Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

The point you're missing OB, is that most of the wealth has come from massive rises in property values.

I'll be honest here. IHT is something I'm affected by, (currently going through probate for my mother). Yes my parents paid tax, but they bought their property for £6k, its now £600k. That's just luck.

I'd rather a chunk of tax was taken from my inheritance, so that if I ever need the services of the NHS ( we all will at some point), it's there for me. It certainly was for my parents in their final years, they got their money's worth there. Also I'd like UK plc to remain solvent as that's in my interest too.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

It'll impact like 3-5% of the population is what I read.

At some point, this country will need to fund a lot more social care. That's going to have to come from some taxes anyway. *Expanding* IHT is one of doing it. It'll be that, a new tax, a new fund people pay into like a pension or something like May suggested of housing being used more to pay back the cost after you die.

Sunak thinks he is losing the next elections so he doesn't really have to worry about this kind of thing and will leave it to whoever is next.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Not taxed enough though to balance the books though hence the state of public finances after 13 years of Tory mismanagement.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

So where are you getting a piddling 6/7 billion from ? Borrow more? Cut public services further? Abandon the triple lock?

They've had 13 years to do any of these things, including reforming IHT, why now? Panic stations at 'oh dear we're screwed central' .

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

It's just as much 'robbing' as any other tax only at the moment fewer people are impacted by it. You could also argue that why should it fall upon me and other working-age people to pay for the social care of people who've accumulated a lot of wealth through a boom in house prices?

But my larger point is that Sunak will spend the next year promising tax breaks that you'll never see or will be reversed after the next election. Either he wins in which case it's done it's job or Labour wins and has to implement unpopular tax rises in their first year.

This country has a large amount of debt, an NHS with huge waiting lists, infrastructure projects that need funding and are on hold, and the whole mess that is social care and pensions which cost more and more each year with the triple lock.

The scope for serious tax cuts is limited. IHT might get away with it because it impacts so few people and fires up their base whereas raising the 20% and 40% tax thresholds with inflation would actually be fairer and impact more people but actually would cost money. So they keep that effective stealth tax rise whilst making a big show of cutting tax for the richest estates.

Sunak/Starmer are lying if they say otherwise.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Wind in the righteous indignation and give your head a wobble, no one said shysters and spivs were the attributes of honest hard working people, what I said is the shysters and spivs love a useful idiot who tries to say their aggressive tax avoidance schemes are like a ordinary plebs ISA and this is similar, the vast, vast majority are completely unaffected by this

Considering hmrc are saying it isn't in the public interests to go after the fraudsters that made of with billions in the pandemic I can't see that aspiration as achievable, someone will be along in a minute to say that con was no different from claiming allowances on your self assessment form no doubt

I never said they were greedy

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

I couldn't agree more!

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Such absurd fulminations.

For a kick off, inheritance tax is in effect levied on those receiving the inheritance, not the one leaving it, because the one leaving it is dead. It can’t affect them in any way. It is a tax on the transfer of wealth that is by its very definition unearned. Absolutely nothing to do with how hard the recipient works themselves. And that is in fact the problem. There are people who are wealthy purely because their parents, grandparents and great grandparents have managed to leave a cascade of wealth flowing down the generations and who therefore have a large number of built-in advantages over those who did not inherit wealth. No society that believes itself to be democratic and meritocratic should leave that totally unchecked. Because yes, when after several generations the inequalities become egregious, that’s when revolutions occur.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

If it is an election ploy, its a terrible one. The 3% who might benefit are mostly already 'in the bag'. The other 97% will see it for what other is, the rich looking after themselves at the expenses of other much more needed causes atm.

I suspect they know the election is lost and are feathering their own beds; even they can't be that thick to think this will win an election. Its the no 1 issue for almost nobody.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Its a non issue for me, I would not come anywhere near the threashold.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Depends If you consider everyone within the M25 that owns their house, “The Rich”.

Anyway Fortunately, for us all and you, we’re all heading for a dementia epidemic and the local authority will take all your assets to pay for your care and your poisoned entitled offspring will get nothing. So inheritance won’t be an issue anyway.

So I don’t see what the issue is.

By shares in care homes.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Isn't this fair enough? Unless we introduce a new tax then it's got to be paid for somehow. Either we all pay into a fund, like a pension, we apply a tax on all inheritance or we do what May proposed and your house is used to help pay for the care you received.

The social care problem will be unavoidable eventually, a government is going to have to bite the bullet at some point and address it.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Since over 90% of the houses within the M25 are under £1,000,000, probably not "everyone within the M25"…

https://www.standard.co.uk/homesandp...-b1059196.html

I’m always confused why people (not saying you do) who have assets/parents have assets, expect others (the taxpayer/council tax payer) to pay for their later life care - most of my wife’s mum’s money from selling her bungalow went to pay for her couple of years in a Dementia Care Home, and we expect the same for outr house assets.

Obviously, if one of a couple is in a care home, and the other isn’t, it gets a bit more complex.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

This will be our reality in a few years.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

It’s amazing the amount of small state/free market capitalists become lefties on their death beds.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

There are multiple examples of "tax twice" - for instance, you pay tax on your earnings, but then pay tax again when you buy things (except food and childrens' clothes).

I have "worked diligently", and would be affected by IHT - however, I have no problems paying it, because I am part of society, and I see part of my role in life to support society.

We help our kids & grandkids (because luckily we can) whilst we are alive, but if there is anything left after care home fees for me and SWMBO, I have no issues on it being taxed once it's over the threshold.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

I've been observing a far more nuanced debate with commentary around funding social care and how much you tax the hard-working entrepreneurs and employees of today and how much you tax those who have the good fortune to inherit substantial sums.

Conclusion seems to be that unless you've millions, a lot of wealth will end up funding care so not a massive issue for many people.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Wealth is routinely taxed when it moves from one person or business to another. I paid income tax on the money I’ve just spent on a coffee. The coffee shop owner will pay tax on that part of my payment that represents their profit. The part of my payment that is used to buy more coffee beans will generate a profit for the wholesaler, who will in turn pay tax on their profit. Wealth moves around the economy and it is taxed almost every time. Suggesting that the very significant value of an entire personal estate should not be taxed when it is transferred, on death, to another person, is special pleading of the very worst kind. The only exemption that makes any sense is the spousal one because their life is intimately connected with the deceased’s affairs and it would be egregious to destroy the living of someone who legitimately depends on that accumulated wealth. But nobody - nobody - should be dependent on the wealth of an inheritance. There is nothing lefty about that belief. We have had inheritance taxes of one sort or another in this country since the 17th century. The only thing that’s really changed in that time is how well designed they are. Abolishing them altogether is really only doing the rich tax-avoiders jobs for them.

Footnote, claiming that the collection of tax betrays a ‘wealth belongs to the state’ mindset is the worst sort of self serving, libertarian guff. We live in a democracy and we agree, via the ballot box, that the operation of the complex modern society we live in should be paid for by all of us, with due regard to means.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

What do you think of May's plan where the cost of care would be secured against your assets if you have any?

Personally, I feel it's unfair. One of the principles of the NHS is that we pool the risk for each other somewhat. Some people will need more care and others less. It was still a way to pay for it though.

Like what? The biggest bills in this country are pensions and the NHS. You're not going to be able to afford government-backed social care by finding 'efficiencies', it's a bill that will go into several billions a year, so we need to pay for it somehow.

An inheritance tax is one of the fairest ways to do this right now. Anything else and you're asking those in work to underwrite the social care costs of a generation who already has benefitted from rising house prices and triple-locked pensions. Personally i think you would need both: a social care tax and some of the money taken back upon your death via inheritance tax.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Why is any tax fair? Tax is necessary to fund everything we expect this country to be able to do for us. We accept that the fairest way to tax is to cream off a portion of wealth as it moves through the economy. It is no more or less fair to tax your children when they benefit from your estate than it is to tax their bank interest, or their wages.

NB Appealing to non-specific ‘Better choices’ is the last refuge of the NIMBY. ‘I don’t know how, just not that way’ is intellectually lazy. This is a discussion forum - propose some alternatives, and explain why they are more fair than inheritance tax.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

All of that barely touches the sides.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

My family will be but guess what, they're fine with that and it isn't the spending choices that need to be better it's the tax system that needs to be better, billionaires paying less in tax than their cleaners, corporations paying less in tax than their ceo's earn and evasion dressed up as avoidance, if these things were tightened up on then perhaps taxes across the board could be lower

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

You missed out on the 3rd group who, ironically have far more (fairly) taxable wealth that the other groups:

3/ People who do not work diligently, rather, rely on existing wealth (property, shares, dividends, etc.) and build up their assets principally via tax loopholes and generous (to the wealthy) schemes where little or no tax is paid to the state.

Loving the "politics of envy" trope :D It betrays poor imagination to constantly trot this out each time taxation is discussed. It normally is presented by those who:

a) have significantly more than the average amount of personal wealth
b) resent having to pay any tax, over and above what they regard as a fair amount i.e. a small amount
c) still expect the country to have high quality infrastructure & services, at least where they live

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

You don’t need to be responsible for the artificial inflation of house prices to be a beneficiary.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

The elephant in the room is that the people you refer to have been, as you correctly identify, "dragged" into an increased tax burden by this government. The 40% tax bracket is a prime example. The reason is that middle income PAYE employees are an obvious cash cow i.e. there is no escaping the tax directive.

The more appropriate approach is to apply a more representative and fairer tax rate to all UK citizens, not just the ones who can't escape from HMRC.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Not what he said…

(may be what he meant, but not what he said)

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Flat tax - bad

Why? Because this would only be imposed on income and not wealth. The classic ultra wealthy deflection: talk about taxing income but never about taxing wealth

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

This is a very childish retort. I have no need to be jealous, I am more than comfortable in terms of my personal wealth. However, you seem to regard those who clearly have accrued disproportionate amounts of (mostly unearned) wealth as somehow immune from contributing at the same level as the rest of us. This either means you are one of them or you have an irrational need to shill on their behalf.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Are you though? Because that phrase is routinely misused so as to make it seem those who argue for fairer taxes think the revenue might be used to provide them with the same yachts, holidays in St Tropez and Range Rover Velars as the very comfortably off enjoy. When in fact, what we typically think is that those who have benefited from getting rich in the UK should pay a reasonable amount towards keeping the UK working. You know, things like making sure hospitals don’t have 8-hour ambulance queues outside them, or schools whose roofs aren’t falling in. Maybe even a modern rail line that extends more than 100 miles from the capital.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

IHT is definitely one of the required tools albeit with some fine tuning to raise thresholds and remove avoidance loopholes.

The term "wealth" is a objective fact whereas "politics of envy" is a lazy trope used to deflect from grown up discussions on fairer levels of societal contribution

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

One of what, though? Are you mindlessly sticking to the lazy smear that the have-nots ‘want’ yachts, fancy holidays and Range Rovers and that this is what the business of raising taxes is about?

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

There is the 7 year rule. You can dispose everything, except the house you live in.

If you pass that on, then you need to pay rent to your off springs/beneficiaries.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

I know no such thing - all you’ve done is throw in another lazy trope. Nobody’s talking about rinsing rich people so they’re not rich any more. And VAT on school fees is the very least they should be doing. Without clear and specific evidence of charitable purpose, private schools should be losing their charity registrations as well. No organisation charging customers £30 a year for its services is a charity unless it can explicitly prove otherwise. And that proof needs to be much more convincing than a small handful of bursaries for carefully-screened individuals.

Built-in tax dodges for those with the least reason to be dodging tax in the first place have got to stop.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Those ordinary folk in line to inherit the best part of a million pounds. Wait there while I get the world’s smallest violin.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

If you're worried about IHT, just give the money away, as long as you survive 7 years , job done. It isn't a hard tax to get round so I don't know why the toffs are moaning.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

They’re moaning that 7 years ago they didn’t anticipate the housing bubble to keep going.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

There has been/will be a lot whinging from the small number of people affected by this but let's face it, they have had a free ride here for so long. The tax free train is coming to a stop on this one.

In the "free market" paradise many of these people adhere to, there is no subsidy if you choose to not use the default, free option. In fact, the funny thing about this is that these are the very same people have meekly accepted the large increases of private school fees in the past:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-a7023056.html

I did not hear them whinging then ...

Please can we have more Chris's on this forum :D

Please define "ordinary" for the basis of this discussion

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Waits for default answers

However, trying to keep the discussion fact-based, the latest figures for U.K. Median disposable* income is £32,300 - not sure many of those "ordinary" people will have a million pound Estate that wil be hit by IHT…

https://www.cableforum.uk/board/atta...6&d=1695891451

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulat...g2022#glossary


* Disposable income is the amount of money that households have available for spending and saving after direct taxes, such as Income Tax, National Insurance and Council Tax, have been accounted for. It includes earnings from employment, private pensions and investments as well as cash benefits provided by the state.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

̶H̶a̶r̶d̶-̶w̶o̶r̶k̶i̶n̶g̶ Hard-inheriting families? ;)

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

If we're defining anyone with a household income over £60,000 as "RICH"............

I've got a bridge to sell you.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

a) it's not income, it's disposable income
b) the context of "richest" is the fifth quintile, which stretchs from £66k disposable income to whatever Gopi Hinduja has...

For instance, I’m one of the tallest in our family, but I’m not tall (imho); I’m 5’11", and my son is 6’4" - he’s tall.

Context is all…

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

You also need to extend/clarify the definition of income to include increases in wealth. You can have people who have modest incomes, as most people define the term but have significant increases in personal wealth from their various asset classes e.g. property, etc. An extreme example of this is a person who owns, outright, a number of rented properties worth millions each appreciating (on average) over time yet has a low tax obligation via tax avoidance vehicles like property investment companies.

The bottom line is that our tax regime has been designed specifically for the benefit of those who have the means to contribute at the levels needed yet are of the strong opinion that they should not do. It is a conversation that needs to be had yet so many are scared to have it.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Which says a fair bit more about your extreme libertarian dog-eat-dog mentality than you probably intended.

The logic of your position is that all of us only pay for what we use, or perhaps if we at least accept the necessity of taxes we should go looking for discounts where we can show there are services we don’t use. My neighbours where I grew up never had children at all and thus gave the state a free ride. Should they have had VAT back on something else by way of compensation?

VAT exemption (which is what Labour is now proposing to remove, it seemingly being legally more straightforward than removal of charitable status) is typically granted on products and services that are essentials and most definitely not luxuries. As a universal eduction is available in this country a private education is a luxury service and there is no justification not to tax it.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Again, more rubbish. We sent both of our children to private schools for most of their primary & secondary education.

If I had that time again, I am unsure if I would do the same again but that is more about how that sector is now more about selling the golden path through our society to those who will pay the most. Their investment and obligation to society as a whole is much diminished today.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

what's the different between joint tenants and common tenants in a property. The financial implications of it.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Certainly an interesting time for Sunak. Underpinning it all is that taxes are at all an all-time record of 37% of income and are likely to stay high. Hunt has been making job cut pledges hemust know are unrealistic in order to get an easy ride at Conference. The UK civil service had to expand significantly as a result of Brexit, one reason why many civil servants told me they were voting for it!

It will be interesting to see how Starmer reacts to policy u-turns like HS2. Will he create some space between the two parties by reversing the decision or will he follow Sunak's lead. It will be trickier for him with key lord mayors like Andy Burnham, tipped as a future Labour leader, looking over his shoulder.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

h/t @M_H_Taylor

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Akshata Murthy for deputy PM? She makes more than Rishi --daddy's money.

I said it before Carrie Numnuts was a good deputy PM and Dylan should have replaced Larry the cat long time ago.

This is the level of the British government at the moment.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Tbh I'm not against the smoking plan but it does seem very difficult to enforce, unless we're all going to have id cards. Retailers will love it...
They all smoke something different these days anyway.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

The funny part about the Smoking plan is that it will not win them any votes and may lose them some. The young, the people he is impacting, will not be voting Tory. A recent YouGov poll put 1% of 18-24 year olds intending to vote Tory at next GE. The older generations who are more likely to smoke anyway would be neutral at best.

The funny part is that the Tories have always claimed to be the party of the "small state" and against the "Nanny State", etc. and here we are :D

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

They just need to scan the chip that was planted in your arm a couple of years ago. It's all carefully thought out.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

For once I agree.

How will you tell a 21 year old from 22, or 34 from 35.
What stops the 22 year old buying for his 21 year old mate ?

It may sound a good plan, but doesnt seem very practical to implement.
Have they not learned from banning other drugs, it just leads to a thriving black market.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

There’s an existing ‘Challenge 25’ campaign for alcohol sales so for the time being anyone who looks like they’re under 25 should be used to being asked for proof of ID when buying products restricted to 18+ only (booze, fags, fireworks).

Once we get beyond that - which will be in the middle of the next decade if they implement this next year with the expectation that it comes into force in 2027 - then the logical progression would be to legally require a photo ID check for every purchase.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

No challange system can stop the older friend, or the black market that will inevitably spring up.

Not everyone has photo ids, they are not compulsory (yet) and these days less young people can afford to learn to drive, or have need of a passport.

Challange 25 is a load of nonsense anyway, why is someone who turned 18 over 6 years previously still having to prove they are over 18, if they look 18+ that should be good enough, not 30%+ of their lifetime later. It particularly pissed me off in the summer 3 years ago (while out for a meal & drink) when my oldest daughter got asked - she was actually 28 by then ... seriously, twenty frigging eight, she quite clearly did not look under 18. She did not have any ID on her. After we finished I made it [very] clear to the manager that it was not acceptable, and we would never go back (and we never have).

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

In the future you’ll have someone who’s 60, being ID checked, when they’re secretly buying cigarettes for someone who’s 59.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

They don't need to do it secretly. 59 year olds will still be allowed to smoke. They just need a responsible adult to do the buying.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Yeah, you're going to have to simply have mandatory ID checks every time you buy them. It seems a bit messy to me but I am guessing the expectation is that the business dies out entirely long before you get to the situation when a 66-year-old is asking their 67-year-old brother to buy them a pack.

---------- Post added at 10:23 ---------- Previous post was at 10:16 ----------

Well, it's because they don't want older-looking 17-year-olds buying alcohol. Judging how old somebody looks is obviously difficult so the 25-year-old rule for checking is the catch-all way of ensuring that.

They're mandated to do this by law with serious consequences if they get caught not doing it as it's usually a condition of their licence to apply it. They're not trying to be difficult but would rather lose your business than their license. If it's overzealous then that's on the Government rather than the business.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Are we living in the same country?

Golden Virginia green 50g:

Tesco/Waitrose/Sainsbury's etc £33.65 Free delivery, ID checked.

Bournemouth/Poole/Brighton/Southampton £16.00 (Luxemburg tax paid, with Lux sticky tape) no ID check, several places in each town

Surrey/Hampshire £11.00 (Italian/Greek tax paid, with tax tape on it) online

Online delivery £1-£2 for 10 packets of the above.

No ID checked, royal mail or Evri delivery.

Don't ask for links.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

I can get Golden Virginia/Amber Leaf with tax tape at £6.00 each for 50 gms.
Those being charged £16 or £11 are being ripped off. Neither are genuine products.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Respect. But these are the prices in the south.

Why not genuine? See tax tape

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

11.30 Euros in Luxemburg, £6 in Wales?

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Has tax tape as well, means nothing to counterfeiters.

BTW your pic shows it's non genuine as all EU packs are black.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

I am an idiot on two counts: fake tobacco and a chain smoker. I did quit for 20 years... One day, I said, one fag, what harm will do... the bloody idiot.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

I agree. Why do governments have to go around banning things? Have they not learned anything from the fiasco of Prohibition in the US? Or the ineffectiveness of our drugs laws?

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Given the next government has not been elected yet you must have the wisdom of Nostradamus.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

tbf, the last three have been shittier than their predecessors, so he’s assuming the Tories will win, and is probably basing it on that…;)

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Apparently Farage was skulking around the Tory Conference. He wants a safe seat so he can make a bid for the UKIP, sorry, Tory Party Leadership when they lose the next GE.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Well, at the Reform Party Conference today, he apparently stated he wouldn’t be doing that (under the current leadership)…

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-67041389

Also

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Which means we reach one logical conclusion.

Britain is shit.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Who is not shit?

Nige? Who has never delivered anything, except division, lies, and a resultant poorer nation.

Do tell.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

We could beg to be the 51st US state but they won't take us, or even offer us an 'oven ready' trade deal. You were part of that daft decision, own it, and stop just blaming politicians for us being 'shit'.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

I see Paul's mod instruction - which I'm not ignoring and I've removed your first sentence solely for that reason to move on to take up your second point.

Business needs political leadership (either colour) to deliver on investment, on infrastructure, on developing skills within the workforce that the private sector simply won't do. Business can only lead a race to the bottom left to its own devices.

The outsourcing of public services demonstrates that.

The next Government needs to ignore the balancing the books language of austerity and drive medium and longer term growth with spending decisions now.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Taking the boat to Sweden. Greta would approve.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Or evading like B. Ecclestone who has been found guilty of it yet again, £400 million quids worth and not a day in prison time served despite his previous, compare that with the homeless shoplifter who is in prison for 22 weeks for nicking £2500 worth of goods, roughly a week for every 100 quid stolen, good job they didn't treat Bernie the same or he'd be in jail for the next 4 million years

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

This is painfully true.......the shoplifter cannot afford a KC....it is a state crime,

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

He can't afford a KFC, least he'll have a roof over his head now, I guess and the opportunity to turn things round if he wishes

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

He probably owed more than that. That result is quite evidently the result of a plea bargain, admit to this, avoid an expensive and lengthy trial and we’ll let you walk and not die in prison.

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

About the size of it and zero deterrent to stop others trying it in future

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi
 

Could result in another by-election. Let's see.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-67122669

Re: The Chronicles of Rishi