VIP50/TiVo Packs and International calls

[savvychels]

This has to do with the phone part of the VIP50 TiVo packages, but because it's the TiVo version only I felt this was probably the best place to put this info. If the mods feel it needs moved then I understand.

I just got my bill today for the first month of my VIP50/TiVo package and all seemed well till I looked at my call charges. I make a lot of international calls, and in both my previous incarnations of the VIP20 and VIP50 packages I had Call International which was a £1.75 a month charge (then reduced in the discounts) and Call Mobile for the same charge. This International plan meant international calls were approx 3p/min.

Imagine my shock when I found that from the 15th of this month (when I had the TiVo installed) my international calls were TWENTY PENCE per minute!! Looking over the bill carefully it seems that when being switched to the TiVo version of the VIP50 contract that version has

Talk International 2
Talk Mobile 2

Both of those at £2 a month and both of those with calls charging MORE than the previous versions.

I don't understand it, I wasn't informed of it and I'm totally gobsmacked at it. Why would I want to pay more (yes I get it discounted) for a plan that actually charges me 10x the amount per minute than my original one.

So I've been on the phone with CS in retentions as I figure they are best placed to try to sort this out - especially as I wasn't informed of the per minute increase and made calls I expected to be around a couple of pounds which are now costing me around £20!! They have said that because it's a TiVo specific bundle they cannot change it, but are ringing the TiVo sales to see what they can do to get me the service I need and once they get that sorted they'll work on figuring out refunds for the differences...

There is a plan for £5 a month which gives 250 free minutes internationally (to Canada and US - not sure where else as I can't find any information on any of these plans on the Virgin Website anywhere - just the main Talk International for £1.75) and if you go over it's 2p a minute after that. I don't mind paying that, but I'm still ticked off about paying (yes it's then discounted) £2 a month for a plan that gives me no benefit at all.

So those of you with VIP50 and TiVo who make international calls be prepared for a HUGE shock when your bill comes in!

I'll let you know the final outcome. The lady who I've been dealing with will be ringing me back once she speaks to the other sales team

---------- Post added at 15:42 ---------- Previous post was at 14:58 ----------

Okay, she's rung me back with further information and I think I'm just about sorted.

Some info since I couldn't find it anywhere on the website. The only 'talk international' I could find on the website was this one:

http://shop.virginmedia.com/phone/talk-international.html

However there are 3 other plans - these can each be associated with the VIP50/TiVo account - I don't know where else they can be bundled in with - but I figured it might be helpful if you want to see the info:

This is the one that they automatically bundle in which is then part of the discount:

http://shop.virginmedia.com/phone/phone-review/talk-international2.html

And here are the other two

http://shop.virginmedia.com/phone/phone-review/talk-international5.html

http://shop.virginmedia.com/phone/phone-review/talk-international10.html

She then transferred me to Sales who were the ones who needed to set that up for me. For my needs (being a transplanted Canadian with friends and family all over the world) I went with the Talk International 10. They took out the 2 and put in the 10, so it's only costing me an extra £8 a month which is what I've been spending on international calls in the past anyway, but this way it gets me them for the equivalent of 1p per minute. Obviously this may be way more than most need, but I figured I'd let you know that you can swap in the best plan for you and still get the £2 discount in your bundle.

But definitely the Talk International 2 is NOT NEARLY the value of the original one - not even close! So watch your bills!

I was then sent back to customer service where I explained that I had not been informed of this difference in international plans and had made calls based on 3p a minute that had ended up costing me around £35 instead of less than £5. I said of course if I'd been advised of the difference I'd have signed up for one of the other plans immediately - I'm not the kind of person who wants something for nothing, but I do want my calls at 3p/minute if that's what I think I'm paying due to lack of information.

He said not a problem at all and has said he will go work out my refund and will ring me back shortly to confirm, but that it won't be an issue.

So - it was a lot of runaround between a few departments but everyone who was involved in the account was very helpful and looks like it'll be sorted shortly.

Apologies for the long-windedness of this. I know to a lot of people the international thing is irrelevant, but for those who DO make a lot of calls I just wanted to give a heads up.

[Stephen]

As it's relating to the phone service I've moved it to the correct section

[andrew.shearman]

what is VIP50 TiVo packages I am on the VIP50 package

[Stephen]

Andrew, its easy to work out. Its the exact same package you have but with a TiVo ;)

[andrew.shearman]

ok thanks stephen

[BenJSmyth]

I am having a very similar issue as the OP.

I too have VIP50 with Tivo (and have Talk International and Mobile listed as version 2) and have been charged £6.10 ex vat for a 36 minute call to a South African landline number. According to the PDF of calls from May 1st, this should be charged at 3.06p + 12.24 connection charge. By my maths the call should have cost around £1.20 ish.

How come I have been charged 5 times this amount?

[savvychels]

I am having a very similar issue as the OP.

I too have VIP50 with Tivo (and have Talk International and Mobile listed as version 2) and have been charged £6.10 ex vat for a 36 minute call to a South African landline number. According to the PDF of calls from May 1st, this should be charged at 3.06p + 12.24 connection charge. By my maths the call should have cost around £1.20 ish.

How come I have been charged 5 times this amount?

Because the International package that comes with the new TiVo bundle is the new 'Talk Int 2' version, which obviously people haven't been advised of.

Do as I did and ring them to discuss what package does meet your needs (the 5 or the 10 versions which I've linked to above) and let them know that you were not advised of the different international plan so made your call to SA under the impression it was 3p a minute not 20. I had to go through a couple of different departments to arrange the new service (they swapped out the talk Int 2 for talk int 10) and then for the refund, but I did get the refund with no issue or hassle at all, just a lot of time on the phone.

Just be really nice about it and you shouldn't have a problem. That's why I wanted to flag this - so people know what's going on.

Hope you get it worked out.

[BenJSmyth]

Thank you for the reply.

That is terrible. I was not advised of any such change to my package. I can't see how simply adding a Tivo box to the account should even affect the telephone part of the VIP package.

I had emailed them at the same time as posting my earlier post so I shall await a response, although I feel I am going to phone anyway.

Just out of interest, have they charged you an extra £10 a month for the Talk International 10 or is it still included in your VIP50/Tivo bundle price?

[savvychels]

They removed the Talk Int 2 and added the Talk Int 10 plan. There is still the £2 'bundle' discount for the international plan so my bill went up by £8 - which is about what I spend a month in calls anyway, but now I get 1000 minutes of free calls which is well over what I have used in the past and means I can do more calling of friends and family overseas at no extra cost (yay!).

If you don't make as many calls as I do, but still make a fair number and went for the Talk Int 5, it would be only £3 extra a month and would include 250 free minutes of international calls, and any over would only cost 2p a minute - so depending on your calling patterns could still work out cheaper for you overall than the original plan.

I'm still trying to figure out how the '2' plan is of any use to anyone... Was told that most overseas calls are around 30p/min so the '2' plan is between 10-20p/min depending on where you're calling. So if you don't call abroad at all or very little then I suppose it's still a good plan for those people.

For me I do believe I'm actually better off with the '10' than I have been previously and I think my overall bill will now be lower (now that there won't be any additional call charges), but it would have been nice to have been informed when adding the TiVo - it may be that the TiVo staff didn't realise there was a difference though and if that's the case then it's very poor communication on the part of VM to their TiVo sales team.

[BenJSmyth]

It is poor communication on part of the Tivo team although I can't understand why there is even a change to the Talk International package in first place.

I don't make many international calls at all and therefore wouldn't get the value out of the 5 or 10 plan, yet if I do make a call I don't want to be getting charged between 10 and 20p.

The original Talk International package worked well for us, being pretty much 3p a minute was excellent for the odd couple of calls overseas. Are you saying that by having Tivo the original Talk International package cannot be had with VIP50?

[BenMcr]

This is being looked into. The VIP 50 bundle did change the Talk International plan, but it should have been communicated to anyone moving bundles what was happening

[savvychels]

Are you saying that by having Tivo the original Talk International package cannot be had with VIP50?

Yes, they tried to put me back on the original plan and the system wouldn't let them. I only had the choice of 2, 5 or 10.

Ben - glad to hear it's being looked into :) Thanks for that.

I still have to say it makes no sense to me that a £1.75 a month plan offers calls for 3p a minute and a £2 a month plan offers the same calls for 10-20p/min?? Unless there are plans to do away with the original Talk International plan in which case it makes sense to have the tiers.

[BenJSmyth]

Thanks for the response Ben and savvychels.

I don't know which International package to opt for now! It certainly won't be the 10 as I don't make enough calls but I'm not sure whether to stick with the 2 or go for the 5, which is essentially just £3 a month more. It wouldn't take long for £3 to be billed if I stick on the 2 and make a couple of calls, but then would I make enough calls to warrant the 5.

Oh the decisions!

[BenJSmyth]

Spent about 35 minutes on the phone to customer service last night about this. A very helpful chap called Martin was dealing with it.

He was perplexed by the change in the Talk International and Talk Mobile packages. He confirmed what we already know about there being a VIP Tivo package and that for some reason they have changed the Talk International and Talk Mobile add ons. He is refunding me the difference in cost for my overseas call but his manager is escalating this to see if the original Talk International/Mobile add ons can be made available for VIP Tivo packs.

They told me this was the first complaint they'd had of this and said they will do their best to get it sorted as they can forsee many calls and complaints. Personally, I think I should be put back on the original Talk International and Talk Mobile tariffs. I was not informed of this change at the time of the Tivo order and cannot understand why the change has even been made!

I shall get a call back before Friday to confirm what is happening. To be honest, if I am not put back to the original tariffs I will be most annoyed. We make calls to France and South Africa. France is fine as it would be included in the '5' tariff, but SA is not and is charged at 20p per minute. If SA was included in the '5' tariff that would present better value for me than the original Talk International package.

I can only see two reasons for the change:

1 - it is a mistake and they have coded the package incorrectly and it should still be the original.
2 - They have incorporated the £3 Tivo fee into the discount and are using the new international call rates to claw back some of that revenue.

I hope it is the first.

[BenMcr]

The VIP bundle Talk Plans have been changed. That is not a mistake. However it's got nothing to do with clawing back the £3 for TiVo, as even if you go for VIP with V+ it's now the same

[BenJSmyth]

The VIP bundle Talk Plans have been changed. That is not a mistake. However it's got nothing to do with clawing back the £3 for TiVo, as even if you go for VIP with V+ it's now the same

You have to admit though it isn't a particularly good value change for the VIP bundle, or a good value package in its own right. Has Talk International been stopped completely then on all package tiers?

[savvychels]

Well I can definitely tell you that it's NOT the first complaint they've had - though it may be the first complaint those particular people have dealt with. I suspect there will be plenty more as people start getting their bills in.

If this is a permanent change (ie the original Talk International plan being binned) then they really need to get that old info off the website. I actually couldn't easily find any info on the new plans till I made a few guesses and typed in the actual http addy's. I found NO links to them through the normal website pathways - only links to the £1.75 plan.

[BenJSmyth]

If only they would add more countries to the Talk International 5 and Talk International 10 then it would certainly make me happy. If South Africa was included in those two bundles I would move to that anyway, even if the original Talk International was still available.

I find it very strange that they are removing value from an already expensive landline service. Other rivals offer international calls free with good value buindles. Sky have £5 a month for unlimited international calls and I think Talk Talk do the same for £2 a month. This change to our bundles has pushed the value of the landline service even further from their rivals and to a lot of people who make lots of international calls this could be a dealbreaker, regardless of the good value of the other bundled service VM include.

Very bad move IMO.

[BenJSmyth]

I still have heard nothing back from VM further to my lengthy phone call to CS. I spoke with a chap called Martin Hawe who had escalated this and did attempt to phone me back a few days later but got through to my father in law. He was going to phone back again but hasn't.

I have attempted to contact VM again but nobody knows anything about my call. I tried emailing but received a response from a customer service agent saying there was no need for them to phone as they can deal with this via email. The email they sent states the costs associated with the Talk International plan and quotes me 3.06p per minute for me to phone South Africa! No it doesn't!!

I wish I could speak to Martin Hawe again as he was very good indeed and understood fully the situation, but I can't get hold of him again!

[savvychels]

Call and choose 'thinking of leaving us'. I did, but was up front and said I wasn't planning to leave, but I felt they were the department that might actually take my call seriously and be able to do something to rectify it.

They had to put me through to sales to change the plan and then sales sent me back to CS for the refund, but it was all done relatively painlessly - sorry you're having such a hard time.

[cookster]

How do I get a VIP package? I don't see them on VM website.

Thanks.

[BenJSmyth]

Call and choose 'thinking of leaving us'. I did, but was up front and said I wasn't planning to leave, but I felt they were the department that might actually take my call seriously and be able to do something to rectify it.

They had to put me through to sales to change the plan and then sales sent me back to CS for the refund, but it was all done relatively painlessly - sorry you're having such a hard time.

I posted on the official Virgin forum and within about 10 minutes of my post Martin called me. Very helpful indeed and has refunded the call cost but has said the only options I now have is Talk International/Mobile 2 and the Talk International 5 and 10 packs. The original ones are being scrapped.

I was very happy with the way the call was handled. He hadn't contacted me because he was waiting to receive confirmation on what was going on! Even those who haven't upgraded to Tivo will be moved across to these new plans as the old one is being phased out. So be aware if you make a lot of international calls.

I am not very happy that they have scrapped the original call plans. 20p per minute to an international landline in 2011 is ridiculous and someone at the top of the Virgin Media tree should reconsider IMO.

---------- Post added at 15:24 ---------- Previous post was at 15:05 ----------

How do I get a VIP package? I don't see them on VM website.

Thanks.

This is what you are looking for:

http://shop.virginmedia.com/bundles/bundles-with-extras/very-impressive-package.html

[savvychels]

I am not very happy that they have scrapped the original call plans. 20p per minute to an international landline in 2011 is ridiculous and someone at the top of the Virgin Media tree should reconsider IMO.

Absolutely agree, but was told it was still good value as it's 10-20p per minute depending on where, and that the original price is 30p per minute. I'm not buying it, but i'm happy overall as for my calling needs I'm getting better value for money now.

[kgollop]

Wow, this is terrible news. I've not be able to access E-Billing for 2 months now so have not realised what was going on. Last months bill looked about £30 too high, but I can't login to E-Billing to check. This would certainly explain it. My wife is American so makes a lot of calls home. I cannot believe that Virgin Media have sneaked this in with no notification whatsoever, absolutely shocking.

[savvychels]

If you ring CS they will sort it for you. Ben seemed to have a hard time with it, but mine was easy. And if you make a lot of international calls then the Int5 or 10 will actually be better value to you than the original international plan was.

[kgollop]

So am I reading this correctly? I can replace the Talk International 2 package included with the VIP 50 Tivo Pack, with Talk International 5 and my bill would be increased by £3 per month. This would give me wife 250 minutes a month to phone home?

---------- Post added at 20:45 ---------- Previous post was at 20:43 ----------

If you ring CS they will sort it for you. Ben seemed to have a hard time with it, but mine was easy. And if you make a lot of international calls then the Int5 or 10 will actually be better value to you than the original international plan was.

Thanks. I think with Int5 I'd be about the same if I'm reading it right. Still really bad form that they have not told anybody about this though!

[savvychels]

So am I reading this correctly? I can replace the Talk International 2 package included with the VIP 50 Tivo Pack, with Talk International 5 and my bill would be increased by £3 per month. This would give me wife 250 minutes a month to phone home?

---------- Post added at 20:45 ---------- Previous post was at 20:43 ----------



Thanks. I think with Int5 I'd be about the same if I'm reading it right. Still really bad form that they have not told anybody about this though!

I agree - Very bad form that no one was told.

Yes, you are reading right - they can replace the Int 2 with the Int 5. You only pay an extra £3 (you still get the original £2 discount) and get 250 minutes free a month which works out at 2p a minute and anything over that 250 minutes is also only charged at 2p a minute. :)

[kgollop]

I agree - Very bad form that no one was told.

Yes, you are reading right - they can replace the Int 2 with the Int 5. You only pay an extra £3 (you still get the original £2 discount) and get 250 minutes free a month which works out at 2p a minute and anything over that 250 minutes is also only charged at 2p a minute. :)

Great stuff, I'll give them a call and get changed over. Thanks :tu:

[BenJSmyth]

I agree - Very bad form that no one was told.

Yes, you are reading right - they can replace the Int 2 with the Int 5. You only pay an extra £3 (you still get the original £2 discount) and get 250 minutes free a month which works out at 2p a minute and anything over that 250 minutes is also only charged at 2p a minute. :)

These packs are actually better value if you make a lot of calls to the included international destinations. My parents live in France which is included but unfortunately my partner's friend lives in South Africa which is not included.

If they added SA to this pack I would add it straightaway. £3 a month extra is good value but it doesn't include enough countries.

But this doesn't detract from the fact VM are sneakily removing the original Talk plans and have seemingly informed nobody about it. I should think CS will be getting a fair few calls over the next few weeks with people complaining of the same problem. Just when I thought the VIP pack had more value added with the £3 Tivo fee included, they go and ruin it by charging me 20p a minute to phone overseas!

[Buzzman]

These packs are actually better value if you make a lot of calls to the included international destinations. My parents live in France which is included but unfortunately my partner's friend lives in South Africa which is not included.

If they added SA to this pack I would add it straightaway. £3 a month extra is good value but it doesn't include enough countries.

But this doesn't detract from the fact VM are sneakily removing the original Talk plans and have seemingly informed nobody about it. I should think CS will be getting a fair few calls over the next few weeks with people complaining of the same problem. Just when I thought the VIP pack had more value added with the £3 Tivo fee included, they go and ruin it by charging me 20p a minute to phone overseas!

After 50 minutes on the phone and having spoken to 3 different people (who also consulted various supervisors) I was informed that there was indeed information sent out regarding changes to call packages and as my international calls are also to South Africa I have no option but to accept 17p/min calls.

Well, I do not accept this and will return to using access numbers (12p/min) or skype.

Not impressed but my hands are tied!

Just setup Skype to use from my Virgin phone. 4p/min to South Africa.

[kgollop]

Just phoned up 150 now, selected billing option and then option 0 for other inquiries. Spoke to a very helpful Scottish gentleman who got me switched over to Talk International 5. He initially wasn't aware of the changes, but with the help of the information on this thread and a supervisor we got there fairly quickly. Thanks again to Savvychels for posting this thread. Looks like the mother-in-law has picked the perfect time to go on holiday to Mexico too, and it seems I've managed to dodge an expensive phone bill! :-)

[savvychels]

Just saw the post on the page before and thought OH NO! but then saw this post. I'm glad you've got it sorted. Sorry it was such a pain. I suspect it's just the beginning as we're all just starting to get our first bills after switching to the TiVo package.

[BenJSmyth]

They refunded my charges for the international calls. What I don't get is that they are still advertising the old packages and they can still be selected by new customers when ordering online. The whole thing is just barmy!

[BenJSmyth]

They have finally updated the Talk International and Talk Mobile pages with:

http://shop.virginmedia.com/phone/talk-international2.html

I love the description:

It can be tough having friends and family on the other side of the world and not being able to catch up with them as regularly as you'd like to. With our Talk International £2 Add On communicating with them has never been so affordable.

I think you'll find it has - a lot more affordable!

[savvychels]

Rofl!!