Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

It's not that complicated. The government has been paying windfarms to shut down at high times to not overload the grid.

If you have cheaper electricity people will use more electricity. If you tell me I have super cheap electricity, I will go out and buy an electric car thus I use more electricity.

More electricity used in the local area means less needs to be transported down to the south.

It is unfortunately for the south to have high prices but the government will save money not paying the windfarms to shut down.

Industry moves to Scotland and then they get cocky again and start an independence vote.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Its not that simple either.

Correct.

As a novelty, yes people try hard to use more, but that soon wears off.
Of course, using twice as much at half the price saves you nothing at all.

Where does it promise "super cheap" ? It "may" be cheaper, some of the time.
Just remember wind power is intermittant, and solar doesnt work at all when its dark.

For example, on Apr 16 wind generation was almost 18GW
Two days later the wind died, and it barely made 2GW, on Apr 8 it dropped below 1GW.

Everyone will be buying electric cars eventually, whatever the electricity price is, enjoy "Net-Zero".

Transport is a two way thing.
When the wind isnt blowing, you need electricty from somewhere else.

Probably the real reason they like the idea.
They dont care about the price we pay, only that they stop paying.

While Scotland is often quoted, Wind Farms are all over the UK.
Atm, Scotland has about 3 times the wind generation capacity of England.
England of course has far more Solar generation, and is increasing its Wind generation.
Scotland on the otherhand is unlikely to ever have much Solar generation.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Yes of course that is the real reason. They've created this stupid green energy regime, everyone has expensive electric bills and they aren't even using the energy properly making their stupidity obvious.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

It's the increase in the cost of gas post the invasion of Ukraine that has driven up bills.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Our use of gas is inversely proportional to the amount of green energy we can leverage. There are days we can turn the gas off.

---------- Post added at 09:01 ---------- Previous post was at 08:59 ----------

If we still had coal we could turn the gas off

If we had more nuclear, we could turn the gas off

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

It’s a strategic decision in the late 1980s to make us reliant on gas for electricity generation that’s driven up bills.

We led the world in nuclear power but by the beginning of the 1990s we were allowing crusties, fruit loops and other assorted eco-loons to set the terms of the debate and make it impossible to plan to build new power stations.

We knew gas was a fossil fuel in the 1980s. We knew it was a finite resource. As a transitory measure to get us off coal, which is also a finite fossil fuel but also incredibly dirty, gas was fine. But as a substitute for clean nuclear energy at which we were a world leader, it was a poor choice.

In order to get back on track we have been forced to pay top dollar to the French state generator, EDF, France not having made the same stupid decisions we did and now being a world leader in nuclear energy. And meanwhile, we have continued to dither over the one area of nuclear tech we do still lead - small reactors, which are installed in every RN submarine, and which can be scaled to provide a large number of small nuclear power stations that can be built quickly and cheaply, certainly in comparison to the behemoth being constructed at Hinckley Point at a cost of £47 billion (and still not ready after 8 years … it probably won’t contribute to the Grid for another 5).

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Strange, though, that in June 2022 my gas rates were

Unit rate 3.182p per kWh
Standing charge 13.17p per day

And this month, they were

Unit Rate 5.37p/kWh
Standing Charge 28.26p/day

Whilst the wholesale price was/is

https://www.cableforum.uk/board/atta...4&d=1745483251

https://www.cliffordtalbot.co.uk/energy-prices/

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

All the sunshine contributing to a cheap 8am - 4pm tomorrow.
Some negative prices for 4.5 hours as of 10:30am - a pity we'll not doing Sunday dinner this week, we would have been paid to cook it.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

First time this has happened to me on the Intelligent Go tariff. The email goes on to explain they will manage it as an account credit in the next 2 weeks. Presumably they have a trigger level for overnight electricity usage on Tuesday night that cancels the rebate.

I charged the car up from 52% to 80% last night even though I wasn’t expecting to need it today, so it’s mildly annoying they didn’t give any more notice than this. Even so, I’ve set the car to take a charge up to 100% tonight. Offspring is on study leave now so I’m not even doing the school run. A full charge will probably last me until the end of next week.

https://www.cableforum.uk/board/atta...1&d=1745878196

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

The Octoprice site still hasn't been updated for Tracker tariffs, not that I need it anymore with being on a Fixed but my muscle memory automatically makes me click on the speed dial daily.

I would have only saved 35 pence staying on the December 2024 Tracker compared to Fixed rate V4 for Electricity, not sure why I didn't stay on the Gas Tracker though as it should easily be cheaper, maybe it was FOMO as the fixed was a limited edition and I was rushing to see if I could signup.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Octoprice hasnt been updated for ages, and sometimes crashes on me as well, I stopped bothering with.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

https://youtu.be/nKJLVaJa9Ko

Edit: Hyperlink removed.
If you're posting links then give some details as to what it is.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Is it worth getting a smart meter

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

In the end, you wont have a choice.
Its generally worth it if you pick the right tariffs for it.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

I was reading about the number of meters that stop working after awhile and some do not work with gas meters, it is so confusing

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

It is confusing and it is faff. Depends how much faff you want. If you can faff around with load shifting you can save money though.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

You don't need to faff around load shifting I never did when on the Tracker tariff.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

I've been on the octopus Tracker for a few years and never faffed yet.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

You can read about any device failing. Meters are no different, so yes, some can fail, so can "non smart" meters.

No "faffing" here, and still saving. Load shifting is over rated and generally just not worth the effort, or even possible - for example no one in my family is going to wait 3 hours for dinner just to save a few pence.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

I should have left my Gas on Tracker as it is seems to be atleast 1p/kWh cheaper most of the time compared to my Fixed rate.

I chat to someone on HotUKDeals and their April 2024 Tracker ended in May 2025 and when they renewed it they got put on the December 2024 Tracker instead of the current April 2025 V2, has this happened to anyone else?

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

There has been a radio ad for British Gas here recently. It says we CAN save money by changing to one of their Fixed Rate tariffs.

I checked online, and their Fixed Rate tariffs are all a lot more expensive compared with their Standard Rate one.

So does the CAN refer to future costs?

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Are you sure about that ?

I just checked and got this ;

Standard Gas / Electric = 6.852p / 26.369p

Fixed Tariff v58 Gas / Electric = 6.126p / 23.654p [to September 2026].

The Longer Fix v32 Gas / Electric = 6.169p / 24.395p [to May 2027].

Neither is particularly cheap, but both are cheaper than the standard rate.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Can we refuse a smart meter,

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

If your meters are EOL then likely not and if you have an RTS meter then that must be replaced as they will stop working on June 30th 2025 so if you have had a letter you must get it swapped out.

There really is no reason to not eventually get a smart meter.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Eventually you'll have no choice, but atm, you can still choose not to have one.

The hype around RTS meters is a little misleading.
They will not stop working, they will stop switching between their day/night registers, and log all your units on the same one (probably daytime).

So you must at the very least make sure you move to a single rate tariff, which charges day and night at the same rate.

Additionally, some of these meters actually controlled heating/hot water circuits, so they were only powered up on the night rate.
In those cases you will need to (must) get your meter changed, otherwise you'll be stuck with them either always on or more likely, always off.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

34000 people are getting money back.and compensation, it's something to do with paying multiple standing charges and the rates being to high, you don't need to fo anything apparently, just wait for the cheque

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

It was to do with having "multiple meter points" in a property, something the vast majority of people do not have.
They were getting multiple standing charges (allowed) but this took many of them over the price cap (not allowed).

Octopus had the largest number of affected accounts, but it also affected Utility Warehouse, Ovo Energy, So Energy, Outfox The Market, Ecotricity, E.On Next, Tru Energy, Rebel Energy and EDF Energy. As best I can tell, all should already have got their payments by now.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Biggest negativie period I've seen tomorrow

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Yep, even the peak prices are lower than SVT.

https://www.cableforum.uk/board/atta...chmentid=31409

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

I will make full use of it, i have a car to charge, there is washing and drying and finally a drive and patio to power wash.

It is nice to know they are paying me to use all that electricity :)

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Sadly we are out for lunch tomorrow, so wont be paid to cook at home this time.

---------- Post added at 00:16 ---------- Previous post was at 00:14 ----------

Atm the predictor is showing some negative for Monday as well, although not as much as Sunday.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Last weekend (May 17th) solar generation hit 39.5% of total generation (wind was 23.1%).

This weekend (May 25th) their combined total hit 76% (solar 30%).
On top of that Nuclear was almost 13.5% while Gas generated just over 5%, hence the cheap/negative rates.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Well I took the plunge and got 'smart meters'. Within 2 days the 'In Home Display' has now failed and no longer works. :rolleyes:

The first night it said our gas has been disconnected (it hasn't). Day 2, the meter can not be found. Great start.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Hopefully you haven't got issues with your meters and it is just your IHD which to be honest doesn't really do much, mines in the drawer unused. If you're with Octopus I recommend getting their Home Mini which is free, this allows you to see live readings for Electricity and half hour readings for Gas via the Octopus app and I have found it very useful.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

My latest bill from Scottish Power says that I could save around £150 p.a. if I switched to their Charity Fixed Tariff. But that could be a lower amount than the upcoming drop in the Cap.

Meanwhile, a flurry of Indian callers have been trying to get me to swap to a smart meter.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Does the Charity Fixed Tariff have exit fees? If it does I would hold out for a better deal later on.

Your mistake is answering the phone to unknown numbers.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Not sure if I have issues with the actual meters as yet. No doubt when the next bill is due I'll find out.

Saying that, obviously when I had the display thing it was a bit of a novelty to see how much energy things took I was taken aback a bit. I'm with EDF and as it stands I'm over £470 in credit with them.

I tend to do what I want without worry if I need to put the heating on or the oven etc (I bake a lot) but with that meter thing I can see how it can help people to reduce their bills and for that 1 day it was working it did have a negative impact on me. Basically I don't want to know how much energy I'm using up all I want to do is pay the bill whatever it is and have the freedom of not caring about such things.

I'll see if the bills are the same but I won't be chasing up to sort out the home display thing out. It can go in the bin (or drawer) for all I care.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Take photos of both meter readings regularly and check once a month to see if they have pulled the correct meter readings from the meters or it could become a problem if not noticed.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Thanks, sound advice and will now being doing that. :tu:

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

I never answer a number i don't know. I check it out first on https://who-called.co.uk/. A little bit of common sense saves me all the hassle

If they don't send there number then i don't even need to check it out as i never answer them ether

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

On my Google Pixel 9 XL it even tells me if they suspect the incoming call is spam and that helps me alot.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

There is always the opt out of marketing or giving them a duff phone number options. Much more effective.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Octopus always pull my meter reading on the first of each month and they show up in the app so I always take my photos then and compare and it so far has always been correct.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Failed how ?
They are prone to disconnecting unless very close to the meter.
Like many on Octopus, I ditched mine and use the home mini instead.

There are sites/apps you can register with to view your meter data from the DCC, 'Bright' for example.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Mine never worked.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Just checked my online account. It states that both meters are online and ''Everything is Good". But when I checked the usage it only shows the 2 days that the display worked.

I called them up to find out more, basically the meters are not sending anything out and the home display can not connect to them either. They said they'll look into it. Not that smart are they, lol.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

O dear anyone here face this problem :erm:


Ofgem is proposing new rules for energy suppliers to manage the phase-out of Radio Teleswitch Service (RTS) meters.
530,000 energy customers who do NOT have a smart meter have been issued a warning from the watchdog as they risk being cut off. Ofgem is proposing new rules for energy suppliers to manage the phase-out of Radio Teleswitch Service (RTS) meters.

Around 530,000 customers rely on these meters, which offer cheaper electricity rates at certain times of day - but they will stop working from the end of June this year. It is important that RTS customers book their installation as soon as they are contacted by their supplier. All customers should have been contacted by their supplier by the end of 2024.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

The meters dont offer cheaper rates, they just record the usage across two counters (registers) - switching between them at different times of the day.

Your supplier can either charge different rates for the two registers, or the same rate.
That switch between registers is what will stop, the meters will carry on working, just logging all usage on one register.
So for most people, all they need to do is charge the same rate for both, and it'll work fine, as one will always have 0 usage.
Of course, if they still want dual rate tarrifs, they will need to get a new meter, but thats a choice, not a requirement.

However, there is an actual issue with a minority of these meters, in that some of them actually control the power to peoples heating and/or hot water, only powering them up on the 2nd (usually cheaper) rate. Those meters (and households) will have an issue, since when they stop switching, your heating/water will no longer power up (or be always powered up, but thats less likely). They are the ones that actually do need to be swapped, and should be prioritised.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Some negative prices tomorrow afternoon, wasnt expecting that.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

I definitely screwed myself over going onto this Fixed Rate because comparing using Octopus Compare my Electricity is £2.78 more expensive for a month's usage on the Fixed Rate compared to the December 2024 Tracker.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

The fixed electric on Octopus has never been great, OutFox seem to do the best fixed deals.

In the spring/summer agile generally works out better (for me) since there is plenty of solar and wind power generation about, and the overall requirement for the country is generally lower, due to it being warmer. Thus except for the peak hours (4-7pm) prices are pretty good (and sometimes negative).

In fact, for me Agile has been good since I switched back at the end of Feb, and great in May. This will almost certainly continue to be the case until the end of summer, at which point I'll look at moving off it. Last year taught me its not a great tariff in the winter months.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Just got a quote from Outfox to compare and the unit rates are slightly better, standing charge maybe slightly better with Octopus but Outfox has £100 each fuel exit fee.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Thats the 2 year fixed (Jun v1.0).

They still offer the 12 & 18 month options which are more or less the same price, but with £50 (12M) or £75 (18M) exit fees.

They also do a 12M electric only which is pretty good @ 19.439p per kWh, and £50 exit fee, as its 12M.

I also notice they are changing their name to Outfox Energy in about 10 days.

If Octopus dont come up with some better fixed deals towards the end of summer, and get fussy about moving back to "Go", I'll be looking at Outfox as an option.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Do outfox have a tariff like Agile that you seem to be doing well on, atleast in the summer months?

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Nope, but Octopus do. :D

[Tomato do as well, but dont go near them ...].


Not everyone will do well on Agile, I do well because my usage is pretty steady across the whole day.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Possibly not the correct board, but there's been talk about EV charging here, so was wondering if there're any recommendations for charging points? So far all we've decided is we want a weathered charger.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Another cheap Sunday, negative prices from 7.30am - 3.00pm

Plus Octopus are running one of their "Free Electricity" hours from 2pm - 3pm.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

"Energy suppliers must pay £40 to households that experience delays exceeding six weeks when awaiting smart meter installation appointments.

The same payment applies when malfunctioning smart meters remain unresolved for more than three months.

This includes devices operating in "dumb" mode, where connectivity issues prevent automatic meter reading transmission."

https://www.gbnews.com/money/energy-...ensation-ofgem

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

TBH I am still holding off due to concerns they get my bills wrong. To many horror stories and my budget is to tight to deal with that kinda crap

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Thats perfectly possible (and probably more likely) with non smart meters, as they rely on humans reading them.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Just had my 'new' smart meter repaired. Only took them 75 days (10 weeks and 5 days) to sort out.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

yeah but I am more intelligent than 99% of the population hahaha

Plus I also realise that once roll out is complete a tiered billing system will be in place and we all will lose out in the end

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Just had my analogue old school meter gas meter, replaced with another analogue old school refurbished gas meter. Took about 20 mins. God knows why but it makes sense to someone. As long as it isn't one of those smart flaky ones. I love taking readings ;).

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Octopus managed to screw up my readings when I moved to them last year, even after I gave them the correct ones.

They mixed them up, and tried to blame OVO, who I moved from (this was before I had a smart meter).

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

I like a human reading my meter, it keeps the bloke in a job.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

I've got smart meters and I still read my meters(take a photo) on the 1st of each month then compare to their automated readings and so far all are spot on.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Since getting my new IHD/CAD I monitor it myself via MQTT and save the data to one of my servers, including the current power usage.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

After multiple years using what is currently a dumb smart meter (series 1), EDF has now organised for the installation of a newer version smart meter!
No more having to submit monthly readings, includind sending photos to confirm usage.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Outfox are again offering some good fixed deals : Electric at 19.36p, Gas at 5.15p.

I'm probably going to sign up, Autumn and Winter are on their way, and prices are not going to get a lot cheaper, esp in the next 24 months.
Agile does not often average out to < 19.36p on a day, so the days it does will be outweighed by the days it does not, esp as summer fades away.

Also, if Outfox offer a better deal, I have learned you can just switch to it in your account (free), which seems good (your 12/18/24 months starts again of course).

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

I'm with Outfox, they are very nice people and more importantly cheap. Their CS reply promptly.

It's true that if they offer a better fixed price tariff they allow you to switch to it from your current fix with no exit fee.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

my reluctance to move to smart might be ending Octopus are saying my meter has been flagged. Will avoid it as long as possible

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

For what reason ?

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Does that just mean they want to send a meter reader round? Don't think I've seen one for a decade, and I don't have smart meters. I'm a very honest person though ;)

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Energy suppliers are legally required to read your meter at least once every two years. I've not had one here since before covid, and we don't have smart meters.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

because I do not trust it wont mess with my bills I have read to many horror stories where it goes wrong customers are over charged and it takes ages to deal with my anxiety has had enough to deal with this year hahaha

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

You will only ever really read "horror stories" just like you will for "standard" meters.

Working meters (i.e. the vast vast majority) are not news.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

yeah I know but as someone suffers with clinical anxiety all these people who are few are still ones it has gone wrong with and no matter how unlikely it is to happen to me it still might

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Scottish Power have just informed me that I could save money by signing up to their new Fixed Tariff.

Standard Tariff = £1898.49 pa.
Fixed Tariff = £1902.02 pa.

"£50 exit fee per fuel if you change supplier"

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Not anymore it seems, apparently as of 1st September, they will charge you the exit fee if you are less than 50% of the way into your existing deal.

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com...september-2025

I suspect a lot of people have been switching regularly, and they have decided to clamp down.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Yes, and they were being more generous before as the smart tariffs were considered beta and they didn't want people to get trapped onto something that may have been unreliable.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Scottish Power seem to tie their fixed tariffs into Cancer Research UK, so a big no from me.
If I want to give to charity, I'll do it on my terms, not be forced into it as part of my energy bill.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

The price cap is going up by 2% from October, to £1755.

---------- Post added at 00:20 ---------- Previous post was at 00:19 ----------

Apparently when this was announced this morning so many people hit the Outfox site it went down for a while.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

I moved from Octopus fixed rate to Fuse fixed rate last night (Octopus expires October 6th) - saving £250 a year over current tariff, and about £120 a year over latest best Octopus rate.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Octopriceuk has finally updated for the latest trackers if anyone likes to still use that.

Unfortunately I made the mistake of fixing my rate with Octopus with an exit fee so I'm stuck with this until April 2026 and would have been better staying on both trackers or possibly switching to Outfox.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Now they've grabbed enough customers , and are the biggest provider, Octopus aren't that competitive any longer. Classic business plan.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

They maybe if someone is on a Tracker Tariff but I've not done the maths but I will compare against other providers in April 2026.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

More than competitive for me. I am on Octopus Agile and nothing comes close to it for my personal needs. In fact free electric for me today from 11:00 till 16:00. YMMV based on usage.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

On days like today, Agile is a clear winner.
However, such days are not that common, esp as summer fades away.
Having spent almost a year on it, the average price overall (for me) works out at 20.7p per kWh.

Thats better that any fixed deal Octopus offer, and better than almost all other fixed deals, however OFE had some that were 1p cheaper (19.7p), and they also had Gas that was cheaper than anyone else (at 5.15p). Octopus Tracker beats that (< 5p) in the spring/summer, but gets more expensive as winter moves in.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Now the bad news!
Since having the meter fitted no indication (at all) of current electric usage!
Having made contact with EDF have to wait for a tech to do a home visit to sort out?

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

It's amazing (to me) how much 'smart' technology is anything but.

I remember when smart meant wearing a tie . . . and both socks were a match

:D

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

No indication where ?

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Nothing on the local display unit even when positioned adjacent to the actual smart meter!
Had to submit model ref/serial No to enable display/smart meter to be paired up to my account.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

Can't help but feel it was better last year. But since it is just weather dependant I guess you can't complain.

Re: Smart Meters and Tariffs
 

I had my first human data collector checking my smart meter readings in August according to my billing, it sure gives to some head scratching billing, like charge me £7.83 for Electricity in the middle of the month then again a week later for the exact same amount only to then credit it back on the same day, luckily the overall bill for the month appears normal.