View Full Version : BT to use Ntl/Telewest for calls
Just read this interesting article in the Telegraph. It is called Broadband Voice.
Would I be correct in assuming that this will only work with a SACAM.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/main.jhtml?xml=/money/2003/12/09/cnbt09.xml&menuId=242&sSheet=/money/2003/12/09/ixfrontcity.html
gary_580
09-12-2003, 10:54
No it works with a normal phone. AFAIK this already happens on some transatlantic voice calls and is used a lot internal within the US. I heard stories that it changes the sound of the voice and the call quality is lower.
If I read the article correctly it mentions a box that is supplied free, that plugs into the cable modem.
Qoute,
"When customers sign up to the service, which costs £7.50 a month, they receive a box free of charge. They have to connect this to their broadband modem before they can start making calls."
MovedGoalPosts
09-12-2003, 11:28
It is proven technology, in that it has been a big thing now for larger companies, with many offices perhaps multinational that have high bandwith connections. As I understand it systems are that well integrated that users in these organisations use their phone normally, but the kit then decides how to route it - VIOP or conventional. Companies even save money on international calls by using the mix of VOIP for the international bit with the remote office then auto dialling to the local standard phone network.
What I really like is the idea that BT can get one over on ntl & telewest who aren't forced like BT to open up their networks to other comapnies - after all if NTL can offer their phone / internet (dial up) service on BT, why shouldnt BT offer phone on ntl.
I dont expect ntl to be too happy about it - lets watch the AUP for "it's not supported" type clauses, wait for the port blocking, and how much bandwidth does VOIP use - capping anyone?
hmm, ok, you get savings on calls, but you have to pay £7.50 'line rental' for it... that is getting close to the cost of some of the 'talk unlimited' packages isnt it? ( talk unlimited is £9 on top of ntl phone line ... gives you "Free UK National and local calls every evening and weekend.
Daytime national calls at local rates †“just 3p per minute. Free International call plan worth £2 per month. " )
whilst I think the VOIP thing is great ( we have IP phones at work, and we have a 'trunk' to the US office so UK and US are effectively on the same exchange, so we can just dial extensions numbers, we can dial out via the us office to us numbers and only pay local rates, and us customers can dial into the us office and get put through to a uk extension and they only pay us calls )
I am not sure that the saving quoted justify paying, basically, an extra line rental and if it does, then one of the talk unlimited services may be just as good if not better.
Whilst i agree about the 'why shouldnt bt be able to use ntl networks' why bother? how many houses DONT have a bt line? why dont they just drop the line rental to £7.50 or something... or offer to reconnect people for free even if some ntl tech has disconnected the bt phone line...
MovedGoalPosts
09-12-2003, 14:45
hmm, ok, you get savings on calls, but you have to pay £7.50 'line rental' for it... that is getting close to the cost of some of the 'talk unlimited' packages isnt it? ( talk unlimited is £9 on top of ntl phone line ... gives you "Free UK National and local calls every evening and weekend.
Daytime national calls at local rates †“just 3p per minute. Free International call plan worth £2 per month. " )
True I'm not convinced that, at face value it's that attractive an offer, even now without talk unlimited my ntl phone bill works on a simple 3 (daytime) 2 (evenings) 1 (weekend) price plan with distance irrelevant - indeed I think at one stage some local calls to ntl numbers were free - but that may have stopped now (at least that's how I think it works). I suspect the big advantage will be for international calls (but then you can get cheap rate diallers anyway (or do those not worrk on ntl lines?).
Looks like telewest have got their act together on this, and don't really see it as a threat:
http://www.ispreview.co.uk/cgi-bin/news/viewnews.cgi?id=EpZpAZVAlyoXzbTQfW
I like the quote in that article:
NTL has chosen not to comment until it has had time to investigate the offer. perhaps we should take that to mean:
"VOIP - what's that all about then - wer'e not tech enough to understand" :p
Just read this interesting article in the Telegraph. It is called Broadband Voice.
Would I be correct in assuming that this will only work with a SACAM.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/main.jhtml?xml=/money/2003/12/09/cnbt09.xml&menuId=242&sSheet=/money/2003/12/09/ixfrontcity.html
I have been involved in this VOIP discussion on another site that I frequent, I didn't notice there was also a discussion going on here about it.
BBKing would be the one to answer or comment on my understandings because I bow down to his superior IP and Docsis knowledge, but here goes as far as I understand the issues.
VOIP is a bolt on to the existing Cable modem Docsis system but requires the use of Docsis ver 1.1. ntl and Telewest currently use Docsis version 1.0, so as far as I understand it the system could not be implemented without an upgrade and changing out of the old CMX's if there are any left that will ot work on ver 1.1. The only exception to the rule would be original CWC areas because they alreay use Docsis ver 1.1, my understanding from a few years ago was that ver 1.0 only supports the transfer of data and not the timing aspects, this is OK for data but not for voice (data voice) as the timing is obviously critical.
I seem to remember (Perhaps correctly, perhaps not) that one of the enhancements for ver 1.1 was the implementation of a QOS facility (quality of service) this would allow the VOIP traffic to be given priority over general internet data, and I guess would slow down surfing and downloading for all the cable modem users not making VOIP calls.
The above info is as I remember it being described a few years ago when ntl started using the second phase cable modems, and I was also told at the same time that the Marconi/GPT system X switches had a bolt on facility to handle VOIP traffic, but I am not sure about the DMS100. I was suprised at this because I always thought the idea was to keep it away from the switch that was already working hard handling lots of SDH calls.
Please forgive me if any of the above is incorrect or inaccurate as I would stand corrected if anyone has any more recent info, or knows if ntl have been spending lots of their spare cash quietly upgrading to Docsis ver 1.1 in all areas.
Perhaps they already have a solution and are welcomng BT to use their network to provide cheap calls and take business away with open arms. :rolleyes:
th'engineer
17-12-2003, 22:21
I think its a good thing anything that opens up competition in the market . Might even focus a few minds at NTL, but there again live in hope
Florence
20-12-2003, 22:20
Today I recieved a card from BT offering this service to me. How long will NTL allow such a service to run where BT are getting money from customers using NTLs BB.
Dear Occupier
We've found a way you could save money on your phone calls using your cable broadband. You just plug your phone into your cable broadband connection ( via a small box we'll send to you for free) and then you can use Broadband Voice almost like it's an additional line.
For just £7.50 per month (plus your cable line rental), you can then make as many evening and weekend UK phone calls as you like, at no charge - for upto an hour each time. And you'll also pay low rates for many other calls. This means you could save up to £109 per year.
Visist www.bt.com/broadband-voice to find out how it all works and how you could start saving, Sign up now and get BT Calling Features FREE until 31st March 2004.
Yours sincerely
Fergus Crockett
Managing Director Consumer
will be interesting to watch this unfold.
themelon
30-04-2004, 09:50
What I really like is the idea that BT can get one over on ntl & telewest who aren't forced like BT to open up their networks to other comapnies - after all if NTL can offer their phone / internet (dial up) service on BT, why shouldnt BT offer phone on ntl.
Why the hell should NTL and Telewest open up their networks to BT? NTL and Telewests networks were built from Private Sector money, BTs network was scrounged off the Tax payer under the days of the GPO and sold 'on the cheap' in 1984 to BT. Personally I dont ever think a Public Funded Network should have been given to a Private company.........and its damn right that people should be able to choose other providers on BT especially when you consider 50%+ of the country would have no alternative were it not for CPS or Indirect providers.
I cant see NTL being too bothered really, if customers are using NTL Broadband, they are paying for NTL Broadband, im not to sure they would be that concerned about spin offs from BT
Ignition
01-06-2004, 22:41
I seem to remember (Perhaps correctly, perhaps not) that one of the enhancements for ver 1.1 was the implementation of a QOS facility (quality of service) this would allow the VOIP traffic to be given priority over general internet data
*nods*
ntl & TW dont need to be told about this as its just using bandwith - you can get software VoIP software for the same thing for a while now.
Today I recieved a card from BT offering this service to me. How long will NTL allow such a service to run where BT are getting money from customers using NTLs BB.
will be interesting to watch this unfold.
umm ... aren't you the least bit worried how BT knew you were a cable broadband user?
Tech_Boy
28-06-2004, 14:40
I use a great prog called skype from http://www.skype.com/ .
I was chatting to a friend who moved to Chicago a couple of days ago, and it was clearer than a phone line:D
I use a great prog called skype from http://www.skype.com/ .
I was chatting to a friend who moved to Chicago a couple of days ago, and it was clearer than a phone line:D
I would second that :tu: skype to skype calls are free too :)
hmm, ok, you get savings on calls, but you have to pay £7.50 'line rental' for it... that is getting close to the cost of some of the 'talk unlimited' packages isnt it? ( talk unlimited is £9 on top of ntl phone line ... gives you "Free UK National and local calls every evening and weekend.
Daytime national calls at local rates –just 3p per minute. Free International call plan worth £2 per month. " )
Is it possible to maintain broadband but have the ntl phone line disconnected and use the BT VoIP service instead?
:welcome:
yep broadband and no ntl phone line is perfectly possible :)
:welcome:
yep broadband and no ntl phone line is perfectly possible :)
Thanks :-) Has anyone done away with their ntl line and used BT Broadband Voice instead? Is it a viable alternative? Is caller display likely to work with a Philips Zenia DECT phone?
ian@huth
08-09-2004, 14:41
Is it possible to maintain broadband but have the ntl phone line disconnected and use the BT VoIP service instead?
The thing to remember is that just using BT VOIP and your cable connection means that you lose the ability to make or receive calls if your broadband goes down or you have a power cut.
I haven't used any paid for VOIP services myself, but you might find some useful info in these links:
comaprison of different services (http://azeem.typepad.com/blog/voip/)
secuirty risks? (http://www.computerworld.com.au/index.php/id;496934826;relcomp;1)
technical information (http://whitepapers.zdnet.co.uk/0,39025945,60031969p-39000412q,00.htm)
hth
MB
The thing to remember is that just using BT VOIP and your cable connection means that you lose the ability to make or receive calls if your broadband goes down or you have a power cut.
I understand that. But I'm a student and none of my flatmates use or contribute financially towards the land line. I'm thinking this would be a good way to save money :-)
Mmmm.... I received BT's little pamphlet with my phone bill this month and noticed a short reference to Broadband Voice. A little investigation on their website (http://www.btbroadbandvoice.com/bbv/brochureware/how_it_works.html) reveals it actualy to be VoIP - here and now!
The price seems to have dropped. The package with free evening and weekend calls is £6.50 per month and with free calls anytime is £14. There is a £1 reduction if you are on BT Broadband but (and this is the bit that suprised me) you can be with any broadband supplier. The adaptor is free but you have to sign up for 12 months.
It doesn't say so directly but this is sold as being suitable for a second phone line so, obviously, there are issues with reliabilty. And note that: The only restrictions are that you can't call premium rate numbers, non-mobile personalised numbers (07), the operator, non BT directory enquiries, fax & dial-up Internet service providers, 15x short codes and emergency services.
Ignition
24-10-2004, 19:52
I understand that. But I'm a student and none of my flatmates use or contribute financially towards the land line. I'm thinking this would be a good way to save money :-)
Also worth mentioning is that if your flatmates and yourself follow the usual student pattern of usage on a broadband connection (loads of P2P running a lot of the time, upload maxed out a fair bit, downloading like the wind) the VOIP won't work very well. Nothing you can do about that whoever your provider is.
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