Re: Israel, Hamas, Hezbollah, Iran … War
 

Re: Israel, Hamas, Hezbollah, Iran … War
 

There’s no evidence that Israel wouldn’t have continued its borderline genocidal campaign even if Hamas had released the hostages. The aim is to “eliminate Hamas”; with such a broad definition as to include the destruction of schools, mosques, churches, universities, hospitals, energy infrastructure and turning off the water supply.

It’s a simplistic retort to absolve Israel from blame - nothing more and nothing less.

Even if Israel had stated that as their position - why would anyone trust them not to move the goalposts? Just as we went from “we don’t bomb hospitals” to “we do bomb hospitals”, and “we don’t summarily execute medical workers” to “well, now that there’s a video, maybe we made mistakes”.

Re: Israel, Hamas, Hezbollah, Iran … War
 

The irony. The 'phrase From the river to the sea' does indeed say it all. From the Likud original party charter:

https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...he-likud-party

This gives you some context as to what motivates the current Israeli administrations mindset.

Re: Israel, Hamas, Hezbollah, Iran … War
 

It's still on Hamas for their October 2023 atrocity. And how else would Israel eliminate Hamas (a necessity imo) other than by military action.

Furthermore, nobody has been able to verify the civilian deaths. Make no mistake, it is sad that civilians (who voted for Hamas on an anti-Israel ticket) have died. But how, other than military action, can Hamas be removed/neutralised.


---------- Post added at 12:57 ---------- Previous post was at 12:54 ----------

The existing Israeli government are bad eggs; I think we all agree on that. But even they had to deal with the October 2023 Hamas atrocity.

'From the river to the sea' is the expression used on London's streets promoting the extinction of Israel.

Re: Israel, Hamas, Hezbollah, Iran … War
 

We did the 2006 Palestinian election during your sabbatical it didn’t have any credibility then and it doesn’t now.

Re: Israel, Hamas, Hezbollah, Iran … War
 

Re: Israel, Hamas, Hezbollah, Iran … War
 

Sounds exactly like Russia is doing in Ukraine but I don't hear about you or any others complainig about that.

Re: Israel, Hamas, Hezbollah, Iran … War
 

Re: Israel, Hamas, Hezbollah, Iran … War
 

Apart from being an utterly deranged response - you clearly think these things are bad except for when it’s happening to Palestinians - Ian sits just outside the top 10 posters in the Ukraine thread. One of their most steadfast supporters on the forum, generally posting to condemn Russia, Trump, or Europe in the context of not doing enough for the Ukrainian cause.

Re: Israel, Hamas, Hezbollah, Iran … War
 

I probably wouldn't have let my army get away with killing our own hostages that we claim we are doing this for, nor would I have allowed shooting of people clearly surrendering to brushed over either, nor would I have allowed aid workers to be murdered or ignored the backlash from the world when it was non Palestinian aid workers being murdered and if I was waging a righteous operation I wouldn't be targetting journalists and I'd allow foreign journalists in to so my claims that the army is most virtuous could be verified, I'd also make my rules of engagement considerably different so dozens of civilians aren't killed to get one terrorist and what I most certainly wouldn't have done in the very first place is prop hamas up so I didn't have to deal with a Palestinian authority bent on nationhood and I'd have dropped the failed Dahyia doctrine that just makes hatred for my nation worse.

The vast, vast majority killed have been women and children are you really trying to claim they're terrorists? Oh and hamas seized power, they weren't elected as such and iirc a majority of people there weren't old enough to vote in 2006 but yeah blame them

I think pretty much everyone spoke in support of Ukraine and complained about Russia, we also complained about Hamas on October 7th

And here ends my participation, if the bar for a nations behaviour is set by a rogue state like Russia its not a conversation worth having, nor is participating in the Israeli government's favourite get out of jail free card which is by claiming if their army and government are held to different standards to others it's in someway antisemitic, unless you want crushing sanctions to be brought on Israel and for them to be treated like an international pariah of course, then you have my interest.

Re: Israel, Hamas, Hezbollah, Iran … War
 

Are you quite sure about that?

Daily Telegraph paywall-dodging link:

https://archive.ph/Twot0

Re: Israel, Hamas, Hezbollah, Iran … War
 

I like the way the starting point for this propaganda piece is to exclude some children altogether then justify the execution of other children because they are theoretically old enough to fight. Truly magnificent.

The absence of “independent” figures being used to justify silencing reporting on the figures is a close second.

Re: Israel, Hamas, Hezbollah, Iran … War
 

Pretty sure, was on the BBC late last year or can't they be trusted anymore, iirc the figures were 44% children and 26% women and again iirc it was verified by the UN

Re: Israel, Hamas, Hezbollah, Iran … War
 

How is it wrong ?

Whatever peoples views are of what is happening now, the fact is this was all triggered by the attack, by Hamas, on 7th Oct 2023.

I have seen no evidence that anything like the events of now would have happened were it not for what took place on that day.

Re: Israel, Hamas, Hezbollah, Iran … War
 

There’s a difference between that being the sequence of events (of which there were decades of actions on both sides before that) and denying that the IDF have agency to decide not to slaughter paramedics, or generally a free pass to ignore the established norms of warfare by bombing hospitals.

7th October is an entirely arbitrary starting date.