Cable Forum - The Chronicles of Rishi

Cable Forum (https://www.cableforum.uk/board/index.php)

- Current Affairs (https://www.cableforum.uk/board/forumdisplay.php?f=20)

- - The Chronicles of Rishi (https://www.cableforum.uk/board/showthread.php?t=33711430)

Re: Rishi Sunak is Prime Minister

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 36138636)

From the article

I thought that would be the case.

---------- Post added at 17:26 ---------- Previous post was at 17:24 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by BenMcr (Post 36138611)

Yeah, why?

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...cerns-MI5.html

So as suspected, nothing came of it. So yeah, why?

Re: Rishi Sunak is Prime Minister

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul (Post 36138651)

I really cant be bothered to read through pages of more arguments, so someone please tell me - What exactly has all this got to do with the topic (Rishi Sunak is Prime Minister) ?

Unless there is another thread where we discuss the Sunak government & its policies, it seems fair to post here.

---------- Post added at 18:15 ---------- Previous post was at 18:13 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sephiroth (Post 36138654)

I’m not being patronising. I am criticising your paranoia.

It is not "my paranoia", I wish it was.

Here's an article from Justice on the dangers of the Bill: https://justice.org.uk/public-order-bill/

There is even an article on Conservative Home :)

MPs must make a stand against the Public Order Bill’s restrictions on free speech

Re: Rishi Sunak is Prime Minister

Quote:

Originally Posted by jfman (Post 36138639)

Nice to see you are still over-indulging in the soup of British exceptionalism rather than addressing the points actually made by ianch99.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jfman

Wastng your time with Chris

Nice to see you giving me reps you probably intended to give someone else :rofl:

Re: Rishi Sunak is Prime Minister

I don't think there's been a backlash here about Sunak's race, as alleged in the US's Daily Show. There will always be some people that hold this view but I don't think it's a significant proportion of the electorate.
He's of course received criticism over Suella Braverman's appointment and for his wife's former tax status.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/entertainm...6b8d18f8606559

Re: Rishi Sunak is Prime Minister

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1andrew1 (Post 36138688)

I've seen it all over the twitterverse, it's works in America as they are just so consumed about race.

As far as I can tell the evidence for this "backlash" is based solely on one idiot that called into LBC or Talk TV.

I don't think anyone (apart from the usual nutters) could care less about his ethnicity, we just want him to sort this mess out.

Re: Rishi Sunak is Prime Minister

The US commentary on the U.K is almost always very bad. They can't help but see everything through their own lens. That's why they think Boris Johnson was Trump.

That Noah commentary is awful. First of all anyone who says 'the Prime Minister of England' should then be ignored when commenting on British politics but he sets up a strawman so he can have a US-Centric argument. He even said it was ironic Brexiters ended up with an Asian PM which makes no sense at all.

Re: Rishi Sunak is Prime Minister

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 36138690)

He even said it was ironic Brexiters ended up with an Asian PM which makes no sense at all.

This makes a lot of sense. A fair number of people who voted for Brexit were racist and so the last person they would welcome as PM is Sunak. For the racist Brexit voters, it is very ironic.

---------- Post added at 11:41 ---------- Previous post was at 11:40 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris (Post 36138675)

Nice to see you giving me reps you probably intended to give someone else :rofl:

But he is not wrong, though :erm:

Re: Rishi Sunak is Prime Minister

Quote:

Originally Posted by ianch99 (Post 36138691)

I know what you mean, but perhaps it's a big strong to assign the term 'racist' to such an implicitly large cohort of Brexiteers.

"Xenophobic" may be a better term. Every faction has its proportion of racists so picking on Brexiteers, especially in the context of Sunak, is poor rhetoric.

Re: Rishi Sunak is Prime Minister

Quote:

Originally Posted by ianch99 (Post 36138691)

A fair number of people who voted for Brexit were racist

What's fair number? A fair number that voted Remain were also racist.

Re: Rishi Sunak is Prime Minister

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sephiroth (Post 36138696)

Pick you terms carefully. I said a fair number, not a large number. Let's be clear though, a number large enough to make a difference in tight elections. I do agree that the number who might be classed xenophobic is larger.

Assigning precise numbers is difficult due to the complexity and nuance in the competing factors that went into the 2016 decision. Here is an interesting article in Nature on this precise subject: Prejudice and the Brexit vote: a tangled web

Re: Rishi Sunak is Prime Minister

Quote:

Originally Posted by ianch99 (Post 36138707)

Quote:

We have deliberately tried to avoid using the term ‘racism’ in this paper where possible as we follow Brown’s (2010) belief that the term ‘prejudice’ can be regarded as synonymous in the social psychological perspective with sexism, racism, homophobia, and so on.

Next is the weak argument made at the foot of the quote pasted below. It’s clear to me that the authors are leaning towards nationalism being a racist belief (see text below). The absurdist part of the argument being put forward below is that people voting for sovereignty needn’t have bothered because we had proportional representation on all the EU’s committees; as in being outvoted by others which did happen, as you know.

Finally, the paper falls down on the first sentence of the extract pasted below.

Quote:

It is difficult to provide a clear narrative on how much prejudice attitudes played a role in the Brexit vote, largely because a multitude of social issues were caught up in a binary referendum question of whether to leave the EU or remain a member. However, there can be no doubt that issues relating to prejudice were paramount in many of the discussions leading up to the vote in 2016 (Berry, 2016; Geddes, 2016; Vasilopoulou, 2016). Those that may appear to be straightforward, such as the focus upon immigration numbers, are tied to additional areas such as availability of jobs or funding of additional services such as in schools and hospitals. Even those issues that do not appear to have a direct link to individuals and groups, such as the argument that leaving the EU would allow the UK to maintain sovereignty and make its own laws, lean towards concepts of nationalism; ‘we’ will not be told what to do by ‘others’ from the continent. Despite having a proportional representation on all EU parliaments and committees, the discourse that ‘they’ are in charge of the EU and would

Re: Rishi Sunak is Prime Minister

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sephiroth (Post 36138713)

I’ve read that article - it is a very bad article, imo.

It lumps all of the ”nuances” of prejudice such as Islamophobia, Homophobia etc into equating prejudice with racism. Clearly this is where you get to use the term “racism”, possibly to emphasise your point but the article on which you rely explains why it does not use the word "racism".

So the first think to debunk is the article’s equivalence of prejudice with racism. We all have prejudices to a certain degree (nuance). For example, people may be prejudiced against Germans because of what happened 80 years ago; even though it’s ridiculous to be prejudiced against all Germans, it can’t be said to be racist, although the article includes that sort of prejudice and classifies this as racist.

Next is the weak argument made at the foot of the quote pasted below. It’s clear to me that the authors are leaning towards nationalism being a racist belief (see text below). The absurdist part of the argument being put forward below is that people voting for sovereignty needn’t have bothered because we had proportional representation on all the EU’s committees; as in being outvoted by others which did happen, as you know.

Finally, the paper falls down on the first sentence of the extract pasted below.

I am not relying on this article. I linked it as it explains the complexity & nuance of the proposition. Anyway, we are down a rabbit hole here. I was responding to the irony of us getting an Indian PM to a section of our society that voted for Brexit for exactly the opposite outcome.

Re: Rishi Sunak is Prime Minister

Quote:

Originally Posted by ianch99 (Post 36138717)

I am not relying on this article. I linked it as it explains the complexity & nuance of the proposition. I know I am right as I was born in the North East of England (note that there are other parts of the country that also apply) and I know what I observed growing up. You may chose to deny this reality but I do not, it explains a lot.

Anyone, we are down a rabbit hole here. I was responding to the irony of us getting an Indian PM to a section of our society that voted for Brexit for exactly the opposite outcome.

We don't have an "Indian PM". We have a British PM, born here (unlike Boris).

I can't imagine that the section of your regional compatriots who voted for Brexit voted to avoid a PM of Asian heritage.

That article was rubbish and you did rely on it to support your notion of racism, preferring the term to "prejudice". Very naughty but it fits your narrative of regarding Brexiteers as somewhat despicable. Naught but not nice.

Re: Rishi Sunak is Prime Minister

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sephiroth (Post 36138725)

I actually agree somewhat, brexit was never about Indian's, yes being sick of people coming over here and doing the jobs we don't want to and filling huge swathes of the workforce was part of it but considering migration here from nationals outside the EU was greater than those from it in the years running up to the vote you'd have thought that'd gain traction somewhere, plus of course it's quite hard to be racist when the people you're attacking are of the same ethnicity, unless we're really disappearing down the rabbit hole of far right untermenschen, which I don't think we are and the vast majority of brexit voters would be disgusted to be associated with that kind of thing