a top keeper for the next 10, 15 years!

And it's not just the size. Compare our two keepers and the effect they have on their defences. Camp is barely 6ft and about 10 stone wet yet commands his area, organises his defence and comes off his line to catch and punch. Smith is about 6'4 and 14 stone and whilst he sits there like a lemon on the line, and is a good shot stopper, does not do any of that. The only real change in our defence from first coming up to the last two seasons is the keeper (we had Gunter at the end of the first season), and look what a difference it made. But we had decent centre backs. Arsenal don't.

sherer 28-02-2011 22:44

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadow Demon UK (Post 35183460)
I'm not looking forward to next season when we might be going through what Arsenal are with keepers this season. On yesterdays showing Van Der Sar is still one of the best around, it will be a big loss when he goes at the end of the season.

Still don't think VDS is that great. Half of those shots from the weekend were hit straight at him. All keepers, no matte how bad, are pretty good shot stoppers.

It's the rest of his game that really lets him down. He constantly gets beaten at the near post, has very poor command of his area, never speaks to the defence ever !!, his decision make can leave a lot to be desired, constantly flaps at or punches the ball and after a lot of his saves the ball is still in the danger zone.

Arthurgray50@blu 28-02-2011 23:26

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
So the FA have down a typical favour to Rooney, and have decided not to charge him after doing the elbow job at the weekend.

This what is totally wrong with football in the Premier League, IF it was any other player, they would have been banned and heavily fined, Rooney gets away with murder, he mouths off to referee's and he conns them left right and centre, and gets away with it.

He would not have lasted five minutes in the days of Vinny Jones etc, he is just a baby still in nappies and deserves a kick up the backside.

Shadow Demon UK 01-03-2011 00:11

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by sherer (Post 35184213)
Still don't think VDS is that great. Half of those shots from the weekend were hit straight at him. All keepers, no matte how bad, are pretty good shot stoppers.

It's the rest of his game that really lets him down. He constantly gets beaten at the near post, has very poor command of his area, never speaks to the defence ever !!, his decision make can leave a lot to be desired, constantly flaps at or punches the ball and after a lot of his saves the ball is still in the danger zone.


I disagree with most of that, from what i remember he has made one mistake this season and that was against West Brom at home, the rest of the time he has been brilliant for us.

---------- Post added at 23:11 ---------- Previous post was at 23:11 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arthurgray50@blu (Post 35184240)
So the FA have down a typical favour to Rooney, and have decided not to charge him after doing the elbow job at the weekend.

This what is totally wrong with football in the Premier League, IF it was any other player, they would have been banned and heavily fined, Rooney gets away with murder, he mouths off to referee's and he conns them left right and centre, and gets away with it.

He would not have lasted five minutes in the days of Vinny Jones etc, he is just a baby still in nappies and deserves a kick up the backside.


Yes, the FA are always doing Rooney favours :rolleyes:

danielf 01-03-2011 01:20

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by sherer (Post 35184213)
Still don't think VDS is that great. Half of those shots from the weekend were hit straight at him. All keepers, no matte how bad, are pretty good shot stoppers.

It's the rest of his game that really lets him down. He constantly gets beaten at the near post, has very poor command of his area, never speaks to the defence ever !!, his decision make can leave a lot to be desired, constantly flaps at or punches the ball and after a lot of his saves the ball is still in the danger zone.

There will be no dissing of Sarretje in his last season. The man is a legend...

iadom 01-03-2011 11:42

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Its official...Ashley Cole has rejoined the Gunners.:D

Damien 01-03-2011 12:00

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadow Demon UK (Post 35184261)
Yes, the FA are always doing Rooney favours :rolleyes:

He was very lucky.

Shadow Demon UK 01-03-2011 12:58

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35184443)
He was very lucky.

He was very lucky in the game, but the FA were right not to punish him afterwards because they would be going against their own rules. That rule needs to be changed really, but i don't see it happening because the FA don't want to be seen going against referees and the decisions they make. Arthur was implying that the FA are always doing Rooney favours, which is certainly not the case.

DocDutch 01-03-2011 17:41

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by danielf (Post 35184292)
There will be no dissing of Sarretje in his last season. The man is a legend...

Am with Daniel..... even if I hate ManU van der Sar is and has been a legend since he joined Manu what how long has he been there now 6 years and how many goals has he let through in those not that many compared to others and yes there is a decent defense but players do get lucky sometimes.

yesman 01-03-2011 18:59

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DocDutch (Post 35184726)
even if I hate ManU

But why do you hate ManU?

I am a United fan, but I don't hate Arsenal, in fact I don't hate any team. It would be interesting to hear your reasons.

Also, It is good to see you call them ManU for a change :clap:

ChrisLUFC22 01-03-2011 21:58

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by yesman (Post 35184788)
But why do you hate ManU?

I am a United fan, but I don't hate Arsenal, in fact I don't hate any team. It would be interesting to hear your reasons.

Also, It is good to see you call them ManU for a change :clap:

Well said. I don't hate any team, not even the green eyed monsters from where I live :shocked:
Rather than hate them, I actually look out for all Yorkshire teams and like to see them do well.
Although, I have to add, Arsenal fans are particularly getting on my nerves at the moment, except you Damien! One of the few that talks sense (or seems to :p:)

Damien 01-03-2011 22:30

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ChrisLUFC22 (Post 35184931)
Well said. I don't hate any team, not even the green eyed monsters from where I live :shocked:
Rather than hate them, I actually look out for all Yorkshire teams and like to see them do well.
Although, I have to add, Arsenal fans are particularly getting on my nerves at the moment, except you Damien! One of the few that talks sense (or seems to :p:)

Arsenal fans rock innit. :cool:

---------- Post added at 21:30 ---------- Previous post was at 21:28 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by yesman (Post 35184788)
But why do you hate ManU?

I am a United fan, but I don't hate Arsenal, in fact I don't hate any team. It would be interesting to hear your reasons.

Also, It is good to see you call them ManU for a change :clap:

I think it doesn't mean he literally hates, as in seethes with rage, them. Just enjoys seeming them between and is annoyed by them.

ChrisLUFC22 01-03-2011 22:33

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35184947)
Arsenal fans rock innit. :cool:[COLOR="Silver"]

:LOL:

Trust me, the one's I work with are....
Well, put it this way, I can't think of a word that will get round the swear filter ;)

DocDutch 01-03-2011 22:59

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
okay Yesman.. hate is a bit too strong a word but cant stand them is that better?

main reasons... hmm where to start really, dont like the cockiness of the supporters for 1 especially those around london areas, the way that in the past they just threw money at clubs for their star players (see Rooney, Rio, Berbatov, and some others that I cant remember the names off) and just the arrogance sometimes of the players themselves and what they get away with most of the time.

Oh biggest dislike goes to Fergie for how he has treated his at the time stars and all of a sudden ditches them, for examples see Roy Keane, Jaap Stam, Ruud van Nistelrooy, David Beckham and Christiano "crybaby" Ronaldo

sherer 02-03-2011 00:01

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DocDutch (Post 35184969)
okay Yesman.. hate is a bit too strong a word but cant stand them is that better?

main reasons... hmm where to start really, dont like the cockiness of the supporters for 1 especially those around london areas, the way that in the past they just threw money at clubs for their star players (see Rooney, Rio, Berbatov, and some others that I cant remember the names off) and just the arrogance sometimes of the players themselves and what they get away with most of the time.

Oh biggest dislike goes to Fergie for how he has treated his at the time stars and all of a sudden ditches them, for examples see Roy Keane, Jaap Stam, Ruud van Nistelrooy, David Beckham and Christiano "crybaby" Ronaldo

Ronaldo was sold because he was always going to go to Spain at some point and so it was either cash in or get nothing. Make no mistakes £80m will make anyone sit up and take notice.

Roy was getting old and not much use to the team. Ruud didn't fit into the team plans and style of football going forwards but I always rated him and wished he had stayed longer.

Beckham and Stam both could have stayed longer than they did

nffc 02-03-2011 00:15

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by sherer (Post 35185004)
Ronaldo was sold because he was always going to go to Spain at some point and so it was either cash in or get nothing. Make no mistakes £80m will make anyone sit up and take notice.

Roy was getting old and not much use to the team. Ruud didn't fit into the team plans and style of football going forwards but I always rated him and wished he had stayed longer.

Beckham and Stam both could have stayed longer than they did

The thing is - and I will admit to freely being a Utd hater - that Ferguson is such a good manager because even in this era, he still maintains the traditional values of building a team, running a club from the ground up, and subordinating his superstars to the ethos of the team and club as a whole.

Ferguson knows precisely what the club employees - especially the playing staff - are capable of because he has been there almost 25 years and requires the level of control to have the influence where it matters. He knows precisely what his fringe players are capable of and whether or not they are ready for the team or need loaning out or dispensing with. How many players has he released who have played for as big a club? Pretty much none. He knows what is good enough and keeps players whilst they are useful and releases them before the wider world realises they are not.

Admittedly maybe he could have got a few more years out of Beckham and Stam but I daresay he got rid of both for non-footballing reasons anyway. As I said, in his ethos no player is bigger than the team and Beckham had become a media circus attached to a footballer and this would disrupt the team if the attention was focused on a player more for his off-field antics than on it; not to mention there had been disputes between the two and in these cases only the manager should win. As for Stam, I happen to think a certain biography was the nail - you don't undermine your employers.

The rest were sold because the price was right and they were waning anyway. Chelsea have kept with their aging stars and it will affect their resale and possibility of using any resale to fund the squad. Arsenal do the same as Utd, look at Vieira, Henry, Petit etc after leaving and yeah, the clubs they have gone to have got maybe a few years out of them and that's all but they never were as good. Part of that is also Wenger's genius as a man manager, and he deals the same hands as Ferguson, only with a completely different character - look at how Anelka was dispatched - in that he runs the club and has done for a long time and builds teams based on bringing players through as well as signing them.

Chelsea bought a team and this season the result of doing so has been cruelly exposed. Man City are about to make the same mistake.

Damien 02-03-2011 12:41

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
United have been brought right back into the title race here. Arsenal better win at the weekend, then we'll be one point behind United with the same number of games played before their trip to Anfield.

Matty_ 02-03-2011 15:14

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
What is it with English/UK born top premiership footballers that makes them think they are so much better than the rest and means they cannot behave in an ordinary cival manner.
Recently we have had "incidents" involving people such as John Terry with his gambling and shady deals going on at the training ground. Ashely Cole with his threesomes, taking a gun into training and shooting a young lad.
Wayne Rooney bagging prostitutes, smoking, ****ing up walls and generally being uncouth. Joey Barton and his continuing sagas, allegations (possibly unfounded) about Steven Gerrard, etc, etc, etc!
When ever you watch a premier league game you see players effing and blinding at the ref constantly. Barging into each other then falling to the floor like Mike Tyson just gave them a right hook.
I used to enjoy watching football on telly (have even been to few games this season) but i am getting more and more disillusioned with the game the more i see stunts like Rooney after scoring standing there arms outstretched with his chest puffed out as if he`s the messiah.
Will anything ever be done to combat this mentality? I very much doubt it, the modern footballer just isn`t brought into the game with the same ethos and values as say a rugby union player. Would they even consider things like swearing at an official an offence which would be punished by a yellow card and free-kick to the opponents. Maybe something similar to the 10 Meter rule in RU.
This is obviously not the case for all players but it does seem the majority have very little respect for opposing players or officials and even less for the fans even of their own team. Personally i think modern football has become a bit of a disgrace and really needs to clean up it`s act :mad:

Rant over (feel better now) :)

gazzae 02-03-2011 18:00

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Matty_ (Post 35185209)
Will anything ever be done to combat this mentality? I very much doubt it, the modern footballer just isn`t brought into the game with the same ethos and values as say a rugby union player. Would they even consider things like swearing at an official an offence which would be punished by a yellow card and free-kick to the opponents. Maybe something similar to the 10 Meter rule in RU.

Actually abusive or offensive language towards an offical is a sending off offence.

I don't think its anything to do with ethos and values its down to the simple fact that rugby refs will enforce the law and football refs don't/won't.

Matty_ 02-03-2011 18:08

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by gazzae (Post 35185342)
I don't think its anything to do with ethos and values its down to the simple fact that rugby refs will enforce the law and football refs don't/won't.

Respectfully disagree, when listening to some of the recent Rugby you could actually hear some of the players calling the ref Sir and asking if things were OK. Also the attitude towards opposing players seems genuine. They may have just crunched into someone with a tackle but they seem genuinely concerned when a player is down injured.
With football you get the feeling that any sympathy is just lip service partly because they don`t know if the other player is faking it or not!

danielf 02-03-2011 18:36

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Matty_ (Post 35185351)
Respectfully disagree, when listening to some of the recent Rugby you could actually hear some of the players calling the ref Sir and asking if things were OK. Also the attitude towards opposing players seems genuine. They may have just crunched into someone with a tackle but they seem genuinely concerned when a player is down injured.
With football you get the feeling that any sympathy is just lip service partly because they don`t know if the other player is faking it or not!

The same applies to a lot of the fans. I find the tribalism displayed by many football fans just as off-putting as the behaviour of the players on the pitch.

gazzae 02-03-2011 23:01

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Matty_ (Post 35185351)
Respectfully disagree, when listening to some of the recent Rugby you could actually hear some of the players calling the ref Sir and asking if things were OK. Also the attitude towards opposing players seems genuine. They may have just crunched into someone with a tackle but they seem genuinely concerned when a player is down injured.
With football you get the feeling that any sympathy is just lip service partly because they don`t know if the other player is faking it or not!

It's like being at school. With some teachers people mucked about in their class as they didn't enforce the rules, other teachers you wouldn't dare mess with as they took no crap.

I don't know why football refs don't send off players who use abusive language to them but until they start it isn't going to stop

Shadow Demon UK 02-03-2011 23:18

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Did anyone else see the end of the Cetlic v Rangers game? I think they realise the football they play isn't entertaining so create the entertainment by fighting and getting sent off. Lennon and McCoist shook hands and hugged at the end of the game and then suddenly started shouting at each other and had to be broken up before they started throwing punches. Crazy

DocDutch 02-03-2011 23:23

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
problem with the scottish league is that its to small and not much of a challenge can you name a team other then celtic or rangers that have won the league in the last 10 years.

Damien 02-03-2011 23:29

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadow Demon UK (Post 35185626)
Did anyone else see the end of the Cetlic v Rangers game? I think they realise the football they play isn't entertaining so create the entertainment by fighting and getting sent off. Lennon and McCoist shook hands and hugged at the end of the game and then suddenly started shouting at each other and had to be broken up before they started throwing punches. Crazy

Pretty pathetic really. The amount of Old Firm games there are each season, as well as the continued decline of the league, has turned people away from the SPL even more. The continued petulance displayed by both sides is also wearing thin, nobody outside Glasgow cares anymore.

People wonder how the Old Firm teams would do in the Premier League, you look at the players and the games and you don't even seem them challenging for mid-table. Although the Premier League money + fanbase would mean they could rectify that if they managed to stay in it for 5 or so years.

DocDutch 03-03-2011 08:40

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
dont think they would last 2 years to be honest damien.

Pog66 03-03-2011 12:10

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DocDutch (Post 35185629)
problem with the scottish league is that its to small and not much of a challenge can you name a team other then celtic or rangers that have won the league in the last 10 years.

....and how many teams have one the Premiership in it's 18-19 years? = 4 I believe!!

Saying that I don't disagree with your sentiments!!

nffc 03-03-2011 18:26

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DocDutch (Post 35185629)
problem with the scottish league is that its to small and not much of a challenge can you name a team other then celtic or rangers that have won the league in the last 10 years.

Aberdeen were the last in 1986 I think.

Damien 03-03-2011 20:47

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Kolo Toure tests positive for drugs

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2...ure-drugs-test

Oppps.

DocDutch 03-03-2011 21:01

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pog66 (Post 35185829)
....and how many teams have one the Premiership in it's 18-19 years? = 4 I believe!!

Saying that I don't disagree with your sentiments!!

yeah okay 4 but you never know which 4...at least the Prem is a bit more shall we say dynamic?

---------- Post added at 20:01 ---------- Previous post was at 20:01 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35186204)
Kolo Toure tests positive for drugs

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2...ure-drugs-test

Oppps.

hope they test Yaya as well...

ChrisLUFC22 03-03-2011 21:21

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35185633)
Pretty pathetic really. The amount of Old Firm games there are each season, as well as the continued decline of the league, has turned people away from the SPL even more. The continued petulance displayed by both sides is also wearing thin, nobody outside Glasgow cares anymore.

People wonder how the Old Firm teams would do in the Premier League, you look at the players and the games and you don't even seem them challenging for mid-table. Although the Premier League money + fanbase would mean they could rectify that if they managed to stay in it for 5 or so years.

I genuinely think alot of Championship teams would scare the living daylights out of them - but they can bugger off if they think they can join our national league(s), and get a share of our money (TV rights etc.). Anyway, who says Celtic & Rangers should join Prem? They should start at the bottom if they really wanted to join.

Arthurgray50@blu 03-03-2011 21:22

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
IF Celtic and Rangers played in the English PL, the clubs would not last long, due to the fast pace of the game and also the large band of thuggery of both clubs.

We saw at the weekend how bad it was, and this can happen week in and week out, l have been to an old firm game, and being a Londoner l was told to keep my mouth shut, on the day it is like a tinder box waiting to explode, as both sets of fans hate each other.

Its not like Spurs/ Arsenal or Man U / Man City, this is not the first time there has been problems between the clubs, and the SFA won't do anything, what has to happen is that BOTH clubs have to have points deducted if these problems happen constantly or even UEFA have to ban them from Europe, what ever happen to the 'respect' campaign, Assault on refs is dispicable, but the weekend game was a disgrace.

I went to the game at Wembley where Celtic were playing in the London Cup, and l was totally gobsmacked when l found that Celtic fans were banned from several pubs in the area, due to crowd problems.

Kymmy 04-03-2011 11:33

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35186204)
Kolo Toure tests positive for drugs

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2...ure-drugs-test

Oppps.

Seems that it's not a case of "drugs" as in cocaine/canabis/etc.. but instead it's something that could have an explanation within a medicinal product.

It's must be a minefield for these guys every time they have a sniffle as to what's available and what they can/can't take.

Damien 04-03-2011 17:11

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Off to old Trafford for the Arsenal game! First time I have been to Old Trafford and, indeed, an away game.

---------- Post added at 16:11 ---------- Previous post was at 16:00 ----------

Any advice into travelling to and from the Stadium to Manchester Piccadilly would be welcome. Full time will be roughly around 7:10 to 7:15 which would give me 1 hour and 15 minutes to make my train departing at 20:30 back to London. I am aware of the Metro line but am unaware of the time it will take to get on and back to the station.

sherer 04-03-2011 19:15

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Kymmy (Post 35186626)
Seems that it's not a case of "drugs" as in cocaine/canabis/etc.. but instead it's something that could have an explanation within a medicinal product.

It's must be a minefield for these guys every time they have a sniffle as to what's available and what they can/can't take.

I heard he had "accidently" taken his wifes diet pills. As these can help reduce fat and also boost muscle growth it might not be as innocent as it sounds

Shadow Demon UK 04-03-2011 23:51

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35186855)
Off to old Trafford for the Arsenal game! First time I have been to Old Trafford and, indeed, an away game.

---------- Post added at 16:11 ---------- Previous post was at 16:00 ----------

Any advice into travelling to and from the Stadium to Manchester Piccadilly would be welcome. Full time will be roughly around 7:10 to 7:15 which would give me 1 hour and 15 minutes to make my train departing at 20:30 back to London. I am aware of the Metro line but am unaware of the time it will take to get on and back to the station.

You might find that the away fans will be held in the stadium for a while after the game but the metro is the best way to get back to picacadilly, the station is only a couple of minutes away from the ground and doesn't take long to get to Piccadilly. You should have plenty of time to get to the station but i don't know how long they keep the away fans in for, if they do at all that is.

Chris 06-03-2011 17:23

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Odd, why is this thread suddenly so quiet? :scratch:

superbiatch 06-03-2011 17:47

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris (Post 35188157)
Odd, why is this thread suddenly so quiet? :scratch:

Can't quite put my finger on it :rofl:

Julian 06-03-2011 17:51

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
It's really Kuyt a mystery. :erm:

Shadow Demon UK 06-03-2011 19:42

Re: Football Season 2010/2011
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris (Post 35188157)
Odd, why is this thread suddenly so quiet? :scratch:

Quote:

Originally Posted by superbiatch (Post 35188182)
Can't quite put my finger on it :rofl:

Its also odd how two people who haven't posted in it for aaaaaaaggggggggeeeeeeeessssssssss have poped up :scratch:


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