Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Correct..

Re: Further Asian gang jailed for child abuse.
 

Same particular problem that Catholic Priests have/had with their attitudes to young boys?

Re: Further Asian gang jailed for child abuse.
 

No, I think he meant beliefs of superiority towards women.

---------- Post added at 16:46 ---------- Previous post was at 16:42 ----------

Absolutely, but since the measures put in place after the Stephen Lawrence enquiry, the police are reluctant to do anything that could be construed as racism. The same goes for the staff of local authorities, but that's more to do with ultra PC management.

Thankfully, these issues have now been recognised and measures are to be put in place to prevent a repetition (unless it was just lip service for the cameras).

Re: Further Asian gang jailed for child abuse.
 

The police should enforce, not ignore the law. The issue was nothing whatsoever to do with racism.

I thought everyone was supposed to be equal under the law? The 'establishment elite' appears to have done much in recent years to erode that principle. Unless this is corrected soon, this will end up with a backlash by the majority who believe that the law is not protecting them.

Re: Further Asian gang jailed for child abuse.
 

Do hear that flying over your head? It was my point.

Re: Further Asian gang jailed for child abuse.
 

Totally agree. Racial equality should not mean that Pakistanis get a free pass to break the law, as has clearly been the case due to public employees being too afraid to challenge and follow up complaints about people of colour.

Re: Further Asian gang jailed for child abuse.
 

Which is exactly what happens when you legislate to give legal rights only to minorities.

The law should give rights of fair treatment to the whole population. That would help to remove the confusion.

Re: Further Asian gang jailed for child abuse.
 

I understood that the vast majority were British.

Re: Further Asian gang jailed for child abuse.
 

Most people here are British, but it goes deeper than that:

White or White British
Black or Black British:
Asian or Asian British: Indian
Asian or Asian British: Pakistani
Asian or Asian British: Bangladeshi
Asian or Asian British: Chinese
Asian or Asian British: Other Asian

Re: Further Asian gang jailed for child abuse.
 

Or Yorkshire/Welsh and sunburnt ;)

Re: Further Asian gang jailed for child abuse.
 

Why did an image of Charlie Williams suddenly pop into my head? ;)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7WucumXbAsk

He was brilliant :D

Re: Further Asian gang jailed for child abuse.
 

And there are all the variations on Black and Mixed.

Still all human beings.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

But are there any Celtic British (natives) left.


Do not like it when the black Americans call their selves African Americans (just call your selves American).

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Me, my father/ grandfather were Scottish, great grandfather was Irish.

I’m 1st generation English. I don’t consider myself Scottish or Irish and have no affinity to either.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

All this emphasis on background, ethnic origin and colour just creases me up! For heaven's sake, we are all people, so what difference does it make? The more we play it up, the more the racists and other extremists grab hold of it as the spark for another campaign of intimidation and violence.

The sooner this stops being an issue and we can all treat each other according to our behaviour, the better.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Spot on, by the time (at latest) that people reach their teenage years they should know the difference between right & wrong, good & bad behaviour, and be well on the way to developing morals that will guide them through life.

The problem as I see it, is that some countries have a different view on various things that are perceived as 'right & wrong', and a different moralistic attitude towards the way life is lived and how others are treated.

I'm afraid Religion plays a big part in this, history is rife with examples of 'my God is bigger than your God' and the conflicts that follow.

It's also fair to say that if your early years are governed by bad parents and poor schooling, you may well pick up the wrong outlook on life and find you can't (or won't) fit into society.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Certain crimes seem to be more prevalent in certain communities. That cannot and should not be ignored.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Agreed.

Political correctness would have us believe that a person's race etc is always irrelevant in every situation, but this is simply not true.

If relevant, to give them chance to make any adjustments in the usual service for me, I mention that I have a disability. Fairly often remarks such as "that's irrelevant" or "we don't treat disabled people any differently, we're not allowed to" are made. I then have to explain that always treating everybody the same is not equality and is against the law.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

There is still a problem when the diversity side is favoured over the equality side.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

In some cases to do so is inappropriate, in others it's the correct thing to do.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

As i’ve Said before I agree there is an issue with the British Pakistani/ Asian part of the population.

Is there an equal problem with the white catholic clergy part of the population?

Is there an equal problem just with white men, is the real issue just with certain men of any nationality/ religion?

Is the common theme actually just vulnerable children and a failure by society to protect them.

Is it the real scandal just ignoring children at lower end of society, and the establishment allowing them to be abused and not caring?

How many children from upper to middle class backgrounds were abused?

Isn’t the case that evil men of any background, race or religion will prey on vulnerable children, and when those children are ignored by society and allowed to be abused by the authorities by those that are supposed to be protecting them.

Monsters come in many forms,

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Seven men have been found guilty of grooming and abusing young girls in Rotherham, including one who was made to have sex with "at least 100 Asian men" by the time she was 16.

https://www.cableforum.uk/images/local/2018/10/15.jpg

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-englan...shire-45980210

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Good heavens Taf, when & where will it all end?

Inaction from law enforcement agencies, afraid of being labelled racist, has led to these Asians behaving like pack animals. It really has to stop.

It really does appear to be the case that the drive for racial equality has led to the pendulum swinging too far the other way when they believe that they can rape underage girls without impunity.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

The issue was recognised a number of years ago, and the investigations that started in 2014 are bearing fruit, and will continue to do do, hopefully.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

If the police, social services and others were afraid of being prosecuted for being racist when all they are doing is responding to complaints and protecting vulnerable people, they need to attend some training courses on what racial discrimination legislation is all about.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Inaction? Really? Did you realise the post before yours is one featuring a court case where they were found guilty?

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

I meant in the past, thankfully they now seem to be taking a more common sense approach and these historical crimes are now being dealt with after many years.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

My apologies. It's just that this:

..contains the word 'has' which appears to indicate the present, as opposed to 'had'.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Is anyone going to open a thread about the abuse of children by the Catholic church? This seems an equally disturbing problem, maybe more so ..

One in 50 priests is a paedophile: Pope Francis says child abuse is 'leprosy' infecting the Catholic Church

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Nothing to stop you opening one if you feel strongly enough about it, that would be a much better option than trying to deflect attention away from a discussion regarding the prevelance of child sex abuse cases by Asian gangs at the moment.

Any group of communities who are indulging in paedophilic activities is worthy of attention and discussion, be it based on ethnicity, religion, sport etc.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

You are correct, the actions of this part of our society warrants serious debate .. as does the issue of paedophile priests.

Let me ask this: how many priests have gone to jail and how many mugshots of white Catholic men do you see in the media?

While we are here, do you think using the specific term "Asians" is warranted? The term describes a rather large part of the world:

https://www.cableforum.uk/images/local/2018/10/13.png

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

On that note, it would appear that the vast majority of grooming gangs were Asian (around 75%), and those who operated paedophilia rings were all White.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-a8101941.html

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

I hesitated to post results from that study earlier as it was at least 6 years old and many, if not all, the Asian lead grooming and rape gangs hadn’t come to light then.

Which makes the findings in the report impotent to say the say the least.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

No point in trying to use statistics because although in the newest Rotherham case, seven were convicted, -

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Asian is used as a generic term, in this country it is usually a collective term for Pakistanis, Indians, Bangladeshis etc. You're quite right though, Chinese people for example, are 'Asian' too.

There are so many different types of them living over here now that it would be impossible to list them all, but in discussions about them in relation to child sex abuse, perhaps they should be reffered to as Pakistanis as these appear to be the main culprits of this horrible crime within the Asian community??

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

“Asian” is typically generically used for the sub-content.

Far East generically is oriental

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

08-05-2012, 19:54 just looked at date of original post - over six years ago

lots of the same thing - lots of same common factor

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Still the biggest joint attribute is being a Muslim. There appears to have been more non-Asians that are Muslim than Asians who aren't Muslim.

Oxford

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

I agree. Members of the British Pakistani community would be more accurate ..

---------- Post added at 07:12 ---------- Previous post was at 07:03 ----------

BTW, there is nothing "fake" about child sex abuse in the Catholic church ... although it may be uncomfortable for some to hear.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Maybe being Muslim is the common denominator then as opposed to being asian/Pakistani?

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

The common denominator is that they’re all male. And the girls are all vulnerable from the lower end of society.

There is a further indicator that they are mainly from Pakistani origin.

I don’t think religion plays into it. The fact that they are of Pakistani origin would automatically make them Muslim.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

It's less to do with them being Muslim.

When I lived in Leicester my ex warned me to never take her daughters to certain parts of the city that had mainly Pakistani residents. She made it her mission to make sure the girls kept away from Pakistani gangs too.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

So how many areas were there with large concentrations of Muslims who weren't Pakistani? If you lived in London or Manchester, would the same warning apply to Somali areas?

Quote:

Three Somali men jailed for raping a 16-year-old girl in Rusholme in 2013

How many examples from around the UK and indeed the world, do you need of depraved Muslim gang behaviour by those not originating from Pakistan?

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

This thread was started in response to Asian gangs grooming children, that's why they are the focus of the discussion.

Nobody is suggesting that every member of this community is a paedophile, nor that non asians/pakistanis/Muslims don't indulge in paedophilic behaviour.

There clearly is a problem with this community and it needs sorting out. Pussy footing around the facts and crying racism is what has led to them getting away with it for so long. Even some of their own leaders have acknowledged this.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

I never did the research.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

When you are raised to believe anyone not of your faith can be lied to, the rest follows on.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Then how can you claim that the only problem areas were ones predominantly Pakistani and not simply predominantly Muslim?

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

I'm not claiming anything of the sort. She told me the problem was with Pakistanis whether Muslim or not.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Most are Muslim but have not followed their teachings as they are supposed to... **** buckets.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Apparently it's known as "Ma Malakat Aimanukum". Basically they can do what they want with "captives" or "slaves".

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

It really is uncivilised behaviour isn't it.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Isn’t that “ no worries for the rest of your days” ?

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Don't worry, I got it....

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

One of the Asian grooming gang from Rotherham got one of his victims pregnant, unbelievably he is to be given the chance to have access to the child (and, therefore, be a permanent reminder to the mother about what happened):

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/r...-a4002186.html

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

No way should ever happen.... but Castration should be implemented... no nuts for numb nuts.

---------- Post added at 18:47 ---------- Previous post was at 18:46 ----------

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Well I think the solution is here:

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

https://www.cableforum.uk/images/local/2018/12/13.jpg

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-46684638

Once again, the word "Asian" is being used, and it's not race that is often the common factor, but a certain religion.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Or men of a certain religion I would say...

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

The biggest problem we have here. And its a major problem. Even though l am nearly 67 years old.

There are some sick *******s out there that we pray on the young. No matter who they are. The law in this country is far too soft on this type of crime.

Its the bravery of the young who are the victims, who come forward to give evidence. And yet the on annoying this is that the '*******s' and l don't care if admin block the use of the word.

Families get involved, and keep there mouth shut when they 'know' this is happening and young people are passed round as though they are lumps of meat.

I strongly believe that 'if' members of the family know this is happening. Then they are as guilty as the offender.

These offenders should get life in prison - without parole. Remember, life is only 15 years, unless directed by the judge.

I am sorry to be so angry, but l really feel for the victims, who will suffer for the rest of there lives

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Totally agree with you Arthur.

Another ten are in a Bradford court today, with only one name released so far, 38 year old Basharat Khaliq.

It is claimed that two 14 year old girls living in a children's home in Bradford were sexually exploited & forced to submit to sexual activity through the use of alcohol, drugs and threats of violence.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Further names and ages have now been released; they are all described as 'Asian' by the BBC.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

There does appear to be one person of a different religion based on the photograph.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Even just based on convictions it is less than 1% non-Muslim. If you actually include the thousands of others involved in the trafficking aspect, it will be less than 0.1% non-Muslim.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Muslims are a minority as a whole in the UK so, even if it's proved that a significant number of them are involved in sex crimes, they would still show up as a tiny proportion when compared to the population as a whole.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

True, but if you want a clearer picture would you not do the following?

total people (by race or religion) divided by the amount of convictions for offence (by race or religion)

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

A more detailed analysis could be done, but I think it's already clear that there is a disproportionate problem with Muslims and child sex abuse (in court yesterday one girl said that over 100 of them had abused her). Statistics won't really matter to the victims.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

More detailed analysis has been done.

https://www.channel4.com/news/factch...al-abuse-gangs

https://www.gov.uk/government/upload...ty-tables.xlsx

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Using data from more than 6 years ago doesn't really count for anything.
Even so...
Using the term "Asian" misrepresents the 7.5% figure used. Also other Muslim gangs are involved that are not Asian, eg they are Somali.

Now add in all the men that the girls are trafficked to, but not identified or prosecuted, and therefore not included in any figures.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-a8101941.html

Will a report from 13 months ago do?

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

The 2nd link provided information up to the end of 2016.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

It ought to do.

I can’t believe we’re still having this ridiculous ‘you can’t say that, it’s racist’ discussion over this issue. There is obviously a problem, and denying it in the name of racial harmony will ultimately help nobody.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

I don’t believe anyone is saying that, but some are saying because most grooming gangs are Asian, then most of the people committing sexual offences against under-age children are are Asian, which is not factually correct.

As Naz Shah said

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Yup, I read the article. The stats for the sex offenders register are broadly in line with the racial profile of the country. However, there are a lot of people on the register who are not considered dangerous to the public at large. Without wishing to diminish the seriousness of what they’ve done in any way, the register is mostly populated by people who have downloaded illegal porn, exposed themselves in public or, more seriously, have committed actual abuse yet within their own family setting. There is an obvious scale of increasing seriousness when it comes to sexual offences just as there is with any other sort of crime, and the activities of these gangs, in the premeditated targeting and grooming of vulnerable girls who are strangers to them, is obviously vastly more serious in terms of risk to the public.

I don’t think anyone is saying that Asians are more likely to be sex offenders, but the statistics do justify at least asking the question and doing the research: why is there a particular issue with these serious sexual offences within our Asian community? That is not a racist sentiment, it is a prudent line of enquiry in the pursuit of public safety.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

I agree with you on that.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

No doubt the surnames Williams, Jones, Smith and Thomas will be well reperesented in those 55...

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Not just the UK.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

It's not just under age girls that they take advantage of, but also the incapacitated.

I was recently in an Asian eatery and could hear what the waiters were saying to each other. They described how they would go into town after work and take advantage of girls under the influence of too much alcohol. They then went into intimate details of what they could get away with doing to them sexually, until I called over our waiter and had the situation dealt with.

To say they're supposed to be so against alcohol, they certainly know how to take advantage of its effects for their own ends.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

I do hope you reported this to the police?

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Richard, fyi, not all Asians* are Muslim - Hindus and Sikhs can (and do) drink alcohol.

btw, did you report these actions to the authorities?

*by "Asians", I assume you mean from the Indian sub-continent (India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Nepal, & Bhutan), rather than including Afghanistan, Armenia, Azerbaijan, Bahrain, Brunei, Cambodia, China, Indonesia, Japan, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Laos, Malaysia, Mongolia, North Korea, Philippines, Singapore, South Korea, Sri Lanka, Taiwan, Tajikistan, Thailand, Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan, and Vietnam

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

An 'Asian eatery' could by definition be anything from a Kebab takeaway to a top class Chinese/Indian restaurant . . . or even a fish & chip shop nowadays ;)

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Indeed. I've fallen into the same trap as calling them 'Asian', when Pakistani (or Muslim if appropriate). Whilst it's highly likely that they will be Muslims, I do know of a Pakistani Christian.

---------- Post added at 15:51 ---------- Previous post was at 15:50 ----------

True. It describes itself as an eatery, which I think is an American term.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Once, when working with one of the big 4 accountancy firms (they were the IT Delivery Partner working with us on a Data Warehouse programme), I employed one of their IT Consultants called Saul Judah, who was a Glaswegian* Catholic of South Indian descent - that often caused confusion after people who had been on a teleconference with him met him face-to-face... :)

*with a very broad Glasgow accent

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

A lot of people from those countries no doubt lump us together as "Westerners".

But I would like reports to be more specific and use the correct country of (ethnic) origin of these foul rapists.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Pakistanis usually refer to us as the 'Gura' (white).

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Three more have been caught and accused of rape, attempted rape and sex with a child over 13:

https://www.examinerlive.co.uk/news/...aping-14920214

One was an asylum seeker who tried to disrupt proceedings by claiming he was 17 and not 25 so he wouldn't be treated as an adult, but this was dismissed by the court.

You'd think that more respect would be shown to the people and laws of a country who had the decency to protect him from 'persecution'.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

But only if it was people from a range of countries/religions/cultures. With all these cases the defining link isn't "Asian". The areas covered by continents is arbitrary in nature and just governed by geography. Eg Africans vary across that continent.


The defining link is Islam. That is the "bond" that allows them to operate. Other Muslims are unlikely to report them,


Before anybody tries to bring in the Catholic church yet again, a key difference is that it was the priests etc that were mainly participating. These "Asian" gangs involve just ordinary Muslims, and so it isn't a matter of protecting any religious institution/hierarchy.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Hmmm, I wonder...

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-new...large-13951555

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Muslims have been demonstrating against a school teaching about the existence of gay people:

https://www.theguardian.com/educatio...rents-complain

It's a shame that they don't become as outraged about child sex abuse as they do about consensual acts between adults.

I'm not surprised that a third of people think that islamic values are incompatible with British values:

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/10...damental-clash

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Nine more Asian men found guilty, with a tenth due to be considersd:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leeds-47319226

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

To be fair are you it's nine?
Although he's not from Bradford some there must some other connection. Another gang in Dewsbury?

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

The guy bottom left might be the odd one out?

https://www.cableforum.uk/images/local/2019/02/18.jpg

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Three more have been charged of sex abuse. One, a former Lord who was regularly called upon to speak about issues facing British Muslims, is charged with abusing both boys and girls under 13, including attempted rape.

https://www.itv.com/news/calendar/20...e-sex-attacks/

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Oh look....

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-englan...shire-47526631

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

I am sad to say this. But this will NEVER stop.
There will always be people out there grooming young kids for sex.

My god, l am 67 years old and it happened to me for a staggering 5 years. And l was 15 years old at the time. I told the police, and NOTHING was done.

IF the police arrest one gang of groomers. Its will go underground even further.

The biggest thing that the police can do, is simply use the groups that target groomers on line, and find them. And join with police forces to catch them.

And if l am not wrong Jeremy Kyle done a documentary, where he found child groomers and chased them on TV.


This has been going on for years and wont stop until courts act accordingly with very strong sentences.

We even have sites that groomers can go onto, but these have got to be closed down. But, again one site closes, and another site will open.

Its a sick world out there, and it will continue. Sorry to say this, but its true.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Lord Ahmed appears in court charged with child sexual offences.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/...exual-offences

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Mohammed Akram (33), Usman Khalid (31),Naveeda Habib (40) and Shanaz Malik (57) from Huddersfield have today been found guilty today of various offences such as rape, sexual assault and child cruelty against a 12 year old girl at Leeds Crown Court.

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 

Oh look, another Asian sex gang in court....

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-shropshire-50633181