VM Business and Superhub

[ccarmock]

When the new fixed IP Virginmedia Business services launch soon (hopefully!) I understand that the Superhub will be used to deliver them.

Given the problems being reported with the Superhub here & elsewhere I am concerned about an upgrade I had planned.

Given that the Fixed IP address service will be delivered by a tunnel formed from the SuperHub into a core of the VM network I would imagine it will be impossible to configure the Superhub for Modem only mode when this option becomes available, as in that mode maybe the tunnel wouldn't be available?

Also I understand there will be an option to have a fixed IP range as well as a single address option and as such the Superhub will be configured in a NO NAT mode.

Does anyone know if the firmware used for the business services will be the same as the residential services and if so what options for modem only mode there will be on the business service with fixed IP address.

[Chrysalis]

if they assign the fixed ip to a MAC then bridge mode may prove to be incompatible with that policy. Since usually a change of router or end pc device forces a new ip.

[craigj2k12]

surely its assigned to the mac of the modem

[Kymmy]

if they assign the fixed ip to a MAC then bridge mode may prove to be incompatible with that policy. Since usually a change of router or end pc device forces a new ip.

Currently that's how they do things..

I think the tunneling will have major problems with non-standard ports and firewall issues

[Ignitionnet]

When the new fixed IP Virginmedia Business services launch soon (hopefully!) I understand that the Superhub will be used to deliver them.

Where did this info come from sir? The Superhub doesn't have the required functionality for the fixed IP services.

[Chrysalis]

surely its assigned to the mac of the modem

if using a normal modem eg. the vmng300, then it seems the mac of the router itself will get the ip assigned, because I found whenever I changed the router, (or pc if not using router) the VM ip changed.

[craigj2k12]

if using a normal modem eg. the vmng300, then it seems the mac of the router itself will get the ip assigned, because I found whenever I changed the router, (or pc if not using router) the VM ip changed.

the mac address of the router is assigned to the network, and the router (or device, assigned to that) that is why whenever you change the device connected to the modem, you need to restart it, to register the mac address of the device

[jb66]

Business use ambit 256s at the moment, news to me about the superhub

[craigj2k12]

Business use ambit 256s at the moment, news to me about the superhub

yes but they are releasing the 50meg (and the 30 i think) as business products with static IPs, i dont think the old ambits are up to that!

[Chrysalis]

the mac address of the router is assigned to the network, and the router (or device, assigned to that) that is why whenever you change the device connected to the modem, you need to restart it, to register the mac address of the device

which was entirely my point when we on about registering ip's to mac's. As the dhcp servers appear to use the router mac not the modem mac.

[Ignitionnet]

The MAC address of the router is irrelevant on the new fixed IP services so not an issue.

[Kymmy]

which was entirely my point when we on about registering ip's to mac's. As the dhcp servers appear to use the router mac not the modem mac.

With business though you can have multiple MACs on Multiple IP's all at the same time. Five of them can be registered so in essence a fixed IP but you can still connect other devices through the modem and get individual dhcp'd non-static IPs for the devices.

My current setup is modem to switch, switch to (router, web/mail_servers on fixed WAN IP's) and finally router to internal IP's

[Chrysalis]

The MAC address of the router is irrelevant on the new fixed IP services so not an issue.

thanks for clearing that up.

[Ignitionnet]

I stand corrected regarding the above, it is indeed the Pooperhub *shudder*

The required functionality coming soon along with bridge mode.

[theoldbill]

I stand corrected regarding the above, it is indeed the Pooperhub *shudder*

The required functionality coming soon along with bridge mode.


In light of recent, should we be afraid, very afraid... or quietly confident that they can't make a complete horlicks of the firmware... again?

[Ignitionnet]

In light of recent, should we be afraid, very afraid... or quietly confident that they can't make a complete horlicks of the firmware... again?

Ask me an easier one such as what existed before the Big Bang. ;)

[pip08456]

In light of recent, should we be afraid, very afraid... or quietly confident that they can't make a complete horlicks of the firmware... again?

Judging by past performance-----------I hope you enjoy horlicks. :D

[Chrysalis]

I stand corrected regarding the above, it is indeed the Pooperhub *shudder*

The required functionality coming soon along with bridge mode.

how much testing? as nothing new to beta testers yet. maybe another 2 day test with bugs ignored and rolled out after.

[Ignitionnet]

There's been a fair whack of testing but not to residential beta testers. It's ongoing.

[Chrysalis]

There's been a fair whack of testing but not to residential beta testers. It's ongoing.

yeah the internal staff testing that never picks up anything?

I get the impression the customer testers is just so they can claim they had beta testers as we had no scripts to run, no forms to fill in etc. like its just a formality.

we been told bridge mode is under testing for a while (VM's site says its been under testing for past 3 months), yet they rolled out R25 with 2 days testing.

[Ignitionnet]

The components of business products would be beta tested by businesses rather than residential customers I'd have thought.

[Chrysalis]

thats fair enough I more meant about the bridge mode on my testing comment.

[stann0]

Excuse the ignorance but I've been able [mod edit: Obfuscated swearing removed] to simply plug in my old Linksys WRT150N via ethernet to the superhub and switch the superhub wireless off. Back to rock-solid wireless, apparently. Am I missing something? What is this "bridge" mode and why would I need it? Cheers.

[Kymmy]

Can I remind members that bad language will not be tolerated on this site even if the word is hidden but the meaning is clear.

Stann0 this thread is about the Superhub in relation to future business usage by Virgin Media business. There are many superhub threads for residential users so please use one of them instead for your issue.

[Chrysalis]

Excuse the ignorance but I've been able [mod edit: Obfuscated swearing removed] to simply plug in my old Linksys WRT150N via ethernet to the superhub and switch the superhub wireless off. Back to rock-solid wireless, apparently. Am I missing something? What is this "bridge" mode and why would I need it? Cheers.

that simple plugin you enabled a new access point but the superhub will still be doing the routing and NAT. So what you done may be enough for your needs but bridge mode will take it further and turn the superhub into a dumb modem that just pushes all traffic to another single device (router or pc).

[craigj2k12]

that simple plugin you enabled a new access point but the superhub will still be doing the routing and NAT. So what you done may be enough for your needs but bridge mode will take it further and turn the superhub into a dumb modem that just pushes all traffic to another single device (router or pc).

its already a dumb modem, along with a dumb router

[ccarmock]

I stand corrected regarding the above, it is indeed the Pooperhub *shudder*

The required functionality coming soon along with bridge mode.

Yup the information about the Superhub beign used for the new Fixed IP business services came from VM Business themselves.

Ah so it'll be new Firmware that delivers that. I wonder if there will be seperate frmware streams for business and residential?

[pip08456]

Yup the information about the Superhub beign used for the new Fixed IP business services came from VM Business themselves.

Ah so it'll be new Firmware that delivers that. I wonder if there will be seperate frmware streams for business and residential?

Quite likely.

[Kymmy]

Personally I'm getting to a point where I'm ready to give in with VMB. It's been over three years since I got the business account and in that time nothing at all has changed (apart form the introduction of 20Mb without fixed IPs so no good to me) where as residential has gone from 2/4/20Mb to 10/30/50/100Mb. With the current costs I might as well just get hosting elsewhere and go with a residential account especially as most of my main bandwidth is done between the hours of 6am and noon.

[ccarmock]

Spoke to them today - looks liek a further delay.... they are saying end of May now. The person I spoke to didn't know why - but I do wonder if it's issues with the Superhub.

[Skie]

Sounds like they are waiting for bridge mode before unleashing the superhub on unsuspecting businesses.

[Ignitionnet]

Bridge mode will be required for some business installs.

[Skie]

You would think all of them will need it if the hub continues to be incapable of handling large file transfers over its lan ports.

[pip08456]

Spoke to them today - looks liek a further delay.... they are saying end of May now. The person I spoke to didn't know why - but I do wonder if it's issues with the Superhub.

Welllllllllllllllllllllll seeing as the R27 firmware (which should enable bridge mode) isn't being pushed to testers until May with a provisional push to all in early June, perhaps that explains why.

Yes it is a plooperhub issue!

[ccarmock]

looks that way for sure!

Ingi - do you know if bridge mode will be used for the static IP option ?

[Kymmy]

If it is then that probably means the same system as my current 2050 so no true static IP block :rolleyes:

[ccarmock]

The system they are implementing does include true static IPs - which is why I asked what mode will use bridge mode - ie will this be a modem only with the superhub and a seperate router behind it for the tunnel required for the static IP addresses.

They will even allow reverse DNS on the static IPs. this part of the new package looks a major step forward actually.

[Kymmy]

Surely they could do exactly the same thing with the 2050/256 modems??

[ccarmock]

In theory yes - though it depends what device forms the tunnel endpoint - the Superhub or a router behind it. I thoguth the Superhub was to be the endpoint which is why they will use them for the new services, but Ingi's post made me wonder why bridge mode was necessary for some business services.

Also of course they needed the central infrastructure to support the static adresses via tunnel.

My current understandign is that a tunnel will be formed between the superhub and core devices in the VM network. There will be three options for the end user:-

1. NAT mode no static address - ie as per the residential services
2. NAT mode with single static address - ie as the current telewest area business services. WAN port of the Superhub gaisn the static address and LAN ports on 192.168.x.x addresses
2. Static Subnet option - multiple static addresses assigned. Superhub operates in a NO NAT mode. Any NATing required would be done by a downstream device. This is the option I plan to go for so I can continue to use my Cisco 881 router for wireless and also as a VPN tunnel endpoint.

Because a tunnel is used the addresses are assigned from the core and delivered via the tunnel and not the UBR so will remain the same across any network segmentation and woudl become true static addresses, which the option for reverse DNS.

Maybe Ingi can advise how bridge mode would be used here.

Clearly the serviecs are slipping which seems to be related to Superhub firmware schedules. I was told by business sales that they have several business customers beta testing this all sucessfully though.

[Ignitionnet]

Bridge will be for IP VPNs as the Super Hub won't have the necessary functionality to be an MPLS CE.

The rest is as you mentioned, they will use PPPoE in a similar manner to DSL products, the PPP tunnels start at the Super Hub, use the CMTS as a LAC / L2TP Access Concentrator then terminate at an LNS / L2TP Network Server and it is there that the IP addresses are provided and 'real' IP connectivity begins, the rest of the hops on the traceroute, including the CMTS and hops up to the LNS, won't be visible as they will be encapsulated inside PPP and L2TP, so resegmentation will only change the modem's own private IP address, the IP addresses it grabs via PPP will be exactly the same while the same log in credentials are used.

To anyone who doesn't understand the above paragraph if you don't understand it you have no reason to care.

TLDR version it supplies static IP addresses in a very similar way to ADSL products, just it uses DOCSIS over a cable network, not ADSL over a telco network, to get to the provider's network.

I think Telewest supplied business services in this way at some point? I know there are nodes on the Ex-TW network that were LNS and were used for termination of PPP tunnels.