Originally Posted by pip08456 (Post 36038934)

It's not Pierre's bolded part, it's yours.

Good luck in drilling home white privilege into underprivileged white people.

Originally Posted by mrmistoffelees (Post 36038937)

Underprivileged white people still have more privileges in certain areas than black people.

You're right, it's a monumental effort to make this point understood and be heard


Meanwhile, back in the US

https://metro.co.uk/2020/06/08/white...neck-12819943/

Originally Posted by Chris (Post 36038935)

Indeed.

Also worth pointing out that this nation, having built so much on the profits of slavery, came to its collective senses, as a result of campaigning by its own people, and not only outlawed the practice but then actively sought its interdiction on the high seas via the Royal Navy.

I’m aware of contemporary complaints that the British government put a stop to it by paying off the slavers, and of the argument that it was somehow therefore just another example of rich men feeding money to other rich men, but this is exactly the sort of argument you get from people who don’t understand how to read history. Within the strictures of the time, it was a pragmatic solution and once done, it allowed this country to lead the world in efforts towards abolition.

Churchill, too, was a man of his time. So was Cecil Rhodes, whose statue at Oxford has been subject to ongoing demands for its removal. So, too, was Edward Colston, and for that matter Andrew Buchanan of Glasgow, who made a fortune from tobacco plantations in Virginia (and therefore, out of slave labour), and whose street in the city centre is now subject to demands it be re-named. Decrying any of these men merely as “racist” is ahistorical. Erasing any of them from memory or from history ensures future generations will be ignorant of history and ill-prepared for their own present. What is required is a proper understanding of context, not self-righteous iconoclasm.

Originally Posted by pip08456 (Post 36038938)

Is that opinion or fact. If fact produce your proof.

Originally Posted by mrmistoffelees (Post 36038939)

We're possibly in agreement but I'm not sure (long morning and not enough coffee) but there's a big difference in a statue giving thanks to a slave trader and to one of Churchill.

The former has absolutely no place in modern society, especially with the inscription that it had. My thinking would be to erect something in replacement such as a monument to the 'unknown slave' in remembrance of the thousands upon thousands that were shipped (with many thousands dying) this would allow subsequent generations to learn the history without celebrating the individual.

Originally Posted by mrmistoffelees (Post 36038929)

I'm not missing anything at all.

Using the slogan BLM highlights exactly where the focus of efforts needs to be. BLM does not segregate people nor does it imply that other lives matter less.

---------- Post added at 13:26 ---------- Previous post was at 13:18 ----------



That, is a great post.


There's a significant amount of the population who would argue that white privilege doesn't exist. That message has to be drilled home and they have to understand it.

Your bolded part is perhaps one of the most often asked and also most mis construed components.

This change however, needs to be sped up where possible.

Originally Posted by Mythica (Post 36038946)

Well if other lives don't matter less then all lives matter
equally.

Originally Posted by mrmistoffelees (Post 36038947)

Whom, or where has it been said that all lives don't matter equally?

For the final time, and i really, really hope you understand this.

Saying 'Black Lives Matter' in no way detracts from 'All Lives Matter' 'Black Lives Matter' is being used to direct attention, people, resources & the spotlight to where they need to be positioned most RIGHT NOW

Originally Posted by mrmistoffelees (Post 36038947)

Whom, or where has it been said that all lives don't matter equally?

For the final time, and i really, really hope you understand this.

Saying 'Black Lives Matter' in no way detracts from 'All Lives Matter' 'Black Lives Matter' is being used to direct attention, people, resources & the spotlight to where they need to be positioned most RIGHT NOW

You're in my neck of the woods. See if this helps


There's a major accident on the A174 involving two lorries and a car. Then there's heavy traffic and a couple of rear end shunts on Acklam Road

Where do you prioritise sending the air ambulance and paramedics too ?

Originally Posted by Mythica (Post 36038952)

A slogan of black lives matter. If all lives matter equally then all lives matter.

Yes it does. It's ironic that in a world we all need to be equal that we need to have slogans that segregate between us and them. If all lives matter then all lives matter regardless of who is on the other end. Just because all lives matter, doesn't mean we can't concentrate on what is wrong at this moment in time. Let's be one and let's be equal.

---------- Post added at 14:18 ---------- Previous post was at 14:14 ----------



Does that need answering?

What you don't do, is make a slogan up which states major accidents matter or lorries matter. You start with all lives matter then prioritise who needs help the most.

Originally Posted by mrmistoffelees (Post 36038919)

I believe that you're confusing white privilege with racism. As before white privilege != racism.

I'm going to come back and write a longer reply, your post deserves it.

But there's a few initial points

1) We (and i mean this collectively) need to look at what causes Black on Black violence as Pierre and i were discussion earlier in the thread this is due to socio/economic reasons that are highly complex and need to be untangled.

2) So what if black people use words that white people shouldnt use. If you call your husband/wife 'strumpet' would you be happy for me to do the same? Of course you wouldn't because the relationship is different.

3) With hindsight several programs shouldn't have been made It aint half hot mum & mind your language are just two that i can think of, Fawlty Towers is up there as well. In the past few days Keith Lemon & David Walliams have come out and said they wouldn't make those programs now.

4) Change is scary, of that there's no doubt. but it will happen. History shows us continuously

Finally, why would anyone in their right mind support violence and thuggery ?

---------- Post added at 13:08 ---------- Previous post was at 13:07 ----------



Who needs protection and help where possible most right now?

Originally Posted by mrmistoffelees (Post 36038956)

It does, why dont you answer the question rather than dancing around the edges


here's something for you to mull over. 'If EVERYTHING is a priority then NOTHING is a priority'

Originally Posted by mrmistoffelees (Post 36038919)

I believe that you're confusing white privilege with racism. As before white privilege != racism.

I'm going to come back and write a longer reply, your post deserves it.

But there's a few initial points

1) We (and i mean this collectively) need to look at what causes Black on Black violence as Pierre and i were discussion earlier in the thread this is due to socio/economic reasons that are highly complex and need to be untangled.

2) So what if black people use words that white people shouldnt use. If you call your husband/wife 'strumpet' would you be happy for me to do the same? Of course you wouldn't because the relationship is different.

3) With hindsight several programs shouldn't have been made It aint half hot mum & mind your language are just two that i can think of, Fawlty Towers is up there as well. In the past few days Keith Lemon & David Walliams have come out and said they wouldn't make those programs now.

4) Change is scary, of that there's no doubt. but it will happen. History shows us continuously

Finally, why would anyone in their right mind support violence and thuggery ?

---------- Post added at 13:08 ---------- Previous post was at 13:07 ----------



Who needs protection and help where possible most right now?

Originally Posted by Sephiroth (Post 36038957)

Originally Posted by nomadking (Post 36038961)

1) Where is the evidence? Eg even very rich rappers get violent. It's just a feeble excuse trotted out. Large areas of the world are poor, yet they're not as violent or aggressive. Strange that.:rolleyes:
2) If allowed behaviour is based upon race, than that is the very definition of RACIST.:rolleyes: Using an example of a jokey term is just ridiculous and deliberately dodges the point. They're not using the words in a personal sense, but often in a general and derogatory manner. If they're using it in a personal manner, why can't everybody use it in a personal manner? Not saying they should, but is unsurprising hypocritical to allow one, but not the other.
3) Caricatures have been made of just about EVERY group, of WHATEVER race. Costumes, comedy characters, fancy dress, etc come from ALL races. NOTHING exclusively anti-non-white about any of it.
4) People HAVE been forced out because they don't support the violent actions. Try publicly criticising it and see what happens. Love to know of examples of where that HASN'T happened.


If Black people need protection, it is from THEMSELVES. The FACTS firmly back that up. White people aren't magically immune from being attacked.



Was that racist?

Originally Posted by mrmistoffelees (Post 36038947)

Whom, or where has it been said that all lives don't matter equally?

For the final time, and i really, really hope you understand this.

Saying 'Black Lives Matter' in no way detracts from 'All Lives Matter' 'Black Lives Matter' is being used to direct attention, people, resources & the spotlight to where they need to be positioned most RIGHT NOW

You're in my neck of the woods. See if this helps


There's a major accident on the A174 involving two lorries and a car. Then there's heavy traffic and a couple of rear end shunts on Acklam Road

Where do you prioritise sending the air ambulance and paramedics too ?

Originally Posted by papa smurf (Post 36038971)

The car with the black people in ???

Originally Posted by mrmistoffelees (Post 36038972)

How do you determine that then? Or, are we going into some sort of pavlovs dog scenario?