Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

Myself don't think it warrants a big success story.

Man U apart from taking Arsenals scalp on the way have done nothing spectacular as their final league position proves that.

Millwall however as 1st division side took some people above them in their league on their route.

On the day though Man U did nothing spectacular playing a side in a league below them.

First goal was due to sploppy defending, second form the penalty spot that was Milwalls own fault probably due to frustration after holding them for 44 mins.

Third goal was from pushing forward too much being two nil down.

Nothing for the Man U fans to write home about just another expected victory.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

I've said it before and I'll say it again - when Arse can dominate an entire decade such as United have done, then I'll start to take them seriously. Do something decent in europe and perhaps the world will take you seriously too.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

Yeah Yeah.

If Arsenal were not a team to be taken seriously then why do man united fans keep saying we cheat? why does the manchester evening news publish that quote above about dirty play (even though we won fair play award).

And why do man united think (or used to think) that a shirt that says comical wenger "we will go though the whole season unbeaten" is funny to run around in? Even though Arsenal are wearing them now

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

Um..I've never said Arse cheat.

I'm not sure, you'll have to ask the editor.

Because he said it last season just before Arse spectacularly fell apart at the seams?

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

The stories about Wenger saying Arsenal would go unbeaten were misquotes, especially the ones when it first hit the headlines. I've seen the interviews myself - Man U fans have been spreading tabloid myths without checking the facts
:rolleyes:

(I know it doesn't really matter now as the way people twisted the story has well and truely backfired) :LOL:

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

OK and I'll respect Man U when they get the same level of consisency as Arsenal, especially as you like talking "long-term"

Shall we take long term as a time period of 75 years or so?

Consistency would be pretty much winning the league at least once in every decade?

and maybe having relegation as something that no fans under the age of 95 has experienced??



exactly how many European trophies have the all conquering Man U won again in total????

How does that compare to others?

Re: Football talk
 

Well, I didn't write that extract from the MEN, but I have to say I totally agree with ALL what was written.

You no doubt will continue gloating from your teams premiership win, but you still have a long way to go to emulate united's success.
And also I agree what has been said by others, you need to win something in europe to be counted amongst the best.
Then there is always the honour of being treble cup winners also, remember 1999 ?
Congrats on your recent success, but it's only temporary, so enjoy it while it lasts.

Re: Football talk
 

OK so Arsenal are a dirty team, it that's what you think then fine. However, if Arsenal are your benchmark for a dirty team, then using your logic, Man U are a bunch of criminals who need locking up for a few weeks, and Middlesbrough's players all should all be shot immediately (not becasue they're boring but becasue of their record in the fair play league).:LOL:

(no offence to Middlesbrough - I was merely using he's warped logic, not expressing my own beliefs) :D

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

Come on...you're not seriously trying to say Arsenal's last 3 or 4 years can seriously compare to United's success in the last 14 years??

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

No, But past history does not make as any less of a team

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

never remotely said that. wasn't taking about 3 or 4 years, or ten year - the guy wanted to talk about the long term and about consistancy so that is what I did!

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

yawn at this never ending arguement........credit where its due the gooners have had a good season and won the league without a loss......they have not managed to defend any of their premiership titles yet so i dont see next year being any different though.
they are not the most successful team ever....they have just won one trophy this year and that doesnt make them anywhere near as successful as man utd .....oh and when they win the treble they can call themselves successful ;)
and if henry ever gets a nasty injury they can kiss any trophys goodbye because one man teams are not usually very successful when they lose their one man......
OUR trophy will be back home where it belongs next year gooners :)

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

*ahem* ... All you Man Utd and Gooner fans. Allow a Liverpool fan to remind you that true greatness is 20+ years of consistent brilliance. Neither of you have achieved that yet. ;)

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

We are not a one man team, we have had several matchs without henry with we have still scored. We have viera, pires, campbell, cole, ryes is also good

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

Of course but it kind of makes titles such as 'immortal' sound a bit flat :D

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

let's face it since the prem started we have been the dominant side.. we won the league 3 seasons running remember.. they other teams that have won it have only really done so when we slipped up or were transitioning between 2 teams.. anyone remember 2000 where we ONLY won the league and it was a dissapointing season to us as is this term as well. Arsenal are making it sound like they are footballing gods and far better than everyone.. they are far too arragant.. remember last season when they thouhgt they had the league won.. remember this season and their treble.. what happened to those 2 trophies..

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

Well they got one trophy for winning the league and another trophy for going the entire season unbeaten.


The ladies did the double as well :clap:

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

What trophy was that??

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

So Houllier has been sacked.. whos going to replace him?

Jose Antonio Camacho is the new Real Madrid boss, come on Fergie, get Queiroz back!

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

The premier league have commissioned one to be made

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

So they won a trophy which was not previously in existance?

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

You could say that. Its a one off award.

It will be a replica of the Premiership trophy, except the silver and gold will be reversed.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

that was the point i was trying to make.. the arse have had a trophy commisioned just for them for the going through the season unbeaten and we did the treble and didn't get anything at all..

also there was talk of the FA giving the FA Cup to arsenal if they won it again as well..

maybe we should get Bobby Charlton on the board of the FA like David Dein is then maybe we might get some pro United decisions like Arsenal get

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

No, that would make us as bad as them. I'd rather have neutrals on the FA and retain our dignity :)

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

on the Quieroz \ Houllier front i think both managers were let down by players not performing as well as they should as have the Leeds managers as well but they players are still on 90,000 a week but the manager gets the sack.. Doesn't always seem to add up to me. Think Quieroz didn't have too bad a season and was let down by the Galicticos not performing as well as they should.. Houllier may have had some part to play in his downfall .

not sure where this leaves Beckham now.. Camacho might not like him and not a favourite with the fans or press either.. Maybe nows the time to get Carlos and DB back to United..

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

sorry Russ when i read your earlier posts i thought you was an Arsenal fan!!

i remember reading some comments from Trevor Brooking stating when he recently took up a post at the FA he resigned from the board at West Ham.. surely David Dein should resign one of his posts as well to prevent a conflict of interests.. Wouldn't prevent things like the deal they made after the battle of OT this year..

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

:eek:

Not the first time I've been accused of being an Arse fan.... :erm:

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

Now come on Russ, you've seen the ads in the Sunday magazines. It's high quality, etched in 4 carat gold and will only cost you £99.99 in 27 easy instalments.

Limited edition of 999 plates (there were 1000 but Lehmann dropped one ;) )

:D :D :D

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

seems a shame but looks like Henrik Larsson will be going to Spain or Italy.. he turned down a move to Blackburn because it was too cold there. He would have been a great signing for Man U.. or even Chelsea or Arsenal for that matter..

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

With a record of 242 goals in 315 games, he'll be a great signing for any team. TBH, you can't blame him for wanting to go somewhere warmer - he's gone on record as saying that he loves it in Scotland but, let's face it, the weather can be a little inclement at times :(

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

The decision to make one was made before Arsenal went the whole season unbeaten. There was no point in making it stright away or in even announcing it as that would have been a sure fire way to put a jinx on the team.

Afterall, it is such an amazing achievement that the chances were that Arsenal wouldn't go unbeaten.

The other reason the trophy doesn't exist is becasue no team has ever gone a full season unbeaten and been crowned champions in well over 100 years. Whilst Preston's achievement was magnificent, their season was almost half the length of Arsenal's, thus the task Arsenal faced was at least 10 times more difficult. That's not to say Preston don't deserve a trophy too, just that an invincible moderen era league campaign is something extra special and cries out for formal recognition and something that the club can keep for ever.

Anyway, don't worry, most Man u fans will tell you they are miles better than Arsenal. Therefore (using their logic) there is no doubt they win at least 14 of these trophies for an unbeaten season in the next 3 or 4 years, especially considering how easy it is to go for 38 games in the league unbeaten. :rofl:

Euro 2004
 

Who do you think will win the tournament ?

My feelings are this:

France should be a good bet.
England could make the quarters or semis.
The hosts are in with a shout, but have a crunch game on the 20th june against Spain.
Don't forget the Germans of course :erm:

But my money is on Holland

Re: Euro 2004
 

I certainly would like to see Holland win. The Germans appear to have a bad spell atm, but they always seem to be there when it matters. Like you say, France stand a good chance. With you on England as well, I don't see them winning, but they should at least make the quarters.

Czech Republic are a side to watch out for as well...

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

So if man united are so clean and fair what about this payments to agents thingy

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

George Graham to you mate,:pp :D

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

In all fairness Damien, I think it's a bit harsh to bring that up.

IMO, it would be naive to believe that any club is completely blameless when it comes to payments to agents - the only reason that Man U's apayments are all over the press is because of the 99 questions that Magnier and his mate (sorry, can't remember his name) sent to the board.

Also, it has to be said, I think Man U have handled it quite well - they've come out now and said that they won't be using the Elite agency anymore, in an attempt to make the whole issue of transfers to / from the club more transparent which, again IMO, should result in a :tu: for the club (and no, I'm not a Man U supporter!)

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

So what do the United fans think of Smith being signed for 7mill? I can't see where he is going to play, and can see him spending a lot of time warming the bench.

Also very sad to see Houllier getting the chop, I thought he was doing a great job for Liverpool ;)

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

That would refer to management and not the team.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

but its the same thing as accussing us of having disicsions go your way because of david dean

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

How is it the same? On one hand you have actions by upper management which do not directly affect the team - alleged inappropriate actions during the signing of players. But with Dean, his position of influence would indicate the Arsenal team directly benefits with certain decisions which aren't going to go the way of other teams.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

on paper doesn't sound like our greatest signing ever.. but he wouldn't be the first player we've signed whose managed to step up a few gears since joining us.. until he's played a few games don't think we'll really know...

i think Fergie wants to get back to 99 when we had 4 strikers and could rotate and no one really knew what we were going to do

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

Let's hope he's a better signing than 'donkey' Diego Forlan....

That guy couldn't hit a cow's arse with a banjo.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

I think its the same agents can influence if players go to a club or not and they are getting paid and those players are a DIRECT affect on the team TIm howard is one of the bigger cases and hes your goalkeeper. Also dont say 'alleged' even united admitted the stories. ALso your manager was mixed up with the dealings.
So:
-it was not just upper management
-it was not alleged it was true
-THe fact that these players play for the team means they do affect the tea,

Also I dont see how Dean has ever helped arsenal with his position

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

Not sure I am too happy about this

Another 2nd rate signing by Ferguson, time for him to go I reckon

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

im quite bemused at the signing of smith, i guess he will add to our red card tally.......

:shrug:

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

lol 2nd rate?

Why? Because he's not a experianced foreigner? blah.

Smiths workrate is immense, his passion is brilliant. I went to watch Manu vs Leeds this season, and Smith's workrate embaressed majority of the Man utd team.. Give him a few games and he'l be just what RVN wants.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

your comparing him to ruud ? :erm:

they are in a diffarent league.....

RVN - world class.

smith - barely premership material.

i dont see smith as adding much to the team, sure he has his 'good matches' but he is inconsistent, not to mention his fiery tempriment.

im awaiting for him to prove me wrong. (i will give him a chance)

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

no im saying he'l work well alongside rvn :rolleyes:

And after this season you cant really say rvn's world class either :confused:

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

I think he`ll be a good player for united. He`s the fifth signing from Leeds over the years and not one of them has been a bad player.
McQueen, Jordan, Cantona, Ferdinand and now Smith.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

he might get a starting berth, whether he does well.....is something completely diffarent.


not had too bad of a season ruud van nistelrooy , 20 goals in the league is not bad, sure he has not 'sparkled' as much.........

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

Yeah, remember cantona? How was he rated before he came to manu!

He was one of the best manu signings in recent years.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

As soon as he starts to perform "World Class" at international level, then I'l agree he's WC.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

he was rated pretty highly before he arrived at United, thats why it was such a shock that Leeds sold him

He was pretty much the reason why Leeds won the title in 92 and not Man Utd

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

OMFG - Great finish, cant believe he got booked for taking his shirt off!!!

I would understand if like terry said, he took his shorts off :eek:

Gazzae, I was under the impression that cantona wasn't really rated before he went to manu, thats what my mate said anyway.

Anyway, if im incorrect... Smiths rated really high at Leeds, they would never of sold him if they had stayed in the premiership... so judging from the past, he should be a good signing.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

Pre-United, Cantona was average with occasional flashes of brilliance. He certainly did not justify anything more than his £1 million price tag. Something clicked however when he joined United and that's when he became the legend he now is.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

He was already in the french national squad and had won trophies in France, and after all he only had a short time at Leeds, but during that time, he was outstanding. Which is why it was a shock he was sold for only 1.2 Mill.

That said he did have numerous clubs in France as his temparment was pretty bad.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

Sorry mate i disagree. Like I said I think he was the reason they won the title in 92 and not Man Utd.

look at this quote from a leeds site over the transfer..not how you would describe an average player who had only been at a club for 6 months...

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

I'm not saying he wasn't impressive - I described him as having occasional flashes of brilliance - but his game was raised immeasurably when he joined Man United.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

Jose mahrino is stupid to come to chelsea.

This isnt a one off, Porto;s way of playing is wicked... they can defend, but their breaks are crucial.

EDIT : Anyone just see the stoke city flag (that massive one?) :D:D

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

Can we set up a topic just for EURO 2004? I mean this topic has so many different topics the last thing we need is another one of such size to be waked in here? That way we can continue the club talk here and have a one-off topic for all the international stuff, i still would like a sub-forum for foootball (or at least sport) but can we at least have a euro 2004 one?

Put it this way if you wanted to continue a conversation here you have to go though pages and pages and topics are merged into each other

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

Yeah, I think that'd be quite sensible damien.

Go for it :)

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

well done to porto on the European Cup win.. glad a French team didn't win it anyway and Porto had a hrad route to the final as well.. least we got knocked out by the winnerss..

think the jury will be out on Smith until he has played a few games

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

Correction, Man Utd actually beat Porto, Paul Scholes scored a perfectly legitimate goal that was disallowed by a Russian official who has now been removed from the list for Euro 2004.
It is about time that video replays and the 4th official were brought into play for any offside decision that results in a disallowed goal and also for penalties. Cricket, rugby (both codes) and many other sports use modern technology to ensure the correct decision ensues. If it is alright to use video evidence weeks later to punish players for foul play, it should be common sense to use it for decisions that could cost a club millions of £ÃÆ ’‚£Ãà¢Ã¢â€šÂ¬Ã…¡Ãƒâ€šÃ‚£s.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

yes i remember it still the this whole season has all been ifs and maybes

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

There already is one here

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

No, because he isn't that good IMO

Re: Euro 2004
 

My money is on the Czech Republic.

Re: Euro 2004
 

My moneys is the betting shop COME ON FRANCE :)

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

just read Danny Pugh has gone the other way to Leeds.. lets just hope he doesn't turn into one of those players we let go who always come back to haunt us

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

Well, unless Man Utd draw Leeds in the cup competitions that may not happen for several years.;)

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/foot...es/3762055.stm

Seeing as all we're going to hear about over the next few weeks is "how close England came to winning Euro 2004" etc I just thought I'd post that to celebrate our win over Canada :)

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

Liverpool - Ranieri ?

Seems like a bloody good match (sorry if its been mentioned before)

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

At least if they let him go he has the £6milli on severance they have to pay him. Last week there was a lot of speculation that their stalling was in the hope he would just quit, thereby resolving them of the responsibility of paying out. To be honest I think that club is in for more trouble with Abramovich in control.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

Well, if that is what happened, good for him for staying put.

You could be right, you will know when Abramovich has had enough, because that two faced money grabbing b*****d Kenyon will be off, he is the one who I dislike the most and I was very pleased when he left OT.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

That would be a good move for Liverpool I reckon.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

Indeed, he has an excellent reputation in the premiership, he says he would like to continue working in the league and i cant think of a manager thats better qualified and available at the moment.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

It`s despicable what Chelsea have done to Ranieri. What more could the guy have done, he took them to the semi`s of the European cup and came runners up in the league. I really hope he gets a decent club after this but I dont want him to get Liverpool, he`s too good for them.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

just wanted to say well done to Palace on getting promoted. They are my local side and I support them as well. Was at the play-off final and we were the better side and what Iain Dowie has done since he took over the club just unbelievable. Fighting for relagation and now promoted to premiership all in one season.. justs shows you that if we didn't have Alan Smith, Trevor Francis and Steve Kember in charge for the last couple of season we could have gone up ages ago. We had 1 win in 14 games at one point this season :Yikes:

Don't think we are good enouhg to stay up most of our players aren't good enough for the prem and can't see Jordan spending much money on players either.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

England 1 Japan 0.. scrappy game, best chances to Japan.

As much as I admire Paul Scholes he should never be allowed in his own penalty area, he cannot tackle cleanly to save his life, that was a clear penalty.
Also if Fat Boy, Fat, behaves like that in the European Championships he will be for the early bath.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

Thats a good sign, thats supposed to be your strongest team too.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

1-1 now lol that us out of the championships if we can't even beat the Japanese.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

At least we'll treat him better than Chelski :D I prefer Rafael Benitez from Valencia , he has a better record of 2 spanish league titles in 3 years since taking charge. Rather good with Real Madrid and Barcelona breathing down your neck.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

:rofl:

always knew they were a bunch of no hopers.

they wont get far i said that at the qualifying stages to myself.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

4 4 2 is the way to go with gerrard and lampard bossing the midfield beckham on the right and hargreaves on the left.....

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

hargreaves is too weak, i like him dont get me wrong but someone else needs to fill that left side......

someone with experiance, pace, crossing, and wont whine about being played on the left.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

Just found this, a dedicated football search engine.http://www.megasoccer.com/

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

ive just picked my euro dream team for the sun and im afraid to say i have no english players in it :(

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

Right....

I'm off to Manchester to see England v Iceland! :D

En-Ger-Land !!! :D

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

Seriousley? I rate englands midfield very highly... I think Lampard OR Gerrard (One or the other, not both) could fit in it easily.

Terry's also going to be a class defender.

Have fun neil, quite a few ex stoke players played for iceland!, Be good to see them!.. Gudjohnson, Martinson to name a few :)

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

Good moral boosting win for england today... should set them up nicely for the french game. Nice to see Lampard grab one, as well as Rooney's double, he needed them.

Going to leave him with a few selection problems though, Left wings a serious problem, and Im not at all impressed with Scholes at the minute, his passing was good today, but his overall game leaves alot to be desired at international level... and his tackling is dire. If it was me, I'd play Wayne bridge left wing.. he's a great attacking player, and a fairly good defender... strong tackler, comes out on top usually. Gary Neville impressed me today, he seems to have that right side sorted, his brother however is lacking, and I dont think he's really a suitable replacement.

Quite sorry Defoe can't make it.. I'd much prefer him to be in the squad than hargreaves, he'd be a great 75th minute sub, would bring loads of firepower to the team.

ROI on at the mo, playing quite well considering they've got a under strength team.. Keanes goal was sweet, great player :)

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

the iceland game as good but don't get too carried away. They had said before hand they weren't going to get too stuck in as no one wanted to injure any of the England players before the finals.. they didn't really turn up on sat.. abit like Millwall in the cup final :)

Scholes had a great game was all over the place and had a hand in 2 of the goals.. It's just the media jumping on his back because he hasn't scored but he's a midfielder.. Becks hadn't scored for England for ages before he was made captain.. Heskey can't score for clup or country nor can Vassell either but the press doesn't start moaning at them either.. Read that Heskey is officially Englands worst striker ever :Yikes: :Yikes:

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

Where we watching the same game, I could swear I saw Vassell score twice,;)

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

one of them goals bounced off onto his leg. Ok his second goal was good. he hadn't scored away from home for over a year and he's hardly scored at home either but i don't see the press saying he should be dropped or not included in the squad. He is a striker as supposedly is Heskey but their records are just as bad as Scholes but because one plays for United the press want him dropped for England

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

To be honest, Vassell has hardly had an decent run in the team unlike Heskey. I would guess that if you counted Vassell's goals ratio to actual time on the pitch, he would have as good a record as most of the current team. Still not convinced he is the best 2nd string available though.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

i'd rather have beatie myself but Sven does just seem to have his favourites and makes strange decisions at times

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

I am not sure which one I would rather go to united, Rooney or Gerrard ?
neither probably :erm:

When the bidding starts, Chelsea will probably get one or the other if the new manager is interested that is, but I doubt that either one would want to leave their beloved clubs.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

I'd say Gerrard as United need to start making plans for a decent Roy Keane replacement, even though he's said he'd never ever play for United.

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

all fans of clubs in the Football League have got to see this !!!!!


League gets revamp


well it looks like oxford will be playing in Division two next year after all :D

Re: [Merged] - Football talk
 

soon be sunday.........bring on the french