Re: The energy crisis
 

Some reporter on Sky says she has a source that says Truss is on about a cap on wholesale prices rather than cap on bills but what if the wholesalers will not sell it to us at the capped price hmmm

https://news.sky.com/story/liz-truss...#liveblog-body

Re: The energy crisis
 

No, there will be a law forcing them to do so. I think the implementation of it is just down to where you direct the compensation.

Re: The energy crisis
 

Cynics will no doubt point out that Truss once worked for Shell but unless you're a career politician, such things will always come up.

Re: The energy crisis
 

I just want to know if I need to increase my DD for October or not hahaha

Re: The energy crisis
 

Plenty of time, things may look totally different tomorrow.

Re: The energy crisis
 

Some disagreement over if they'll borrow it or if it's a 'loan' the companies take out - back by the Government - that we consumers pay back over the next 10/20 years.

Re: The energy crisis
 

Professional career. From 1996 to 2000, Truss worked for Shell, during which time she qualified as a Chartered Management Accountant (ACMA) in 1999. In 2000, Truss was employed by Cable & Wireless and rose to economic director before leaving in 2005.

Re: The energy crisis
 

Good industry experience.

Re: The energy crisis
 

I suffer from clinical anxiety exasperated by brain damage I received as a child. This sort of shiz really triggers me

---------- Post added at 13:27 ---------- Previous post was at 12:13 ----------

This one does not look so great. £2500 cap still get the £400. I do not think the paywall killer cleared all of the story

https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https%3A%2F%...cies-6njmjzzmz

Re: The energy crisis
 

£2500 is better than the alternative £3549 per year and it looks like the £400 rebate is still there.

Re: The energy crisis
 

we need and 18 month to 2 year solution or nothing really is changing. Think it is time for me to start avoiding this page and news outlets till we know what the score is haha

---------- Post added at 13:39 ---------- Previous post was at 13:37 ----------

Absolutely but then what. If it is only for 3 months then in Jan it jumps to what? nearly 4K then April 5 or 6K like I said we need some sort of stability or people are still gonna be in the mire only they get 1 last good Christmas

Re: The energy crisis
 

looking like it's 2 years.

Re: The energy crisis
 

Apparently she is making an address at 4PM

Re: The energy crisis
 

She might not go into the fine details, today has been a busy day for her.

Re: The energy crisis
 

It's lookling like £2,500 - paid for by borrowing and not a loan or a windfall tax - but with the £400 rebate brings it closer to the current price. You will pay more from October but not as much and get £400.

Re: The energy crisis
 

:D

Re: The energy crisis
 

I vote for Paul to be the next Chancellor of the Exchequer

Re: The energy crisis
 

Nah, it wouldn't work. People who make sense wouldn't be backed by the Fat Cats and you don't seem to able to get anywhere without being willing to grease a few palms.

Re: The energy crisis
 

We need to know the unit price per Kwh, then we can work out how much we can afford to use .

Re: The energy crisis
 

Paul is in the pocket of big Cable Forum

Re: The energy crisis
 

A 40 pence bung won't go far;)

Re: The energy crisis
 

Esp as I expect our own costs will go up at some point, last I checked, servers use electricity. :(

Re: The energy crisis
 

Re: The energy crisis
 

Yeah but we're still unclear if it's at £1,971 or £2,500 - the £400 discount (so £2,100 as the 'average').

Re: The energy crisis
 

Nothing on whether or not the second cost of living will be scraped or kept separate also.

Re: The energy crisis
 

The problem with a price freeze/fix, is that it doesn't incentivise people to reduce their energy consumption

Re: The energy crisis
 

There were ideas where you could taper the usage. I think OVO energy had this where it would work on a personal allowance system similar to taxation where only a certain amount of energy - probably the average usage or whatever - would be sold as the old price cap level but that would increase the more you use.

Re: The energy crisis
 

This is true - the law of supply and demand. If we are not careful, the increasing scarcity of energy caused by prices to consumers being artificially low and usage kept at its present level could push the price even higher.

Re: The energy crisis
 

Considering the current price is 80% higher than at the beginning of the year, that may incentivise people to reduce their energy consumption…

Re: The energy crisis
 

According to below, the £3549 cap would have consisted of £2491 actual wholesale cost, £649 running costs, £169 VAT, £152 green tax, and £63 supplier profit.

So basically, if they took over running the networks, dropped the taxes, and allowed the suppliers a small profit, they would hit the £2500 limit. :)

https://www.cableforum.uk/images/local/2022/09/1.png

Re: The energy crisis
 

Truss says her plan means a typical household will pay no more than £2,500 a year for energy for the next two years from October.

A typical household will save on average £1,000 a year from her two-year energy price guarantee, she claims.
An average energy bill for a typical household will be no more than £2,500 a year for the next two years from 1 October under the plan. This figure takes account of the removal of green levies (worth around £150 per household) and it will supersed the existing energy price cap.

---------- Post added at 11:49 ---------- Previous post was at 11:49 ----------

From The Guardian live so any link I post will change

Re: The energy crisis
 

:rofl:

It’s almost as if the market cannot be trusted!

Re: The energy crisis
 

So they went with Paul's Energy Plan.

The Government won't give projections of the cost but it won't be a windfall tax (as we already knew) that pays for it.

Re: The energy crisis
 

way I look at it is we pay the new cap and when prices drop we continue to pay the new cap to pay back the debt. Guess it is slightly better that some of us being totally crippled by it shorter term

Re: The energy crisis
 

If the actions taken today are expected to curb inflation by 5% wouldn’t it have been better to confirm this before the local government pay settlements?

Re: The energy crisis
 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-62833623

We typically use around 6,000 kwh of gas and 4,000 kwh of electricity annually.

Re: The energy crisis
 

we still need unit rates but to guess what it will cost is pretty easy as too all intents and purposes it is a 25% rise when you do not factor in the £400.

I pay £110 DD but use £90 so a close estimate will put my consumption up to around £112. I have £300 credit and should get the WMD so I should not need to change my DD and I may well be able to spend the £400 as it comes back to me from the DD refunds

Obviously this will not be accurate as it does not factor in standing charges which I hope remain the same

I am a very low gas user but high electric I think high gas users will get hit the hardest

Re: The energy crisis
 

We use way more than this :(

Re: The energy crisis
 

We use around 12.5kwh Gas, 4.5kwh Electricity for our 4 bed detached house (gas cooker and central heating which we had on through the day last winter for part of the week because our three year old grandson with us for 3-4 days a week - that won’t happen this winter, as he started school on Monday: back to two times a day, two hours in the morning and three hours late afternoon/early evening).

Our predicted monthly usage is £254.44 per month (averaged over 12 months), so around 3k for a year (previously paying around £1450 a year).

This peak should be a bit flatter this year…

https://www.cableforum.uk/board/atta...3&d=1662643550

Re: The energy crisis
 

I'm hoping our gas will be less this year, we have a new boiler for the heating and water.
It seems (so far) to be using less for the water. Not needed to use the heating yet (a bit of global warming this winter would be nice ...)

Re: The energy crisis
 

https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news...ource=hs_email

https://www.cableforum.uk/board/atta...4&d=1662644847

Re: The energy crisis
 

Ok perhaps I am just stupid not thinking of this. The guy just serviced my boiler asked if I ever added cold water when I run hot. If so my boiler is set too high , don't know it had a control on it ! :shocked:

Re: The energy crisis
 

I turn mine right down to 45 degrees I also knock the water to rad temp down too but I hardly ever use them
every time the council contracted service jobbies come round they ramp it back up thouhg. The last one was last week and he did not even top up the pressure

Re: The energy crisis
 

Most modern boilers are preset to 60c - 65c, and you have no way to override it.

The temperature for the rads is best at 75c according to most manufacturers, as you get most efficient use of the gas. Any lower, and the pump will run more often and longer and use more electricity.

Re: The energy crisis
 

Mine has a thermostat which I set to 55.
The do say you should try and keep it at 60C+ to prevent Legionaires.


Mine came set at 78C, I turned it down to 75C, but as yet, Ive not actually seen it in action.

Re: The energy crisis
 

Liz Truss campaign’s biggest donation came from wife of former BP executive
Fitriani Hay, wife of James Hay, donated £100,000 to Truss’s successful bid to become PM

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...box=1662636333

the real reason she against a winfall tax

Re: The energy crisis
 

A former BP executive it says.

Did you not understand that bit?

Re: The energy crisis
 

20 years ago - a bit tenuous…

Re: The energy crisis
 

It's considerably less time than he spent at BP though...

Re: The energy crisis
 

Our hot water is set to 50C and heating to around 65C as recommended by the installer. You don't want the water much higher as that goes to scalding and there is no point having the heating too high as the radiators can't "push out" the heat fast enough. (The boiler is less than 1 year old BTW)

Re: The energy crisis
 

Sounds good. I think I may reduce mine down a few degrees too.

Re: The energy crisis
 

We've got our central heating set around the middle of the range so it gets to around 60, but the hot water is on maximum simply because both Mrs G and I like a shower to have some oomph and this gives us a superb water flow - heating water just to cool it down with cold water is wasteful but at the moment we're happy to pay it. One thing I'm planning to change though is turn the water pre-heat off. I'll take some grief because she likes 'instant' hot water in the shower but that is a waste of gas. I wish when we were renovating the house we'd not put the boiler at the far end of the loft as it's crawling access only down that end!

Re: The energy crisis
 

This summer we moved house to a super efficient new build with 1.3KW of solar panels integrated to the roof. Since the electricity meter was activated last spring it has exported about a third more electricity to the grid than it has imported … sadly as our wholesale market is rigged against the little people, Scottish Power can get away with paying me a small fraction of what they will sell that solar power on for. Nevertheless we get some benefit because the house consumes any available solar power before drawing from the grid so there are times when we’re using electricity at little or no cost. Add to that the construction of the house makes it like some sort of giant storage heater and we’ve still yet to switch the central heating on (a notable achievement in this part of Scotland in September).

All told I’m hopeful that despite the price increases, we’re actually going to reduce our energy bill compared to last winter, as our old house was so draughty. However as Scottish Power has been truly glacial in setting up our account and the counter-top smart meter doesn’t actually work, it’s still going to be a while before I know what it’s actually costing us to live here.

Re: The energy crisis
 

Any batteries?

Re: The energy crisis
 

Oddly enough I was reviewing the documentation yesterday and the house builder does have a recommended supplier if we want to add them. I think I’m going to at least ask, and see how cost effective they are.

Re: The energy crisis
 

Not that I will ever be able to afford it but keep us informed anyway

Re: The energy crisis
 

Aside from the noise, I wonder how cost effective a home generator would be now.

Re: The energy crisis
 

It's not so long ago that there was a push in the UK to have home gas boilers removed, and gas powered electricity generators fitted that had waste heat to warm the homes. I suspect that is on the furthest point away from becoming a reality now.

Re: The energy crisis
 

You must kidding 75c !!!: shocked:

Re: The energy crisis
 

It's all down to how condensing combi boilers work. 75c leaving the boiler, but a lot lower on the return leg. I had it explained to me in a very techie way, and it made total sense.

But, and it's big BUT, Building Regs Part L changed again in June this year.

Now the system must be able to cope with 55c.

This guy explains it, but the writing on the screen is a bit off-putting.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SbcVKU1QxJ4

Re: The energy crisis
 

I managed to find what the numbers on the boiler are really for in respect of temperatures for the radiators.

The fitters set it between 3 and 4 (approx 65c), so I shall try it at the new recommended level between 2 and 3 (approx 55c). The youtube vid I recently posted talks about larger radiators and pipework, and ours was installed with double rads and 15mm pipes, so it should cope.

Re: The energy crisis
 

I checked and it seems I actually set mine to 70C (not 75C as I thought).
As winter comes along, at it gets cold enough to trigger them, I'll see how it goes.
The previous boiler did not get anywhere near that, so radiators almost too hot to touch will be a new thing.

Re: The energy crisis
 

October Average unit prices from Martin Lewis Site

Electricity
Unit rate: 34.00p per kWh
Standing charge: 46.36p per day.

Gas
Unit rate: 10.30p per kWh.
Standing charge: 28.49p per day

Re: The energy crisis
 

My current tariff (Shell Energy Flexible 7) -

Re: The energy crisis
 

The prices I quoted are the new ones for October averages as not all area caps are the same

Re: The energy crisis
 

I have E7 Electricity [atm], so always a little different.

Re: The energy crisis
 

Just to warn you that you might experience a delay in receiving your FIT payments from your solar panels:

https://forum.ovoenergy.com/my-accou...d-to-ovo-10513

Today's You and Yours coveted this from about 36:29

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m001byjp

Re: The energy crisis
 

I live in a top-floor flat so I plan to mooch off the suckers below. :D

Re: The energy crisis
 

As I’m with Scottish Power and not SSE or Ovo, hopefully this doesn't apply to me. Although as I have yet to actually have an account even with Scottish Power, who knows …

Re: The energy crisis
 

The Martin Lewis (MoneySavingExpert) site has made an Energy Price Cap Calculator available, for when the price cap rises in October.

https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/ut...p-unit-rates-/

It works out that our annual energy bill will increase to approx. £3,200 per year (this has not deducted the £400 Government money, so £2,800 per year); this time last year my yearly bill was around £1,400...

Re: The energy crisis
 

...

Re: The energy crisis
 

Re: The energy crisis
 

Compared with the current cost, there will be practically no difference after 1 October. As well as the £400 reduction, there are other factors to be borne in mind too, such as the suspension of the green energy levy.

Re: The energy crisis
 

Not sure that a 10% increase (in my and Taf’s examples) is "practically no difference"…

Re: The energy crisis
 

Are we meant to have received official notification of price changes, ahead of 1st Oct?
I pay gas by DD, and electric via quarterly bill. Not sure how this £400 rebate will work. Will it come off the gas or the electric?

Looking at the website about my account, it's saying the gas DD is going down from £39 to £31. Not sure whether that will change come October.

Re: The energy crisis
 

From what I gleaned is the DD is taken as normal then the rebate is paid into your bank. Octopus may be giving an option to keep it in the account but this is only guesswork from their magic eye projection. I have no idea what will happen with yours as it is not standard dual fuel DD

Re: The energy crisis
 

It'll come off your electric, on account of not everyone has gas, but everyone has electric. DD should be reduced by approx £67 for 6 months.

Re: The energy crisis
 

I do not think that is right. They are calling it a Rebate. As I said I think the DD goes out and then they refund the #66. We will know soon enough anyway

Re: The energy crisis
 

Mr K is correct, it will be a credit on your bill.They are calling it a dsicount not a rebate.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/4...ds-this-winter

Re: The energy crisis
 

Octopus are wording it differently

---------- Post added at 21:48 ---------- Previous post was at 21:46 ----------

In fact it is supplier specific how it will be done so we are both correct

https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/ne...ng-support-pa/

ironically Octopus who call it a rebate on the MSE list say it is a reduction so confused.com.

Re: The energy crisis
 

What Shell Energy say…

Re: The energy crisis
 

Bulb say a similar thing.
https://help.bulb.co.uk/hc/en-us/art...t-Scheme-EBSS-


---------- Post added at 01:22 ---------- Previous post was at 01:21 ----------

Mind you, I'm sure they will try and increase my DD again, they keep plugging at it, and I keep reducing it again, Im in credit so I think they're taking the pee atm.

Re: The energy crisis
 

We top our energy up online using a Utilita payment card and then it shows up on the smart meter once the transaction goes through..

Re: The energy crisis
 

...

Re: The energy crisis
 

Just wanted to compare peoples average Gas unit usage in the Summer with it only being used to heat hot water.

Currently only person in the house and with a 25year old boiler I use 6 units to heat hot water PER MONTH during the summer months.

How does this compare to you guys?

Re: The energy crisis
 

6 units total? You counting June July August? I have used 11 in that period just for hot water and I have been washing myself in cold water mainly 10 year old boiler ish. Might well need my meter changing after all haha

Re: The energy crisis
 

I take a meter reading on the 25th of each month and for the summer months I'm using 6 units per month, just wanted to know how good or bad that is for 1 person in the house.

I've edited my main post to reflect per month.

You taking showers and washing up in cold water too?

Re: The energy crisis
 

We’ve used 18 m3 of gas this month so far - with 5 of us in the house, hot water (including showers) and hob are all on gas. Over the same period we’ve imported 170 kWh of electricity, and the solar panels have exported 29kWh (they export to the grid whatever they’re making that we’re not using). To find out how much electricity we’re actually using rather than just what we’re buying, I’d have to work out how to factor in the reading from the solar panel meter, which gives the reading for total generation. Haven’t had time to think about how to calculate that yet.

(Edit) ok so it looks like the panels have generated 72kWh in the first 19 days of this month. If we’ve exported 29 of those, then we must have used 43, which means our total electricity consumption from 1st to 20th September is 213kWh.

Re: The energy crisis
 

I'm assuming each number on a meter is 1 unit? That's how I got my 6 units subtracting the August reading from July.

Re: The energy crisis
 

Your gas meter records cubic metres of gas used (or cubic feet if it’s an old one). You have to refer to your bill to find out how many actual kWh of gas that equates to because there’s a further calculation required, to factor in the energy content (”calorific value”) of the gas supplied to you. I guess your counter-top smart meter might do this calculation, though as I’ve been supplied a dodgy smart meter I don’t know.

But if you want to do a straight comparison of what you’re using compared to your neighbours or other forum members, as long as we’re all comparing the same thing it doesn’t really matter which units we’re using. I haven’t had my first bill yet so I don’t know how my gas use translates from m3 to kWh.

Re: The energy crisis
 

No smart meter here so I will have to look at bills when I have time.

Re: The energy crisis
 

think that is ok tbh both
Have used 1 bowl of hot a day for washing up and dogs dinner

Re: The energy crisis
 

I have been using 25 units per month over the summer (hot water only).

Thats for 4 adults and 1 child.

The conversion from units to kwh is 11.2, it works out at roughly £20 month.

My heating has not kicked in yet, although I did run a 30 minute test the other night to check all the radiators.

Re: The energy crisis
 

Metres Cubed x Volume Correction x Calorific Value / 3.6 (convert from Joules) = KWH Gas the calorific value fluctuates. It is as Paul says pretty much 11 to 11.5 per Cubic Metre

Re: The energy crisis
 

I've not had time to figure mine out but my Gas Meter is the older type so my units are in FT.

Re: The energy crisis
 

36 units here between 28th May and 1st Sept Inc. That's 2 of us hot water only.

Re: The energy crisis
 

I'm not clued up on conversion.

My Gas Meter has FT cubed Units and I would like to compare with someone who has a Meter Cubed Unit Meter can anyone do the maths for me please or link to an online convertor.

6 Units of FT Cubed Gas is equivalent to what in Meters Cubed Units?

---------- Post added at 09:55 ---------- Previous post was at 09:49 ----------

Just got this Email from Bulb.

Re: The energy crisis
 

https://www.google.com/search?q=FT+c...hrome&ie=UTF-8

Google can convert for you

---------- Post added at 10:17 ---------- Previous post was at 10:15 ----------

when you say 6 units do you mean 6 cubic foot cuz looking at the conversion that is incredibly little. Google says 1 Meter cubed is over 35 cubic foot

Re: The energy crisis
 

My Meter says Cubic Foot and I have used 6 of those Units on the Meter in 1 month.

---------- Post added at 10:33 ---------- Previous post was at 10:28 ----------

Just checked my statement and I think the conversion has been done for me, so the conversion is 16.98 Metric units?

Re: The energy crisis
 

My meter must measure the same as yours as the equation I posted earlier is the same